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Mike Tomlin extension to be announced soon

DBS1970 said:
How many times has Tomlin beaten the Cheatriots again?

What steps is Tomlin taking to groom and develop a replacement for Ben again?

Refresh my memory and let me know about delusions Slappy.
Click to expand...

Well, looking at pre-Tomlin, it seems to have been a long pattern:

2006, the team went 8-8. no Playoffs and no game against the *'s.
2005, the team whent 11-5, and won the SB. Played the *'s in the Regular Season and lost 23-20
2004, Ben's first year, team goes on a tear to go 15-1, beat the *'s during that run in the Regular season , 34-20. Played the *'s in the AFCCG...Cowher's D gave up 41 ******* points while the O put up 27. A half-*** attempt at coaching D would have won that game, right? Oh.
2003, the team is 6-10, no PO's no *'s game
2002, the team is 10-5-1, started out the season against the *'s. Lost 30-14. Team got to the PO's where the D gave up 33 in game 1 vs. Browns and gave up 34 in 2nd game vs. titans. no 3rd game. These were Cowher coached defenses giving up 33 and 34 in the Playoffs. Now, however, in a much more pass friendly game, Tomlin is **** because his D gave up 36 to a cheating sack of **** team. Hmm.
2001 13-3, PO loss to *'s 17-24
2000 9-7, no PO, no *'s game
1999 6-10, no PO, no *'s game
1998 7-9. no PO, lost to *'s 9-23 in regular season


Tomlin vs *'s:
2007 L 13-34 regular season, team finishes 10-6, loses in first PO game vs Jags.
2008 W 33-10 regular season, team finishes, 12-4 and wins SB.
2009 9-7, no PO's, no *'s game
2010 L 26-39, finishes 12-4, loses in SB
2011 team finishes 12-4, loses in 1st round of PO's and no *'s game
2012 8-8, no PO's, no *'s game
2013 8-8, big loss to *'s 55-31, no PO's
2014 11-5, no *'s game, lost in 1st PO game
2015 10-6 Lost to *'s to start the season 21-28, lost 2nd game in PO's (D allows no more than 23 points in a PO game, btw).
2016 finish 11-5, lost to * in regular season 16-27 and AFCGG 17-36.

so, looks like from 1998-2006, Cowher beat the *'s once. Since, Tomlin has beat the *'s....once.
 
Tomlin needs to shave his head or something to make it fun for the guys.
 
ark steel said:
Well, looking at pre-Tomlin, it seems to have been a long pattern:

2006, the team went 8-8. no Playoffs and no game against the *'s.
2005, the team whent 11-5, and won the SB. Played the *'s in the Regular Season and lost 23-20
2004, Ben's first year, team goes on a tear to go 15-1, beat the *'s during that run in the Regular season , 34-20. Played the *'s in the AFCCG...Cowher's D gave up 41 ******* points while the O put up 27. A half-*** attempt at coaching D would have won that game, right? Oh.
2003, the team is 6-10, no PO's no *'s game
2002, the team is 10-5-1, started out the season against the *'s. Lost 30-14. Team got to the PO's where the D gave up 33 in game 1 vs. Browns and gave up 34 in 2nd game vs. titans. no 3rd game. These were Cowher coached defenses giving up 33 and 34 in the Playoffs. Now, however, in a much more pass friendly game, Tomlin is **** because his D gave up 36 to a cheating sack of **** team. Hmm.
2001 13-3, PO loss to *'s 17-24
2000 9-7, no PO, no *'s game
1999 6-10, no PO, no *'s game
1998 7-9. no PO, lost to *'s 9-23 in regular season


Tomlin vs *'s:
2007 L 13-34 regular season, team finishes 10-6, loses in first PO game vs Jags.
2008 W 33-10 regular season, team finishes, 12-4 and wins SB.
2009 9-7, no PO's, no *'s game
2010 L 26-39, finishes 12-4, loses in SB
2011 team finishes 12-4, loses in 1st round of PO's and no *'s game
2012 8-8, no PO's, no *'s game
2013 8-8, big loss to *'s 55-31, no PO's
2014 11-5, no *'s game, lost in 1st PO game
2015 10-6 Lost to *'s to start the season 21-28, lost 2nd game in PO's (D allows no more than 23 points in a PO game, btw).
2016 finish 11-5, lost to * in regular season 16-27 and AFCGG 17-36.

so, looks like from 1998-2006, Cowher beat the *'s once. Since, Tomlin has beat the *'s....once.
Click to expand...

