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Leighton Vander Esch injury concerns
- Thread starter FordFairLane
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Yeah that pyramid sure will predict outcomes. especially when Jarvis wasn't coming off a injury and Evans was.
That is cherry picking two different positions, and conditions and thinking the outcome will be the same.
Thankful you aren't our GM.
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https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/ryan-shazier
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/lawrence-timmons
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/tj-watt
Or how about pro bowl roster.
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/von-miller
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/jadeveon-clowney
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/cj-mosley-2014
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/chandler-jones
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/ryan-kerrigan
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/anthony-barr
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/luke-kuechly
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/bobby-wagner
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/khalil-mack
Are we seeing a trend?
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It may be cherry picking but wow! Jarvis and Evans look horrendous on paper. LVE looks like a rock star in comparison. It's only paper so if we end up with Evans, we can only hope his paper doesn't turn out to be as bad as Jarivs's was.
I am curious what you think you see? I mean you are throwing the figures out there, tell me what you think it means.
Also again Evans injury could have altered that pyramid, which would make it inaccurate in a recovery process.
Top sparq players from last year had mixed results.
A lot of these formulas are simply showing athleticism. And we know that is important. As is instincts, and playing speed. You know some players play faster on the field than in shorts and vice versa.
Evans poor 3 cone could also be viewed as predictable for someone recovering from a groin or not?
I see what you are throwing out there, but you are putting Evans into a mix of variables that we aren't privy to the information to accurately diagnosis.
That would like seeing a breast mass, and giving a person Cancer without seeing the pathology report.
There is a chance that it is Cancer but it is inconclusive.
Which makes me not want Evans in 1 due to risk, but at the same time I acknowledge the Steelers could have the path report in their hands.
Steelers haven’t picked a small school player in the top two rounds since 2004.
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He was near the bottom of all the drills he decided to run.
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Every player I listed has something above average vs his peers. Whether it’s size, or speed, strength, explosion. Usually, it’s the speed and explosion is what sets a player apart from good to special. But Evans has none of these qualities. He’s not exceptionally big, fast, agile... nothing.
I have been stating Evans looked slow before he decided to not run. Way back in February. So his workout numbers are not a surprise to me.
I agree. Just because you are a great athlete doesn’t mean you are a great football player. But you will be hard pressed to show me a great football player that is not a great athlete.
Yes sometimes workout numbers don’t translate on the field. But I’ve never seen a player who was fast on the field and slow in shorts.
Or he’s using it as an excuse. I’ve never heard of a groin injury lasting 6 months.
But do you want to take a first round player that you don’t know all the facts with.
Again, do you want a player in the first round you aren’t sure about?
I know the realization is the Steelers want him. I’m just not happy about it.
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Hard to know a time frame with that injury or if say he aggravated it.
Again I prefer other players in one, but would be ok with the pick if that is who the Steelers want.
I think there will be safer picks available. Just probably at different positions.
One thing is for sure LVE isn't a safe pick either.
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If he’s the pick I’ll root for him and hope I’m wrong. I did the same with Uncle Jarvis. I’ll just cross my fingers this time I’m wrong.
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I know everyone has an opinion and I've gone on record as not being a fan of Evans going to the Steelers. No 40? After the combine AND... TWO Pro Day opportunities? Heck... he could do a solo Pro Day tomorrow and most teams would send someone out if he wanted to run the 40. Pass.
I have also gone record of being a fan of LVE. I pretty much shelved the medical stuff as teams trying to manipulate the draft. However, after hearing Mayock mention it a couple of times on his pre-draft conference call... I am wondering if there is something to it. It seems to revolve around a past neck injury??? That said... he was not called back for medical re-checks after the combine. IMO... if the Steeler doctors and the Steelers brass are on board with him... then so am I.
IF... he is still there at #28... which seems unlikely... pick him.
I know everyone has an opinion and I've gone on record as not being a fan of Evans going to the Steelers. No 40? After the combine AND... TWO Pro Day opportunities? Heck... he could do a solo Pro Day tomorrow and most teams would send someone out if he wanted to run the 40. Pass.
I have also gone record of being a fan of LVE. I pretty much shelved the medical stuff as teams trying to manipulate the draft. However, after hearing Mayock mention it a couple of times on his pre-draft conference call... I am wondering if there is something to it. It seems to revolve around a past neck injury??? That said... he was not called back for medical re-checks after the combine. IMO... if the Steeler doctors and the Steelers brass are on board with him... then so am I.
IF... he is still there at #28... which seems unlikely... pick him.
Luckily, he won't be .. and they won't have the opportunity.
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Holy crap that’s not a very flattering opinion none the less from a GM. I personally like the Evans kid from Bama better and from what I’ve read, has a very good football IQ. I’ve not ever been sold on LVE and kind of hope some other team buys into the hype and drafts him before our spot.
