Do the democrats have any path forward?

[madinsomniac]

I ask this in all seriousness.

Look, Im a moderate who lives in the very democratic city of Pittsburgh. I have friends from every walk of life and while the hardcore dems and the Hardcore republicans have the expected responses, im finding the vast majority of my like minded independants and even the typically moderate democrats are simply done with this aspect of the party. I had a long conversation with several of them, Of note, one of which is a bisexual woman and another who has probably 90% homosexual friends... both lamented the overreactionary state of the male gay population and the extreme democratic hardcores... they literally spoke as I would expect the conservatives here too, only with more outrage because they feel like the reaction to trump has been worse than his own immature behavior.
This is the group that abandoined Hillary and right now I am hearing them do what i did years ago and shut themselves off of voting for the dems anymore. I cannot see how alienating all the middle is going to win them anything going forward.

I cannot see how they can even dent the state legislatures, and the repubs are ever so close to being able to force consitutional ammendments

I cant see any path forward in the judicial route... they lost that badly

I cant see how they ever get the house back without the state governements gerrymandering them in their favor again

I cant see them holding what they have in the senate next term, much less gaining it back..


I mean maybe 8 to 10 years from now they have a shot, but this looks like an endless black hole for them... What am I missing?

 

[Ron Burgundy]

What am I missing?

Nothing.

Good friend of mine, both on FB and in real life, is a moderate Dem and active on the county Dem committee just like I am active on the county GOP committee. He was with us for a while but went back to the Dems. He thinks the party has gone too far Left too and has narrowed their appeal too much. He thinks Sen. Joe Manchin is the **** and the party needs more politicians like him. While I agree with that assessment, I think that the leadership of the party AND the major money comes from the far-Left fringe and at this point they are incapable of appealing to middle America, or at least if a Democrat did then they would not have support of the party. Limbaugh reporting today that a lot of Senate Dems have been told that if they don't oppose every single one of Trump's appointments then they won't get any money from the big donors. I've told a few people on FB if you don't like Trump then put up a candidate who can win next time. (***** and giggles) Thing is, if they put up a moderate candidate who could win, either President or anything else, that candidate would be too centrist to get party support.

I mean, in four years lets run someone who is opposed to everything Trump stands for. The Dems need a candidate who runs on a platform of more Mexicans, more Muslims, more taxes, more regulation, more men in the ladies rooms, and higher energy and healthcare costs. Yes, I think that is a plan. They should do that.

 

[wig]

The problem is, Trump is so polarizing right now with the 20 somethings, unless they go through some difficult times and get some real maturing under their belts, they'll vote for whoever the Democratic party rolls out against Trump or any other Republican candidate.

The youth has been awakened and they are ******* PISSED about not getting their participation trophy. They're gonna want one next time around. You can bet your ***.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

The problem is, Trump is so polarizing right now with the 20 somethings, unless they go through some difficult times and get some real maturing under their belts, they'll vote for whoever the Democratic party rolls out against Trump or any other Republican candidate.

The youth has been awakened and they are ******* PISSED about not getting their participation trophy. They're gonna want one next time around. You can bet your ***.

Ha. They voted for the queen ***** but that wasn't enough. Going to take more than that.

 

[diver]

Never count them dead. I remember just a few years ago people were saying similar things about Republicans.

 

[Steeltime]

The youth has been awakened and they are ******* PISSED about not getting their participation trophy. They're gonna want one next time around. You can bet your ***.

If the economy is booming by 2018, you can bet those millenials will re-think their position. They, more than anybody, need a booming economy to earn the type of income that allows them to pay off those idiotic student loans and buy ****.

 

[steel shinin]

I ask this in all seriousness.

Look, Im a moderate who lives in the very democratic city of Pittsburgh. I have friends from every walk of life and while the hardcore dems and the Hardcore republicans have the expected responses, im finding the vast majority of my like minded independants and even the typically moderate democrats are simply done with this aspect of the party. I had a long conversation with several of them, Of note, one of which is a bisexual woman and another who has probably 90% homosexual friends... both lamented the overreactionary state of the male gay population and the extreme democratic hardcores... they literally spoke as I would expect the conservatives here too, only with more outrage because they feel like the reaction to trump has been worse than his own immature behavior.
This is the group that abandoined Hillary and right now I am hearing them do what i did years ago and shut themselves off of voting for the dems anymore. I cannot see how alienating all the middle is going to win them anything going forward.

I cannot see how they can even dent the state legislatures, and the repubs are ever so close to being able to force consitutional ammendments

I cant see any path forward in the judicial route... they lost that badly

I cant see how they ever get the house back without the state governements gerrymandering them in their favor again

I cant see them holding what they have in the senate next term, much less gaining it back..


I mean maybe 8 to 10 years from now they have a shot, but this looks like an endless black hole for them... What am I missing?