There goes that argument down the toilet.
 
to be fair, any QB we drafted would have been behind Ben and taken the field only when Ben was hurt. We have a true HOF QB and any of the ******* drafted by us since then would have either been a waste of a roster spot (Omar Jacobs, Tee Martin) or JAG (Landry Jones). And to be even more fair, all three of those guys were winners at the college level. So it's not as if we just completely ignored the position. Hell, we even brought in whatshisberger from LSU last season. Sometimes guys just don't pan out. Even with a lot of playing time (Geno Smith of the Jets is a prime example - drafted high, given a lot of PT, etc).

but, **** Tomlin for sticking with Ben, right?

and, we can sit around and look at numbers, but very few teams have actually beaten the *s in the playoffs. We all know why.
 
Supersteeler said:
I'm sorry, it's a dumb argument to say a coach is not good because he gets worse if you take away a franchise QB. No ****! Give Bill Belecheck Landry Jones instead of Brady. Even he couldn't cheat enough to keep winning. Chuck Noll had a lot of lousy seasons at the end of his coaching career. He also had people like Bubby Brister, Todd Blackledge and Mark Malone playing QB. Does his poor record after Bradshaw was gone mean he was a bad coach? Or did he instantly and magically get dumber when his Franchise QB retired and he had to use sub standard players at the position?
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In 2008, when Brady went down for the season in week one, Belichick was given Matt Cassel, who won the game after replacing Brady in the first quarter of a 0-0 tie, then proceeded to go 10-5 as a starter that year. Cassel's career starting record everywhere else is 26-39.

I'm sorry, but 11-5 with Matt Cassel (aka Landry Jones Sr.) is pretty good.


Tomlin can't beat New England because that ****** zone is good enough get past quarterbacks like Matt Moore and Alex Smith, but it's never, ever going to beat Tom Brady. It's not rocket science. Sometimes the "We Do What We Do" mentality gets exposed. Even my 10-year-old's coach gameplans differently for certain opponents. Too bad Tomlin can't seem to understand this simple concept.
 
topseed said:
In 2008, when Brady went down for the season in week one, Belichick was given Matt Cassel, who won the game after replacing Brady in the first quarter of a 0-0 tie, then proceeded to go 10-5 as a starter that year. Cassel's career starting record everywhere else is 26-39.

I'm sorry, but 11-5 with Matt Cassel (aka Landry Jones Sr.) is pretty good.


Tomlin can't beat New England because that ****** zone is good enough get past quarterbacks like Matt Moore and Alex Smith, but it's never, ever going to beat Tom Brady. It's not rocket science. Sometimes the "We Do What We Do" mentality gets exposed. Even my 10-year-old's coach gameplans differently for certain opponents. Too bad Tomlin can't seem to understand this simple concept.
Click to expand...

I still say any extension for MT ought to include a bonus of $1 million to $5 million payable every time he beats the Pats*****. $1 million for a regular season win, $3 million for a playoff win, $5 million for a AFCCG win.
That'll wake his *** up. Maybe even bring some halftime adjustments.
 
topseed said:
In 2008, when Brady went down for the season in week one, Belichick was given Matt Cassel, who won the game after replacing Brady in the first quarter of a 0-0 tie, then proceeded to go 10-5 as a starter that year. Cassel's career starting record everywhere else is 26-39.

I'm sorry, but 11-5 with Matt Cassel (aka Landry Jones Sr.) is pretty good.


Tomlin can't beat New England because that ****** zone is good enough get past quarterbacks like Matt Moore and Alex Smith, but it's never, ever going to beat Tom Brady. It's not rocket science. Sometimes the "We Do What We Do" mentality gets exposed. Even my 10-year-old's coach gameplans differently for certain opponents. Too bad Tomlin can't seem to understand this simple concept.
Click to expand...

What about all those other teams that aren't doing the zone D that the *''s also mw down year after year.

They understand the "simple" concept but still lose regularly. There are occasionalso defeats of the *'s, but no one does it consistently.

You might say, the exact Cassell issue you describe suggest that something else is going on. Cassell' 's record outside of the *'s, billicheck's outside of the *'s. My God, what could be the difference.
 
You could also argue it's partly Lebeau and the system. He was there for much of this.

