sounds pristine and ideal to Flog
Covid Vaccine
- Thread starter jitter77
- Start date
As an epidemiologist said last spring, Covid is coming for all of us. It's just a matter of when you get it.
We are all going to get it. And that natural immunity is more powerful than vaccines. I know it pains you (which I love knowing) to hear, but having natural immunity is your BEST defense.
No one is suggesting you run out and "catch it" but if you have had it, you've won the lottery.
Beating COVID is not about the vaccine. It's about natural immunity + the vaccines.
Only a moron - you - would argue differently.
Come on FDA.
www.google.com
Novavax and European Commission Finalize Advance Purchase Agreement for up to 200 million doses of COVID-19 Vaccine
Novavax, Inc. (Nasdaq: NVAX), a biotechnology company developing next-generation vaccines for serious infectious diseases, today announced that it has reached an agreement with the European Commission (EC) for the purchase of up to 200 million doses of NVX-CoV2373, the company's recombinant...
If you're 75 with COPD, we all agree, 17 and healthy, not so much.
It's bizarre. It's explicable though. The media won't mention it. Won't discuss it. It's all vax or go home. We have had to have other doctors scream at the top of their lungs - "Don't forget natural immunity" - for it to get mention.
This practice by the media has led to legions of Tibs and Trogs who likewise won't mention or consider it. They are a perfect example of how brainwashed sheeple can become.
Millions like them are out there, fed by the media, believing literally that natural immunity doesn't factor into this. The media has made it binary - vaxed or not.
Astonishing to see, more astonishing to see how many so called "intelligent" Americans believe it too. I've been debating a CEO of a company elsewhere on these topics. Manhattan CEO. He too won't even consider natural immunity is even a part of the equation.
Our media wields a ton of power.
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Back in the day, when one kid in the family got chicken pocks, all the kids in the family that hadn't had chicken pocks were put in a room with the kid that had it so all of the kis could get it out of the way and then be immune to it. By today's standards, vaccination is the only way to defeat any virus as apparently our bodies' own defense mechanisms have been rendered powerless by COVID 19. You can disregard the millions that have recovered from COVID 19, you know, naturally without vaccination. Outliers, one and all.
Well to be fair, a good portion of Americans are a bunch of *******.
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There was a South Park episode about this...The kids found out the parents did it on purpose so they hatched revenge and had a local prostitute use their parent's personal items to give them all Herpes.
and a certain ex-pat sheltering in a bunker overseas, wrapped in toilet paper and deep in a closet with the lights out is as well.
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It is suggested that people get vaccinated. As you just stated, no one is suggesting people run out and get natural immunity. So you agree that it is NOT A VIABLE OPTION. Thank you.
WHO calls for a moratorium on vaxxing.
WHO asks wealthy nations to hold off on Covid vaccine boosters at least through September
The World Health Organization on Wednesday called for a halt of Covid-19 booster shots, citing vaccine inequity around the world.
this is definitely not political football
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Try this, from about a week ago.Sweden, you say? The last I heard…
Coronavirus: Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf says coronavirus approach 'has failed'
Sweden has been criticised for its more relaxed approach to handling the pandemic.www.bbc.com
Daily COVID Deaths in Sweden Hit ZERO, as Other Nations Brace for More Lockdowns
Daily COVID Deaths in Sweden Hit ZERO, as Other Nations Brace for More Lockdowns
humansarefree.com
I didn't actually know there was a king still in Sweden.....I thought Bjorn Borg was the local royalty unless ABBA was performing.
NO I don't asswipe. That is not what I say, nor what I am inferring.
The point is that we are ALL going to get it, just like have all gotten the cold. THAT immunity is going to beat COVID. Not vaccines alone whos efficacies are wearing off. People that are only vaccinated don't have the Tcell Bcell defenses. They need booster shots. The vaxes have varying degrees of good to average defenses against variants. Natural immunity is showing to provide defenses against variants as well.
Getting everyone vaxed alone will not beat COVID. Together, it will beat COVID. The more people that catch COVID, the better protected we are. Vaxed people catching COVID are the ideal, as they likely won't get sick.
The bottom line is....we are all going to have it if we haven't. And until it naturally spreads to the majority of us, the vax alone will never beat it, even if all of us were vaxed.
Given that roughly 150M Americans have had the virus, we are doing very well.
By the way you'll love this new study Floggio.
A map shows how many people had undiagnosed COVID-19 in the first 6 months of the pandemic, across 7 regions of the US
The Mid-Atlantic saw the most undiagnosed coronavirus cases — nearly 9 out of every 100 people — by July 2020.
www.businessinsider.com
But a new report published in the journal Science Translational Medicine offers the most robust look yet at how widespread the virus actually was during that initial wave. The results show that for every diagnosed case of COVID-19 in the US, nearly five others went undiagnosed during the first six months of the pandemic.
