Make a prediction. Others are speculating and you spend your time trying to debunk everyone else's theories. Put a stake in the ground.
The Coronavirus thread
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Make a prediction. Others are speculating and you spend your time trying to debunk everyone else's theories. Put a stake in the ground.
Who's surprised? Anyone?
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Chinese Biological Experiments With Coronavirus To Infect Humans Exposed In 2015 By Italian State Media
Five years ago, Italian state owned media Company, Rai – Radiotelevisione Italiana, exposed dark efforts by China on viruses. The video, which was broadcast in November, 2015, showed how Chinese scientists were doing biological experiments on a SARS connected virus believed to be Coronavirus, derived from bats and mice, asking whether it was worth the risk in order to be able to modify the virus for compatibility with human organisms.
Below is a transcription of the Italian broadcast translated in English.
---------------------------
Chinese Biological Experiments
Chinese scientists have created a pulmonary supervirus from bats and mice only for study reasons but there are many questionable aspects to this. Is it worth the risk? It’s an experiment, of course, but it is worrisome. It worries many scientists: It is a group of Chinese researchers attaching a protein taken from bats to the SARS virus, Acute Pneumonia, derived from mice. The output is a super coronavirus that could affect man. It remains closed in laboratories and it is only for study purposes, but is it worth the risk – creating such a great threat only for examination purposes?
The debate about the risks of research is as old as science itself. Like the myth of Icarus, who plunged from the Sky and perished in the sea, having gone too close to the Sun with the wings of wax designed by his father!
Chinese scientists experiment on SARS virus to infect humans. Rai – Radiotelevisione Italiana
Here is an experiment in China, in which a group of scientists has managed to develop a chimera – an organism modified by attaching the surface protein of a coronavirus found in bats of the common species called the Great Horseshoe Bat, to a virus that causes SARS in mice, although in a non-fatal form. It was suspected that the protein could make the chimeric hybrid organism suitable for affecting humans, and the experiment confirmed it.
It is precisely this molecule, called SHCO14, that allows the coronavirus to attach itself to our respiratory cells and to trigger the syndrome. According to researchers, the two organisms, the original and even more so the engineered one, can infect humans directly from bats, without going through an intermediate species like the mouse, and it is this eventuality that raises many controversies.
Just one year ago (this broadcast is of 2015), the U.S. government suspended research funding, which aimed to make viruses more contagious. The moratorium did not stop the work of the Chinese on SARS, which was already in advanced stages and looked relatively harmless.
According to a section of the scientific community, it is in fact not dangerous. The probability that the virus may pass to our species was insignificant compared to the benefits of the virus – an argument that many other experts rejected. First, because the relationship between risk and benefit is difficult to evaluate and second, because especially in these times, it is more prudent to not put into circulation an organism that can escape or be removed from the control of laboratories.
As soon that this broadcast went viral on the Italian social media, journalists and experts began explaining it away saying, that the virus in the video was not COVID-19. Even the British journal Nature, which wrote the very publication this Italian show was based on, clarified that the virus the broadcast talked about was not related to the “Natural” COVID-19.
However, that is beside the point. This is not to say that the viruses are literally the same. This is to say that the information presented in the video is consistent with the information that China is doing a lot of research on bioweapons, and that the impact of the virus in the broadcast has a lot in common with mainstream information about the symptoms of COVID-19.
Moreover, Nature itself had done a piece in February, 2017, on the BSL-4 laboratory in Wuhan, the Wuhan Institute of Virology, raising valid concerns and theories, and wondering out loud whether experimentation with deadly viruses was a good idea.
In January, 2020, Nature then sheepishly added an editor’s note to the top of the article, saying that there is in fact “no evidence” of this lab playing a role in the outbreak of coronavirus and that scientists believe that the source is likely “an animal market.”
Meanwhile, the Italian scientists at Milan University are investigating whether the coronavirus outbreak actually began in Italy in the last quarter of 2019. Milan and Lodi cities of Lombardy administrative region reported a “significant” increase in the number of people hospitalized for pneumonia and flu in October and December of 2019. Meanwhile, amidst worldwide criticism, a $20 trillion lawsuit has been filed against China for waging Biological war using Coronavirus.
