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The Coronavirus thread

SteelerInLebanon said:
No one in their right minds I have heard has said our outcome will be like Italy, the continuing point is we have to keep it from being like Italy.


Total New Total Deaths New Deaths Recovered Active Serious/Crit Per 1M POP
Italy 53,578 +6,557 4,825 +793 6,072 42,681 2,857 886
USA 22,738 +3,355 288 +32 171 22,279 64 69
We are doing a better job of distancing but New York City is a disaster of cases so far.
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I hope you’re right.
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2020/3/20/21179040/coronavirus-us-italy-not-overreacting

A lot of these graphs don’t look promising, but we also have population spread throughout and places like NYC, LA have large populations
 
MTC said:
I hope you’re right.
https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2020/3/20/21179040/coronavirus-us-italy-not-overreacting

A lot of these graphs don’t look promising, but we also have population spread throughout and places like NYC, LA have large populations
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We have two realities right now, NYC and the rest of the country. NYC makes up half of all cases. I’d like to see those graphs with NYC taken out and see if they are any more promising. God help NYC, that could be another Italy.
 
I see Tibs is "trying" not to get political but he can't hide what he is trying to get across.

BTW why didn't you include this little bit from the article instead of just the standard scare tactic? "It is no secret that coronavirus testing in the United States has lagged compare to other countries. Limited testing in the United States potentially downplays the numbers below, leaving the true number of cases unknown. In the past week, the number of tests conducted in the United States has increased, however, the data for the past couple days has not been compiled yet. This could skew the numbers to look like coronavirus is growing faster, yet we are simply testing more.Ultimately, it's impossible to capture the true number of coronavirus cases at any given point. The numbers show the minimum number of COVID-19 cases and are highly dependent on two factors: population and rate of testing."

So in the article it says the numbers are basically unknown but never waste a crisis I guess?
 
Vader said:
I see Tibs is "trying" not to get political but he can't hide what he is trying to get across.
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What am I 'hiding' and trying to get across? Sharing worldwide data as I continue to be alarmed by the number of folks not seeing this for what it is?

TimSteelersfan had one of his typical meltdowns a month ago that I was making this 'political' when I dared criticize Trump & the US gov that they weren't acting fast enough. You know, when he was getting urgent & dire reports back in January from his intelligence agencies, but downplayed the threat and went golfing instead. And now he's crying that the Chinese should have let him know earlier, that all this came as a surprise to him. What a joke.

Now I completely ignore Trump and simply post actual information, and you attack me regardless.

It always has been, and always will be a zero sum game posting on this board. Not sure why I even bother.

Stick your head in the sand all you want, that's your perogative.
 
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Trog, the US numbers I used are from the John Hopkins site: current confirmed cases 24,148. The state number is from the live science site I posted, which shows: 8,310. Which is 34%.

The sad fact is, with the low testing thus far, these numbers may be nowhere near the actual numbers. That would be true for NY, CA and elsewhere around the country.

So I do agree, the current stats need to be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately, it's not a game of numbers & stats, but a race against time, imo. What's been alarming in places like Italy, has been the number of 30-60 year olds who have caught the virus. It's a pretty big leap of faith at this stage to claim this only affects the elderly. Look at the number of doctors who've died, and 3,500 health care workers afflicted in Italy. No way those people are all in their 70's...
 
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Beaches are packed in St. Augustine, Florida. That's about 15 miles from me. And I do mean packed. This is just south of Jacksonville Beach. Which is closed. It should be interesting to see the outcome. I'd wager not much out of it considering the outdoors location.
 
India has only tested 14,000 over the last few days, we have tested over 100,000. So obviously we are going to have many more confirmed cases. Italy has almost the number of new cases as we do over the last several days, however it has just 18% of the population of the United States.

We don't have the foggiest idea how many people actually have the virus or had it weeks or months ago and never got tested, . Of those who just recently tested positive we don't know how long they may have had it. So percentage of growth in number of confirmed cases on any given day or set of a few days is pretty much one of the most meaningless statistics there is. That's a stat about how fast we are testing, not how fast the virus is spreading. Data can be twisted to make it sound better or worse than it is.