---------
5 to 1. More widespread than anyone knew they now say shocked. Some of us were screaming this then. Some of us are clairvoyant.
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It's very weird. I don't share the "it's all a conspiracy to make money" belief but I do believe they are afraid if they say natural immunity works, people will just decide to roll the dice. That would be deadly for some people, there's no denying that. But why not just tell people that? Just say "Yes natural immunity is strong as far as we know but it's risky to try and acquire that way." I mean, we've known that about other illnesses for years. We know that chicken pox is a mild illness in most people, we know that natural immunity is strong, but we get kids vaccinated anyway because it's unpleasant and can have severe long term effects in some people. Why is the messaging so different for this one?
The constant half truths to manage our behavior, these stubborn dogmas that refuse to align with facts, these are what have sown the seeds of mistrust in science. It's going to incredibly difficult to ever come back from it.
This was suggested to me the other day by a Liberal elsewhere. And you know what...it makes sense, I had to agree. He essentially said this should be the messaging, our position, and it will drive up vaccination rates. Essentially...
Americans. The way we beat this virus will be through natural immunity and vaccines. Not one or the other, but both together. COVID is endemic, it will be with us forever, and we are all going to get it at some point per epidemiologists. If you are vaccinated, when you do eventually get COVID, it will not lead to death, your symptoms will be mild, but more importantly, you will develop long lasting, highly effective natural immunity to COVID.
That would be my campaign. "It's coming for all of us, get protection, then develop natural immunity safely."
Instead, they do the dumbest thing possible, they don't discuss natural immunity at all. Thus, they create camps and lines and keep us divided. As they do on race and so many other things.
Maddening, because this is costing lives.
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I think I read somewhere that they believe the earliest cases of covid were in January. My niece who lives in Manhattan and her husband and 2 year old son had a fever for 5 days in December. It was Christmas week, we were supposed to visit them but they were all sick. Tested negative for flu.
I read just the other day that they confirmed cases were in the US 6 months before our "official" first case.
There were blood samples laying around from other prior studies in 2019 they were able to test and found many loaded with COVID antibodies.
@madinsomniac shared this with me. He's on the run and couldn't share. This data doesn't bode well for the vaccines. And it doesn't bode well for all of us if what is happening is Israel is coming here. The vaccines aren't keeping the vaccinated from being sick in Israel and they are 85% vaccinated. As Alex explains, you cannot blame the unvaccinated there. Have a read.
If you read this, you have to ask yourself...are the vaccines really working? Given the # of people that are in SERIOUS condition that are vaccinated?
I have a bigger Stack planned on the Pfizer trial results.
But Israel has gone back to being more transparent, and the new data are now too bad not to highlight.
A reminder - Israel and the United Kingdom were the two major countries that vaccinated earliest and most aggressively. And they are much better at providing data than the United States - they provide updates every day, which limits their opportunities to manipulate it.
Israel is now segmenting the number of serious cases by vaccinated and unvaccinated and by age on its primary data dashboard, available here:
datadashboard.health.gov.il
You can use Google translate and check it for yourself. It’s actually pretty straightforward.
So here’s the chart of new serious cases each day:
As you can see, new serious cases have risen 10-fold since the beginning of July - from roughly five a day to about 40 over the last week. The overall number of patients has soared too - from 30 to more than 200.
But how many of those people are vaccinated?
The vast majority. Israel has broken out the data in various ways at various times, but throughout July most new patients were vaccinated.
In an effort to play down that reality, Israel has begun to provide data comparing RATES of serious illness in older people who were not vaccinated and those who were. And those show that as of now, unvaccinated people are still becoming seriously ill significantly more frequently than those who aren’t.
But that comparison hides a very big problem.
Israel did an excellent job convincing people over 60 to be vaccinated. Only about 1 person in 15 in that age range didn’t receive at least one dose. Fewer than 1 in 10 is not fully vaccinated.
Why should you care? Because the tiny fraction of older people who are unvaccinated in Israel at this point are almost certainly materially different than the vast majority who are. As far as I know, the Israel government hasn’t broken out the differences. But given the pressure to vaccinate, a significant number of those older unvaccinated people are likely simply too sick to tolerate the vaccine - especially those over 80, where overall vaccination rates are even higher.
