Covid Vaccine

[Tim Steelersfan]

Some interesting data...

United States — As of June 11, 2021, the U.S. Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System (VAERS) had posted 358,379 adverse events, including 5,993 deaths and 29,871 serious injuries. In the 12- to 17-year-old age group, there were 271 serious illnesses and seven deaths. Among pregnant women, there were 2,136 adverse events, including 707 miscarriages or premature births.

Now Floggy gone tell ya only 1 kid died from the vaccines. Hell, 7 died just in the 12-17 year age group...omits 18 and those 0-11. But let's stray from that data and look at the whole picture.

The reported death rate from Covid-19 shots now exceeds the reported death rate of more than 70 vaccines combined over the past 30 years, and is about 500 times deadlier than the seasonal flu vaccine, which historically has been the most hazardous.

Wait, what? These COVID vaccines have a higher death rate than SEVENTY vaccines combined over 30 years? FIVE HUNDRED times deadlier than the flu vax? Nooooooooo

The Covid-19 shots are also claimed to be five times more dangerous than the pandemic H1N1 vaccine, which had a 25-per-million severe side effect rate. Assuming the Covid-19 shots had the same side effect rate, and assuming some 200 million got the vaccine, the estimated number of people suffering a serious side effect would be about 5,000. We have passed that already, as 35,864 people have been seriously injured or killed.

Hmmm, ok

In the European Union’s database of adverse drug reactions from Covid-19 shots, called EudraVigilance, there were 1,509,266 reported adverse reactions, including 15,472 deaths as of June 19.

Wow, ok.

Remarkably, about half of all reported illnesses — 753,657 — are listed as “serious,” meaning the injury is life-threatening, requires hospitalization, results in a medically important condition, significant disability, or persistent incapacity.

The British Yellow Card system had received, as of June 9, 2021, 276,867 adverse event reports following Covid-19 vaccination, including 1,332 deaths.

Yeah, but that's just the U.K.

According to a report by the Israeli People Committee, a civilian body of health experts, “there has never been a vaccine that has harmed as many people.” For example, Israeli data show boys and men between the ages of 16 and 24 who have been vaccinated have 25 times the rate of myocarditis (heart inflammation) than normal.

Males aged 16-24 have a TWENTY FIVE times higher rate of heart inflammation.....

Carry on.

 

[Stainless]

For anyone using VAERS as their source of deaths attributable to the vaccines, assuming that's what you're actually doing, you may want to qualify your position/statements with the disclaimer that reports of death are not equivalent to cause of death.

 

[Troglodyte]

Some interesting data...



Now Floggy gone tell ya only 1 kid died from the vaccines. Hell, 7 died just in the 12-17 year age group...omits 18 and those 0-11. But let's stray from that data and look at the whole picture.



Wait, what? These COVID vaccines have a higher death rate than SEVENTY vaccines combined over 30 years? FIVE HUNDRED times deadlier than the flu vax? Nooooooooo



Hmmm, ok



Wow, ok.





Yeah, but that's just the U.K.



Males aged 16-24 have a TWENTY FIVE times higher rate of heart inflammation.....

Carry on.

Not seeing where it says seven deaths, but for argument’s sake, never mind that, “let’s say” that is true. Where are the other 493-1,093 deaths???

Back to your toil trying to prove you’re not a delusional, ideological zealot.

 

[madinsomniac]

For anyone using VAERS as their source of deaths attributable to the vaccines, assuming that's what you're actually doing, you may want to qualify your position/statements with the disclaimer that reports of death are not equivalent to cause of death.

True but then you have to apply that to covid deaths too... that number is every death that potentially could have been caused by the virus... the virus doesn’t even have to have been detected in the death to have been counted

I don’t really care if they use real numbers or estimates, but if you do potential death estimates then you have to also use total case estimates, which drops the virus death rates to a smidge over the flu.

it doesn’t matter though... the CDC and European counterparts have always pulled vaccines with around 50 non co morbidity deaths associated for more testing with them and they have well past that here...