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Chinese Biological Experiments With Coronavirus To Infect Humans Exposed In 2015 By Italian State Media
Five years ago, Italian state owned media Company, Rai – Radiotelevisione Italiana, exposed dark efforts by China on viruses. The video, which was broadcast in November, 2015, showed how Chinese scientists were doing biological experiments on a SARS connected virus believed to be Coronavirus, derived from bats and mice, asking whether it was worth the risk in order to be able to modify the virus for compatibility with human organisms.
Below is a transcription of the Italian broadcast translated in English.
---------------------------
Chinese Biological Experiments
Chinese scientists have created a pulmonary supervirus from bats and mice only for study reasons but there are many questionable aspects to this. Is it worth the risk? It’s an experiment, of course, but it is worrisome. It worries many scientists: It is a group of Chinese researchers attaching a protein taken from bats to the SARS virus, Acute Pneumonia, derived from mice. The output is a super coronavirus that could affect man. It remains closed in laboratories and it is only for study purposes, but is it worth the risk – creating such a great threat only for examination purposes?
The debate about the risks of research is as old as science itself. Like the myth of Icarus, who plunged from the Sky and perished in the sea, having gone too close to the Sun with the wings of wax designed by his father!
Chinese scientists experiment on SARS virus to infect humans. Rai – Radiotelevisione Italiana
Here is an experiment in China, in which a group of scientists has managed to develop a chimera – an organism modified by attaching the surface protein of a coronavirus found in bats of the common species called the Great Horseshoe Bat, to a virus that causes SARS in mice, although in a non-fatal form. It was suspected that the protein could make the chimeric hybrid organism suitable for affecting humans, and the experiment confirmed it.
It is precisely this molecule, called SHCO14, that allows the coronavirus to attach itself to our respiratory cells and to trigger the syndrome. According to researchers, the two organisms, the original and even more so the engineered one, can infect humans directly from bats, without going through an intermediate species like the mouse, and it is this eventuality that raises many controversies.
Just one year ago (this broadcast is of 2015), the U.S. government suspended research funding, which aimed to make viruses more contagious. The moratorium did not stop the work of the Chinese on SARS, which was already in advanced stages and looked relatively harmless.
According to a section of the scientific community, it is in fact not dangerous. The probability that the virus may pass to our species was insignificant compared to the benefits of the virus – an argument that many other experts rejected. First, because the relationship between risk and benefit is difficult to evaluate and second, because especially in these times, it is more prudent to not put into circulation an organism that can escape or be removed from the control of laboratories.
As soon that this broadcast went viral on the Italian social media, journalists and experts began explaining it away saying, that the virus in the video was not COVID-19. Even the British journal Nature, which wrote the very publication this Italian show was based on, clarified that the virus the broadcast talked about was not related to the “Natural” COVID-19.
However, that is beside the point. This is not to say that the viruses are literally the same. This is to say that the information presented in the video is consistent with the information that China is doing a lot of research on bioweapons, and that the impact of the virus in the broadcast has a lot in common with mainstream information about the symptoms of COVID-19.
Moreover, Nature itself had done a piece in February, 2017, on the BSL-4 laboratory in Wuhan, the Wuhan Institute of Virology, raising valid concerns and theories, and wondering out loud whether experimentation with deadly viruses was a good idea.
In January, 2020, Nature then sheepishly added an editor’s note to the top of the article, saying that there is in fact “no evidence” of this lab playing a role in the outbreak of coronavirus and that scientists believe that the source is likely “an animal market.”
Meanwhile, the Italian scientists at Milan University are investigating whether the coronavirus outbreak actually began in Italy in the last quarter of 2019. Milan and Lodi cities of Lombardy administrative region reported a “significant” increase in the number of people hospitalized for pneumonia and flu in October and December of 2019. Meanwhile, amidst worldwide criticism, a $20 trillion lawsuit has been filed against China for waging Biological war using Coronavirus.
Question is when this calms down will countries hold their nutts to the fire on this.