But if they are too sick to tolerate the vaccine, they are obviously at much higher risk from Covid than the vaccinate. In other words, ability (and propensity) to be vaccinated is likely a marker for overall health. Researchers know this is true of the influenza vaccine - once they adjust for the fact that older people who get the vaccine are healthier to start than than those who don’t, the advantage the vaccine seems to offer mostly disappears.
So the comparison between vaccinated and unvaccinated isn’t useful.
What is useful is examining the trend among serious illness in older vaccinated people.
And it is terrible. The rate of cases has risen 12-fold IN A MONTH. On July 4th, fewer than 1 older vaccinated person in 100,000 became seriously ill. Today the rate is 10 in 100,000.
Remember - comparing unvaccinated and vaccinated at this point hardly matters. THE DARK GREEN LINE IS THE ONE THAT COUNTS:
And though we cannot be sure what will happen next, it is worth noting that rates of serious illness among the vaccinated are now as high as they were among the unvaccinated only TWO WEEKS AGO. Perhaps that’s why the Israeli government is now predicting a further quadrupling of new serious cases by the end of August:
A quadrupling would represent 800 serious cases, approaching the peak of the winter surge (which was itself probably FUELED by a spike in cases following the first vaccine dose) - and far more than at this time last year.
And remember, Israel CANNOT BLAME THE UNVACCINATED FOR THIS SPIKE - around 85 percent of adults over 30 are fully vaccinated. That’s well above the range experts said would provide herd immunity.
And yet instead of pulling back and at least considering a pause on vaccinations as it digests the disaster of the last month, Israel is going the other way - pushing a third dose on the elderly. Meanwhile the cry to mandate or quasi-mandate vaccinations in the United States is only getting louder.
—
What on earth is going on?
If you read this, you have to ask yourself...are the vaccines really working? Given the # of people that are in SERIOUS condition that are vaccinated?
Quick update on the Israeli vaccine data
It is bad and getting worse.
I have a bigger Stack planned on the Pfizer trial results.
But Israel has gone back to being more transparent, and the new data are now too bad not to highlight.
A reminder - Israel and the United Kingdom were the two major countries that vaccinated earliest and most aggressively. And they are much better at providing data than the United States - they provide updates every day, which limits their opportunities to manipulate it.
Israel is now segmenting the number of serious cases by vaccinated and unvaccinated and by age on its primary data dashboard, available here:
קורונה - לוח בקרה
דשבורד נתוני וירוס הקורונה בישראל מטעם משרד הבריאות הישראלי
datadashboard.health.gov.il
You can use Google translate and check it for yourself. It’s actually pretty straightforward.
So here’s the chart of new serious cases each day:
As you can see, new serious cases have risen 10-fold since the beginning of July - from roughly five a day to about 40 over the last week. The overall number of patients has soared too - from 30 to more than 200.
But how many of those people are vaccinated?
The vast majority. Israel has broken out the data in various ways at various times, but throughout July most new patients were vaccinated.
In an effort to play down that reality, Israel has begun to provide data comparing RATES of serious illness in older people who were not vaccinated and those who were. And those show that as of now, unvaccinated people are still becoming seriously ill significantly more frequently than those who aren’t.
But that comparison hides a very big problem.
Israel did an excellent job convincing people over 60 to be vaccinated. Only about 1 person in 15 in that age range didn’t receive at least one dose. Fewer than 1 in 10 is not fully vaccinated.
Why should you care? Because the tiny fraction of older people who are unvaccinated in Israel at this point are almost certainly materially different than the vast majority who are. As far as I know, the Israel government hasn’t broken out the differences. But given the pressure to vaccinate, a significant number of those older unvaccinated people are likely simply too sick to tolerate the vaccine - especially those over 80, where overall vaccination rates are even higher.
But if they are too sick to tolerate the vaccine, they are obviously at much higher risk from Covid than the vaccinate. In other words, ability (and propensity) to be vaccinated is likely a marker for overall health. Researchers know this is true of the influenza vaccine - once they adjust for the fact that older people who get the vaccine are healthier to start than than those who don’t, the advantage the vaccine seems to offer mostly disappears.
So the comparison between vaccinated and unvaccinated isn’t useful.
What is useful is examining the trend among serious illness in older vaccinated people.
And it is terrible. The rate of cases has risen 12-fold IN A MONTH. On July 4th, fewer than 1 older vaccinated person in 100,000 became seriously ill. Today the rate is 10 in 100,000.