This is an extremely bad idea right now... and im not a big antivax proponent in most cases

there is a real bad question about heart and blood complications here... it needs to be sorted out asap and frankly the protection factor is being reported as almost irrelevant in some countries... fully vaccinated cases are common and around 50% of cases in several countries that are tracking it

 

[Troglodyte]

For anyone using VAERS as their source of deaths attributable to the vaccines, assuming that's what you're actually doing, you may want to qualify your position/statements with the disclaimer that reports of death are not equivalent to cause of death.

Oh, Tim could officially give a ****, trust me!

 

[madinsomniac]

So here are the basic facts that matter as far as i am concerned

the vast majority of both the virus and the vaccine deaths are old sick people that were probably dead with any infection... the average age of the vaccine related deaths is about five to six years younger than the virus deaths, but you have to factor that a large portion of the virus deaths took out the older people most likely to have vaccine complications too.

the death percentage of the vaccine is about equivalent to aspirin deaths... it’s mostly safe

the death rate for young people from the virus makes it irrelevant and stupid to force the vaccine on them, period... if you actually like science read the papers on this... it’s illogical to chance short and long term complications on a age segment that is an extremely low percentage of bad complications

yeah its harsh, but the reality is older people should risk it, young people shouldn’t and everyone in the middle should read as much as they can and follow their conscience... especially since the mutations probably means its just going to cycle with lower symptoms variants for a long time and the vaccines probably will be like the flu ones where annual shots are needed .

the important thing is not to judge people who have or haven’t gotten it... its absolutely a difficult position for either decision

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Not seeing where it says seven deaths, but for argument’s sake, never mind that, “let’s say” that is true. Where are the other 493-1,093 deaths???

Back to your toil trying to prove you’re not a delusional, ideological zealot.

What the post that you quoted and replied to establishes is that the vaccines are more dangerous than any vaccine we have prescribed to humanity in what...a century? More adverse events than 70 vaccines combined over 30 years.

They are untested. They are not approved. They are killing people. They are harming people. For a virus that just is not as deadly as you believe, as your media has led us to believe.

The vaccines now have official warnings forced on them by the FDA because they cause heart inflammation. The post goes on to illustrate factual data from around the globe from numerous constituencies demonstrably showing there is grave reason to be concerned with the vaccines.

Further, and has been established, forcing these vaccines on the very population that needs them the least - the 0-18 age group - is not necessary and at best dangerous. It is established that it is causing heart inflammation in otherwise healthy young people, people that have a 0.000005 chance of dying from COVID...an age group that is FAR more at risk of dying from under age drinking.

To force vaccines on this age group is dangerous. Period. And you can provide NO reasonable reason to do so. None.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Stainless said:
For anyone using VAERS as their source of deaths attributable to the vaccines, assuming that's what you're actually doing, you may want to qualify your position/statements with the disclaimer that reports of death are not equivalent to cause of death.

Oh, Tim could officially give a ****, trust me!

As was previously stated, these quotes illustrate the hypocrisy of the Left.

For over a year, we objected to the arbitrary means by which COVID deaths were labeled COVID deaths. Die in a motorcycle accident, test positive for COVID, it was labeled a COVID death. Dr. Birx herself admitted that all deaths, regardless of cause, where the victim had COVID....gunshot, suicide, car accident....would be labeled a COVID death even though COVID wasn't the cause of death.

Your side ridiculed anyone who would question the over-representation of COVID deaths.

COVID deaths were over-inflated.

Now.....when people point to VAERS and point out all of the adverse effects, deaths, injury that are tied to the vaccines, now your side says woah, wait a damned minute...just because someone died immediately after getting the vaccine doesn't mean they died because of the vaccine.



Pick your argument instead of vacillating between positions.