Study: Coronavirus Death Rate Lower Than Previously Reported
A new study published in The Lancet Infectious Diseases medical journal estimates that the death rate of coronavirus is significantly lower than previously reported.
In early March, World Health Organization Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said the estimated mortality rate of COVID-19 globally was about 3.4%, while Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said it could be anywhere from 1-2% if “you just do the math,” based on initial reports out of other countries.
“What we’re hearing right now, on a recent call from the WHO this morning is that there aren’t as many asymptotic cases as we think. Which made them elevate, I think, what their mortality is,” Fauci explained in the first week of March. “You know as well as anybody that the mortality for seasonal flu is .1% so even if it goes down to 1% it’s still 10 times more fatal.”
As reported by CNN Tuesday, a new study published in Lancet estimates that even the lower-end 1% fatality rate estimation is too high. A more accurate estimation of the percentage of people who will die due to complications from the virus, researchers say, is about two-thirds that, 0.66%.
“That coronavirus death rate, which is lower than earlier estimates, takes into account potentially milder cases that often go undiagnosed — but it’s still far higher than the 0.1% of people who are killed by the flu,” CNN explains. “When undetected infections aren’t taken into account, the Lancet study found that the coronavirus death rate was 1.38%, which is more consistent with earlier reports.”
As noted by CNN, when Dr. Fauci presented his 2% estimation in March, he stressed that determining the true death rate requires accurate data on the number of people who have contracted the virus but are asymptomatic, or show no symptoms, a metric that has been glaringly lacking thus far. Only taking into account confirmed cases results in an incomplete data set and generally includes those with the more severe symptoms, rather than the more mild cases, which some previous studies suggest could be about half the number of COVID-19 cases.
The new study attempts to account for the asymptomatic or very mild cases, not just the confirmed cases. To do so, the researchers looked at infection rates of people who returned to their home countries on flights from Wuhan, China, CNN explains.
“According to the study, these people received PCR tests — a type of test that would be able to identify how many of those travelers were shedding the virus, even if they didn’t show symptoms,” CNN explains. “Researchers combined that data on ‘infection prevalence’ with public information on reported cases and deaths, estimating the overall death rate to be about two-thirds of 1%.”
For those younger than 40, the estimated fatality rate is even lower, just 0.16%, while those younger than 9 have only an estimated 0.00161% chance of dying from complications related to the virus. For those 80 or older, however, the fatality rate is an alarming 7.8%, researchers found.
“There might be outlying cases that get a lot of media attention, but our analysis very clearly shows that at aged 50 and over, hospitalisation is much more likely than in those under 50, and a greater proportion of cases are likely to be fatal,” said Imperial College London professor and study co-author Azra Ghani said, as reported by CNN.
While researchers found that the fatality rate is far lower than some previous estimates, they also note that the often prolonged recovery time for the virus, which can take over three weeks, threatens to overwhelm health care systems.
A new study published in The Lancet Infectious Diseases medical journal estimates that the death rate of coronavirus is significantly lower than previously reported.
In early March, World Health Organization Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said the estimated mortality rate of COVID-19 globally was about 3.4%, while Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, said it could be anywhere from 1-2% if “you just do the math,” based on initial reports out of other countries.
“What we’re hearing right now, on a recent call from the WHO this morning is that there aren’t as many asymptotic cases as we think. Which made them elevate, I think, what their mortality is,” Fauci explained in the first week of March. “You know as well as anybody that the mortality for seasonal flu is .1% so even if it goes down to 1% it’s still 10 times more fatal.”
As reported by CNN Tuesday, a new study published in Lancet estimates that even the lower-end 1% fatality rate estimation is too high. A more accurate estimation of the percentage of people who will die due to complications from the virus, researchers say, is about two-thirds that, 0.66%.
“That coronavirus death rate, which is lower than earlier estimates, takes into account potentially milder cases that often go undiagnosed — but it’s still far higher than the 0.1% of people who are killed by the flu,” CNN explains. “When undetected infections aren’t taken into account, the Lancet study found that the coronavirus death rate was 1.38%, which is more consistent with earlier reports.”
