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The Coronavirus thread

What you're ignoring is the human behavior part of science.

Not at all. Restrictions and mandates don’t work if people disregard them (see Rose garden ceremony). That’s true with any law, but it doesn’t mean they’re entirely or mostly useless.
 
Wait, SCIENTIFIC studies? So there’s a control group identical to the treatment group? What, some parallel universe without any Covid restrictions?

You really are that stupid. It is illegal to "test" human populations by exposing them to a dangerous disease, but researchers can and have compared societies with very different levels of response to the Chinese flu, and in so doing compared societies that had severe lockdowns - the ones you think prevent the spread of the Chinese flu - to societies that remained essentially "open" - i.e., those you insist will experience an "explosion" of the spread of the Chinese flu.

https://thefatemperor.com/wp-conten...easuring-the-impact-of-government-actions.pdf

In this exploratory analysis, our objective was to examine country-specific public health interventions to contain the virus spread.Knowing the most effective interventions in containing COVID-19 caseloads (recovered or critical) and reducing overall mortality can assist health policy makers in resource allocation decisions, provide evidence regarding the effectiveness of population health measures,and assist countries with internal geographic disparities in mitigating risk with more informed resource planning.We accessed publicly available COVID-19 surveillance data from the top 50 countries in terms of reported cases to assess the impact of population health interventions (e.g. containment measures such as lockdowns, border closings), country-specific socioeconomic factors, and healthcare capacity on overall COVID-19 cases (recovered or critical) and deaths.

When COVID-19 mortality was assessed, variables significantly associated with an increased death rate per million were population prevalence of obesity and per capita GDP (Table 4). In contrast, variables that was negatively associated with increased COVID-19 mortality were reduced income dispersion within the nation, smoking prevalence, and the number of nurses per million population(Table 4). Indeed, more nurses within a given health care system was associated with reduced mortality (Fig. 1). Mortality rates were also higher in those counties with an older population upon univariate analysis, but age as a factor was not retained in multivariable analysis(Fig. 2). Lastly, government actions such as border closures, full lock-downs, and a high rate of COVID-19 testing were not associated with statistically significant reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality.

Science ... *****.
 
Not at all. Restrictions and mandates don’t work if people disregard them (see Rose garden ceremony). That’s true with any law, but it doesn’t mean they’re entirely or mostly useless.

We could eliminate all contagious illness if we just never let anyone go near another human being again. We would prevent millions of people from dying of these contagious illnesses.

There are reasons we don't do this.
 
Lets keep it real simple--

This virus and its variants and well as the next ones coming along in the future cannot be cured from playing "hide and seek"...

In fact, the lockdowns do more damage to people's lives than the virus...that's a fact i've witnessed with my own eyes in my own family..

We are meant to live and interact with each other... and we cannot continue to cower in fear..

Lockdowns must end.
Stop the madness.
Lets live again.
 
Flogged....LOL keep on spinning man. There is no correlation between population sizes in counties and the infections rate. Literally none.

Franklin County, the most populous, has a 7.49% infection rate.
The infection rate for the entire state is 7.20%

The average infection rate of the top 10 population counties in Ohio is 7.22%
The average infection rate of the ten smallest population counties in Ohio is 6.66%.

The average infection rate of the top 20 population counties in Ohio is 7.05%
The average infection rate of the 20 smallest population counties in Ohio is 6.92%

Here are the top 25 counties by population.



Do remember, there is a state wide mask mandate Flog. If a mask protects you in Cleveland, won't it equally protect you in Athens?

Finally, Spike could have predicted a late fall/winter surge...because it's a seasonal virus. Good lord. SMH.

Again nice try, Tim. Top-down by case rate, not population. Where is Pickaway County with its 12.2% case rate? Less than 1/20th the population of Franklin County and 62% higher case rate. How? It should kick Franklin County’s ***.
 
******* ****, Flog, if you are so horny for lockdowns, then lock yourself down. Crawl into a hole and bury yourself for all I care.

But how about not forcing the rest of us to go along with your bizarre fetish?
 
Biden signs executive order mandating that masks be worn at all times on Federal property. His family celebrates the order at the Lincoln Memorial, which if I am not mistaken is located in Washington, D.C. which if I'm not mistaken would make it Federal land.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The older Biden grandkids, plus Ashley Biden in a chic tux, take pictures at the Lincoln Memorial. <a href="https://t.co/P0C57DooyX">pic.twitter.com/P0C57DooyX</a></p>— Jennifer Epstein (@jeneps) <a href="https://twitter.com/jeneps/status/1352070810182295558?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 21, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Beijing Joe, the Basement Boy, Punxsutawney President, shows his commitment to his own order:

Biden-6-scaled.jpg


Rules for thee, but not for me.
 