Remember - comparing unvaccinated and vaccinated at this point hardly matters. THE DARK GREEN LINE IS THE ONE THAT COUNTS:
And though we cannot be sure what will happen next, it is worth noting that rates of serious illness among the vaccinated are now as high as they were among the unvaccinated only TWO WEEKS AGO. Perhaps that’s why the Israeli government is now predicting a further quadrupling of new serious cases by the end of August:
A quadrupling would represent 800 serious cases, approaching the peak of the winter surge (which was itself probably FUELED by a spike in cases following the first vaccine dose) - and far more than at this time last year.
And remember, Israel CANNOT BLAME THE UNVACCINATED FOR THIS SPIKE - around 85 percent of adults over 30 are fully vaccinated. That’s well above the range experts said would provide herd immunity.
And yet instead of pulling back and at least considering a pause on vaccinations as it digests the disaster of the last month, Israel is going the other way - pushing a third dose on the elderly. Meanwhile the cry to mandate or quasi-mandate vaccinations in the United States is only getting louder.
—
What on earth is going on?
So lets go back to the two cruise ships that were quarantined in the first couple months of covids revelation to the world that actually did widespread testing on the crew and guests…NO I don't asswipe. That is not what I say, nor what I am inferring.
The point is that we are ALL going to get it, just like have all gotten the cold. THAT immunity is going to beat COVID. Not vaccines alone whos efficacies are wearing off. People that are only vaccinated don't have the Tcell Bcell defenses. They need booster shots. The vaxes have varying degrees of good to average defenses against variants. Natural immunity is showing to provide defenses against variants as well.
Getting everyone vaxed alone will not beat COVID. Together, it will beat COVID. The more people that catch COVID, the better protected we are. Vaxed people catching COVID are the ideal, as they likely won't get sick.
The bottom line is....we are all going to have it if we haven't. And until it naturally spreads to the majority of us, the vax alone will never beat it, even if all of us were vaxed.
Given that roughly 150M Americans have had the virus, we are doing very well.
By the way you'll love this new study Floggio.
A map shows how many people had undiagnosed COVID-19 in the first 6 months of the pandemic, across 7 regions of the US
The Mid-Atlantic saw the most undiagnosed coronavirus cases — nearly 9 out of every 100 people — by July 2020.
But a new report published in the journal Science Translational Medicine offers the most robust look yet at how widespread the virus actually was during that initial wave. The results show that for every diagnosed case of COVID-19 in the US, nearly five others went undiagnosed during the first six months of the pandemic.
---------
5 to 1. More widespread than anyone knew they now say shocked. Some of us were screaming this then. Some of us are clairvoyant.
One had 3711 people on it the other 3800… though the precise number of crew wasn’t totally certain there
thats 7511 people that were thoroughly exposed with enough time to incubate and were thoroughly tested, albeit mostly only once…
there was 712 confirmed cases on the first and 852 confirmed cases on the second
thats 1564 cases
So roughly 21% of people caught the virus in that situation… not counting those who may have developed it after the initial test they got…. While that won’t translate directly to how many will have been infected immediately, you can loosely estimate that we probably are pushing over a billion already worldwide… this was way more contagious and thus way less severe than they made it out to be… ill be willing to bet the final estimates will be between 1.5 and 3 billion cases worldwide over the first year and a half when they release data in a couple years…
I didn’t have time to verify that article… im in meetings all day… it seems legit this far…
also they are quietly starting a push here to supplement j&J shots with pfizer mrna shots… as a booster despite the recent data showing the the Pfizer shot probably has the least effect on delta of them all… I’ll find stuff when i have time… makes no sense
also they are quietly starting a push here to supplement j&J shots with pfizer mrna shots… as a booster despite the recent data showing the the Pfizer shot probably has the least effect on delta of them all… I’ll find stuff when i have time… makes no sense
In February (I believe), I had a fever for 2 days and I can probably count on one hand how many times I've had a fever in my life. Was pretty shocked so I was looking at local flu trends and all doctors could say was that they thought a nasty strain of Influenza B was making its rounds. 3rd day started feeling better and by the 4th day was back at it.
Haven't had an issue since. Also try to take some preventative measures. If the Novavax vaccine gets rolled out soon (in Phase 3 clinical), I'll feel better about taking a traditional vaccine approach of using purified pieces of the Covid to trigger an immune response as opposed to mRNA.
U.S. clinical trial results show Novavax vaccine is safe and prevents COVID-19
The investigational vaccine known as NVX-CoV2373 demonstrated 90.4% efficacy in preventing symptomatic COVID-19 disease.
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Why is that? You've now come full circle and have argued yourself into a corner. Covid is nothing to worry about, remember? You've been screaming that from the rooftops for over a year now, that's it's not dangerous, not deadly, not a concern at all.
So why do you care now if it's spreading like wildfire again? Who cares, it's just the flu or hayfever, right?