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Draft 2017 - deljzc

deljzc said:
I am debating now that I have enough time to create a Steelers-Specific Big Board.

Since most of my heavy lifting and overall board are done, I'm kind of twiddling my thumbs a bit this last month so this will be the first year I attempt to do something specific for one team based on needs, style of play, etc.

Should be an interesting exercise.
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Your big board and analysis already gives us an idea of which players could fit our scheme but if you can refine it well that's even better.

Regarding Tabor, how can a player be good enough on film to be projected as a sure 1st rounder and then have so terrible numbers at the combine? Is it an injury or the scheme he played had him in a bubble that covered his lac of athleticism
 
Litos said:
Your big board and analysis already gives us an idea of which players could fit our scheme but if you can refine it well that's even better.

Regarding Tabor, how can a player be good enough on film to be projected as a sure 1st rounder and then have so terrible numbers at the combine? Is it an injury or the scheme he played had him in a bubble that covered his lac of athleticism
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perhaps a mixture of instincts and scheme
 
I'm really starting to like Marcus Williams in the 3rd round, he needs to add weight but his athletic numbers are great for the position and 14 reps show some strength that can be improved.

To me he seems a bit underrated right now and he could be as good as any free safety taken mid 2nd round and might be available when is our turn to pick in the 3rd round

The only negative I see regarding his fit with the Steelers is that he would be a FS only, unlike Davis or Mitchell that can play both positions. OTOH I think the Steelers didn't send anyone to Utah's pro day so he must be out of their radar

Any thoughts?
 
I currently have Marcus Williams pretty high on my Steelers Big Board (#54) so he's potentially in play even for our 2nd round pick.

I have in a group of potential picks like Eddie Jackson, Cordea Tankersley, Kendall Beckwith, Kevin King. Of those 5 how would you order them for Steelers if you have to pick one at #62? Would you pick Sidney Jones over them if he was available but injured for 2017?
 
deljzc said:
I currently have Marcus Williams pretty high on my Steelers Big Board (#54) so he's potentially in play even for our 2nd round pick.

I have in a group of potential picks like Eddie Jackson, Cordea Tankersley, Kendall Beckwith, Kevin King. Of those 5 how would you order them for Steelers if you have to pick one at #62? Would you pick Sidney Jones over them if he was available but injured for 2017?
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thanks for the reply, if we pick someone like Obi in the first that can play nickel CB and S in a pinch I would take Sidney Jones in the 3rd for sure, he's like a 1st round pick for 2018. Having Obi in the first gives us the flexibility needed to hold on for a year until Sidney comes back from injury. This also means that it would put us on a tough spot in the 2nd round to get an OLB and might end up reaching for a mid 3rd round talent.

Regarding the 5 players in your grup I think the Steelers are showing their hand with Tankersley and probably would be their #1 choice if they go OLB in the first round. (I like Awuzie in the 2nd round if we go CB, also Quincy Wilson). After him probably Kevin King as FS/CB hybrid and then Marcus Williams

Jackson shouldn't be picked before mid 3rd round and Beckwith I don't think he's what we are looking for right now so early.
 
So if I understand you in round 2 (and let's assume we got an edge OLB in round 1), you would select all the following CB's ahead of Sidney Jones (assume Lattimore, White, Conley and Humphrey are gone for sure):

Tebor, Jackson, D. King, Sutton, Wilson, Tankersley, K. King and Awuzie

Plus safeties Jones, Jackson and Williams

Is this correct? Would you go any deeper on our corner list? Witherspoon, Moreau, Lewis?
 
deljzc said:
So if I understand you in round 2 (and let's assume we got an edge OLB in round 1), you would select all the following CB's ahead of Sidney Jones (assume Lattimore, White, Conley and Humphrey are gone for sure):

Tebor, Jackson, D. King, Sutton, Wilson, Tankersley, K. King and Awuzie

Plus safeties Jones, Jackson and Williams

Is this correct? Would you go any deeper on our corner list? Witherspoon, Moreau, Lewis?
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you understood me correctly, except:
- you have to add Obi to the already drafted players
- Tabor scares me so early because of his lack of speed, 4th rounder
- Sutton is too high, 3rd rounder pick, same goes for Williams, Witherspoon, Moreau, Lewis, D King
So my wishlist in the 2nd round would be Awuzie, Wilson, Jackson, Tankersley, K King. Of these, the Steelers have shown interest in Awuzie, Wilson,Tankersley
 
I have once again updated the final big board and more specifically the new (for this year), Steelers Specific Big Board on who I would draft for the Steelers.

I listed all the players I would consider to our round 3 picks (up to pick #105) and ranked them mano y mano. Maybe some final adjustment heading into Thursday/Friday and maybe I will update it after round 1 concludes and we know what position we took.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_S4HtRAAFdxY0KBpgZJwp20avN0Hk5zd4-laQNKHKp8/edit?usp=sharing
 
I moved Conley temporarily down to #21 on my Steelers Draft Board pending what happens over the next couple days with this rape accusation.
 
deljzc said:
I have once again updated the final big board and more specifically the new (for this year), Steelers Specific Big Board on who I would draft for the Steelers.

