DJIA in freefall

[Steeltime]

Dow Jones Industrial Average - a composite of 30 leading industrial stocks (including energy and financials) is down almost 700 points (more than 2%) right now. The financial sector (JP Morgan, Goldman Sachs, Amex) is getting pummeled. This fact is a massive problem for a multitude of reasons:

• A lot of Americans rely on investment income to support themselves. Losing 5% of your worth in a single week is devastating. Losing 10% in two months is debilitating.
• That loss of income adversely affects every aspect of the economy - housing, travel, manufacturing, you name it.
• The greedy ******** (i.e., government) see less tax revenue as a result and the Fed thinks it hunky-dory to print another trillion unbacked dollars.
• Fed has no concerns about incurring even more debt.
• The idiotic decision to print and spend unbacked trillions triggers more inflation.
• So now we have a shrinking economy, declining manufacturing, increasing M2, a recession and inflation. Yipee!
• The loss of assets by lenders means a smaller investment pool for new companies, the lifeblood of a growing economy,
• The resulting impact on the economy will trigger a hard recession.
• Ronald Reagan and Milton Friedman are dead. Currently, no elected officials have the intellect or guts to do what is needed to improve the situation.

And that blithering imbecile, the dementia patient who **** his pants while visiting the Pope, is arguably the least competent semi-sentient being ever to be responsible for fixing the disaster he created.

 

[Superman]

ah, no worries. if Joe were to kick off, we'd have the second least competent semi-sentient being ever to take responsibility for fixing this disaster the Dems created.

 

[ZonaBurgh]

With the Dow only down 400 at this moment, President Joe, the greatest of all time, is taking credit for the come back.

 

[Sarge]

Recovered back to -331, for now.

 

[BLITZ]

I got 1/2 out the month after the 2020 election. cant wait for the timing to be right to get 100% out

 

[steel dino]

Im not a financial guru...but Im buying CD's right now..

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

****. I never pull out.

 

[Steeltime]

****. I never pull out.

That you, Shawn Kemp?

 

[Djfan]

Im not a financial guru...but Im buying CD's right now..

We just moved to money markets.

The cool thing is that the fed dropped rates. Hoping that continues, and house prices fall like RV prices. We'll be set if they do.

 

[Confluence]

We just moved to money markets.

The cool thing is that the fed dropped rates. Hoping that continues, and house prices fall like RV prices. We'll be set if they do.

The Fed raised rates

 

[Djfan]

The Fed raised rates

I have the link at work. I'll look at it later.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Dow Jones Industrial Average - a composite of 30 leading industrial stocks (including energy and financials) is down almost 700 points (more than 2%) right now. The financial sector (JP Morgan, Goldman Sachs, Amex) is getting pummeled. This fact is a massive problem for a multitude of reasons:

• A lot of Americans rely on investment income to support themselves. Losing 5% of your worth in a single week is devastating. Losing 10% in two months is debilitating.
• That loss of income adversely affects every aspect of the economy - housing, travel, manufacturing, you name it.
• The greedy ******** (i.e., government) see less tax revenue as a result and the Fed thinks it hunky-dory to print another trillion unbacked dollars.
• Fed has no concerns about incurring even more debt.
• The idiotic decision to print and spend unbacked trillions triggers more inflation.
• So now we have a shrinking economy, declining manufacturing, increasing M2, a recession and inflation. Yipee!
• The loss of assets by lenders means a smaller investment pool for new companies, the lifeblood of a growing economy,
• The resulting impact on the economy will trigger a hard recession.
• Ronald Reagan and Milton Friedman are dead. Currently, no elected officials have the intellect or guts to do what is needed to improve the situation.

And that blithering imbecile, the dementia patient who **** his pants while visiting the Pope, is arguably the least competent semi-sentient being ever to be responsible for fixing the disaster he created.

But Orange Man Bad.

 

[Djfan]

The Fed raised rates

Here's the link I read -

Today's 30-year mortgage rates tumble to 6% | March 14, 2023

 

[Confluence]

Here's the link I read -

Today's 30-year mortgage rates tumble to 6% | March 14, 2023

The Fed sets short term rates; the bond market trades up/down based on supply/demand.

Higher short term rates makes it more likely that all keep more funds in cash, rather than spending, which is why the Fed raises short rates to slow inflation.

Mortgage rates are set by market forces, certainly affected by Fed short rates and jawboning, but moves according to supply/demand. Usually, when the stock market tumbles for a few days, the money shifts from stocks towards bonds, causing bond prices to go higher, which drops effective rates. Thus the 30year bond rate drops, allowing mortgage rates aligned with it, to drop. Usually.


Ironically, after more than a decade of almost zero short rates, the Feds consistent move towards higher short rates has moved all longer rates higher, crushing bond prices. This sharp decline in bond prices, reasonably predictable, was what caused the regulatory shortfall at the Silicon Valley Bank and forced the firesale which started the run that killed the bank.....which is reason the stock markets are shaky and your 30 mortgage rates are down.

