Dan Moore

[Confluence]

He has been underrated because he was young and raw plus he played in a terrible offense that set the line up for failure. This year the offense is struggling due to injuries and the learning curve of the QB, but it is now at least a real NFL worthy concept that doesn't set the line for failure. He improved every year.

Because it just makes sense that the team drafted two R1 LTs because Dan Moore has one leg shorter......and instead of the swing backup, he starts and the improved play beside him, from Frazier out makes him look better.

Green, Dotson and Moore have all been disappointing starters for the Steelers because the team asked them to play positions they were not suited for or not ready for.....so now there are qualified LTs with "pedigree" and Moore was LT all thru TC?

This is a continuation of the misuse of talent on the OL. After getting fortunate with Villaneuva, who got seasoned on another team, the Steelers now continue to stuff round pegs in square holes, and because Moore isn't dead last in ratings again this year, the lowered expectations of Steeler fans lead to defending him as LT.

Very clearly, the standard is substandard.

 

[Confluence]

Focus and effort was never an issue with Moore, though.

It seems to be the case with Jones, as coaches have reportedly been unhappy with his work in practice and it's reflected in him appearing lackadaisical and lazy in games.

While Moore has steadily improved after starting off poorly, Jones started off pretty well last year and has regressed big time.

It's not a good sign, and between Jones and Pickens, maybe the Steelers should layoff drafting the UGA players high for awhile.

Alternatively, it's likely that Jones was drafted to play LT, has had to fill in at RT cuz the guy he was supposed to replace has one shorter leg, got his arm/shoulder injured, played thru that and now folks are trashing him and Moore is having a better year.....so the kid is likely grumpy....he's not a 5th round shot like Dotson was, the team traded up to grab him as the anchor LT and where has he played?

Everyone around him has to be saying WTF?

 

[Punxsutawney]

Everyone around him has to be saying WTF?

If they are, it probably has as much to do with his ****** effort and play as it does him being played out of position, a position in which he played well last season.

I'm sorry, but if George Pickens legitimately deserves criticism for dogging reps because he's unhappy about how he's being used, so does Jones.

 

[Confluence]

If they are, it probably has as much to do with his ****** effort and play as it does him being played out of position, a position in which he played well last season.

I'm sorry, but if George Pickens legitimately deserves criticism for dogging reps because he's unhappy about how he's being used, so does Jones.

I wish that Steeler players had the mentality of Aaron Smith, Brett Kiesel, Hines Ward and Troy Polamalu, but that hasn't happened.

The recent drafting of headcase/diva WRs and misuse of OL has costs. I greatly dislike Pickens immaturity, but he is the most talented player, and only difference maker on O, and he rode pine much of a game the Steelers lost by 3 points.

Poor strategic resource allocation because the standard is substandard.

 

[Punxsutawney]

I wish that Steeler players had the mentality of Aaron Smith, Brett Kiesel, Hines Ward and Troy Polamalu, but that hasn't happened.

The recent drafting of headcase/diva WRs and misuse of OL has costs. I greatly dislike Pickens immaturity, but he is the most talented player, and only difference maker on O, and he rode pine much of a game the Steelers lost by 3 points.

Poor strategic resource allocation because the standard is substandard.

It's ultimately up to the team to assess the mentalities of the players they draft.

Maybe Kevin Dotson was disgruntled by playing on the left side with the Steelers, leading to the friction between him and Tomlin, but if he was, it did not reflect on the effort he showed on the field, at least on game days.

He didn't perform at the allpro level he has on the right side with the Rams, but I thought he was generally pretty good when he did play and Tomlin didn't have him on the bench. He at least tried his best.

Jones, on the other hand, looks like he doesn't give a **** half the time.

 

[diver]

Because it just makes sense that the team drafted two R1 LTs because Dan Moore has one leg shorter......and instead of the swing backup, he starts and the improved play beside him, from Frazier out makes him look better.

Green, Dotson and Moore have all been disappointing starters for the Steelers because the team asked them to play positions they were not suited for or not ready for.....so now there are qualified LTs with "pedigree" and Moore was LT all thru TC?

This is a continuation of the misuse of talent on the OL. After getting fortunate with Villaneuva, who got seasoned on another team, the Steelers now continue to stuff round pegs in square holes, and because Moore isn't dead last in ratings again this year, the lowered expectations of Steeler fans lead to defending him as LT.

Very clearly, the standard is substandard.

I agree with the misuse of talent with the OL. What they have done does not make a lot of sense. They can hide behind injuries now, but as you said, they started camp with Jones at RT.