If you insist everyone died because of COVID....even if they didn't die due to COVID...then you must also admit everyone that died after receiving the vaccine died because of the vaccine. It's the same logic.

Or you must admit that not everyone that died while having COVID died because of COVID.

Take ONE position.

 

[Troglodyte]

What the post that you quoted and replied to establishes is that the vaccines are more dangerous than any vaccine we have prescribed to humanity in what...a century? More adverse events than 70 vaccines combined over 30 years.

They are untested. They are not approved. They are killing people. They are harming people. For a virus that just is not as deadly as you believe, as your media has led us to believe.

The vaccines now have official warnings forced on them by the FDA because they cause heart inflammation. The post goes on to illustrate factual data from around the globe from numerous constituencies demonstrably showing there is grave reason to be concerned with the vaccines.

Further, and has been established, forcing these vaccines on the very population that needs them the least - the 0-18 age group - is not necessary and at best dangerous. It is established that it is causing heart inflammation in otherwise healthy young people, people that have a 0.000005 chance of dying from COVID...an age group that is FAR more at risk of dying from under age drinking.

To force vaccines on this age group is dangerous. Period. And you can provide NO reasonable reason to do so. None.

“Reasonable reason” FFS. Other than bringing a pandemic to an end? There are reasons to get vaccinated other than preventing death.

The vaccine has minuscule risks. Should everything that has a minuscule risk that isn’t necessary for children be banned because of that minuscule risk? The leading cause of death for children is accidents (car accidents, drowning, etc.). Should children be banned from swimming pools as they aren’t necessary? That’s essentially your “reasonable reason” for children not getting vaccinated. You’re like a neurotic, overprotective mother.

 

[Troglodyte]

As was previously stated, these quotes illustrate the hypocrisy of the Left.

For over a year, we objected to the arbitrary means by which COVID deaths were labeled COVID deaths. Die in a motorcycle accident, test positive for COVID, it was labeled a COVID death. Dr. Birx herself admitted that all deaths, regardless of cause, where the victim had COVID....gunshot, suicide, car accident....would be labeled a COVID death even though COVID wasn't the cause of death.

Your side ridiculed anyone who would question the over-representation of COVID deaths.

COVID deaths were over-inflated.

Now.....when people point to VAERS and point out all of the adverse effects, deaths, injury that are tied to the vaccines, now your side says woah, wait a damned minute...just because someone died immediately after getting the vaccine doesn't mean they died because of the vaccine.



Pick your argument instead of vacillating between positions.

If you insist everyone died because of COVID....even if they didn't die due to COVID...then you must also admit everyone that died after receiving the vaccine died because of the vaccine. It's the same logic.

Or you must admit that not everyone that died while having COVID died because of COVID.

Take ONE position.

Here’s ONE position: Covid was related to 600,000+ deaths, the vaccine is POSSIBLY related to 5,000 deaths.

What’s your one position?

 

[Stainless]

As was previously stated, these quotes illustrate the hypocrisy of the Left.

Until today, I never realized there was hypocrisy in the truth. Does stating something truthful place me firmly on the left? If so, I find that very interesting. I'm pretty sure I've never made any comments about Covid death calculations. I have no insight worth mentioning, and you'll need to take those arguments up with whoever reports cause of death. I do know that reports in VAERS are not synonymous with cause of death. If you're actually interested in the truth, it's probably important to be consistent.

 

[stillwright]

Here’s ONE position: Covid was related to 600,000+ deaths, the vaccine is POSSIBLY related to 5,000 deaths.

What’s your one position?

Now break down the deaths by age groups. Use those numbers and then determine the risk rewards for the young to get the vaccine. You are you the right path now. Good job.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

The vaccine has minuscule risks.

That's just flat out lying bullshit. When these vaccines have SEVENTY TIMES more adverse events than ALL vaccines combined for 30 years, you aren't even close to being right.