I listed all the players I would consider to our round 3 picks (up to pick #105) and ranked them mano y mano. Maybe some final adjustment heading into Thursday/Friday and maybe I will update it after round 1 concludes and we know what position we took.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_S4HtRAAFdxY0KBpgZJwp20avN0Hk5zd4-laQNKHKp8/edit?usp=sharing
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Thanks for all the work you put in Del. An interesting read. Shall keep it handy during the draft. I do agree,I think they draft someone who they think will put consistent pressure on QB. Something we have been lacking for years. Depending,of course who is on the board.
 
Interesting reading Del. Do you really think that the Steelers have Peppers that high on their board? Or Trubisky for that matter?
 
I don't know. I'm running out of players with first round grades that the Steelers would take.

We can discuss whether the Steelers have all the pass rushers (not counting Garrett) ahead of Peppers or not. I think all the pass rushers we are looking at in round 1 aren't "perfect" and have some chinks in their armor. And I think Peppers is actually a better prospect (regardless or position or fit) than them. That's Lawson, McKinley, Barnett, Watt, Charlton (who to me is a 4-3 end), Harris and Williams (who is off our board I think).

How high do we put the three WR's? I think they are all graded similarly but the only reason I lower Ross is because of his potential injury history and I think he duplicates what we have with Brown. Do you take the WR's over Peppers when we need defensive help?

McDowell and Reddick are kind of tough for me to pin down with us. I have Reddick above all the pass rushers but not above maybe getting one of the clear 1st round talents. McDowell would be a hell of a 5-technique in my opinion. I love him as a prospect (probably more than most) and if he becomes available at pick #30 I have a tough call to make because I can probably easily keep Heyward and Tuitt under contract. But the logic you can't have enough D-lineman kind of rings true to me.

I don't think Thomas and Allen fit for us and I'm not a Thomas fan on tape (even though he is probably the cleanest of all the prospects in round 1)

As for Trabinsky, I just can't see us passing on him at #30 for almost any reason. I mean, to me, that's like Aaron Rogers falling. He is the only QB prospect I like to be a real franchise guy. He has all the tools and seems to have the personality/drive/work ethic to do it. He just fits the mold for me. I just asked myself if Trabinsky was on the board, is there really any prospect in this draft that would PREVENT me from taking him? And only two guys answered that question.
 
I agree that, if Trubinski is on the board, they would be hesitant to pass on him. That might also give them the bait they need to trade down. Would you value Trubinski over getting an extra pick in what is supposedly a deep draft? I didn't look at the chart to see what you might get, though, or who would want a QB enough to trade.
 
Hard to say yes/no to any trade without knowing how good an offer is. Would I trade pick #30 for normal draft value chart value if Trabinsky was on the board? No way. But how much more it would take is probably open to debate. I mean, if I could get a #1 next year and throw in a 2nd rounder and mid-rounder this year I might consider it. Especially depending on how my board looks (and if Trabinsky is there that likely means my board is pretty skimpy looking).

Could you forgive yourself if Trabinsky becomes a solid top-10 QB in the league while we struggle to find Roethlisberger's replacement and you passed on him? That would be tough to swallow come 2020.
 
I will say this last thing. If you want good things for the Steelers on Thursday night root hard for the QB's and Offensive lineman to be taken in round 1 before us.

The more of Trabinsky, Mahomes, Watson, Robinson, Ramzcyk and Bolles that get taken the better our choices are going to be come pick #30.

I guess you can add RB into the mix, but I think Fournette and McCaffrey are locks now for round 1 so only Dalvin Cook is a question mark (having him picked would help too).
 
ark steel said:
I agree that, if Trubinski is on the board, they would be hesitant to pass on him. That might also give them the bait they need to trade down. Would you value Trubinski over getting an extra pick in what is supposedly a deep draft? I didn't look at the chart to see what you might get, though, or who would want a QB enough to trade.
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Same here.
 
deljzc said:
I don't know. I'm running out of players with first round grades that the Steelers would take.

We can discuss whether the Steelers have all the pass rushers (not counting Garrett) ahead of Peppers or not. I think all the pass rushers we are looking at in round 1 aren't "perfect" and have some chinks in their armor. And I think Peppers is actually a better prospect (regardless or position or fit) than them. That's Lawson, McKinley, Barnett, Watt, Charlton (who to me is a 4-3 end), Harris and Williams (who is off our board I think).

How high do we put the three WR's? I think they are all graded similarly but the only reason I lower Ross is because of his potential injury history and I think he duplicates what we have with Brown. Do you take the WR's over Peppers when we need defensive help?


McDowell and Reddick are kind of tough for me to pin down with us. I have Reddick above all the pass rushers but not above maybe getting one of the clear 1st round talents. McDowell would be a hell of a 5-technique in my opinion. I love him as a prospect (probably more than most) and if he becomes available at pick #30 I have a tough call to make because I can probably easily keep Heyward and Tuitt under contract. But the logic you can't have enough D-lineman kind of rings true to me.

