• Please be aware we've switched the forums to their own URL. (again) You'll find the new website address to be www.steelernationforum.com Thanks
  • Please clear your private messages. Your inbox is close to being full.

Gruden Wins in Court vs NFL

tapeANaspirin2it

Well-known member
Contributor
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
12,985
Reaction score
17,650
Points
113
NFL tried to block it but now he'll get to take them to court. For those who forgot, years ago Gruden was a vocal critic of Goodell, then some select internal emails were leaked that made Gruden look bad and he was forced out of the league. I believe it also added pressure to force Daniel Snyder to sell the redskins

Goodell is essentially a slick politician so maybe he was smart enough not to have his fingerprints on directing somebody to leak the emails. If discovery does turn up some evidence of Goodell or the league purposely leaking private emails, they could be on the hook for a lot of money. Would be sweet if Goodell was forced out.

 
NFL tried to block it but now he'll get to take them to court. For those who forgot, years ago Gruden was a vocal critic of Goodell, then some select internal emails were leaked that made Gruden look bad and he was forced out of the league. I believe it also added pressure to force Daniel Snyder to sell the redskins

Goodell is essentially a slick politician so maybe he was smart enough not to have his fingerprints on directing somebody to leak the emails. If discovery does turn up some evidence of Goodell or the league purposely leaking private emails, they could be on the hook for a lot of money. Would be sweet if Goodell was forced out.


Wonder what Gruden's team will find in discovery. Or could a possible BIG pay off be coming Gruden's way?:unsure:
 
The decision held that Gruden could proceed in court rather than binding arbitration, which is a nemesis to plaintiffs. Arbitration agreements are unenforceable if they are procedurally and substantively "unconscionable," meaning that the arbitration clause offends notions of justice and fair play. The arbitration term is procedurally unconscionable since it is a provision that the NFL demands be put into every employment agreement for NFL teams and is therefore not negotiated, meaning it is a contract of adhesion (forced onto the party with lesser power). As to the substantive unconscionability, the NFL's problem with their arbitration provision is that Gruden was no longer an employee of the league when he filed the lawsuit so the arbitration term would not apply according to its own language (i.e., that all claims by employees must be litigated in arbitration and not court).

Not only that but the final arbiter of any claim against the league or its employees would be Goodell, so if the arbitration term were enforced, then Goodell would decide the fate of Roger Goodell. The only inexplicable part of the decision from the Nevada Supreme Court is how two of the seven justices felt that the arbitration term was conscionable, i.e., fair, where Goodell would decide the fate of Goodell.

Gruden would have been allowed discovery if the case had proceeded via arbitration so the emphasis on discovery is not really relevant. In fact, arbitration terms which limit discovery are generally deemed unconscionable. The issue is that arbitration is so grotesquely slanted in favor of defendants that any plaintiff seeking damages is trying to overcome a massive bias in favor of the defendant. That is the case since the party who places the arbitration clause into an agreement is obligated to pay the cost of the arbitrator since all a plaintiff would need to pay to pursue the case is a filing fee. Arbitrators get paid $100,000 or more for trials and thereby have a huge bias in favor of the party paying them for the simple reason that they want future cases and if they slam the defendant, guess who never gets another $100,000+ arbitration referred to them?

State law cannot prohibit arbitration since Federal law recognizes a right to arbitration under the Federal arbitration act. However, arbitration is no longer allowed for sexual harassment cases in either state of Federal lawsuits under a 2021 law, 9 U.S.C. §402. That statute was passed after a series of well-publicized sexual assault cases involving US Army personnel were forced into arbitration rather than via the courts.
 
The decision held that Gruden could proceed in court rather than binding arbitration, which is a nemesis to plaintiffs. Arbitration agreements are unenforceable if they are procedurally and substantively "unconscionable," meaning that the arbitration clause offends notions of justice and fair play. The arbitration term is procedurally unconscionable since it is a provision that the NFL demands be put into every employment agreement for NFL teams and is therefore not negotiated, meaning it is a contract of adhesion (forced onto the party with lesser power). As to the substantive unconscionability, the NFL's problem with their arbitration provision is that Gruden was no longer an employee of the league when he filed the lawsuit so the arbitration term would not apply according to its own language (i.e., that all claims by employees must be litigated in arbitration and not court).

Not only that but the final arbiter of any claim against the league or its employees would be Goodell, so if the arbitration term were enforced, then Goodell would decide the fate of Roger Goodell. The only inexplicable part of the decision from the Nevada Supreme Court is how two of the seven justices felt that the arbitration term was conscionable, i.e., fair, where Goodell would decide the fate of Goodell.