Absolutely they do. There is a huge line in the sand right now though. If they keep the leadership they have now they are ****** done for 10 years at least as far as holding a majority in any branch. They would literally be waiting for a bigger shift in voter demographics at that point for any realistic chance to really grab any power back. They need to go back to putting feet on the ground and being involved with people on a more personal basis and not relying on shaming everyone into things. They think everyones issues align the same in their base in the big picture and they just don't. People have made it very clear that they don't give a **** about each other from a survival stance when it comes to that kind of compromise. People are willing to listen to the plights of others and compromise when it suits them and things are going fairly well but when they aren't the majority will lean on what they think is the best way for them to survive. Progress be damned in some areas. It's about sustaining a foundation and tradition that people just aren't willing to let go of if it means they can't identify with it or lead a respectable life from their point of view.

Now that being said I think the one thing that conservatives are underestimating just like progressives did recently is just how much difference being made uncomfortable can push you. What it will make you consider. What you are willing to put aside to take a risk. I can't imagine that a candidate like Trump could ever run as Democrat obviously but the door is open for someone to come through who can ride a wave of resistance. The problem is finding a candidate or candidates that are authentic enough to carry that message with authority and class is going to be tough in this climate. They can't just run the opposite to Trump candidate. It will blow up in their ******* faces. They need to run someone with a real message and a real plan. As much as I hate to admit it, Trump has had a plan and is doing what he said he would for the most part. I think a lot of it is ill conceived, divisive, and short sighted but he's doing it. He's being aggressive and even when people hate him, he's controlling the narrative. He's in control. But as we've all seen before, a huge catastrophe can destroy that.

 

[ark steel]

8ish years ago we were being told the demographics were changing such that the GOP would never win the Whitehouse again. Then the Dems go and run such a ****** candidate that they lost WI, MI, FL and PA....WI a state the GOP couldn't win with a WI rep on the ballot.

**** can happen.

 

[madinsomniac]

The thing is the repubs had a strong base in the state level to rebuild from after Obama... they didnt have the house or senate logistics issues the dems have now.. they had control of the SUpreme Court... there was always a path forward for them, despite what the morons who orgasmically called them dead without looking at the base...

Lets contrast that with the dems... their strongholds are:

The urban centers, based on the ethnic and poor vote there.. that likely wont change, however if trump made good on his promise to revitalize them the dems would be doomed forever

The northeast, which is susceptible to far left leaning candidates... not exactly the moderates tge dems need to win back the middle vote. Both this and the unreliable youth vote will be dramatically impacted if the debates are forced to carry the mainstream third party players...

California... who keeps threatening to leave the us or break into segmented states... either would block the dems path to the presidency for a long while
Tou los
I mean swing too far left and you lose the union workers for good... as well as the catholic hispanic voters. You lose all the rust belt... stay with the centrists and watch the young bernieites flock to some 3rd party communist...


They way i see it the dems NEED trump to **** up in a grand and obvious way.. which is why they are freaking

 

[madinsomniac]

I mean a real carismatic well planned out candidate might get tgem back the presidency, but the senate is likely at least three cycles out and the house is just gone...... the court is lost for at least 15 years.. longer if any more fall in the next 4 years...

 

[steel shinin]

I mean a real carismatic well planned out candidate might get tgem back the presidency, but the senate is likely at least three cycles out and the house is just gone...... the court is lost for at least 15 years.. longer if any more fall in the next 4 years...

Young, charismatic candidates are the ONLY candidates that have won the White House for Democrats since Kennedy. (Carter was an anomaly......and so was his Presidency) To appeal to the type of base they have, with the diversity it has is so hard to do. You are completely correct as far as how fragile balancing all of those demographics is. They have to figure this out on the ground or they are ******. Trump runs the risk of coming through on his promises but overextending him reach and doing some of the work in bringing people together for a common cause. As long as he controls the narrative it'll work but if he ***** up in a big way, then that's when people of different demographics can put their differences aside.

 

[Steelr4evr]

They certainly are a ******* violent destructive lot. They really need a major attitude adjustment to their major malfunction.

 

[Spike]

Yes!!!

Hard core anarchists on the left is the way to go.

Everyone can identify with them!

Go for it!

BLACK ATHEIST POWER!

amen.

 

[hamster]

The best thing that Trump can do with young voters,is to help them defray college costs. I don;t know how, or thought it through. But if he can, those Bernie supporters are Republicans for life.

 

[Spike]

College age kids. Their minds are warped. They need a readjustment.

Open up the draft. Attack against Iran on the ground. We got 8000 spare tanks and plenty of new troops.

We need a new disposable generation. Women encouraged to join the front lines.

A lesser impact on the environment if we lose a million feeding mouths. Do it for America. Enlist.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

The best thing that Trump can do with young voters,is to help them defray college costs. I don;t know how, or thought it through. But if he can, those Bernie supporters are Republicans for life.

Fix the economy and the job market and take credit for it all the way. I have no doubt Trump will do that. Thing is, the economy has been so bad for so long that a lot of young people think that the only way they can make more money is if they vote for people who will force employers to pay them $15 an hour because they've never experienced a strong economy where employers are bidding for workers.