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for comparison, also, is Roquan smith.
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/roquan-smith
Jarvis Jones, part 2, if we go by this alone.
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/roquan-smith
Jarvis Jones, part 2, if we go by this alone.
Well ****! Put my foot in it on this one. If the more reputable national guys like Mayock and King are running with this spinal condition thing with LVE, he might just be there at 1:28 (hope not) and we all know how well it worked out the last time the Steelers picked guy with a reported spinal condition in round 1.
Interestingly enough, in regards to Jarvis Jones' "spinal condition" many doctors who had examined Jones claimed that he:
Sound familiar?
Now, as far as we know, the spinal issue was not the reason that Jones flamed out in the NFL. However, anything that links a prospect to Jones is a (another) reason to stay away.
https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2013/3/10/4085842/doctors-insist-jarvis-jones-is-medically-cleared-for-nfl-football
Every bit of a high ceiling high bust look to him.
And yes Jarvis had that label as well.
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Not at all. Jarvis only real attributes were height weight was decent. Smith attributes are speed but undersized.
If you look at coaches “what would you trade for Roquan Smith” thread I mentioned I personally wouldn’t trade up for Smith. And in fact compared Smith to Jerome Baker. I see Baker going a lot after the Steelers third round pick and I personally think the value of Baker at 92 vs Smith at 28 is more appealing.
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Great site, Supe. The measurables for LVE are off the chart GOOD. Okay, still on the chart but very high:
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/leighton-vander-esch?position=ATH
81st percentile height, 64th weight, 89th wingspan, 83rd arm length, 61st hand size, 94th vertical, 87th broad jump, 80th 3-cone drill, 82nd 20-yard shuttle. 7 measurables that are 80th percentile or higher.
Really, the health issue is by far the biggest reason I can see for passing on him.
Also, the reference to the Jarvis medical issues don't fly since he failed not due to spinal stenosis, but instead due to suckage - which most predicted based on his terrible measurables. Specifically:
Broad jump 50th percentile, vertical jump 11th percentile, 40 yard dash 6th percentile, hand size 13th percentile, 3-cone drill 10th percentile, 3-cone drill 1st (FIRST!!) percentile, bench press 8th percentile.
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/jarvis-jones
Holy Jesus, want to know why TMC went off the rails on the guy?!?
LVE is elite in measurables, Jarvis Jones was elite in how bad his measurables were. The medical issue is the ONLY thing they have in common.
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/leighton-vander-esch?position=ATH
81st percentile height, 64th weight, 89th wingspan, 83rd arm length, 61st hand size, 94th vertical, 87th broad jump, 80th 3-cone drill, 82nd 20-yard shuttle. 7 measurables that are 80th percentile or higher.
Really, the health issue is by far the biggest reason I can see for passing on him.
Also, the reference to the Jarvis medical issues don't fly since he failed not due to spinal stenosis, but instead due to suckage - which most predicted based on his terrible measurables. Specifically:
Broad jump 50th percentile, vertical jump 11th percentile, 40 yard dash 6th percentile, hand size 13th percentile, 3-cone drill 10th percentile, 3-cone drill 1st (FIRST!!) percentile, bench press 8th percentile.
https://www.mockdraftable.com/player/jarvis-jones
Holy Jesus, want to know why TMC went off the rails on the guy?!?
LVE is elite in measurables, Jarvis Jones was elite in how bad his measurables were. The medical issue is the ONLY thing they have in common.
Not true. LVE has troubles getting off blocks, as did Jarvis.
Here is some more:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SLLvxiGFhs
And these are not highlight reels, they are full game films showing every defensive play. So is LVE blocked sometimes? Of course. Does he take on blockers, including offensive lineman, and beat them? Absolutely.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SLLvxiGFhs
And these are not highlight reels, they are full game films showing every defensive play. So is LVE blocked sometimes? Of course. Does he take on blockers, including offensive lineman, and beat them? Absolutely.
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Might want to go back to the beginning of this thread son. You are bringing up things from a page or two ago lol
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Interesting thing to me is that Shazier is out because of a neck injury due to poor form when making a tackle. So, it comes out that LVE might have a spinal condition (possibly stenosis) and many folks want him anyway. You literally want to replace a guy who experienced paralysis due to poor technique with a guy who could get paralyzed even if his technique is perfect. Boggles my mind.
Definitely not impressive footage. I seen RB glide on by due to being blocked. In his immediate area. For every good play you see three more that make you scratch your head. This kid isn't Urlacher. Too much Jane in his game for me...
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/484267002
Several trades. We trade up to 18 to get Evans......
Several trades. We trade up to 18 to get Evans......