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This should end well

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https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation...ider-proposal-to-limit-when-police-shoot-guns

After Stephon Clark shooting, California lawmakers consider proposal to limit when police shoot guns
Nation Apr 3, 2018 3:59 PM EDT

SACRAMENTO, Calif. (AP) — Several lawmakers and the family of a 22-year-old unarmed black man who was fatally shot by police are proposing Tuesday that California become the first state to significantly restrict when officers can open fire.

The legislation would change the standard from using “reasonable force” to “necessary force.”

That means officers would be allowed to shoot only if “there were no other reasonable alternatives to the use of deadly force” to prevent imminent serious injury or death, said Lizzie Buchen, legislative advocate for the American Civil Liberties Union, which is among the groups behind the measure.

The goal is to encourage officers to try to defuse confrontations or use less deadly weapons, said Terry Schanz, a spokesman for Democratic Assemblyman Kevin McCarty of Sacramento, who is co-authoring the legislation with Assemblywoman Shirley Weber, a San Diego Democrat.

Some in law enforcement called the proposal “irresponsible and unworkable.”

Officers already use deadly force only when necessary and are taught to try to defuse dangerous situations first when possible, said Ed Obayashi, a Plumas County sheriff’s deputy and special prosecutor who trains officers and testifies in court on police use of force.

Tinkering with legal protections for police could make it more difficult to hire officers and is dangerous because they may hesitate when confronting an armed suspect, threatening themselves and bystanders, Obayashi said.

Leslie McGill, executive director of the California Police Chiefs Association, and Cory Salzillo, a lobbyist for the California State Sheriffs’ Association, said they had not seen the proposal and could not comment.

Sacramento Police Chief Daniel Hahn told The Associated Press last week that he is open to examining the department’s policies on pursuing suspects and other practices but warned that changes could carry consequences.

Sgt. Vance Chandler, a department spokesman, said Tuesday that Hahn was reluctant to comment on pending legislation but that “law enforcement is changing” and must be open to ways of improving.

California’s current standard makes it rare for officers to be charged after a shooting and rarer still for them to be convicted. Frequently it’s because of the doctrine of “reasonable fear.” If prosecutors or jurors believe that officers have a reason to fear for their safety, they can use deadly force.

That standard “gives very broad discretion,” said Buchen of the ACLU. “It doesn’t mean there has to have been a threat. If a reasonable officer could have perceived a threat and responded with deadly force, then it’s legal.”

The tougher proposed standard could require officers to delay confronting a suspect they fear may be armed until backup arrives or force police to give explicit verbal warnings that suspects will be killed unless they drop the weapon, Buchen said.

Officers also might have to use de-escalation techniques or try non-lethal weapons before shooting.

The proposal would open officers who don’t follow the stricter rules to discipline or firing, sometimes even criminal charges.

The ACLU says California would be the first state to adopt such a standard, though some other law enforcement agencies, including San Francisco, have similar or more restrictive rules.

Cities’ strict standards are generally for situations where there is time to de-escalate volatile situations, such as with people who are mentally unstable, Obayashi said. That wasn’t the case with Clark, he said, when the officers say they suddenly confronted a man they mistakenly thought was pointing a gun.

The lawmakers and ACLU point to a 2016 study by policy analyst and racial justice advocate Samuel Sinyangwe that analyzed use-of-force policies by major U.S. police departments. He found that officers working under more restrictive policies are less likely to kill and less likely to be killed or assaulted.

Officers fatally shot 162 people in California last year, only half of whom had guns, the lawmakers said.

They cited studies showing that black people are far more likely than white people to die in police shootings and that California has five of the nation’s 15 police departments with the highest per capita rates of killings by officers: Bakersfield, Stockton, Long Beach, Santa Ana and San Bernardino.
 
I don't think California will have too many people wanting to join law enforcement. At that pace the state will become completely lawless. Then the federal government will have to step in and take over. Is that what these people really want?
 
I don't think California will have too many people wanting to join law enforcement. At that pace the state will become completely lawless. Then the federal government will have to step in and take over. Is that what these people really want?

I believe it is. California liberals are going to get exactly what they want. Can't wait to see how it turns out.
 
As if that state isn't enough of a hellhole.

Shortages of police in lots of places already. It's working out great for Baltimore.
 
I don't think California will have too many people wanting to join law enforcement. At that pace the state will become completely lawless.

Note to all who think Roy is overstating the situation here. I have clients who are police officers with a department other than LAPD. So LAPD begins pursuit of a vehicle with two male suspects, and the vehicle winds up in my clients' jurisdiction. My clients help stop the vehicle, and order the two out of the car. They refuse. My guys open the door, order suspects out. The driver exits the vehicle and begins wrestling with my cops. Three of them are wrestling the guy, who is 6'4", 260 lbs. (But hey, no worries, he was unarmed.) They are grappling with him for several minutes. The driver breaks one guy's wrist, punches another guy in the face and breaks his nose. (But no worries, he was "unarmed.") One of my guys finally gets the driver to stop wrestling by pointing his pepper spray into the guy's mouth and blasting him.