People the world over have a right to be concerned about these vaccines for a pandemic that sort of wasn't. It just wasn't that deadly at all.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Here’s ONE position: Covid was related to 600,000+ deaths, the vaccine is POSSIBLY related to 5,000 deaths.

What’s your one position?

What is yours? You argued once that COVID deaths were UNDER REPORTED. You laughed at people pointing out the gross misreporting of COVID deaths.

Now you believe only a % of VAERS-reported incidents are really vaccine related....

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Until today, I never realized there was hypocrisy in the truth. Does stating something truthful place me firmly on the left? If so, I find that very interesting. I'm pretty sure I've never made any comments about Covid death calculations. I have no insight worth mentioning, and you'll need to take those arguments up with whoever reports cause of death. I do know that reports in VAERS are not synonymous with cause of death. If you're actually interested in the truth, it's probably important to be consistent.

I'm not saying you are on the Left, nor did I. I've read this argument in about a dozen places now. It's being used by the rags and the media anytime any other outlet dares write about the extraordinary high number of adverse events related to the vaccine.

There is a hypocrisy on display on this issue. For over a year, those interested in the truth demanded the REAL numbers on COVID deaths. Those asking for the truth were ridiculed. Told to trust big daddy government. That the #s were accurate and YES that if you died in a motorcycle accident and had COVID that truly was a COVID death (they said it with a straight face). We know for a fact that COVID deaths were over reported.

Now those same rags did a full 180. When VAERS lists COVID + [some adverse reaction/death] in their database, these SAME people are running out saying "it's faulty to call of those incidents 'vaccine related' because it could just be circumstantial that these people had an event and took the vax."

Hmmm...ya mean like dying of a gunshot while the corpse tested positive for COVID???

The same people in the same groups make the same arguments. As will and have people here.

I'm calling out that bullshit.

No, 100% of the events listed in VAERS aren't truly vax-related. Likewise, 100% of the 600K reported COVID deaths were not COVID-caused deaths.

Which way are we gonna have it?

 

[Troglodyte]

Now break down the deaths by age groups. Use those numbers and then determine the risk rewards for the young to get the vaccine. You are you the right path now. Good job.

Exactly, the rewards for getting the vaccine far outweigh the risks, that’s why the CDC is still recommending vaccination for young people.

 

[Troglodyte]

That's just flat out lying bullshit. When these vaccines have SEVENTY TIMES more adverse events than ALL vaccines combined for 30 years, you aren't even close to being right.

People the world over have a right to be concerned about these vaccines for a pandemic that sort of wasn't. It just wasn't that deadly at all.

30k serious injuries, 6k deaths out of 200 Million vaccinations. What’s so risky?

 

[Troglodyte]

What is yours? You argued once that COVID deaths were UNDER REPORTED. You laughed at people pointing out the gross misreporting of COVID deaths.

Now you believe only a % of VAERS-reported incidents are really vaccine related....

View attachment 5532

When did I say deaths were under-ureported?

If Covid deaths were under-reported, it’s a hell of an anomaly that deaths from all causes went up by the same amount.

 

[stillwright]

Exactly, the rewards for getting the vaccine far outweigh the risks, that’s why the CDC is still recommending vaccination for young people.

Apparently reading compression is an issue for you....or simple math isn't a strong point of yours.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

30k serious injuries, 6k deaths out of 200 Million vaccinations. What’s so risky?

Do you ever bother to read? Seriously, do you read??? They are FAR more deadly than 70 vaccines COMBINED.

Your stupid ***, on one hand, will argue that COVID is bubonic-plague-like-deadly for those 18 and under when the rate is 0.000005 chance of dying, then turn around 180 degrees and say the vaccines (which have a 250% higher fatality rate than COVID itself) "isn't a big deal."

You are legitimately a moron.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

When did I say deaths were under-ureported?

If Covid deaths were under-reported, it’s a hell of an anomaly that deaths from all causes went up by the same amount.

You have also been educated on this, but in your ideological fashion, refuse to READ or digest.