I don't think Thomas and Allen fit for us and I'm not a Thomas fan on tape (even though he is probably the cleanest of all the prospects in round 1)

As for Trabinsky, I just can't see us passing on him at #30 for almost any reason. I mean, to me, that's like Aaron Rogers falling. He is the only QB prospect I like to be a real franchise guy. He has all the tools and seems to have the personality/drive/work ethic to do it. He just fits the mold for me. I just asked myself if Trabinsky was on the board, is there really any prospect in this draft that would PREVENT me from taking him? And only two guys answered that question.
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I think BPA at Edge or corner is the way to go.

I read that McKinley is hurt and may not be be ready to start the season...this means his stock will fall and perhaps another edge rusher will be selected before we pick.
 
I was just interested in your reasoning. I guess you can think that you have another Honeybadger in the making with Peppers or you can think you have a guy without a position. Also I read your Steelers board as the guys the Steelers would take in order of preference if they were available. If that's the case I struggle seeing Peppers over some of the other guys that fit us better - corners, slot guys, edge guys. What's your view on Peppers? Do you think he has the same issues as TMC thinks? All I know is that Michigan were better when he was playing.

I happen to agree on QB. I personally think that Kizer is going to be something special in a couple of years time. Trubisky also has a really high ceiling. They're both high risk, high reward and I think that we're in a great position to take a QB high this year. No it doesn't help us immediately but I can easily see us taking Kizer.
 
Teams looking to bail on weak first round?



ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Bucs have talked with "at least three teams" about moving back in the first round and possibly out of round one altogether.

Tampa Bay isn't alone in wanting to move back. It's far easier said than done because most teams want to keep their second- and third-round picks in what is perceived to be a draft class that lacks star talent but is thought to be extremely deep.

Many teams in the second half of Round 1 will probably be working the phones on Thursday night trying to move back and stock picks.

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/857202708943712256
 
Slaine said:
I was just interested in your reasoning. I guess you can think that you have another Honeybadger in the making with Peppers or you can think you have a guy without a position. Also I read your Steelers board as the guys the Steelers would take in order of preference if they were available. If that's the case I struggle seeing Peppers over some of the other guys that fit us better - corners, slot guys, edge guys. What's your view on Peppers? Do you think he has the same issues as TMC thinks? All I know is that Michigan were better when he was playing.

I happen to agree on QB. I personally think that Kizer is going to be something special in a couple of years time. Trubisky also has a really high ceiling. They're both high risk, high reward and I think that we're in a great position to take a QB high this year. No it doesn't help us immediately but I can easily see us taking Kizer.
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I don't want Kizer in round 1. There are too many things on film that remind me of Byron Leftwich. If pick #62 comes around and he's still on the board, I can see a debate (I still might not pull the trigger) but that's probably just me.

Trabinsky is the only QB I'd take in round 1 at pick #30. Depending on how far he falls, I might even consider trading up to get him. Depends on how many spots maybe my pick #105 moves me up. That's all I'm willing to throw in.
 
deljzc said:
Hard to say yes/no to any trade without knowing how good an offer is. Would I trade pick #30 for normal draft value chart value if Trabinsky was on the board? No way. But how much more it would take is probably open to debate. I mean, if I could get a #1 next year and throw in a 2nd rounder and mid-rounder this year I might consider it. Especially depending on how my board looks (and if Trabinsky is there that likely means my board is pretty skimpy looking).

Could you forgive yourself if Trabinsky becomes a solid top-10 QB in the league while we struggle to find Roethlisberger's replacement and you passed on him? That would be tough to swallow come 2020.
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Boy, it's 2017. I just can't give a **** about 2020.

Look, I know you are thinking ahead, and that organizations have to as well. You are probably more right than I am. Still.

Everybody always uses the Aaron Rodgers example. OK. That being said, if you really look at it, the Packers have won just 2 SBs with the great luck of having 2 franchise guys in a row. Ben has won 2. Do you want to draft a guy that just won't help for a while just to feel more comfortable about 2020?
 
diver said:
Boy, it's 2017. I just can't give a **** about 2020.

Look, I know you are thinking ahead, and that organizations have to as well. You are probably more right than I am. Still.

Everybody always uses the Aaron Rodgers example. OK. That being said, if you really look at it, the Packers have won just 2 SBs with the great luck of having 2 franchise guys in a row. Ben has won 2. Do you want to draft a guy that just won't help for a while just to feel more comfortable about 2020?
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I know a certain baseball franchise in town that would look toward 2020 even if they had a championship-level team for 2017.
 
diver said:
Boy, it's 2017. I just can't give a **** about 2020.

Look, I know you are thinking ahead, and that organizations have to as well. You are probably more right than I am. Still.

Everybody always uses the Aaron Rodgers example. OK. That being said, if you really look at it, the Packers have won just 2 SBs with the great luck of having 2 franchise guys in a row. Ben has won 2. Do you want to draft a guy that just won't help for a while just to feel more comfortable about 2020?
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Lol. " have just won 2 SB's". I know a few Cleveland fans that could only dream about saying that.
 
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