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I figured out what I was feeling about all this

diver said:
What a crock of shiit. Complete and total speculation. We KNOW Tomlin won it. End of discussion.

They threw the ball 40 times against the Packers. Overall, they were running for over 5 yards a carry. Maybe he should have run the ball more.

NFL films recently released a little segment on the myth of halftime adjustments with Peyton Manning. I always maintained that adjustments argument is way overused. Well, it ain't just me saying that. I don't know anything, but I would think Peyton Manning does.

Look, I wouldn't extend him either. But some of the arguments just aggravate me.
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I will add this regarding half time adjustments, if you have to adjust drastically at halftime it means your gameplan sucked and/or your advanced scouting sucked. If halftime adjustments are needed on a large scale there are larger issues...minor tweeks with a player or two sure, because you noticed a tendency. Whole scale adjustments at halftime without practice just aren't that big of an actual occurrence for the most part.

Now judging by how many times the Steelers entered a game and didn't even show up for the first half (laid an egg) it would lend me to believe that the gameplan sucked (looking at you here Tomlin and Canada) more likely than the advanced scouting. If Tomlin were so bad at adjusting how does a mid-low tier QB like KFP have all those 4th quarter comebacks? Is Tomlin just some X and O genius that figures it out at the end??? Highly unlikely, because as you state referencing Manning, halftime adjustments and in game adjustments in general are just over blown.

If we are going to discredit Tomlin for not making halftime adjustments we have to credit him for the 4th quarter comebacks, I'm not ready to anoint him some late game genius. More often than not 90% or more boils down to players executing/making plays or not making plays once the game begins.

Can coaches scheme players out of a gameplan or not put them in a position to succeed, most definitely, but this is indeed usually done before the game ever starts and I am in no way endorsing Tomlin, his turtle ball or the position he puts some players in to succeed/fail.
 
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xjx said:
I think we can give some credit to Tomlin on player development. When Dupree was ineffective from the left side he had him switch sides with TJ. Highsmith arrived with athletic gifts, but he didn't have a spin move till he learned it here. It took him about a year. Those are two I can think of.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought I read Highsmith crediting TJ with much of his "moves development" post college, in particular the spin. He did flip Dupree tho, but even a blind monkey flinging **** gonna hit a target once in a while.
 
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The adjustment I have wanted to see is going after rookies, exploiting injury substitutions, going after known weaknesses of opponents, etc. It's not rocket science, except to Shades.
 
Greg Lloyd said:
2022

- Pickett - Horrid, horrid play, immature attitude, already off the team. Huge miss.
- Pickens - Uber talented, trying to overcome immaturity.
- Leal - No one knows what they were thinking. A total tweener without a position.
- Austin - small person, zero production so far. Not even mentioned even with the team being so weak at WR.
- Connor Heyward - More Shades "brother drafting." A major fail.
- Robinson - an ILB who has failed so far.
- Oladoken - QB who's off the team.

2021

- Harris - 1st round RB who turned out not worth it. Just OK.
- Muth - TE we missed on a lot of beter players for.
- Green - failed picks who was a shot in the dark at C, turned out horrible at OG as well.
- Moore - a bad LT who still stinks to this day.
- Buddy Johnson - a LB who....??
- Loudermilk - failed DLman
- Roche - DL, fail
- Norwood - DB fail
- Harvin - punter who stunk
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Needed social distancing from many of those people.
 
Steelr4evr said:
I was just putting it into correlation between men risking everything to spoiled coddled millionaires with fragile overinflated egos over playing a meaningless game.
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My thoughts as well. I watch grown men chase a ball for entertainment. These guys don't care if I live or die, don't go on message boards to wonder if I can improve my career, and at this stage of my life if watching them chase a ball is no longer enjoyable, I stop watching.
 
steelhurt said:
Remember this boys, Tomlin has had a huge amount of authority with player personnel on this football team for a long time. It was not all Kevin.
It’s been said many times that other than Art,Tomlin has had final say on player personnel.
Hopefully that has changed now.
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Appears to be the case. Team is making a lot of very un-Shades-like moves this off-season.
 
Steelr4evr said:
From what I've read, no competition was going to happen. He was going to back up Wilson. Period.

He unfortunately got drafted into the worst possible situation with an OC who should never have been hired. They also do not develop players for ****.
I'd ask for a trade too after being told completely the opposite of what actually transpired. Again in the long run it will be better for Pickett and the team. It will be interesting to see how his career goes in Philly. Those fans are bigger ******** than Steeler fans

They pulled the same crap on Mason. I have a pretty good idea of what they're trying to do from top to bottom on the team. It's pretty easy to connect the dots and actions speak louder than words.


I think they're going all in for next year. It will look good on paper, but we know how that goes.


Anyhow, what's done is done. Now that Wilson is a Steeler, I hope he puts his heart and soul into the offense.
He's playing for his next big contract as well and redemption.

He's definitely going to be under a microscope 24/7. No excuses.
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Bingo. Thing is, they need to make all these moves and a new OC just to stay even. Like I said, they lucked out when Burrow got hurt, if not for that they’re not in the playoffs.
Browns are gonna Brown and won’t be able to afford to put much talent around Watson. Still gonna be a chore to finish ahead of the Rats and Bungles though.
 