As noted by CNN, when Dr. Fauci presented his 2% estimation in March, he stressed that determining the true death rate requires accurate data on the number of people who have contracted the virus but are asymptomatic, or show no symptoms, a metric that has been glaringly lacking thus far. Only taking into account confirmed cases results in an incomplete data set and generally includes those with the more severe symptoms, rather than the more mild cases, which some previous studies suggest could be about half the number of COVID-19 cases.
The new study attempts to account for the asymptomatic or very mild cases, not just the confirmed cases. To do so, the researchers looked at infection rates of people who returned to their home countries on flights from Wuhan, China, CNN explains.
“According to the study, these people received PCR tests — a type of test that would be able to identify how many of those travelers were shedding the virus, even if they didn’t show symptoms,” CNN explains. “Researchers combined that data on ‘infection prevalence’ with public information on reported cases and deaths, estimating the overall death rate to be about two-thirds of 1%.”
For those younger than 40, the estimated fatality rate is even lower, just 0.16%, while those younger than 9 have only an estimated 0.00161% chance of dying from complications related to the virus. For those 80 or older, however, the fatality rate is an alarming 7.8%, researchers found.
“There might be outlying cases that get a lot of media attention, but our analysis very clearly shows that at aged 50 and over, hospitalisation is much more likely than in those under 50, and a greater proportion of cases are likely to be fatal,” said Imperial College London professor and study co-author Azra Ghani said, as reported by CNN.
While researchers found that the fatality rate is far lower than some previous estimates, they also note that the often prolonged recovery time for the virus, which can take over three weeks, threatens to overwhelm health care systems.
Rick Madcow making himself a fool...yet...again
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WHOOPS
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WHOOPS
Wait, what? Chinese propaganda and CNN have assured me that (1) the United States developed the virus and (2) its spread is all due to Trump!!
You doubt reliable sources such as Chinese propaganda and CNN?
Meanwhile, unlike the legion of never helpful doomsayers, I interrupt to provide information that may actually help. If the pandemic warriors object, I understand, but how about one bit of useful information??
The right way to wear a surgical face mask
The first step is examining the mask. If it is damaged, throw it away. If the mask looks okay, pull the loop around the ears, expand the mask over the nose and chin and make sure it has a snug fit. Do not touch the surface of the mask when putting it on, while wearing it, or when taking it off.
Replace the mask if it is soiled with bodily fluids, either on the inside (by the wearer) or outside (through public exposure). But in general, surgical masks are single use items and should never be recycled or reused. Remove the mask only by touching the ear loops to avoid cross-contaminating fingers. Wrap and dispose of mask properly, and wash your hands.
https://forkast.news/coronavirus-how-to-use-face-mask-infection-prevent-covid19/
Useless **** information from the guvmint advises against using any breathing protection for the simple reason that misuse can in fact increase the chances of infection. Rather than teach us how to do the **** the right way, they take the easy approach, lie, and tell us that masks provide no protection, a statement which is definitively false and disproved by looking at every ************ who goes near the infected.
The issue is that the fit must be right. That is easy to learn. The mask must NOT be touched, ever, when put or or more importantly, when removed. The mask must cover the nose and mouth with a tight fit. Breathing must be through the mask itself, without cheating by allowing an air passage around the nose, for example.
Most importantly, DON'T TOUCH THE GODDAMN MASK, AT ALL, DURING THE ENTIRE TIME YOU WEAR THE THING. If in fact any aerosolized virus has made contact with the mask, the greatest risk of infection occurs when we touch the mask or use our hands to remove the mask, and then touch our face or indeed any other surface before disinfecting our hands. Further, when removing the mask, (1) use only the strap or elastic band to remove and don't touch the goddamn mask, (2) use gloves when doing so, and (3) carefully dispose of the mask while wearing gloves and IMMEDIATELY wash your hands.
But giving that information and expecting (D)im voters to be able to follow the basic instructions is too much to ask, so the guvmint instead lies to us and says, "Oh, those masks that every ******* medical professional wears around the infected? They do nothing, no good, at all, zero benefit."