Biden Wants To Vaccinate 1 Million Americans A Day. Uh, U.S. Inoculated Daily Average Of 912,497 Last Week.
Biden's so-called lofty goal of 1 million vaccinations a day easily achievable because of Trump

CNN, which spent the last four years ripping every action (or perceived inaction) of former President Donald Trump, on Thursday posted a breathless story with a dire headline.

“Biden inheriting nonexistent coronavirus vaccine distribution plan and must start ‘from scratch,’ sources say,” blared the headline.

“Newly sworn in President Joe Biden and his advisers are inheriting no coronavirus vaccine distribution plan to speak of from the Trump administration, sources tell CNN, posing a significant challenge for the new White House,” said the lede. “The Biden administration has promised to try to turn the Covid-19 pandemic around and drastically speed up the pace of vaccinating Americans against the virus. But in the immediate hours following Biden being sworn into office on Wednesday, sources with direct knowledge of the new administration’s Covid-related work told CNN one of the biggest shocks that the Biden team had to digest during the transition period was what they saw as a complete lack of a vaccine distribution strategy under former President Donald Trump, even weeks after multiple vaccines were approved for use in the United States.”

CNN cited (once again) an anonymous source who said: “There is nothing for us to rework. We are going to have to build everything from scratch.”

The liberal network also noted that Biden “has made clear that slowing down the spread of Covid-19 and getting 100 million vaccine shots into Americans’ arms in his first 100 days in office are of utmost priority—goals that will shape whether Biden’s first years in office are ultimately deemed successful.”

Well, that won’t be the Herculean task some have made it out to be, as one new report says the U.S. is already vaccinated more than 900,000 Americans a day.

“Vaccinations in the U.S. began Dec. 14 with health-care workers, and so far 17.2 million shots have been given, according to a state-by-state tally by Bloomberg and data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. In the last week, an average of 912,497 doses per day were administered,” Bloomberg reported on Wednesday.

That means under Trump, vaccinations were already 91.2% on their way to 1 million a day. Biden will just need to pump that up by a tiny 8.8%, just 87,503 people, to reach his goal.

Bloomberg also gave Trump some credit for creating Operation Warp Speed to quickly develop a vaccine for the virus. “Coronavirus vaccines are coming to market at a record pace, shaving years off the typical development time. That speed has been financed in part by rich countries like the U.S., whose Operation Warp Speed program helped subsidize development and manufacturing of half a dozen novel vaccines.”

Pfizer’s COVID-19 vaccine, the first in the U.S., was approved by the FDA for emergency use authorization (EUA) on Dec. 11. The FDA on Dec. 18 also approved Moderna’s EUA request. Both are already being distributed. Moderna said its data showed their vaccine was 95% effective in its late-stage clinical trial, the same as Pfizer’s.

The Moderna vaccine was developed in conjunction with the Trump administration’s Operation Warp Speed. A key advantage of Moderna’s vaccine is that it does not need sub-zero storage like Pfizer’s, which needs to be stored at -94 degrees.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/bide...cans-a-day-uh-u-s-inoculated-912497-last-week

Beijing Joe learned well from the Liar-in-Chief, Obama: Claim credit for everything your predecessor did well, shift blame to predecessor for everything you **** up.
 
******* **** Stoogetime, if you are so horny for a never ending pandemic, then you suck.

How about not forcing the rest of us to go along with your bizarre fetish?

I want the pandemic and all the **** that goes with it over, it’s why I wear a mask and why I’ll get the vaccine.You’re probably one of the anti-vaxers that’ll be bitching that mask mandates and restrictions are still in place a year from now because we haven’t achieved herd immunity.
 
******* **** Stoogetime, if you are so horny for a never ending pandemic, then you suck.

How about not forcing the rest of us to go along with your bizarre fetish?

I want the pandemic and all the **** that goes with it over, it’s why I wear a mask and why I’ll get the vaccine.You’re probably one of the anti-vaxers that’ll be bitching that mask mandates and restrictions are still in place a year from now because we haven’t achieved herd immunity.