I never understood if the Patriots were cheating as much as everyone says and everyone in the league knew about it, how could you possibly go into the AFCCG vs. them in 2005 and use the same defensive signals? It's not like Farrior was stupid and couldn't deal with it. To me, cheating or not, that's bad coaching.

Not sure cheating had anything to do with lining up mano-y-mano on 4th and 1 with Bettis in the backfield and losing that battle. That's on the players. And then you come back and not expect a bomb on the play after that, which New England is notorious for (have been forever). That's on the coaches.

Down 10-0 halfway through the 1st quarter. Tough for me to say that's all cheating. That's being out-coached and out-played as well. And in any playoff game (let alone one where we have a conservative coach from the Schottenheimer tree and a rookie QB and game plan designed to play with the lead), it's going to be hard to come back from that. Going to be hard to change game plans, open up the playbook and try to come back against a good team (New England was 14-2 and defending champs). I still argue that 2004 Patriots team with Corey Dillon was their best, most balanced team of their dynasty.

In most cases when I think of our rivalry with the Patriots, I think they are more talented and have the better Coach/QB. The only game I don't was in 2001 AFCCG. And that game was lost on special teams, which was always a complaint under Cowher going back all the way to losing to Eric Metcalf's 2 punt return for TD's. That one is always going to piss me off.

Most of the other games, I think the better team (including coach) won.
 
deljzc said:
You could also argue it's partly Lebeau and the system. He was there for much of this.

I never understood if the Patriots were cheating as much as everyone says and everyone in the league knew about it, how could you possibly go into the AFCCG vs. them in 2005 and use the same defensive signals? It's not like Farrior was stupid and couldn't deal with it. To me, cheating or not, that's bad coaching.

Not sure cheating had anything to do with lining up mano-y-mano on 4th and 1 with Bettis in the backfield and losing that battle. That's on the players. And then you come back and not expect a bomb on the play after that, which New England is notorious for (have been forever). That's on the coaches.

Down 10-0 halfway through the 1st quarter. Tough for me to say that's all cheating. That's being out-coached and out-played as well. And in any playoff game (let alone one where we have a conservative coach from the Schottenheimer tree and a rookie QB and game plan designed to play with the lead), it's going to be hard to come back from that. Going to be hard to change game plans, open up the playbook and try to come back against a good team (New England was 14-2 and defending champs). I still argue that 2004 Patriots team with Corey Dillon was their best, most balanced team of their dynasty.

In most cases when I think of our rivalry with the Patriots, I think they are more talented and have the better Coach/QB. The only game I don't was in 2001 AFCCG. And that game was lost on special teams, which was always a complaint under Cowher going back all the way to losing to Eric Metcalf's 2 punt return for TD's. That one is always going to piss me off.

Most of the other games, I think the better team (including coach) won.
Click to expand...

In general, my point is, this losing to the *'s, and even bad losses, has been going on for a long time. It didn't start happening in 2007 and doesn't appear to have happened any more routinely under Tomlin than it did Cowher. That is not intending to compare Tomlin to Cowher, just to point out how long it has been going on.

Just as importantly, all of these "simple" solutions that seem obvious to us are, indeed, being tried by other teams, with about the same level of success.

Spend more on FA DB's? Texans have a pretty expensive DB group (the cheap one just got a big contract elsewhere, I think). They held Brady to a low QB rating, even got an interception or two. End result? Allowed 2 less points than we did.

Play less zone/cover-2, more man, whatever? We played more zone than anyone else? Looking at points allowed, it seems to have worked with everyone else and it seems simple that it won't work against Brady. Look at how many points the *'s scored during the regular season against teams that played less zone than us. Basically, same results.

A couple years ago, Gronk scored 3 or 4 TD's. Everyone here bitched about it. Rex Ryan says in an interview that he knows better than to allow that to happen. Folks here cheer and say "That's the way a coach should be". Result? Gronk doesn't score 3 or 4 TD's. *'s still score 12 more points than they did against us AND, in fact, the *'s score more than 30 points per game for the next 6 games following our game (most were ****** teams...). Didn't their coaches know how simple it is to stop them? What about the other coaches for the rest of the season when they only lost 4 games and only the last two involved the *'s scoring less than 21 points?

The suggestion tht the solution is "simple" and Tomlin is too stupid that he is the only one that doesn't see the "simple" solution is ludicrous.
 
You know, when it really comes down to it, there are just three things that matter in football games: coaching, quarterback and the rest of the team.