Ultimately we will see hundreds of thousands if not millions of cases, just like we do with the flu every year. The actual mortality rate will be the issue, and it is virtually impossible to calculate or even estimate at this point, given the fact that the sickest make up the vast majority who are actually getting tested.
 
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Troglodyte said:
Nope.

I’ve been saying that the economy was fake, based on people borrowing and spending more and more and that it wouldn’t be resilient if and when the **** hit the fan.

So was it resilient, at all?
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How does one "fake " an economy Trogtard?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Steeler Nation mobile app
 
Tibs said:
What am I 'hiding' and trying to get across?
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You omitted parts of the article that softened the news. Journalists do **** like this all the time.

Tibs said:
TimSteelersfan had one of his typical meltdowns a month ago that I was making this 'political' when I dared criticize Trump & the US gov that they weren't acting fast enough.
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No, I criticized you for politicizing this issue when you in fact were NOT criticizing the US Government not acting fast enough. Your Post #4 in this thread below pasted because Liberals are allergic to facts. What you specifically said:

1. Before knowing squat about ****, you simply criticized Trump for putting Pence in charge.
2. You posted a link to WashPo discussing fears growing and markets tumbling
3. You hoped city and state governments would get ahead of the curve.
4. You posted a mock up vid ridiculing the President discussing funding to develop a vaccine.

Facts: You politicized in your VERY FIRST POST and second, you never ever in this post criticized the US Government for not acting fast enough. You stand corrected AGAIN.

----------------------------------------------

Tibs said:
Nothing to worry about as super-smart genius, always forthright & honest Trump has handed over the baton to world-renowed scientist, pandemic virus expert VP Mike Pence to handle.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">At the Coronavirus press conference, Trump contradicted scientists just seconds after they’d spoken.<br><br>CDC: It’s only a matter of time until the disease spreads in America.<br><br>Trump: I don’t think so, and no one knows more about infectious diseases than I do.<a href="https://t.co/wtmot3QtBz">https://t.co/wtmot3QtBz</a></p>— Dr. David A. Lustig (@drdave1999) <a href="https://twitter.com/drdave1999/status/1233013791534800897?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 27, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Fears grow of a coronavirus pandemic as markets stumble again
https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...live-updates/#link-CMIRHGDM2VB7TBLIOH7IRBG7YE


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">BREAKING: President Trump calls a press conference to assure the American people that the <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Coronavirus?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Coronavirus</a> has been completely contained, and that there is no legitimate threat to any Americans.<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CoronavirusOutbreak?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#CoronavirusOutbreak</a> <a href="https://t.co/7DJa9rOiYX">pic.twitter.com/7DJa9rOiYX</a></p>— Paul Lidicul (@PaulLidicul) <a href="https://twitter.com/PaulLidicul/status/1232521315254292480?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 26, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I hope local city and State goverments can get ahead of the curve on this. Situation is probably worse then what it seems on the surface, as is usually the case. Hope everyone stays safe and this thing remains manageable.
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Those who still think this is some sort of flu would be well served to read this first-hand report from a respiratory therapist in Louisiana, working with Covid-19 patients. It's fairly lengthy, but I think it helps puts this disease into perspective, as far as what doctors, and the health care system is dealing with.

A Medical Worker Describes Terrifying Lung Failure From COVID-19 — Even in His Young Patients
https://www.propublica.org/article/...ilure-from-covid19-even-in-his-young-patients

As of Friday, Louisiana was reporting 479 confirmed cases of COVID-19, one of the highest numbers in the country. Ten people had died. The majority of cases are in New Orleans, which now has one confirmed case for every 1,000 residents. New Orleans had held Mardi Gras celebrations just two weeks before its first patient, with more than a million revelers on its streets.

I spoke to a respiratory therapist there, whose job is to ensure that patients are breathing well. He works in a medium-sized city hospital’s intensive care unit. (We are withholding his name and employer, as he fears retaliation.) Before the virus came to New Orleans, his days were pretty relaxed, nebulizing patients with asthma, adjusting oxygen tubes that run through the nose or, in the most severe cases, setting up and managing ventilators. His patients were usually older, with chronic health conditions and bad lungs.