Why would you need a mask if you lockdown and stay at your house all the time? It's almost like you are living life normally, making a lot of money off the Chinese flu and love, love, LOVE the benefits of lockdowns.

Wait ...
 
I wonder when they will make the vaccine mandatory? It won’t take long for those who want it to get it and then they will see stockpiles of vaccine and no lines of people to get it. At that point they will devise a scheme to force people to get it. Not by law. That would be illegal. But by encouraging employers and businesses to require you show your "papers" to enter an establishment.
 
I assume Biden’s first acts will be to sign orders doing a bunch of things that have already been done, just to take credit. His Covid response will be half token gestures and half payoffs to Dem favorites.
 
Why would you need a mask if you lockdown and stay at your house all the time? It's almost like you are living life normally, making a lot of money off the Chinese flu and love, love, LOVE the benefits of lockdowns.

Wait ...

For **** sake, I’m saving in fuel costs, I seldom dine out and I was forced to cancel my vacation.That’s the extent of my financial gain.

Who the **** is living normally?
 
I assume Biden’s first acts will be to sign orders doing a bunch of things that have already been done, just to take credit. His Covid response will be half token gestures and half payoffs to Dem favorites.

Expect the gaslighting from the leftist media to start any minute crediting Beijing Biden with creating the vaccine.
 
Again nice try, Tim. Top-down by case rate, not population. Where is Pickaway County with its 12.2% case rate? Less than 1/20th the population of Franklin County and 62% higher case rate. How? It should kick Franklin County’s ***.

I am failing to see your point regarding density. I'll ask again, if a mask works in Cleveland, why won't it work in Athens? If a lockdown works in Cleveland, why won't it work in Athens?

Next, you're trying to correlate population density with case rates by picking outliers. That's a failed approach and you know it as well as I do. Are you familiar with the geography of Ohio? I am intimately. I've spent a ton of time in Ohio. Do you know where the population centers are? Do you understand the concept of suburbs? Do you understand that while a county may be 'locked down' people are still working and moving. Leave your bubble, drive around. Roads are packed. Do you understand the concept of travel?

I'll give you some examples. My county shut down indoor dining. So about once a week we go to a neighboring county that did not to eat out. People throughout the country travel from county to county for business, pleasure, necessity. But when they get tested, regardless where they caught it, it registers in their home county.

Let's dive into geography. Pickaway County borders Franklin, the seat of the state Government, Columbus OH. Right...next....door. It's a small county, and with Franklin right next door. Pickaway's largest town is Circleville, 34 minutes from downtown Columbus. I'm sure no one in Pickaway County, right...next...door to Franklin County ever goes into Franklin. Ever. I grew up in a small county and we would almost always leave ours to go to others for shopping and entertainment our county didn't have.

Let's take a look at every neighboring county of Franklin. Commuter counties if you will. Tell me if you see a pattern....



Gollee Gomer, look at that. The infection rate of the Columbus metro area shows absolutely no pattern. Franklin County sits dead in the middle geographically and from a case % rate. Some adjoining counties have higher infection rates and some lower. Hmmmm. I mean, using your logic, those suburban counties should ALL have higher infection rates because the cities are all doing it right, ammmmiiirrittte?

OK....let's look at the Cincinnati/Dayton metro area. You know they are 54 minutes apart, right? This table includes all counties that touch Montgomery and Hamilton counties, the seats of Southwest Ohio, home to 2.7Million people.



Do you see a pattern? Nope. I certainly don't. Again, no correlation. You have low population counties in this metro area with low infection rates, some with higher. No discernable pattern.

You can go throughout the state. Here, I've provided a map to guide you....



That map shows IFRs by county throughout the state. There is no pattern, save for the fact that darker green areas are "generally" in what we would call metro areas. The Columbus metro area, the Dayton/Cincy area, the Cleveland area, and those areas where people live in Ohio but commute to other states metro areas to work, eat, play.

You might try using some critical thought.

There is no analytic evidence that supports your theory that "denser" areas are doing better than less dense areas. The data doesn't agree with you. Nor does the science.

Back to banging your lockdown drum.
 
I am failing to see your point regarding density. I'll ask again, if a mask works in Cleveland, why won't it work in Athens? If a lockdown works in Cleveland, why won't it work in Athens?