 

[JMM]

The Fed sets short term rates; the bond market trades up/down based on supply/demand.

Higher short term rates makes it more likely that all keep more funds in cash, rather than spending, which is why the Fed raises short rates to slow inflation.

Mortgage rates are set by market forces, certainly affected by Fed short rates and jawboning, but moves according to supply/demand. Usually, when the stock market tumbles for a few days, the money shifts from stocks towards bonds, causing bond prices to go higher, which drops effective rates. Thus the 30year bond rate drops, allowing mortgage rates aligned with it, to drop. Usually.


Ironically, after more than a decade of almost zero short rates, the Feds consistent move towards higher short rates has moved all longer rates higher, crushing bond prices. This sharp decline in bond prices, reasonably predictable, was what caused the regulatory shortfall at the Silicon Valley Bank and forced the firesale which started the run that killed the bank.....which is reason the stock markets are shaky and your 30 mortgage rates are down.

Wouldn't be surprised if real estate barons and mega DNC donors like Warren Buffett has his thumb on mortgage rates as well with his party in total control. No way in hell they'll alienate him and other powers that be by letting the mortgage rates from launching.

 

[Djfan]

e by letting the mortgage rates from launching.

What do you mean by this?

 

[JMM]

What do you mean by this?

I have to wonder if the rates are still governed by natural economic reactions to real economic data or are they influenced by external factors such as individuals who are "too big to fail".

In this case, should mortgage rates be higher and then balance things out faster and create real recovery sooner or are they artificially lower due to influence by mega donors and real recovery is prolonged..

So if mortgage rates were allowed to skyrocket as they probably should have, yes it would obviously hurt those attempting to buy a house but I'm not sure the current administration is overly concerned about that. They are more concerned with hurting individuals who are mega donors and in turn financing those in charge.

 

[str8liner]

Im not a financial guru...but Im buying CD's right now..

Yea but you get taxed on the earnings......I want my money for nothing and my chicks for free.

 

[Djfan]

I have to wonder if the rates are still governed by natural economic reactions to real economic data or are they influenced by external factors such as individuals who are "too big to fail".

In this case, should mortgage rates be higher and then balance things out faster and create real recovery sooner or are they artificially lower due to influence by mega donors and real recovery is prolonged..

So if mortgage rates were allowed to skyrocket as they probably should have, yes it would obviously hurt those attempting to buy a house but I'm not sure the current administration is overly concerned about that. They are more concerned with hurting individuals who are mega donors and in turn financing those in charge.

Roger that. I think you are leaning the right way on this. It is not hard to see it most clearly by understanding that the motives of a healthy economy, or the benefit of the masses, are not the priorities or focus.

 

[JMM]

Roger that. I think you are leaning the right way on this. It is not hard to see it most clearly by understanding that the motives of a healthy economy, or the benefit of the masses, are not the priorities or focus.

Usually they're just byproducts. The people in charge could give less than a crap about regular citizens. Big time donors, that's another story.

 

[Confluence]

Wouldn't be surprised if real estate barons and mega DNC donors like Warren Buffett has his thumb on mortgage rates as well with his party in total control. No way in hell they'll alienate him and other powers that be by letting the mortgage rates from launching.

In 2005/6/7/8/9 "they" rigged LIBOR, and finally two minions went to jail a couple years ago....now LIBOR doesn't exist, and its like the fraud didn't happen......

 

[Ron Burgundy]

We just moved to money markets.

The cool thing is that the fed dropped rates. Hoping that continues, and house prices fall like RV prices. We'll be set if they do.

I have exactly zero savings left and am not in the market, thanks Bomma.
I called our family stockbroker today to discuss my mother's savings, mostly an IRA left from my dad. I have power of attorney.
We decided to keep the amount of her minimum distribution this year and put the rest into a one-year CD paying 5%.
Mom has a smaller account in her name with only two stocks in it, one that didn't lose much (Apple) and another for a small medical device company founded by a friend of my dad that actually went up slightly the last year. Selling them to move into something else would cost some capital gains tax and it seems unlikely that she would lose more than what the capital gains tax would cost so we're just going to leave them.

 

[Djfan]

5% is nice. Well done.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

I have exactly zero savings left and am not in the market, thanks Bomma.
I called our family stockbroker today to discuss my mother's savings, mostly an IRA left from my dad. I have power of attorney.
We decided to keep the amount of her minimum distribution this year and put the rest into a one-year CD paying 5%.
Mom has a smaller account in her name with only two stocks in it, one that didn't lose much (Apple) and another for a small medical device company founded by a friend of my dad that actually went up slightly the last year. Selling them to move into something else would cost some capital gains tax and it seems unlikely that she would lose more than what the capital gains tax would cost so we're just going to leave them.

I’ve lost more in the last “couple” years… it just makes me vomit. We are check to check for the most part, that’s are (her) fault as we spend more than we should but whatever…..that didn’t drain my accounts.

I just look at my accounts and I’m sick. Sick to hear is gone. My money.