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Time Reports That Scientists Were Wrong

Ron Burgundy

Ron Burgundy

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Apparently the low-fat heart-healthy diet crap they've been feeding us for 60 years has made things worse with more obesity and diabetes.

http://time.com/tag/diet/

You have to subscribe or buy the latest issue to get the full article apparently. Butter is good for you.
You don't suppose that in say, 50 years after the world economy is wrecked and we're living like the Amish, someone will come along and say "You know that global warming thing? Nevermind."

 
I know from personal experience that half that dietary advice is bullshit. When I was first diagnosed with hypertension in 2001, they told me to cut my salt intake to less than 2000mg per day. My wife and I went overboard, and not only did we eliminate added salt and cut all the packaged foods that are high in sodium, we switched everything we could to food that were naturally low in sodium. So I went from putting salt on just about everything to having almost no salt at all in my diet. After a year it had made absolutely no change in my blood pressure, and eventually we have stopped worrying about salt. Same thing with fat - tested with borderline high cholesterol, and doctors and nutritionists told us "get rid of butter." Years later I see lots of studies saying margarine is worse than butter after all. Over time I've gone back and forth with low-fat diets and my normal fat intake and never see a swing in the cholesterol levels... because some people are genetically pre-disposed to produce high amounts of cholesterol in their liver (like me), and what they eat doesn't really affect their cholesterol levels as long as you don't choke down a tub of lard and a few sticks of butter every day.

And don't get me started on gluten-free crap. I knew when that whole thing started it was some kind of fad. Now the doctor who published the original study that started the gluten-free craze has updated his findings, and has reversed his position by saying that gluten-free diets have no special benefits for people who don't suffer from celiac disease. Which just confirms the suspicion I had all along that someone diagnosed with celiac disease got some advice to cut out wheat and wheat products, which means that they stopped eating bread and a lot of other highly processed foods. They probably lost a bunch of weight, and got a lot healthier as a result, and all of their friends would ask, "what did you do?" To which, that person would reply, "I'm on this amazing gluten-free diet!" And then all these people who didn't have celiac disease started demanding gluten-free everything. They may have actually felt better, but, again, it was because they had stopped eating crap and paid more attention to their diet, not because gluten-free is some magical cure-all.

I strongly believe that the effects of certain foods and substances within foods, and even medications to an extent, vary drastically from person to person. Moderation in all things is the key.
 
Well, some people might look at this result and say "See, science has corrected itself", which is, I suppose, true.

However, look how long it took? The article references Senate hearings for dietary goals and a government agency, the USDA (I think), actually putting out dietary information based upon this.

Now, it turns out to be based upon incomplete information and, while eventually, corrected took how many years? How much money has been wasted based upon this information? Any correlation to other stuff? I wonder....

I wonder what the State Science Institute has to say about this.
 
ark steel said:
However, look how long it took?
Click to expand...

Say what you want about anything else, you can't criticize the length of time. These are experiments that are done in real time with human subjects, and the effects take years to manifest. On top of that, you may need to do multiple successive rounds of studies to isolate certain factors and solidify the results. Bottom line is it took as long as it did because that's how long it takes to perform the experiments and see results. You can't just say, "here, eat this piece of buttered bread" and then measure the person's cholesterol the next day and say that's a meaningful outcome.
 
JupiterBnG said:
Say what you want about anything else, you can't criticize the length of time. These are experiments that are done in real time with human subjects, and the effects take years to manifest. On top of that, you may need to do multiple successive rounds of studies to isolate certain factors and solidify the results. Bottom line is it took as long as it did because that's how long it takes to perform the experiments and see results. You can't just say, "here, eat this piece of buttered bread" and then measure the person's cholesterol the next day and say that's a meaningful outcome.
Click to expand...

That is, really, my point. The human body is incredibly complex. I'm not complaining about the time involved, I'm complaining about the government jumping on board and promoting something which does, indeed, take years to find out if you were correct.
 
ark steel said:
That is, really, my point. The human body is incredibly complex. I'm not complaining about the time involved, I'm complaining about the government jumping on board and promoting something which does, indeed, take years to find out if you were correct.
Click to expand...

Got it. I thought you were making a comment about science and the fact that it took so long to reach the conclusions. I see now what you were saying, that the government was quick to legislate/regulate based on incomplete science, and that's led to a reversal now on all the things we've been told for years.
 
ark steel said:
That is, really, my point. The human body is incredibly complex. I'm not complaining about the time involved, I'm complaining about the government jumping on board and promoting something which does, indeed, take years to find out if you were correct.
Click to expand...


If it creates one government job, we've got a duty to act...
 
So if 99% of Doctors were wrong, could 99% of scientists be wrong? And the crazy part is I don't even see the financial gain part of it for the Drs.....however for the scientists and submitting to "facts" around almost any topic, the political and monetary gains are as clear as day.
 
Eat real food.
Limit simple carbohydrates, especially sugar.
Don't stuff yourself.

I pretty much follow these rules and I've been at a healthy weight my entire life. Not that I couldn't afford to lose 10 or 20 lbs, but I'm not willing to give up beer to do that.
 
I think sitting in front of TV's, Computers, etc... and being less active has had more to do with obesity and diabetes, than diet.

When I was a kid, it was out of the house in the am and on a bike most of the day, back in time for dinner. Today it seems
like kids don't leave the house much.
 
21STEELERS21 said:
I think sitting in front of TV's, Computers, etc... and being less active has had more to do with obesity and diabetes, than diet.

When I was a kid, it was out of the house in the am and on a bike most of the day, back in time for dinner. Today it seems
like kids don't leave the house much.
Click to expand...