Since last week, he’s been running ventilators for the sickest COVID-19 patients. Many are relatively young, in their 40s and 50s, and have minimal, if any, preexisting conditions in their charts. He is overwhelmed, stunned by the manifestation of the infection, both its speed and intensity. The ICU where he works has essentially become a coronavirus unit. He estimates that his hospital has admitted dozens of confirmed or presumptive coronavirus patients. About a third have ended up on ventilators.

His hospital had not prepared for this volume before the virus first appeared. One physician had tried to raise alarms, asking about negative pressure rooms and ventilators. Most staff concluded that he was overreacting. “They thought the media was overhyping it,” the respiratory therapist told me. “In retrospect, he was right to be concerned.”

He spoke to me by phone on Thursday about why, exactly, he has been so alarmed. His account has been condensed and edited for clarity.
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“Reading about it in the news, I knew it was going to be bad, but we deal with the flu every year so I was thinking: Well, it’s probably not that much worse than the flu. But seeing patients with COVID-19 completely changed my perspective, and it’s a lot more frightening.”

“I have patients in their early 40s and, yeah, I was kind of shocked. I’m seeing people who look relatively healthy with a minimal health history, and they are completely wiped out, like they’ve been hit by a truck. This is knocking out what should be perfectly fit, healthy people. Patients will be on minimal support, on a little bit of oxygen, and then all of a sudden, they go into complete respiratory arrest, shut down and can’t breathe at all.”

“We have an observation unit in the hospital, and we have been admitting patients that had tested positive or are presumptive positive — these are patients that had been in contact with people who were positive. We go and check vitals on patients every four hours, and some are on a continuous cardiac monitor, so we see that their heart rate has a sudden increase or decrease, or someone goes in and sees that the patient is struggling to breathe or is unresponsive. That seems to be what happens to a lot of these patients: They suddenly become unresponsive or go into respiratory failure.”

“It’s called acute respiratory distress syndrome, ARDS. That means the lungs are filled with fluid. And it’s notable for the way the X-ray looks: The entire lung is basically whited out from fluid. Patients with ARDS are extremely difficult to oxygenate. It has a really high mortality rate, about 40%. The way to manage it is to put a patient on a ventilator. The additional pressure helps the oxygen go into the bloodstream.
<aside class="pullquote-left">
“With this virus, it seems like it happens overnight.”
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</aside>
“Normally, ARDS is something that happens over time as the lungs get more and more inflamed. But with this virus, it seems like it happens overnight. When you’re healthy, your lung is made up of little balloons. Like a tree is made out of a bunch of little leaves, the lung is made of little air sacs that are called the alveoli. When you breathe in, all of those little air sacs inflate, and they have capillaries in the walls, little blood vessels. The oxygen gets from the air in the lung into the blood so it can be carried around the body.

“Typically with ARDS, the lungs become inflamed. It’s like inflammation anywhere: If you have a burn on your arm, the skin around it turns red from additional blood flow. The body is sending it additional nutrients to heal. The problem is, when that happens in your lungs, fluid and extra blood starts going to the lungs. Viruses can injure cells in the walls of the alveoli, so the fluid leaks into the alveoli. A telltale sign of ARDS in an X-ray is what’s called ‘ground glass opacity,’ like an old-fashioned ground glass privacy window in a shower. And lungs look that way because fluid is white on an X-ray, so the lung looks like white ground glass, or sometimes pure white, because the lung is filled with so much fluid, displacing where the air would normally be.”

“With our coronavirus patients, once they’re on ventilators, most need about the highest settings that we can do. About 90% oxygen, and 16 of PEEP, positive end-expiratory pressure, which keeps the lung inflated. This is nearly as high as I’ve ever seen. The level we’re at means we are running out of options.