Where I disagree is lowered expectations. C'mon, that's horseshiit. You root for the kid because he has worked hard, he has never complained and toughed it out during some bad circumstances. He has improved. I rooted for those types of players in a time when expectations theoretically where higher. I don't think any of us have called him a great player. But dammit, he is the kind of guy the Steelers need a little more of, instead of these 14 year old mentality divas. Maybe Jones also shares a little responsibility for him not being given the LT job.

 

[madinsomniac]

Not really, PFF numbers are hot garbage. When those numbers support Miles Garrett over TJ Watt, you know, the man who ties the NFL sack record, you can't possibly use those numbers to support a damn thing.

Oh I agree with PFF being hot garbage... particularly along the lines...

The issue is it's rankings are based off of what their analysts think the blocking scheme ought to be.... and there are enough variations that you cant really know that on every play without the actual playbook.. and even if you had the playbook, you dont know if in game adjustments were made to various schemes... so on some play that was supposed to be a quick pass out to the right flat, the LT might have been told to cover the inside gap at all costs. A DE beats him wide, but that is irrelevant to the play... it affects nothing... but the DE gets a win in pff stats and the LT gets a loss...

PFF would religiously rank Pouncey poorly because his block was supposed to be two gaps over and they would grade him on a block a guard or RB was schemed to get...

I think the Steelers use of Moore got him underrated the past couple years.. i think this new offense is closer to what PFF expects from how they use him so they read it better

I also think Fans, in general, only focus on linemen when they make huge mistakes... so Moore playing ok for several series, then having a noticeably bad play gets him labeled bad... but I dont think the guy has all pro talent or anything... he is ok...

 

[Lloyd]

I don't pay any attention really to PFF numbers. I use my eyes. And, again, I am not saying he was great. But I didn't think he was as bad as he was portrayed. He sure as hell wasn't helped by the OC they had.

The only reason I brought it up is their numbers were used by you as a way to disparage him. You threw out those numbers every chance you got to rip him. Why didn't you start a post pointing out that it appears those numbers have improved significantly? Doesn't fit the narrative I guess.

He was last in sacks the #s that I saw. I don't care how you slice that, it isn't good. If you want to brag over how great those #s are, be my guest.

 

[Badcat]

Oh I agree with PFF being hot garbage... particularly along the lines...

The issue is it's rankings are based off of what their analysts think the blocking scheme ought to be.... and there are enough variations that you cant really know that on every play without the actual playbook.. and even if you had the playbook, you dont know if in game adjustments were made to various schemes... so on some play that was supposed to be a quick pass out to the right flat, the LT might have been told to cover the inside gap at all costs. A DE beats him wide, but that is irrelevant to the play... it affects nothing... but the DE gets a win in pff stats and the LT gets a loss...

PFF would religiously rank Pouncey poorly because his block was supposed to be two gaps over and they would grade him on a block a guard or RB was schemed to get...

I think the Steelers use of Moore got him underrated the past couple years.. i think this new offense is closer to what PFF expects from how they use him so they read it better

I also think Fans, in general, only focus on linemen when they make huge mistakes... so Moore playing ok for several series, then having a noticeably bad play gets him labeled bad... but I dont think the guy has all pro talent or anything... he is ok...

great insight, thank you.

 

[diver]

He was last in sacks the #s that I saw. I don't care how you slice that, it isn't good. If you want to brag over how great those #s are, be my guest.

I bragged? Saying I think he wasn't as bad as portrayed is bragging? Saying I think he will be solid, not great, is bragging? You have called him trash. I'm just pointing out I don't think he is, and the #s you are always spouting off about may be starting to bare that out.

 

[steel dino]

The Steelers won 10 games with Sean Mahan as the starting center. Teams can win with bad players in the starting lineup. Moore was without a doubt a low-end LT. I'm glad he's played at an above average this year. Outside of Jones and Anderson, I think the OL has played pretty well individually, not always as a unit because of breakdowns.

I hear ya..
But Mahan had a guy that he snapped to the ball to……that in 12 games started went 9-3 that season

 

[Lloyd]

Oh I agree with PFF being hot garbage... particularly along the lines...

The issue is it's rankings are based off of what their analysts think the blocking scheme ought to be.... and there are enough variations that you cant really know that on every play without the actual playbook.. and even if you had the playbook, you dont know if in game adjustments were made to various schemes... so on some play that was supposed to be a quick pass out to the right flat, the LT might have been told to cover the inside gap at all costs. A DE beats him wide, but that is irrelevant to the play... it affects nothing... but the DE gets a win in pff stats and the LT gets a loss...