I posted articles from your beloved New York Times that discussed the deaths from all causes going up last year. In that article, they scientifically and with tons of supported data showed that the increase in 2020 in overall deaths was absolutely NOT from just COVID, that a large and substantial number of our increased deaths came from other causes. For instance, blood pressure/hypertension deaths, alzheimer's deaths and countless others like cancer were far ahead of the prior year. In some categories, these deaths were up by more than 70% and had nothing to do with COVID.

Why?

Because in 2020 the lockdowns kept people the world over from receiving necessary and regular medical care. That kills people Floggy.

But you love the lockdowns and refuse to admit they caused any harm at all in any way. They absolutely led to innumerable, drastic, and even deadly harms on people the world over. One of those was the lack of medical care people SHOULD have been receiving and were not.

And expectedly, deaths likewise rose because of the lockdowns.

It's like saying if you pass laws making minor theft not a crime, minor thefts like shoplifting will skyrocket. It's logical, simple, common sense stuff you and your side are incapable of processing.

PS...that was a typo...it was meant to say you argued deaths weren't under reported. You have always argued the deaths reported are accurate, despite being presented with endless examples of medical personnel counting deaths as COVID deaths when they were not.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

LMAO

 

[Troglodyte]

Apparently reading compression is an issue for you....or simple math isn't a strong point of yours.

600,000 Covid deaths / 36 Million Covid cases > 6,000 Deaths after Vaccination / 200 Million vaccinations.

There’s the math and perspective. What Tim is offering is hysteria.

 

[Troglodyte]

Do you ever bother to read? Seriously, do you read??? They are FAR more deadly than 70 vaccines COMBINED.

Your stupid ***, on one hand, will argue that COVID is bubonic-plague-like-deadly for those 18 and under when the rate is 0.000005 chance of dying, then turn around 180 degrees and say the vaccines (which have a 250% higher fatality rate than COVID itself) "isn't a big deal."

You are legitimately a moron.

70 vaccines combined! So the **** what? Even if that’s true, it’s spin. Statically it’s still VERY safe, that’s the bottom line. And its why, in REALITY, the world forges on with vaccinations.

How the **** are you getting a 250% higher fatality rate? That’s obviously bullshit. 200 Million have been vaccinated.

The more you lose an argument, the more you resort to strawman arguments, misinformation and insults.

 

[Troglodyte]

You have also been educated on this, but in your ideological fashion, refuse to READ or digest.

I posted articles from your beloved New York Times that discussed the deaths from all causes going up last year. In that article, they scientifically and with tons of supported data showed that the increase in 2020 in overall deaths was absolutely NOT from just COVID, that a large and substantial number of our increased deaths came from other causes. For instance, blood pressure/hypertension deaths, alzheimer's deaths and countless others like cancer were far ahead of the prior year. In some categories, these deaths were up by more than 70% and had nothing to do with COVID.

Why?

Because in 2020 the lockdowns kept people the world over from receiving necessary and regular medical care. That kills people Floggy.

But you love the lockdowns and refuse to admit they caused any harm at all in any way. They absolutely led to innumerable, drastic, and even deadly harms on people the world over. One of those was the lack of medical care people SHOULD have been receiving and were not.

And expectedly, deaths likewise rose because of the lockdowns.

It's like saying if you pass laws making minor theft not a crime, minor thefts like shoplifting will skyrocket. It's logical, simple, common sense stuff you and your side are incapable of processing.

PS...that was a typo...it was meant to say you argued deaths weren't under reported. You have always argued the deaths reported are accurate, despite being presented with endless examples of medical personnel counting deaths as COVID deaths when they were not.

******* nonsense, Tim. 600,000 people didn’t die because they were denied healthcare. No reasonable, qualified person is claiming that.

Equating my belief that deaths were accurately reported as me claiming deaths were under reported wasn’t a typo, it was a strawman. It’s your M.O.