• Please be aware we've switched the forums to their own URL. (again) You'll find the new website address to be www.steelernationforum.com Thanks
  • Please clear your private messages. Your inbox is close to being full.

Math & J'Biden's 1%

wig

Well-known member
Forefather
Contributor
Joined
Jun 10, 2014
Messages
10,990
Reaction score
13,078
Points
113
As it turns out, today's democratic socialist may need to spend more time in basic math classes and less in the social studies building.

The battle cry (for now) of the socially conscious democratic socialist is to make the 1% pay their fair share. The story is spun and perpetuated that if only the super wealthy would "pay their share" we would live in a blissful, strife-free economic utopia. Unfortunately basic math, not greed or racism, sinks that socialist ship of dreams.

Some quick research will yield that the United States wealthiest people control 34.2 trillion in wealth and assets. Conversely, the lowest 50% of American earners only account for 2.1 trillion. Admittedly, this is a significant gap. Nobody is arguing that. But the battle cry for democratic socialists is to tax the wealthy more aggressively and with fewer loopholes. This, they say, will make it "fair" for everyone. Alexandra Ocasio Cortez famously recommended that the wealthy could and perhaps should be taxed as much as 90% of their income.

Well, let's take a look and see how that would solve America's economic woes.

The U.S. has (at last count) 834 billionaires. Obviously these folks make up much of the infamous 1%. Interestingly, on average these people make an income of about $516k a year. (That's a lot of money. I don't make that much myself.) So, if you take the average income of the 1% and then multiply that by the number of billionaires in that 1% group, you get a total taxable income amount of just about 430 million dollars annually. (I bet you can already see where this is going...)
If we taxed these horrible, decadent monsters a full 95% of their income, we would see an income tax amount of 408 million dollars. NICE! Unfortunately, the estimated 2021 tax revenue for the U.S. is set at a bit under 3.87 trillion (Yes, with a T). So, great news... if we tax our 1% at 95%, we could gather a full 11% of our estimated 2021 tax revenue.

Sadly, that still leaves us with 89% to gather. Where does that come from? The rest comes from income taxes on all the folks J'Biden said he would NOT over-tax as well as from ... wait for it... Payroll Taxes! These are taxes your employer pays on your behalf to the U.S. government. Please note that J'Biden has never said he would not increase payroll taxes. Now, a small amount of the tax revenue will ALSO come from corporate taxes. "AHA!" says our democratic socialist! "Tax THEM to oblivion!" they cry in unison.

We should remember however that most large corporations pay taxes on their income and they ALSO pass taxes through to their shareholders. A C corp, while providing a number of positive financial benefits for shareholders also must weather a double tax hit. The far more prolific LLC corporations directly pass ALL their taxes through to the owning partners. This leads to greater tax burdens on those individuals as they must claim any income from the LLC on their own personal taxes. In short, corporations aren't really getting away with highway robbery as the democratic socialist would have you believe.

The revelation that simply over-taxing the wealthy on their income will not significantly dent the U.S. tax need ultimately leads to the next phase of democratic socialist devolution. At some point the cry will come forth to tax not only the income of the 1% but their wealth as well. This marks a dangerous departure from American policy. Once legislators begin eying additional taxes on individual assets, we have become full-fledged socialists. Any American at any income and wealth rate who is opposed to the idea of the government seizing some percentage of your savings or retirement accounts, or even foreclosing upon and selling your home, cars or other property should be terrified at the idea of wealth taxation.

Property tax and luxury tax already exist to generate some degree of revenue from the assets of citizens. If additional taxes were legalized and levied, what part of your home, cars, savings or retirement would you be willing to donate for the good of the people?

And therein lies the true failure of socialism, "democratic" or otherwise. The movement is driven by people who look with great jealousy at the success and holdings of other people. True socialism doesn't "normalize" wages. It doesn't merely tax the wealthy. True socialism sets an equivalent tax for EVERYONE. All citizens pay the same tax in order to support government and services that all may use. That means that the millionaire making 380k a year will be taxed 60% as well as the McDonalds employee making 38k a year. They BOTH must pay an equivalent tax. So, wealthy guy grumbles as he is compelled to pay 228k of his salary to taxes. Yet no one weeps for him as he still has $152k to live on. However, you also must not weep for McDonalds guy who equivalently has to pay almost 23k of his income to the government, retaining around $15k over the year to pay for housing and food.

THIS is the truth and inevitability that democratic socialists don't want you to understand. Truthfully, most of them don't understand it themselves. Socialism is AMAZING when it's other peoples' money, but by definition, socialism is YOUR money. Anyone who calls for socialism must be willing to pay the exact same tax rate that they wish to impose upon others. If not, they aren't socialists, they're bums.
 
These numbers don't seem right. How can billionaires only average 516k? The avg NFL salary is like 860k. NBA is higher. Even MLB players avg around 560k.
 
Huh... did somebody say something? All I hear is a distinct high-pitched buzzing noise.
 
These numbers don't seem right. How can billionaires only average 516k? The avg NFL salary is like 860k. NBA is higher. Even MLB players avg around 560k.

Billionaires do not achieve most of their monetary gain on income; they earn it via capital gains, from property, stocks, investments, etc. That money is not subject to an income tax.