Gruden would have been allowed discovery if the case had proceeded via arbitration so the emphasis on discovery is not really relevant. In fact, arbitration terms which limit discovery are generally deemed unconscionable. The issue is that arbitration is so grotesquely slanted in favor of defendants that any plaintiff seeking damages is trying to overcome a massive bias in favor of the defendant. That is the case since the party who places the arbitration clause into an agreement is obligated to pay the cost of the arbitrator since all a plaintiff would need to pay to pursue the case is a filing fee. Arbitrators get paid $100,000 or more for trials and thereby have a huge bias in favor of the party paying them for the simple reason that they want future cases and if they slam the defendant, guess who never gets another $100,000+ arbitration referred to them?

State law cannot prohibit arbitration since Federal law recognizes a right to arbitration under the Federal arbitration act. However, arbitration is no longer allowed for sexual harassment cases in either state of Federal lawsuits under a 2021 law, 9 U.S.C. §402. That statute was passed after a series of well-publicized sexual assault cases involving US Army personnel were forced into arbitration rather than via the courts.


That is exactly what I was going to say.
 
Hope they do not limit the scope of discovery; Goodell's prior bad acts are well known here. Maybe Steeler Nation court be a friend of the court.



It will be like an IRS audit,……. They find one thing and keep leading to more and more.

Also know the NFL will have extremely good lawyers to counter act that, but also know Gruden has a pretty good set of Lawyers too!!!

If you haven’t noticed……. I’m a little ANI-Geed Machine.



Saluter the nation
 
The decision held that Gruden could proceed in court rather than binding arbitration, which is a nemesis to plaintiffs. Arbitration agreements are unenforceable if they are procedurally and substantively "unconscionable," meaning that the arbitration clause offends notions of justice and fair play. The arbitration term is procedurally unconscionable since it is a provision that the NFL demands be put into every employment agreement for NFL teams and is therefore not negotiated, meaning it is a contract of adhesion (forced onto the party with lesser power). As to the substantive unconscionability, the NFL's problem with their arbitration provision is that Gruden was no longer an employee of the league when he filed the lawsuit so the arbitration term would not apply according to its own language (i.e., that all claims by employees must be litigated in arbitration and not court).

Not only that but the final arbiter of any claim against the league or its employees would be Goodell, so if the arbitration term were enforced, then Goodell would decide the fate of Roger Goodell. The only inexplicable part of the decision from the Nevada Supreme Court is how two of the seven justices felt that the arbitration term was conscionable, i.e., fair, where Goodell would decide the fate of Goodell.

Gruden would have been allowed discovery if the case had proceeded via arbitration so the emphasis on discovery is not really relevant. In fact, arbitration terms which limit discovery are generally deemed unconscionable. The issue is that arbitration is so grotesquely slanted in favor of defendants that any plaintiff seeking damages is trying to overcome a massive bias in favor of the defendant. That is the case since the party who places the arbitration clause into an agreement is obligated to pay the cost of the arbitrator since all a plaintiff would need to pay to pursue the case is a filing fee. Arbitrators get paid $100,000 or more for trials and thereby have a huge bias in favor of the party paying them for the simple reason that they want future cases and if they slam the defendant, guess who never gets another $100,000+ arbitration referred to them?

State law cannot prohibit arbitration since Federal law recognizes a right to arbitration under the Federal arbitration act. However, arbitration is no longer allowed for sexual harassment cases in either state of Federal lawsuits under a 2021 law, 9 U.S.C. §402. That statute was passed after a series of well-publicized sexual assault cases involving US Army personnel were forced into arbitration rather than via the courts.
What really strikes me Steeltime is the amount of time it has taken to get to this point. It’s been years already. While I follow on the sidelines waiting for a few scraps from the media,you have a working knowledge and I’m sure can read between the lines. Why is this taking so long? Things get lost,memories falter,people die etc,etc. Have they been working nonstop to get to this point? Are there delaying tactics by the NFL legal team? Is this just the norm? Does it go full speed ahead now?
 
The decision held that Gruden could proceed in court rather than binding arbitration, which is a nemesis to plaintiffs. Arbitration agreements are unenforceable if they are procedurally and substantively "unconscionable," meaning that the arbitration clause offends notions of justice and fair play. The arbitration term is procedurally unconscionable since it is a provision that the NFL demands be put into every employment agreement for NFL teams and is therefore not negotiated, meaning it is a contract of adhesion (forced onto the party with lesser power). As to the substantive unconscionability, the NFL's problem with their arbitration provision is that Gruden was no longer an employee of the league when he filed the lawsuit so the arbitration term would not apply according to its own language (i.e., that all claims by employees must be litigated in arbitration and not court).

Not only that but the final arbiter of any claim against the league or its employees would be Goodell, so if the arbitration term were enforced, then Goodell would decide the fate of Roger Goodell. The only inexplicable part of the decision from the Nevada Supreme Court is how two of the seven justices felt that the arbitration term was conscionable, i.e., fair, where Goodell would decide the fate of Goodell.