“In my experience, this severity of ARDS is usually more typical of someone who has a near drowning experience—they have a bunch of dirty water in their lungs—or people who inhale caustic gas. Especially for it to have such an acute onset like that. I’ve never seen a microorganism or an infectious process cause such acute damage to the lungs so rapidly. That was what really shocked me.”
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“It first struck me how different it was when I saw my first coronavirus patient go bad. I was like, ‘Holy ****, this is not the flu.’ Watching this relatively young guy, gasping for air, pink frothy secretions coming out of his tube and out of his mouth. The ventilator should have been doing the work of breathing but he was still gasping for air, moving his mouth, moving his body, struggling. We had to restrain him. With all the coronavirus patients, we’ve had to restrain them. They really hyperventilate, really struggle to breathe. When you’re in that mindstate of struggling to breathe and delirious with fever, you don’t know when someone is trying to help you, so you’ll try to rip the breathing tube out because you feel it is choking you, but you are drowning.
<aside class="pullquote-left">
“Holy ****, this is not the flu.”</aside>
“When someone has an infection, I’m used to seeing the normal colors you’d associate with it: greens and yellows. The coronavirus patients with ARDS have been having a lot of secretions that are actually pink because they’re filled with blood cells that are leaking into their airways. They are essentially drowning in their own blood and fluids because their lungs are so full. So we’re constantly having to suction out the secretions every time we go into their rooms.”

“Before this, we were all joking. It’s grim humor. If you are exposed to the virus and test positive and go on quarantine, you get paid. We were all joking: I want to get the coronavirus because then I get a paid vacation from work. And once I saw these patients with it, I was like, ‘Holy ****, I do not want to catch this and I don’t want anyone I know to catch this.’
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“I worked a long stretch of days last week, and I watched it go from this novelty to a serious issue. We had one or two patients at our hospital, and then five to 10 patients, and then 20 patients. Every day, the intensity kept ratcheting up. More patients, and the patients themselves are starting to get sicker and sicker. When it first started, we all had tons of equipment, tons of supplies, and as we started getting more patients, we started to run out. They had to ration supplies. At first we were trying to use one mask per patient. Then it was just: You get one mask for positive patients, another mask for everyone else. And now it’s just: You get one mask.

“I work 12-hour shifts. Right now, we are running about four times the number of ventilators than we normally have going. We have such a large volume of patients, but it’s really hard to find enough people to fill all the shifts. The caregiver-to-patient ratio has gone down, and you can’t spend as much time with each patient, you can’t adjust the vent settings as aggressively because you’re not going into the room as often. And we’re also trying to avoid going into the room as much as possible to reduce infection risk of staff and to conserve personal protective equipment.”

“But we are trying to wean down the settings on the ventilator as much as possible, because you don’t want someone to be on the ventilator longer than they need to be. Your risk of mortality increases every day that you spend on a ventilator. The high pressures from high vent settings is pushing air into the lung and can overinflate those little balloons. They can pop. It can destroy the alveoli. Even if you survive ARDS, although some damage can heal, it can also do long-lasting damage to the lungs. They can get filled up with scar tissue. ARDS can lead to cognitive decline. Some people’s muscles waste away, and it takes them a long time to recover once they come off the ventilator.
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“There is a very real possibility that we might run out of ICU beds and at that point I don’t know what happens if patients get sick and need to be intubated and put on a ventilator. Is that person going to die because we don’t have the equipment to keep them alive? What if it goes on for months and dozens of people die because we don’t have the ventilators?

“Hopefully we don’t get there, but if you only have one ventilator, and you have two patients, you’re going to have to go with the one who has a higher likelihood of surviving. And I’m afraid we’ll get to that point. I’ve heard that’s happening in Italy.”
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It's a pretty big leap of faith at this stage to claim this only affects the elderly.
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Nobody said it only affects the elderly. The fact is the vast majority of deaths occur in the elderly.

The average age of those who have died in Italy is 79.5. 99% of the fatalities occurred in people with other illnesses.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says

Yes, that's still awful and sad. It's not true that younger people won't get sick. But it's not a leap of faith to say that the vast majority of people who are not elderly and don't suffer from other health conditions don't need to panic. That's a fact.

We do need to slow the spread to avoid overwhelming our healthcare system. We don't need to all fear that death is right around the corner. And at some point we're going to have to make the calculation that destroying the economic lives of almost everyone is not worth saving the lives of a few. Yes, it sounds harsh and brutal but the reality is the human misery caused by some of the proposed "solutions" is eventually going to outweigh the benefits.
 
Since the way it is transmitted is by cough particles landing in your mouth/nose - I don't understand why regular masks would not be effective. They are saying this is not an aerosol transmission where these tiny particles are floating in the air and getting into any breach of your mask. This is direct contamination from a couch by an infected person near you. I don't think you need special N95 rated masks.
 