Next, you're trying to correlate population density with case rates by picking outliers. That's a failed approach and you know it as well as I do. Are you familiar with the geography of Ohio? I am intimately. I've spent a ton of time in Ohio. Do you know where the population centers are? Do you understand the concept of suburbs? Do you understand that while a county may be 'locked down' people are still working and moving. Leave your bubble, drive around. Roads are packed. Do you understand the concept of travel?

I'll give you some examples. My county shut down indoor dining. So about once a week we go to a neighboring county that did not to eat out. People throughout the country travel from county to county for business, pleasure, necessity. But when they get tested, regardless where they caught it, it registers in their home county.

Let's dive into geography. Pickaway County borders Franklin, the seat of the state Government, Columbus OH. Right...next....door. It's a small county, and with Franklin right next door. Pickaway's largest town is Circleville, 34 minutes from downtown Columbus. I'm sure no one in Pickaway County, right...next...door to Franklin County ever goes into Franklin. Ever. I grew up in a small county and we would almost always leave ours to go to others for shopping and entertainment our county didn't have.

Let's take a look at every neighboring county of Franklin. Commuter counties if you will. Tell me if you see a pattern....



Gollee Gomer, look at that. The infection rate of the Columbus metro area shows absolutely no pattern. Franklin County sits dead in the middle geographically and from a case % rate. Some adjoining counties have higher infection rates and some lower. Hmmmm. I mean, using your logic, those suburban counties should ALL have higher infection rates because the cities are all doing it right, ammmmiiirrittte?

OK....let's look at the Cincinnati/Dayton metro area. You know they are 54 minutes apart, right? This table includes all counties that touch Montgomery and Hamilton counties, the seats of Southwest Ohio, home to 2.7Million people.



Do you see a pattern? Nope. I certainly don't. Again, no correlation. You have low population counties in this metro area with low infection rates, some with higher. No discernable pattern.

You can go throughout the state. Here, I've provided a map to guide you....



That map shows IFRs by county throughout the state. There is no pattern, save for the fact that darker green areas are "generally" in what we would call metro areas. The Columbus metro area, the Dayton/Cincy area, the Cleveland area, and those areas where people live in Ohio but commute to other states metro areas to work, eat, play.

You might try using some critical thought.

There is no analytic evidence that supports your theory that "denser" areas are doing better than less dense areas. The data doesn't agree with you. Nor does the science.

Back to banging your lockdown drum.

The point is that if masks and restrictions don’t work, doesn’t it stand to reason that urban areas with many people living in close proximity to each other would have higher case rates of a highly contagious disease? The risk of exposure is much greater - people sharing apartment complex and office building lobbies, elevators, and stairwells. People traveling in and out of the city. People sharing mass transit.

The data DOES agree with me. You picked Ohio, check out Pennsylvania, rural Forest and Montour County at the top. Philadelphia and Allegheny way down the list. SD, ND and Utah leading the US in case rate.
 
The point is that if masks and restrictions don’t work, doesn’t it stand to reason that urban areas with many people living in close proximity to each other would have higher case rates of a highly contagious disease? The risk of exposure is much greater - people sharing apartment complex and office building lobbies, elevators, and stairwells. People traveling in and out of the city. People sharing mass transit.

The data DOES agree with me. You picked Ohio, check out Pennsylvania, rural Forest and Montour County at the top. Philadelphia and Allegheny way down the list. SD, ND and Utah leading the US in case rate.

Do you have any evidence from scientists that mask mandates have any appreciable positive effect? All you do is argue and cite anecdotal ****, i.e., non-science.

Here are a couple of research papers using actual SCIENCE to examine the question.

Background: Acute respiratory illnesses (ARIs) are the most common respiratory infectious diseases among humans globally. Surgical mask (SM) wearing has been shown to be effective in reducing ARI among healthcare workers. However, the effectiveness of SM in reducing ARI in the non-healthcare settings remains unclear. This review aims to summarize and assess the association between SM wearing and ARI incidence, from existing interventional and observational studies conducted in non-healthcare settings.

Methods: Systematic literature searches conducted in PubMed, Cochrane Library, and Embase databases identified 503 unique studies. After screening, 15 studies (5 randomized controlled trials and 10 observational studies) were assessed for reporting and methodological qualities. Proportions of ARI episodes in each group and adjusted summary statistics with their relevant 95% CIs were extracted. Data from 10 observational studies were pooled using the generic inverse variance method.