I think it's a lot of things...drinking soda, eating out a lot, buying huge quantities of food at places like Sam's Club and Cosco (it always amazes me to see how many giant cakes, pies and other baked goods they sell. Either everybody who shops there is having a massive party every weekend, or they're buying cakes intended for 20 people and eating them).
 
21STEELERS21 said:
I think sitting in front of TV's, Computers, etc... and being less active has had more to do with obesity and diabetes, than diet.

When I was a kid, it was out of the house in the am and on a bike most of the day, back in time for dinner. Today it seems
like kids don't leave the house much.
Click to expand...

Same here. Even in college, I didn't look to get extra exercise, but we walked or rode bicycles everywhere. Our everyday life involved exercise. Now, I walk to the car and park as close as I can when I get to the office, etc..
 
Trusting esteemed scientists/nutritionists is about as useful as trusting esteemed politicians or esteemed educators.

It just ain't what it used to be because there are so many agendas and special interests.

What about the last food guide proffered by the First Lady and her friends from Harvard?
 
oneforthebus said:
Eat real food.
Limit simple carbohydrates, especially sugar.
Don't stuff yourself.

I pretty much follow these rules and I've been at a healthy weight my entire life. Not that I couldn't afford to lose 10 or 20 lbs, but I'm not willing to give up beer to do that.
Click to expand...
High fructose corn syrup is in practically everything and IMO is a lot worse for you than sugar. I avoid it as much as I can. I pretty much eat all sorts of garbage though and my weight is fine, but then I don't over-eat either. When I was in Italy I saw almost no overweight people and they eat a mess of carbs but then meat is very very expensive there. They're also big on fruits and veggies, all fresh, organic is simply how it is done, and they walk a lot.
 
A lot of obesity has to do with, IMO, the sedentary state of people now.
like 21 said, kids used to spend all day outdoors. Now, not so much. xbox, ps3/4, laptop, pc gaming, smartphones... as well as medicating the kids ... things have changed right before our eyes.

I noticed I gained weight and got my *** into the gym. I started watching what I eat (like onefor's post) and hitting the gym hard. Since mid-March, I've now lost nearly 20 pounds (down from 218 then to 199 this past Saturday). My metabolism is back up and I now when I eat something not too good for me, it's not a big deal.

I don't fault anyone for gaining weight. We're all working long hours, have a lot of stress at work and just want to collapse into some comfort when we get home. Combine that with kids going bonkers because their medication has worn off, they have a lot of new-found energy and no direction in which to use it and the stress level rises when you get home - sometimes. And stress will have adverse effects on the body.
 
Calories in/calories out. Figure what your calorie should be to maintain your weight and eat what ever the **** you want to.
 
Superman said:
A lot of obesity has to do with, IMO, the sedentary state of people now.
like 21 said, kids used to spend all day outdoors. Now, not so much. xbox, ps3/4, laptop, pc gaming, smartphones... as well as medicating the kids ... things have changed right before our eyes.

I noticed I gained weight and got my *** into the gym. I started watching what I eat (like onefor's post) and hitting the gym hard. Since mid-March, I've now lost nearly 20 pounds (down from 218 then to 199 this past Saturday). My metabolism is back up and I now when I eat something not too good for me, it's not a big deal.

I don't fault anyone for gaining weight. We're all working long hours, have a lot of stress at work and just want to collapse into some comfort when we get home. Combine that with kids going bonkers because their medication has worn off, they have a lot of new-found energy and no direction in which to use it and the stress level rises when you get home - sometimes. And stress will have adverse effects on the body.
Click to expand...

Providing glory hole services in the gym's locker room does not count as "hitting the gym hard"...
 
21STEELERS21 said:
I think sitting in front of TV's, Computers, etc... and being less active has had more to do with obesity and diabetes, than diet.

When I was a kid, it was out of the house in the am and on a bike most of the day, back in time for dinner. Today it seems
like kids don't leave the house much.
Click to expand...

Yeah, as a kid, I tended to ride my bike all over the place, often miles away, when I was as young as only 7 or 8 years old. Then again, back then in the late 70s/early 80s, parents didn't seem to need to be quite as worried about that kind of thing as they are today. I was also a latchkey kid, and it wasn't unusual for me to walk home from school, let myself into the house, and be alone until my parents got home from work. It seems unheard of today that a kid of any age is allowed to leave sight of their house without some constant parental supervision, or be left alone at home. It's not just that kids today have computers and video games, I think it's that the current generation of helicopter parents is too paranoid to let them get out of sight.
 
ark steel said:
Providing glory hole services in the gym's locker room does not count as "hitting the gym hard"...
Click to expand...

I told you that, but you insisted
 
Ron Burgundy said:
High fructose corn syrup is in practically everything and IMO is a lot worse for you than sugar. I avoid it as much as I can. I pretty much eat all sorts of garbage though and my weight is fine, but then I don't over-eat either. When I was in Italy I saw almost no overweight people and they eat a mess of carbs but then meat is very very expensive there. They're also big on fruits and veggies, all fresh, organic is simply how it is done, and they walk a lot.
Click to expand...

I count HFCS as sugar. I avoid it all. It's funny but I have gone years eating and drinking very few sweets and I don't even miss them anymore. Can't even stand sugar in my coffee.
 
I wasn't bragging, merely stating a fact.
 
JupiterBnG said:
It's not just that kids today have computers and video games, I think it's that the current generation of helicopter parents is too paranoid to let them get out of sight.
Click to expand...

It is not just that the parents are "helicopter parents" it is also that our parents didn't have to worry about us getting shot in a drive-by, kidnapped, raped, etc. It may not be that it happens more (per capita or whatever), I didn't look. But, now, you can see on any TV what is happening all over the country 24/7/365 whereas, years ago, it was an article in the paper and a spot on the 1 hour news show.
 
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