Tibs said:
Trog, the US numbers I used are from the John Hopkins site: current confirmed cases 24,148. The state number is from the live science site I posted, which shows: 8,310. Which is 34%.

The sad fact is, with the low testing thus far, these numbers may be nowhere near the actual numbers. That would be true for NY, CA and elsewhere around the country.

So I do agree, the current stats need to be taken with a grain of salt. Unfortunately, it's not a game of numbers & stats, but a race against time, imo. What's been alarming in places like Italy, has been the number of 30-60 year olds who have caught the virus. It's a pretty big leap of faith at this stage to claim this only affects the elderly. Look at the number of doctors who've died, and 3,500 health care workers afflicted in Italy. No way those people are all in their 70's...
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I was looking at the New York TImes site that has a map and by state numbers. They have NY well over 10,000. Case stats just went out the window though as NYC just announced they will cease testing non-hospitalized patients. So the true number of cases will ultimately be based on models based on assumptions and any decision to lift lock-downs and closures will also be based on assumptions.
 
oftb, while the death rate is high with the elderly, this is worth watching..as far as how it's affecting patients of all ages. Look, I'm not trying to scare anyone. I myself am trying to get as much information I can. The disease seems to spread freely between young, middle aged and the elderly. The death rates may be much higher with older and weaker patients, but I don't think it's a legitimate argument that this only effects our senior citizens.

 
FDA authorizes first rapid, 'point of care' coronavirus test

The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has approved the first coronavirus diagnostic test that can be conducted entirely at the point of care.

The test from California-based Cepheid will deliver results in about 45 minutes - much faster than current tests that require a sample to be sent to a centralized lab, where results can take days.

The test has been designed to operate on any of Cepheid's more than 23,000 automated GeneXpert Systems worldwide, of which 5,000 are in the U.S., the company said. The systems are already being used to test for conditions such as HIV and tuberculosis.

The systems do not require users to have specialty training to perform testing and are capable of running around the clock.

"An accurate test delivered close to the patient can be transformative" and can "help alleviate the pressure" that the COVID-19 outbreak has put on health facilities, David Persing, Cepheid's chief medical and technology officer, said in a statement.

"People in general are frustrated with the turnaround time. They don't know their status until days later. Knowing your status quickly ... will allow much better decisionmaking" and help doctors choose the best treatment, Persing said in a video on the company's website.

The test initially will be used primarily by hospitals, the company said, but the FDA's "emergency use authorization" covers all "patient care settings," including doctors' offices.

The test will begin shipping next week.
 
Tibs said:
oftb, while the death rate is high with the elderly, this is worth watching..as far as how it's affecting patients of all ages. Look, I'm not trying to scare anyone. I myself am trying to get as much information I can. The disease seems to spread freely between young, middle aged and the elderly. The death rates may be much higher with older and weaker patients, but I don't think it's a legitimate argument that this only effects our senior citizens.

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Nobody is making the argument that "it only affects our senior citizens". You keep setting up that strawman to try and knock it down.

And anecdotes are not data.
 
This article is SUPER. I encourage everyone to read. Does a good job of explaining how the stats are so incredibly misleading.

https://medium.com/six-four-six-nine/evidence-over-hysteria-covid-19-1b767def5894

Evidence over hysteria — COVID-19

After watching the outbreak of COVID-19 for the past two months, I’ve followed the pace of the infection, its severity, and how our world is tackling the virus. While we should be concerned and diligent, the situation has dramatically elevated to a mob-like fear spreading faster than COVID-19 itself. When 13% of Americans believe they are currently infected with COVID-19 (mathematically impossible), full-on panic is blocking our ability to think clearly and determine how to deploy our resources to stop this virus. Over three-fourths of Americans are scared of what we are doing to our society through law and hysteria, not of infection or spreading COVID-19 to those most vulnerable.

The following article is a systematic overview of COVID-19 driven by data from medical professionals and academic articles that will help you understand what is going on (sources include CDC, WHO, NIH, NHS, University of Oxford, John Hopkins, Stanford, Harvard, NEJM, JAMA, and several others). I’m quite experienced at understanding virality, how things grow, and data. In my vocation, I’m most known for popularizing the “growth hacking movement” in Silicon Valley that specializes in driving rapid and viral adoption of technology products. Data is data. Our focus here isn’t treatments but numbers. You don’t need a special degree to understand what the data says and doesn’t say. Numbers are universal.