Results: A total of 23,892 participants between 7 and 89 years old involved across 15 studies from 11 countries were involved. Key settings identified were Hajj, schools, and in-flight settings. A modest but non-significant protective effect of SM on ARI incidence was observed (pooled OR 0.96, 95% CI 0.8–1.15). Subgroup analysis according to age group, outcome ascertainment and different non-healthcare settings also revealed no significant associations between SM use and ARI incidence.

Conclusion: Surgical mask wearing among individuals in non-healthcare settings is not significantly associated with reduction in ARI incidence in this meta-review.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7546829/

New Danish Study Finds Masks Don’t Protect Wearers From COVID Infection

A total of 3030 participants were randomly assigned to the recommendation to wear masks, and 2994 were assigned to control; 4862 completed the study. Infection with SARS-CoV-2 occurred in 42 participants recommended masks (1.8%) and 53 control participants (2.1%). The between-group difference was −0.3 percentage point (95% CI, −1.2 to 0.4 percentage point; P = 0.38) (odds ratio, 0.82 [CI, 0.54 to 1.23]; P = 0.33). Multiple imputation accounting for loss to follow-up yielded similar results. Although the difference observed was not statistically significant, the 95% CIs are compatible with a 46% reduction to a 23% increase in infection.

https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-6817

Conclusions

The filtration, effectiveness, fit, and performance of cloth masks are inferior to those of medical masks and respirators. Cloth mask use should not be mandated for healthcare workers, who should as a priority be provided proper respiratory protection. Cloth masks are a more suitable option for community use when medical masks are unavailable. Protection provided by cloth masks may be improved by selecting appropriate material, increasing the number of mask layers, and using those with a design that provides filtration and fit. Cloth masks should be washed daily and after high-exposure use by using soap and water or other appropriate methods.

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/10/20-0948_article

So cloth masks are not shown to have any positive effect, and indeed if used cloth masks must be multi-layered, with proper fit, and washed daily or they make **** worse.

Guess how the real world operates, dumbass.
 
The point is that if masks and restrictions don’t work, doesn’t it stand to reason that urban areas with many people living in close proximity to each other would have higher case rates of a highly contagious disease? The risk of exposure is much greater - people sharing apartment complex and office building lobbies, elevators, and stairwells. People traveling in and out of the city. People sharing mass transit.

I just broke down a state for you and showed you that metropolitan areas and their suburbs are hardest hit.

How about New York Floggy?? It should be our poster child case, right?



The darker areas have more cases. Updated January 20. Wanna keep telling us that metro areas are NOT hardest hit?

Now switching gears that we have established the hardest hit areas are those that are metro in origin. Let's discuss how it is passed, because your assumptions appear to be baseless. "Ooohh, mass transit." Except...

New York did a study of 46,000 contact tracing data points. Densest city in the country. Their results...you've seen it before:



You're assuming everyone in an urban area gets it by being in close contact "in public" commuting, at stores, etc. 74% of COVID was spread in at home social gatherings. 1.43% from restaurants. 0.6% from gyms. The data Flog shows that even in the densest areas, people are getting it when at home.

0.96% from TRANSIT. 0.69% from Church. 0.61% from Retail. 0.14% from Haircare.

Here's what I know. Metro areas are hardest hit, as a general rule. I'm not doing any more homework for you. What we don't know is exactly how it is spread. Scientist believe they do, but they changed their positions so often, who knows? All I know is they tell us it is airborne, and that's how it's spread. But when you begin looking at the contact tracing data, it DESTROYS these ideas that is it is dangerous to go outside, to go to church, to the gym, to eat out. There is NO evidence.

Further, more and more school studies are coming out showing scant, bare percentages of transmission in schools. It's not happening.

But it's happening at home. 3/4 of the time.
 
I saw an article this morning that said that a single positive test with no clinical presentation of symptoms no longer constitutes a positive Covid19 test, that there has to be a second positive test to confirm.

Must have been bunk because I can’t find the link now.
 
I think Zona is on to something here......

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Bullshit. Dr. Flog the freeloader will be here to explain why the Chinese flu is a unique virus, behaving like a lion. If you just hide in your bedroom for 15 days ... ehh, five months ... uhhh, ten months, it will just get up and leave.
 
I saw an article this morning that said that a single positive test with no clinical presentation of symptoms no longer constitutes a positive Covid19 test, that there has to be a second positive test to confirm.

Must have been bunk because I can’t find the link now.

i believe those are the new WHO guidelines that they dropped as soon as Biden was sworn in. Also CNN has dropped their on screen COVID death count. Just coincidence.
 
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