LAPD? No assistance. At all. Simply stood by and watched.

Meanwhile, the passenger gets out of the vehicle and starts running. Runs right by several LAPD officers, who simply watch him go. Do not lift a finger to stop him.

And this has nothing to do - NOTHING - with "jurisdiction." The chase started in LAPD zone, they could and should have intervened. Why didn't they? Why should they? They have body cameras, other cops are handling it, why risk one of the suspects making a claim?? "**** it," they said.

And that is happening more and more and more and more. Dangerous, violent criminals are let go because police are not going to risk their lives and then wind up getting prosecuted. "**** it."

Anybody who doubts that is what is happening has no clue, and has never spoken to a police officer.
 
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I don't think California will have too many people wanting to join law enforcement. At that pace the state will become completely lawless. Then the federal government will have to step in and take over. Is that what these people really want?

You guys are the most fearmongering, freakout and leap to extreme conclusion MFs ive ever seen. Lawlessness ? Goddamn....goddddd damn. Its not like they said cops cant shoot folks, period.

Maybe....just maybe, cops should use better responsible judgement and try and de-escalate situations as opposed to just blasting folks with 20 rounds claiming there was a gun, when in fact, there was no gun. And if you **** up and just happen to flood a body with 20 rounds you pay a consequence, like reckless manslaughter charges and convictions. Cops do what they do because they know they can do so with near impunity. Im not okay with cops that have fear of certain cultures or nationalities and their actions are predicated on this fear. If youre afraid of black or brown folks and you feel you need to always use deadly force even in doubt, get out the cop game...simple as that. Ive had relatives, neighbors that have served on the force and never had to use their weapon, even having physical conflicts with suspects or giving foot chase. Cops nowdays can have a beef with you, meet you on a public domain during a basic traffic or jaywalking stop, escalate a situation and kill you and then resort to the trusted and tried, "I felt my life was in danger..." , receive a vote of confidence and support for the municipality, the union, and he will never get charged. Wash, rinse, strap up, repeat.

Whats crazy is the Klan has infiltrated police forces so this should really make police reform a mandatory project NATIONWIDE.
 
Note to all who think Roy is overstating the situation here. I have clients who are police officers with a department other than LAPD. So LAPD begins pursuit of a vehicle with two male suspects, and the vehicle winds up in my clients' jurisdiction. My clients help stop the vehicle, and order the two out of the car. They refuse. My guys open the door, order suspects out. The driver exits the vehicle and begins wrestling with my cops. Three of them are wrestling the guy, who is 6'4", 260 lbs. (But hey, no worries, he was unarmed.) They are grappling with him for several minutes. The driver breaks one guy's wrist, punches another guy in the face and breaks his nose. (But no worries, he was "unarmed.") One of my guys finally gets the driver to stop wrestling by pointing his pepper spray into the guy's mouth and blasting him.

LAPD? No assistance. At all. Simply stood by and watched.

Meanwhile, the passenger gets out of the vehicle and starts running. Runs right by several LAPD officers, who simply watch him go. Do not lift a finger to stop him.

And this has nothing to do - NOTHING - with "jurisdiction." The chase started in LAPD zone, they could and should have intervened. Why didn't they? Why should they? They have body cameras, other cops are handling it, why risk one of the suspects making a claim?? "**** it," they said.

And that is happening more and more and more and more. Dangerous, violent criminals are let go because police are not going to risk their lives and then wind up getting prosecuted. "**** it."

Anybody who doubts that is what is happening has no clue, and has never spoken to a police officer.

My next door neighbor is a cop. My brother in-law is a cop. My uncle and cousins are cops.

That's a cool story you wrote but im trying to figure out what you mean by getting prosecuted ... in the current climate its better that you kill the suspect and remain free of any accountability and let the taxpayers foot the bill.
 
That's a cool story you wrote but im trying to figure out what you mean by getting prosecuted ... in the current climate its better that you kill the suspect and remain free of any accountability and let the taxpayers foot the bill.

Are you trying to be obtuse? If police are allowed to use lethal force only upon a showing of "necessary force," then by definition, a mistaken shooting is a crime. Suspect pulls hand out of pocket and turns towards officer. Officer shoots. Guy has wallet in his hand.

Prosecution since that was most definitely not "necessary force," was it? Hey, guy who volunteered and trained to be a police officer, and wanted to enforce laws and protect those who cannot protect themselves, goes to jail.

Yeah, that won't have a deleterious effect on recruiting good officers, will it? And that could not possibly cause officers to say "**** it" and just let dangerous criminals go, because the officer is not willing to wind up in jail or shot, could it?

By the way, it's not a "story." It ******* happened. I related exactly what was told to me by two police officers I represent. Both were there, and confirmed that is what happened.
 
You guys are the most fearmongering, freakout and leap to extreme conclusion MFs ive ever seen. Lawlessness ? Goddamn....goddddd damn. Its not like they said cops cant shoot folks, period.