I hope you walk away with a more informed perspective on how you can help and fight back against the hysteria that is driving our country into a dark place. You can help us focus our scarce resources on those who are most vulnerable, who need our help.

Note: The following graphs and numbers are as of mid-March 2020. Things are moving quickly, so I update this article twice a day. Most graphs are as of March 20th, 2020. Follow me on Twitter if you would like to see the updated graphics and articles.

Best,

Aaron Ginn

Here are the chapters involved:

Table of Contents
  1. Total cases are the wrong metric
  2. Time lapsing new cases gives us perspective
  3. On a per-capita basis, we shouldn’t be panicking
  4. COVID-19 is spreading
  5. Watch the Bell Curve
  6. A low probability of catching COVID-19
  7. Common transmission modes
  8. COVID-19 is likely to burn off in the summer
  9. Children and Teens aren’t at risk
  10. Strong, but unknown viral effect
  11. What about asymptomatic spread?
  12. 93% of people who think they are positive aren’t
  13. 1% of cases will be severe
  14. Declining fatality rate
  15. So what should we do?
  16. Start with basic hygiene
  17. More data
  18. Open schools
  19. Open up public spaces
  20. Support business and productivity
  21. People fear what the government will do, not infection
  22. Expand medical capacity
  23. Don’t let them forget it and vote

Preview:

Every country has a different population size which skews aggregate and cumulative case comparisons. By controlling for population, you can properly weigh the number of cases in the context of the local population size. Viruses don’t acknowledge our human borders. The US population is 5.5X greater than Italy, 6X larger than South Korea, and 25% the size of China. Comparing the US total number of cases in absolute terms is rather silly.

Rank ordering based on the total number of cases shows that the US on a per-capita basis is significantly lower than the top six nations by case volume. On a 1 million citizen per-capita basis, the US moves to above mid-pack of all countries and rising, with similar case volume as Singapore (385 cases), Cyprus (75 cases), and United Kingdom(3,983 cases). This is data as of March 20th, 2020.
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Confluence said:
How does one "fake " an economy Trogtard?
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My sister-in-law’s family has Penguins season tickets, they fly down to Florida for vacation every year, and they lease new cars every four years, including those of their kids. They have no savings, retirement or otherwise, despite being in their 50’s because... they can’t afford it. They live paycheck to paycheck as do many Americans. They love variable rates and when interest rates drop. If they were to stop living this way, it would be prudent however, it would also severely hurt the US “economy”.

It’s fake.
 
oneforthebus said:
Nobody is making the argument that "it only affects our senior citizens". You keep setting up that strawman to try and knock it down.

And anecdotes are not data.
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I think you'll really enjoy the article I just posted based upon your contributions to the thread about "data". Pretty interesting.
 
Tibs, I’m not scared. I went to Auto Zone, Aldi, Walmart and the county landfill today. As I said, I will wash my hands and **** like that, but I am not going to barricade myself in my house hoping I don’t get sick. This nonsense of shutting down states and airlines and businesses will do more damage to this country than the virus will. Korea has this **** figured out. They are employing a policy of trace, test and treat that allows them to identify and isolate those infected while allowing healthy people to live their lives. They haven’t shut down their nation. And they are slowing the spread.

Here in America, everyone is running around with their hair on fire, waving their arms and screaming and hoarding toilet paper. Our answer is to tell everyone to stay home and shut down 90% of the economy. Stupid.
 
Troglodyte said:
My sister-in-law’s family has Penguins season tickets, they fly down to Florida for vacation every year, and they lease new cars every four years, including those of their kids. They have no savings, retirement or otherwise, despite being in their 50’s because... they can’t afford it. They live paycheck to paycheck as do many Americans. They love variable rates and when interest rates drop. If they were to stop living this way, it would be prudent however, it would also severely hurt the US “economy”.

It’s fake.
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Ridiculous. There are always people living on credit/paycheck to paycheck. Record employment, GDP - the longest expansion in US history. Nothing fake about it, and I hope you know that and are just acting stupid. This isn't an arguable point.
 
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