SN PSA: Wash your hands after touching the mail or opening your mailbox. You don't know where the mailman's fingers have been
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Wait, what? Chinese propaganda and CNN have assured me that (1) the United States developed the virus and (2) its spread is all due to Trump!!
You doubt reliable sources such as Chinese propaganda and CNN?
Meanwhile, unlike the legion of never helpful doomsayers, I interrupt to provide information that may actually help. If the pandemic warriors object, I understand, but how about one bit of useful information??
The right way to wear a surgical face mask
The first step is examining the mask. If it is damaged, throw it away. If the mask looks okay, pull the loop around the ears, expand the mask over the nose and chin and make sure it has a snug fit. Do not touch the surface of the mask when putting it on, while wearing it, or when taking it off.
Replace the mask if it is soiled with bodily fluids, either on the inside (by the wearer) or outside (through public exposure). But in general, surgical masks are single use items and should never be recycled or reused. Remove the mask only by touching the ear loops to avoid cross-contaminating fingers. Wrap and dispose of mask properly, and wash your hands.
https://forkast.news/coronavirus-how-to-use-face-mask-infection-prevent-covid19/
Useless **** information from the guvmint advises against using any breathing protection for the simple reason that misuse can in fact increase the chances of infection. Rather than teach us how to do the **** the right way, they take the easy approach, lie, and tell us that masks provide no protection, a statement which is definitively false and disproved by looking at every ************ who goes near the infected.
The issue is that the fit must be right. That is easy to learn. The mask must NOT be touched, ever, when put or or more importantly, when removed. The mask must cover the nose and mouth with a tight fit. Breathing must be through the mask itself, without cheating by allowing an air passage around the nose, for example.
Most importantly, DON'T TOUCH THE GODDAMN MASK, AT ALL, DURING THE ENTIRE TIME YOU WEAR THE THING. If in fact any aerosolized virus has made contact with the mask, the greatest risk of infection occurs when we touch the mask or use our hands to remove the mask, and then touch our face or indeed any other surface before disinfecting our hands. Further, when removing the mask, (1) use only the strap or elastic band to remove and don't touch the goddamn mask, (2) use gloves when doing so, and (3) carefully dispose of the mask while wearing gloves and IMMEDIATELY wash your hands.
But giving that information and expecting (D)im voters to be able to follow the basic instructions is too much to ask, so the guvmint instead lies to us and says, "Oh, those masks that every ******* medical professional wears around the infected? They do nothing, no good, at all, zero benefit."
Those around infected do not usually wear basic surgical masks they wear n95 respirators. A surgical mask protects the patient and does little to filter air coming in. An n95 respirator must be fit snugly to the face and actually filters the air through the mask and must be fit air tight to the face. They do a special test when you first get fit to make sure you know how to wear it and what size to wear so no air escapes in and out around the sides negating the effect. You are absolutely correct about the touching part.
If the mask you are wearing doesn't cause you to have to work a little harder to breathe it is not filtering through the mask and is little more than a basic shield against droplets.
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MORE MONEY! MORE MONEY! MORE MONEY!
Trump, Pelosi see 'Phase 4' coronavirus package that includes infrastructure spending
Trump on Tuesday called for $2 trillion in spending on infrastructure, saying in a tweet that it was time to “be VERY BIG & BOLD” while interest rates are low.
The president’s statements on Twitter come after Pelosi on Monday said a “Phase 4” coronavirus stimulus package ought to include a bipartisan deal on infrastructure spending. In his tweets on Tuesday, Trump used the term “Phase 4” and said Pelosi “wasn’t bad” in a TV appearance on Tuesday.
She would like to see the next bill feature “more direct payments” to Americans, more money for state and local governments, increased protections for workers, more assistance for hospitals and nursing homes and “more opportunity for family and medical leave.”
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/p...structure-spending-2020-03-30?mod=nextup_bomw
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Where's my check? Where's my check? Where's my check?
Trump, Pelosi see 'Phase 4' coronavirus package that includes infrastructure spending
Trump on Tuesday called for $2 trillion in spending on infrastructure, saying in a tweet that it was time to “be VERY BIG & BOLD” while interest rates are low.