I think there is a lot of frustration and resentment that we lose to the Patriots in coaching and quarterback while seemingly doing well in the analysis of "The Rest of the Team". We just wish our coaches would rise to the occasion and be as good as Belichick (and really it's not just him but their entire staff). We wish Roethlisberger would rise to the occasion and be as good as Brady. Because we know if we could just get one piece of that, the rest of the team might do enough to win.

Let's face it, in most games if you win on two of those three areas (coaching, quarterbacking, rest of team), you win.

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it but in many respects it's true.
 
Congratulations Coach Tomlin. I apologize in advance for the things I will say about you. Now get this thing done!!!!!!
 
deljzc said:
You know, when it really comes down to it, there are just three things that matter in football games: coaching, quarterback and the rest of the team.

I think there is a lot of frustration and resentment that we lose to the Patriots in coaching and quarterback while seemingly doing well in the analysis of "The Rest of the Team". We just wish our coaches would rise to the occasion and be as good as Belichick (and really it's not just him but their entire staff). We wish Roethlisberger would rise to the occasion and be as good as Brady. Because we know if we could just get one piece of that, the rest of the team might do enough to win.

Let's face it, in most games if you win on two of those three areas (coaching, quarterbacking, rest of team), you win.

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it but in many respects it's true.
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Agreed..

So with that sound reasoning...

With our record during Tomlins' tenure ....Our two out of three are doing pretty damn good...
 
Supersteeler said:
Seriously, those 0 losing seasons Tomlin has had, enough is enough! And last time I checked his winning percentage was higher than Cowhers, but hey, Rooney Rule, Rooney Rule. I know, Cowher's players he drafted 17 years ago are the reason Tomlin is still winning, everyone knows that. Your politics are leaking into your football.
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Ben hasn't had a losing season either. When Ben Retires ( SOON ), We'll see if Tomlin can win with a loaded team without a Hall of Fame bound Quarterback.

Cowher did 10-6 or better with Tomzack, Stewart, and Maddox and took his team to the lowB repuS with a better than average O'Donnell at quarterback. Just imagine is his wife wasn't dying with cancer and he stuck around with Ben. Cower is 5-1 with Ben in the playoffs, Tomlin is 8-6 with Ben in the playoffs. And Tomlin had Ben in his prime, Cowher did not.

If Tomlin go 10-6 without Ben, all homage to him. If not, many who feel he's over rated will be proven correct.
 
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deljzc said:
You know, when it really comes down to it, there are just three things that matter in football games: coaching, quarterback and the rest of the team.

I think there is a lot of frustration and resentment that we lose to the Patriots in coaching and quarterback while seemingly doing well in the analysis of "The Rest of the Team". We just wish our coaches would rise to the occasion and be as good as Belichick (and really it's not just him but their entire staff). We wish Roethlisberger would rise to the occasion and be as good as Brady. Because we know if we could just get one piece of that, the rest of the team might do enough to win.

Let's face it, in most games if you win on two of those three areas (coaching, quarterbacking, rest of team), you win.

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it but in many respects it's true.
Click to expand...

I would say an average head coach could do the same, but in the playoffs, the team with the best coach and QB tend to win.

Ben is the best QB in just about every playoff game we have played since Tomlin took over, and we lose too often as a points favorite, so those in the business are essentially saying we lose with superior talent.

We also have a bad habit of losing to inferior teams under Tomlin that finish .500 or below with greater frequency than the other top coaches. 1 game blown a year might sound like much, until its the difference between making the playoff or not, and getting a home game in the playoff or going on the road.
 
Cowher had a losing season with Ben as the QB.

Cowher's wife was never on the field to have any gameday impact. It may have been the reason for him retiring, but it didn't cost us games.
 
Cope said:
Cowher had a losing season with Ben as the QB.

Cowher's wife was never on the field to have any gameday impact. It may have been the reason for him retiring, but it didn't cost us games.
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The Steelers went 8-8 that season. It was Ben's health issues that derailed it.

As for Tomlin's extension, I'm not thrilled about it, bit knew it was inevitable.
 
Cope said:
Cowher had a losing season with Ben as the QB.

Cowher's wife was never on the field to have any gameday impact. It may have been the reason for him retiring, but it didn't cost us games.
Click to expand...

I could be wrong but as far as I recall, Mrs. Cowher was not diagnosed with cancer until after he retired and moved to NC.
 
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