Gruden would have been allowed discovery if the case had proceeded via arbitration so the emphasis on discovery is not really relevant. In fact, arbitration terms which limit discovery are generally deemed unconscionable. The issue is that arbitration is so grotesquely slanted in favor of defendants that any plaintiff seeking damages is trying to overcome a massive bias in favor of the defendant. That is the case since the party who places the arbitration clause into an agreement is obligated to pay the cost of the arbitrator since all a plaintiff would need to pay to pursue the case is a filing fee. Arbitrators get paid $100,000 or more for trials and thereby have a huge bias in favor of the party paying them for the simple reason that they want future cases and if they slam the defendant, guess who never gets another $100,000+ arbitration referred to them?

State law cannot prohibit arbitration since Federal law recognizes a right to arbitration under the Federal arbitration act. However, arbitration is no longer allowed for sexual harassment cases in either state of Federal lawsuits under a 2021 law, 9 U.S.C. §402. That statute was passed after a series of well-publicized sexual assault cases involving US Army personnel were forced into arbitration rather than via the courts.
I had forgotten which one of us is a lawyer.
Not that I understood everything but I agree.
 
What really strikes me Steeltime is the amount of time it has taken to get to this point. It’s been years already. While I follow on the sidelines waiting for a few scraps from the media,you have a working knowledge and I’m sure can read between the lines. Why is this taking so long? Things get lost,memories falter,people die etc,etc. Have they been working nonstop to get to this point? Are there delaying tactics by the NFL legal team? Is this just the norm? Does it go full speed ahead now?

Yeah, this case has taken a long time for a determination as to the enforceability of the arbitration provision. What happens is that Gruden filed the lawsuit, defendants answered and then filed a motion with the trial court to refer the case to arbitration. Gruden's lawyers opposed for the reasons I cited. The trial court renders its decision after hearing, maybe 3 or 4 or so months after the case is filed.

The losing party then files something known as a writ of mandate, asking that the decision of the trial court be ordered reversed. Not an appeal since no final judgment is rendered and a final judgment is a prerequisite to an appeal. The writ application is filed about 60 days after the ruling on the motion. The Court of Appeal accepts the writ and invites briefing by the other side, and a reply brief by the party seeking the writ. The Court of Appeal then sets a hearing date, months after the papers have been filed. All together that might take as much as a year.

The Court of Appeal issues its decision and the losing party then petitions for review with the Supreme Court. The petition has to be filed within 60 days of the ruling by the Court of Appeal. The Supreme Court grants review and the case is then set on another briefing and argument schedule - another year at least.

That's about 2 1/2 years, not 4 years. I really don't know why this took so long and remember - the case has not even started yet. Since the argument was about which venue can hear the case, the parties have not even begun discovery.
 
Yeah, this case has taken a long time for a determination as to the enforceability of the arbitration provision. What happens is that Gruden filed the lawsuit, defendants answered and then filed a motion with the trial court to refer the case to arbitration. Gruden's lawyers opposed for the reasons I cited. The trial court renders its decision after hearing, maybe 3 or 4 or so months after the case is filed.

The losing party then files something known as a writ of mandate, asking that the decision of the trial court be ordered reversed. Not an appeal since no final judgment is rendered and a final judgment is a prerequisite to an appeal. The writ application is filed about 60 days after the ruling on the motion. The Court of Appeal accepts the writ and invites briefing by the other side, and a reply brief by the party seeking the writ. The Court of Appeal then sets a hearing date, months after the papers have been filed. All together that might take as much as a year.

The Court of Appeal issues its decision and the losing party then petitions for review with the Supreme Court. The petition has to be filed within 60 days of the ruling by the Court of Appeal. The Supreme Court grants review and the case is then set on another briefing and argument schedule - another year at least.

That's about 2 1/2 years, not 4 years. I really don't know why this took so long and remember - the case has not even started yet. Since the argument was about which venue can hear the case, the parties have not even begun discovery.
They judged Jesse James catch far more quickly
 
NFL caved to Kaepernick as soon as he was about to start asking for internal emails. I wonder if they'll do the same here. We'll find out if Gruden wants money or revenge.
 
Not only that but the final arbiter of any claim against the league or its employees would be Goodell, so if the arbitration term were enforced, then Goodell would decide the fate of Roger Goodell.
That is bizarre. How can the arbiter of a dispute in an arbitration be a party to the dispute? That sounds more like an internal review than arbitration. In fact it defies the definition of arbitration, as arbitration is the resolution of a dispute by an independent third party.
 
That is bizarre. How can the arbiter of a dispute in an arbitration be a party to the dispute? That sounds more like an internal review than arbitration. In fact it defies the definition of arbitration, as arbitration is the resolution of a dispute by an independent third party.

Yep. That is why five of the seven Nevada Supreme Court justices found the arbitration provision unconscionable. How in the world could the other two rule that the arbitration term was still enforceable? No clue.
 
Top