The president’s statements on Twitter come after Pelosi on Monday said a “Phase 4” coronavirus stimulus package ought to include a bipartisan deal on infrastructure spending. In his tweets on Tuesday, Trump used the term “Phase 4” and said Pelosi “wasn’t bad” in a TV appearance on Tuesday.
She would like to see the next bill feature “more direct payments” to Americans, more money for state and local governments, increased protections for workers, more assistance for hospitals and nursing homes and “more opportunity for family and medical leave.”
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/p...structure-spending-2020-03-30?mod=nextup_bomw
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Where's my check? Where's my check? Where's my check?
The math isnt set in stone but the general principle are this
In closed environments such as the cruise ships loaded with high risk people, 18 to 20% tested positive
Ising the bell curve and the high end of the numbers its expected that within the first year 50 to 80 million Americans will contract it... the rough 20% number puts it at 66 million... roughly the same as swine flu its first year
The death rate is expected to be calculated between .65 and .05 % (.0065 and .0005) that calculates from close to a half million down to the high 20thousands
The high number keeps coming down..
Given the population breakdown by age and risk factors, 100k to 200 k are a safe estimate, but the more likely number is under 100k... 80k is my bet but a lot of math says 60k
I think they are going to realize that this is the second pass of it and tge upper respiratory flu that killed so many in the last quarter of last year was it too... the Chinese just lied about it badly and we are seeing late stage 2 of this epidemic, but thats just spitballing about a weird and deadly mystery illness that mimics this directly before news of it broke
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The point of all the COVID-19 hysteria is to prevent 200 million cases and 1-2 million deaths. Because of limited testing there are many things they not are sure of, but the fact that it is certainly more contagious and deadly than the flu aren’t among them.
Gubmint cheese time!
https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/30/health/coronavirus-lower-death-rate/index.html
Bam... For about a month math has been saying.65 was the worse case scenario for this... now the fearmongering media is catching up
The end result is probably going to be 0.1something% , a hair higher than the flu...
Bam... For about a month math has been saying.65 was the worse case scenario for this... now the fearmongering media is catching up
The end result is probably going to be 0.1something% , a hair higher than the flu...
At person's goin catch their death of cold standin aut in na rein like at.
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FREE FOOD! FREE FOOD! FREE FOOD!
PENNSYLVANIA FOOD BANK DRAWS MILE-LONG LINE OF CARS AS TRUMP APPROVES STATE'S CORONAVIRUS DISASTER DECLARATION
Load up them Caddys!
Just catch the friggin virus already and lets restart the world.
I highly doubt those figures would have ever come to pass.
FREE FOOD! FREE FOOD! FREE FOOD!
PENNSYLVANIA FOOD BANK DRAWS MILE-LONG LINE OF CARS AS TRUMP APPROVES STATE'S CORONAVIRUS DISASTER DECLARATION
Load up them Caddys!
******* 80k suv and he/she begging for food. **** sake.
The point of the hysteria was to gain political currency for the election... now that Trump is looking better and better the spin machine is going to go polar opposite and declare all of this was overblown panic induced by Trump and he is to blame for the economic collapse that came from it
I hearby declare that absolutely nobody who was on board with the fearmongering gets to make those claims and not be utterly and totally ignored by me and my kind...
This was always a serious but not world ending pandemic... we needed to do better than we did for the less deadly H1N1, and we did, if only slightly... but we reached overkill stages quickly
And for the record, our testing capacity is ahead of any previous pandemic at the same stage right now... and its now at a higher pace than any other country
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For the n95s you are supposed to use a fit test kit which is basically a hood you put over your face and they spray chemical in it. If you can smell it then it doesn't fit right. I bet 90% of people wearing them have never been fitted. I had a hell of a time even finding a test kit. Most are ordered till may or June
You just like licking knobs. I keed, I keed
Osha actually has lessened their stance in the RP standard because of that and the CDC issued non fit testing protocol for folks that are out of them. Ideal? No but better than just a surgical mask