PFF would religiously rank Pouncey poorly because his block was supposed to be two gaps over and they would grade him on a block a guard or RB was schemed to get...

I think the Steelers use of Moore got him underrated the past couple years.. i think this new offense is closer to what PFF expects from how they use him so they read it better

I also think Fans, in general, only focus on linemen when they make huge mistakes... so Moore playing ok for several series, then having a noticeably bad play gets him labeled bad... but I dont think the guy has all pro talent or anything... he is ok...

I'm not gonna look it up again, but Moore led the league in sacks a few times. His #s stink.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

so do most of your postings.

 

[madinsomniac]

I'm not gonna look it up again, but Moore led the league in sacks a few times. His #s stink.

So devils advocate here... who determines sacks allowed? That isnt anywhere on the NFL stats nor profootball reference... the only places i see with it are PFF and Sharp... which are both subjective nonsense sites...

 

[bermudasteel]

I don't know what the hell the PFF numbers mean half the time. I pay very little attention to it. But before the season their numbers were used by some here to disparage Dan Moore.

Turns out that they are now saying Dan Moore may be the most improved player in the NFL.

Interesting.

Are those numbers gospel now?

Fire Coach Tomlin!!!

 

[Lloyd]

So devils advocate here... who determines sacks allowed? That isnt anywhere on the NFL stats nor profootball reference... the only places i see with it are PFF and Sharp... which are both subjective nonsense sites...

So you think the make up these #s?

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/qb-sacked-per-game

 

[NormalJake]

I'm not gonna look it up again, but Moore led the league in sacks a few times. His #s stink.

TJ has led the league in sacks 3 times, does he stink too

 

[madinsomniac]

So you think the make up these #s?

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/qb-sacked-per-game

No those are straight sacks... that is an objective stat..

You said that " Moore led the league in sacks a few times" I am looking for any official stat on "sacks allowed" because unless something changed, thats not an official stat.. its subjective... like drops... five sites will have five different numbers for it, because it is something they guess at watching film...

 

[Lloyd]

No those are straight sacks... that is an objective stat..

You said that " Moore led the league in sacks a few times" I am looking for any official stat on "sacks allowed" because unless something changed, thats not an official stat.. its subjective... like drops... five sites will have five different numbers for it, because it is something they guess at watching film...

Look I know what I saw, you can dispute it all you want, no biggie to me. You can convince yourself Dan has played like an all pro the last 3 1/2 years, it really doesn't matter to me. Convince yourself of whatever you please.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MoorDa05.htm

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

Why not , you do it all the time And then hit replay button until its all you say, .

 

[diver]

Look I know what I saw, you can dispute it all you want, no biggie to me. You can convince yourself Dan has played like an all pro the last 3 1/2 years, it really doesn't matter to me. Convince yourself of whatever you please.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MoorDa05.htm

No one said he played like an all pro. You, however, have stated he is "trash." You have said he "stinks." You have called him the "worst tackle in the league."

 

[madinsomniac]

Look I know what I saw, you can dispute it all you want, no biggie to me. You can convince yourself Dan has played like an all pro the last 3 1/2 years, it really doesn't matter to me. Convince yourself of whatever you please.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MoorDa05.htm

Im not disputing your personal opinion, nor am i disputing his actual stats...as found on pro football reference...
I am certainly not saying he was at even an above average level... i said PFF and the fanbase underrated him the last couple years and are probably overrating him now...

Every player that isnt an all pro right out of the gate isnt trash. And guys... especially tackles, often take 3 or 4 years to develop into decent starters...

It feels like some arguments here are based on a fallacy that if a player has a bad play, his overall play is bad and if a player wasnt good early in his career, he can never be good later... neither of those are remotely true

 

[Lloyd]

Im not disputing your personal opinion, nor am i disputing his actual stats...as found on pro football reference...
I am certainly not saying he was at even an above average level... i said PFF and the fanbase underrated him the last couple years and are probably overrating him now...

Every player that isnt an all pro right out of the gate isnt trash. And guys... especially tackles, often take 3 or 4 years to develop into decent starters...

It feels like some arguments here are based on a fallacy that if a player has a bad play, his overall play is bad and if a player wasnt good early in his career, he can never be good later... neither of those are remotely true

4 years in he still sucks. Imagine whatever you wish. Go for it!

 

[slashsteel]

4 years in he still sucks. Imagine whatever you wish. Go for it!

Yes because your opinion differs his has to be wrong.

He has played better this year so no he isn’t “sucking”.

 

[BLITZ]

4 years in he still sucks. Imagine whatever you wish. Go for it!

Not trying to be a dick, but do you watch the games?