Maybe....just maybe, cops should use better responsible judgement and try and de-escalate situations as opposed to just blasting folks with 20 rounds claiming there was a gun, when in fact, there was no gun. And if you **** up and just happen to flood a body with 20 rounds you pay a consequence, like reckless manslaughter charges and convictions. Cops do what they do because they know they can do so with near impunity. Im not okay with cops that have fear of certain cultures or nationalities and their actions are predicated on this fear. If youre afraid of black or brown folks and you feel you need to always use deadly force even in doubt, get out the cop game...simple as that. Ive had relatives, neighbors that have served on the force and never had to use their weapon, even having physical conflicts with suspects or giving foot chase. Cops nowdays can have a beef with you, meet you on a public domain during a basic traffic or jaywalking stop, escalate a situation and kill you and then resort to the trusted and tried, "I felt my life was in danger..." , receive a vote of confidence and support for the municipality, the union, and he will never get charged. Wash, rinse, strap up, repeat.

Whats crazy is the Klan has infiltrated police forces so this should really make police reform a mandatory project NATIONWIDE.

Or here is a novel concept, do what the cop tells you, when he tells you to do it...if you resist, if you reach for anything that a cop may perceive as a weapon, or if you do anything that could be construed as a threat to the law enforcement than you made your bed so go lay in it. If you were mistreated by the police you can sue the crap out of those departments and also the city they have jurisdiction over. You can't do that if you are dead. But I guess it is much easier to take no responsibility for your actions, blame others for everything that happens to you, and then regurgitate the false narrative that cops are out to kill everyone for sport. Here is another novel concept, why doesn't the community as a whole do a better job raising kids and teenagers instead of turning a blind eye and keeping their imaginary street cred and their no snitch policies.
 
if I had a Glock 17 which holds 17 rounds, if i think someone is going to shoot me, i believe I would use all of those rounds.
 
if I had a Glock 17 which holds 17 rounds, if i think someone is going to shoot me, i believe I would use all of those rounds.

"Yeah, but only if that someone was a person of color. Well, non-color, I guess, since black is the absence of color. Or something. RACIST!!"

/s Stupid Lefty
 
..just maybe, cops should use better responsible judgement

I think maybe if the bad actor uses better responsible judgement the police wouldn't need to pull their weapons. Have you ever considered that?
 
YouTube Shooting Fails To Conform To Gun Control Narrative

A mass shooting happened Tuesday at YouTube’s headquarters in California, and it might be impervious to politicization.

Aghdam used a handgun in her attack, a weapon that is not in the crosshairs of gun control proponents. She’s also a woman of Iranian descent, an identity that doesn’t lend itself to left-wing narratives about the threat of angry white men.

Gun control advocates believe an assault weapons ban and a gun registry will prevent future tragedies. Tuesday’s shooting disproves that theory, so don’t be surprised when the story suddenly disappears from the front pages.

http://dailycaller.com/2018/04/04/youtube-shooting-gun-control/

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Radical vegan, animal activist, Persian, woman - yep this story will be hidden quickly






sNEIWjP.jpg
 
Nope, no money to be made there. You'll barely hear any more about it from the MSM.
 
Cue David Hogg to being ranting about crazy Persian women in 3 ... 2 ... 1 ...
 
Would be interesting to see an entire state turn into Baltimore with the additional bonus of no immigration enforcement.
 
YouTube Shooting Fails To Conform To Gun Control Narrative

A mass shooting happened Tuesday at YouTube’s headquarters in California, and it might be impervious to politicization.

Aghdam used a handgun in her attack, a weapon that is not in the crosshairs of gun control proponents. She’s also a woman of Iranian descent, an identity that doesn’t lend itself to left-wing narratives about the threat of angry white men.

Gun control advocates believe an assault weapons ban and a gun registry will prevent future tragedies. Tuesday’s shooting disproves that theory, so don’t be surprised when the story suddenly disappears from the front pages.

http://dailycaller.com/2018/04/04/youtube-shooting-gun-control/

---------------------------


Radical vegan, animal activist, Persian, woman - yep this story will be hidden quickly






sNEIWjP.jpg


Vegan bodybuilder PETA nut Iranian female. No nothing to see here,but it's the NRA's fault. And they had fair warning her cheese was sliding off the cracker. Well if she had any cheese on it to start. That's one creepy chick.
 
Would be interesting to see an entire state turn into Baltimore with the additional bonus of no immigration enforcement.

Libtard friends of ours, now former friends of mine, moved to San Fran a few years ago. He works in IT and got a job in Silicon Valley. I got unFriended on FB after I said Bomma was a Communist and he demanded I take it back and apologize. :lol:

Vegan bodybuilder PETA nut Iranian female. No nothing to see here,but it's the NRA's fault. And they had fair warning her cheese was sliding off the cracker. Well if she had any cheese on it to start. That's one creepy chick.

She is pretty hot though.
 
back wheel broke off David Hogg's BigWheel somewhere around Albuquerque or he'd be giving us a first-hand account of how he survived this.
 
back wheel broke off David Hogg's BigWheel somewhere around Albuquerque or he'd be giving us a first-hand account of how he survived this.

Naw. Don't want him around these parts
 
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