 

[Steelin]

In flyover country we have our fair share of snowflakes. We also have a large population of young people who did the right thing, went to college and now they just want decent paying jobs to pay back their loans, buy houses, etc. etc. The economy has been flat though and wages have stagnated for quite some time now. Unfortunately, the hottest topic amongst the young people I know is of defunding Planned Parenthood.

 

[SteelChip]

Or just continue the fight....

 

[deljzc]

There is no doubt democrats can win the White House back in 2020. The constant tearing down of Trump will have an effect.

I think Congress is Republican for a while. The 2018 mid term elections look okay. The senate is always a crap shoot, but that looks Republican for the next 4-6 years. The gerrymandering of districts looks to have made the House solid republican for a while.

The Supreme Court looks solid for at least somewhat middle ground. Even if RBG lasts until a democrat in office in 2020, that's not the end of the world. A core of Roberts, Gorsuch, Thomas and Alito (all under 68) seems pretty solid.

The Presidency will always flop back and forth. It's just the way we are wired. People get fed up with the bullshit and just vote for someone new. It's inevitable.

And now that we see Obama's methods of governance by executive orders as the rule, not the exception, that will continue. So expect a lot of drastic changes and a lot of flip-flopping on major issues.

 

[madinsomniac]

There is no doubt democrats can win the White House back in 2020. The constant tearing down of Trump will have an effect.

I think Congress is Republican for a while. The 2018 mid term elections look okay. The senate is always a crap shoot, but that looks Republican for the next 4-6 years. The gerrymandering of districts looks to have made the House solid republican for a while.

The Supreme Court looks solid for at least somewhat middle ground. Even if RBG lasts until a democrat in office in 2020, that's not the end of the world. A core of Roberts, Gorsuch, Thomas and Alito (all under 68) seems pretty solid.

The Presidency will always flop back and forth. It's just the way we are wired. People get fed up with the bullshit and just vote for someone new. It's inevitable.

And now that we see Obama's methods of governance by executive orders as the rule, not the exception, that will continue. So expect a lot of drastic changes and a lot of flip-flopping on major issues.

The issue there is executive order is still trumped by congressional law or congressional amendment... in either case the dems almost solely have to focus on the presidency and i still see no one on the horizon capable of winning in this atmosphere... run a establishment goon and its going to lose the young leftists, run a communist and you dont get the middle vote back... screaming antitrump isnt going to build anything to the party

 

[DBS1970]

If Trump can get the economy moving, take some action on the deficit/national debt, bring us to relative peace in a few years the DNC can forget the next two presidential elections. If he does those things he will not only get the conservative base behind him he will get tons of independents and disaffected democrat voters.

 

[wig]

The media, working for YOU! (and the new Democratic Party.)

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

The Dems have moved so far left. They no longer have a real platform outside of personal attacks. They have a real problem with available candidates. There used to be tons of moderate Dems who were good candidates to become Senators and Governors and then make a run for Prez. But look at how many seats Dems have lost even down to state and local levels.

The only people winning for Dems are in the heavy blue areas. In these areas, it's the most liberal nutjob that is winning. So now the Dems pretty much only have liberal nutjobs in office. These people won't win state wide or national elections. There are very few Dems in office now who are not radicals.

it became so bad that they lost white working class and union members. That was always their base. But these leftists threw them away in favor of catering to minorities, thinking they will continue to grow in numbers and form an unbeatable base.

The problem with that is the assumption that all people of color will just pull that Dem lever no matter what.

This is why Dems want not just immigration, but nearly unchecked immigration. It's because they don't want any kind of filter which would mean we only accept the best and brightest. Those people will get jobs and think for themselves. In other words, they won't need big government. That's why they demand we accept anybody with a pulse that shows up. They want a new class of dependents.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Apparently their new platform is eliminating immigration laws and an abortion for everyone.

 

[wig]

Read "Brave New World" by Aldous Huxley.

Children should not be born. They should be grown. It's so much easier to cultivate a strong economy when you can grow a working class, a literate class, and a leadership class. This is achieved by withholding or increasing oxygen supply to the developing fetus at precisely the right time during the growth cycle. This way you can grow relatively unintelligent people or extraordinarily bright people based on the caste they're grown in.

Then it's merely a case of training and classical conditioning using both vulgar methods as well as some fairly pleasant drugs to motivate your classes to not only do what they're supposed to do but LOVE their role in society. Manual laborers are thrilled that they don't have to deal with the drudgery of having to "think" too much. They just do their job for which they are physically perfect and then they get to go home, drop some great drugs and have lots of consequence free sex. Meanwhile the scientists and politicians are happy as pie that they don't have to do manual labor, and after work they get to go home, drop some great drugs and have lots of consequence free sex.

In many ways it's the perfect society. People are literally grown into the perfect role for their lives. Until you get some fool yahoo who comes in and suggests people should have choice and free will and they should choose they want to love. What kind of a stupid, destructive notion is THAT? Well, you'll have to read the book to see how that works out.