Therefore, increasing the income tax - which is what Beijing Joe and the imbeciles on the left harp about - does nothing to address the endless spending and debt.

I agree that capital gains taxes need to be addressed. The problem is that doing so is incredibly complex, as most Americans have their net worth tied up in their primary residence. I wager 90% of the board would fall under this description. When those people sell their homes for retirement to "downsize" and net a large amount of wealth for retirement, taking a big chunk of that money is a bad idea. VERY bad.

So we build in exceptions. "No taxes on the first [x] dollars of capital gains." Awesome. So the people who have billions of dollars are idiots, I guess, and will just turn over huge amounts of taxes cuz Biden.

Or maybe they sell a $75 million piece of property, or take out a line of credit in that amount, 1033 the gains, and then make a short-term investment in 30 pieces of real estate, where they net "x" dollars in capital gains after the allotted time and pay nothing. Whatever. Please don't delve into details about how the brilliant government will stop such tactics. The government is a lying shill lap dog for these very people.

The simple fact is when you start crafting the exceptions, lawyers and accountants (i.e., the good and the ugly in that order) will find a way to exploit the exception. Politicians make a lot of money by allowing that to happen, so it will happen. That's life.
 
Let's take a guy like mahomes who makes close to 50 mil / yr. Based on the 516k that is like another 95 billionaires. Even a guy making 10 mil / yr is another 20 billionaires. I'm not sure where the 1% cut off is, but the articles numbers seem to be missing alot of $$
 
Let's take a guy like mahomes who makes close to 50 mil / yr. Based on the 516k that is like another 95 billionaires. Even a guy making 10 mil / yr is another 20 billionaires. I'm not sure where the 1% cut off is, but the articles numbers seem to be missing alot of $$

Let me repeat:

A substantial amount - vast amount, majority, huge amount - of wealth generated by the 1% comes from capital gains, NOT income, and is thereby excluded from any income tax. Warren Buffet and Bill Gates are worth billions upon billions NOT due to income but instead due to capital gains (real estate, stocks, company shares, etc.).

Got it?
 
Short version, wealth is not income. Income is not wealth.

J'Biden and company would have you believe that we can tax the living bejebus out of rick folk's income and that will magically fix everything. But it simply isn't true. Spending and money management are completely out of control. Unless we can reduce the federal budget need, there is no such thing as taxing to a balanced budget, it is fiscally impossible, no matter how much love the hippies want to make.
 
I understand that, but this article is still misleading. You only need about 540k / yr to be in the top 1%. This comes out to 1.4 million people who avg $1.7 mil / yr. This comes out to almost 2.4 trillion not 430 mil
 
Last edited:
I understand that, but this article is still misleading. You only need about 540k / yr to be in the top 1%. This comes out to 1.4 million people who avg $1.7 mil / yr. This comes out to almost 2.4 trillion not 430 mil
You are misreading the statement. What he said was the 1%ers EARN an average 540k, not that earning 540k makes you a 1%er. Those 1%ers ALREADY have the assets that give them that classification. They “EARN” very little compared to what they “MAKE” each year.
 
This is what i was going by. If you are taxing the top 1% then i think you need to include everyone in that bracket not just "billionaires"

Nationwide, it takes an annual income of $538,926 to be among the top 1%. Among the approximately 1.4 million taxpayers who meet this threshold, the average annual income is about $1.7 million – about 20 times the average income of $82,535 among all taxpayers. Wealth, however, is far more concentrated in certain parts of the country than in others, and as a result, the amount it takes to be among the top 1% in each state varies considerably.
 
Last edited:
Precisely. And taxing those evil 1% folks even 95% of their income does virtually nothing to cover the expected 2021 revenue amount.
We cannot tax our way to a balanced budget.

It's not possible.
 
Tucker asked a serious question about government spending - why tax us at all? I mean, the government spends trillions it does not have and will never get, so why not just let us keep our money and have the government keep printing trillions of dollars it doesn't have?
 
Those people's income is about 2.4 trillion, not the 430 million the article was claiming.
Precisely. And taxing those evil 1% folks even 95% of their income does virtually nothing to cover the expected 2021 revenue amount.
We cannot tax our way to a balanced budget.

It's not possible.
I agree with this, just pointing out the income of the top 1% is 2.4 trillion, not the 430 million. On the flip side i would not have much sympathy for people paying more taxes who have like 12 cars, a yacht, 5 houses etc etc. Important thing is where the taxes are going to. The amount of waste in the govt is just absurd
 
Steeltime is full of ****.

Errry body noes rich pipoze gotz big pilez of money, gold barz, and silver the ski on like Scrounge McDuck.
 
Steeltime is full of ****.

Errry body noes rich pipoze gotz big pilez of money, gold barz, and silver the ski on like Scrounge McDuck.
 
Steeltime is full of ****.

iu


Errry body noes rich pipoze gotz big pilez of money, gold barz, and silver the ski on like Scrounge McDuck.

iu
 
Wait? So you're saying that super rich people don't get most of their wealth from the type of income that is taxed in income tax? That can't be right. That would mean that raising the income tax would mostly be symbolic in taxing the rich and would hurt many small businesses. The Dems are for the little guy so that can't be right.
 
But if you get the PEOPLE to believe that in raising taxes you are "keepin' down the MAN!" you can garner more and more votes from behind your palatial walls.
 
Top