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As I see it the coaching issue is a combination of Deuce wanting to keep costs outside of Tomlin low and Tomlin wanting company men. And his access to innovative younger coaches is relatively limited. I believe Tomlin couod win it all with right assistants. He makes in game errors but that us infrequent and can be overcome. His disdain of risking it for the biscuit especially on defense and allowing free range over the middle is the most real problem. Good Qs will just feed that.
 
xjx said:
I think we can give some credit to Tomlin on player development. When Dupree was ineffective from the left side he had him switch sides with TJ. Highsmith arrived with athletic gifts, but he didn't have a spin move till he learned it here. It took him about a year. Those are two I can think of.
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Tomlin was instrumental in putting them on the wrong side in the first place.
 
Fiji Mariner said:
I will add this regarding half time adjustments, if you have to adjust drastically at halftime it means your gameplan sucked and/or your advanced scouting sucked. If halftime adjustments are needed on a large scale there are larger issues...minor tweeks with a player or two sure, because you noticed a tendency. Whole scale adjustments at halftime without practice just aren't that big of an actual occurrence for the most part.

Now judging by how many times the Steelers entered a game and didn't even show up for the first half (laid an egg) it would lend me to believe that the gameplan sucked (looking at you here Tomlin and Canada) more likely than the advanced scouting. If Tomlin were so bad at adjusting how does a mid-low tier QB like KFP have all those 4th quarter comebacks? Is Tomlin just some X and O genius that figures it out at the end??? Highly unlikely, because as you state referencing Manning, halftime adjustments and in game adjustments in general are just over blown.

If we are going to discredit Tomlin for not making halftime adjustments we have to credit him for the 4th quarter comebacks, I'm not ready to anoint him some late game genius. More often than not 90% or more boils down to players executing/making plays or not making plays once the game begins.

Can coaches scheme players out of a gameplan or not put them in a position to succeed, most definitely, but this is indeed usually done before the game ever starts and I am in no way endorsing Tomlin, his turtle ball or the position he puts some players in to succeed/fail.
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GREAT post Fiji Mariner, thanks for all the great ones along the way.

The latter part of your post is definitely a factor. Both pre-game planing & Schemeing players away from their strengths.

LOOK at all the players Tomlin has had playing out of position, add in that 2DL set where TJ is schemed out with triple teams………….

On the adjustment note: There definitely are some adjustments made including at 1/2 time. BILL COWHER has made that indication before, and so has Tomlin.



Salute the nation
 
Greg Lloyd said:
I feel a twinge of this and a feeling of "now the grown ups are in charge." I believe Kahn is his own man, a man who's been around and witnessed how we got here, the good and bad. And this just in: There has been the bad, and it's up to him to correct the bad. And he is doing just that. Is his vision superior to what we've been operating under?

Only time will tell, but my bottom dollar says "likely." We've had over a decade of seeing what the "leadership" of Shades and Colbert bought us. And I've got to say, the further we went on an odyssey with those two, the more obvious it was that that ship wasn't seaworthy. Yes, I'm gonna say it one more time: Shades Super Bowl season was not a team built with his vision; it was Cowher's. And the further we got away from Cowher's leadership, the worst our team got, even with a franchise QB.

Yes, we've only seen one year of drafting by Kahn, but this just in: It looks pretty promising. Jones, JPJ, Benton and Herbig all look like quality draft picks, and there's still hope for Washington and even Spenser Anderson becoming solid pieces. Even Colbert's "better" draft classes usually had 1 decent player and maybe one other worth starting. Colbert's/Shades' draft classes are why we are in the weak position we are in, including their last few which were really weak.

2022

- Pickett - Horrid, horrid play, immature attitude, already off the team. Huge miss.
- Pickens - Uber talented, trying to overcome immaturity.
- Leal - No one knows what they were thinking. A total tweener without a position.
- Austin - small person, zero production so far. Not even mentioned even with the team being so weak at WR.
- Connor Heyward - More Shades "brother drafting." A major fail.
- Robinson - an ILB who has failed so far.
- Oladoken - QB who's off the team.

2021

- Harris - 1st round RB who turned out not worth it. Just OK.
- Muth - TE we missed on a lot of better players for.
- Green - failed pick who was a shot in the dark at C, turned out horrible at OG as well.
- Moore - a bad LT who still stinks to this day.
- Buddy Johnson - a LB who....??
- Loudermilk - failed DLman
- Roche - DL, fail
- Norwood - DB fail
- Harvin - punter who stunk

The rest of their drafts mostly read the same way. And before anyone can say "Drafting is hard, a lot of team's picks don't work out." I know that. But anyone giving a real, hard look at Pgh's drafts know they've been mostly fail. Cowher's era did not produce such paltry drafts.
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The offense has failed Harris, Muth, Austin and Heyward. They can all play.
 
xjx said:
I think we can give some credit to Tomlin on player development. When Dupree was ineffective from the left side he had him switch sides with TJ. Highsmith arrived with athletic gifts, but he didn't have a spin move till he learned it here. It took him about a year. Those are two I can think of.
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Myself and many others were calling for the switch of sides well before Tomlin even considered it. As in at least a season. Dupree had played the right side through college and you could see he constantly took the wrong angle on his unnatural side. I would hardly give Tomlin any credit whatsoever in this. In fact a major fail. It’s kind of like a guard that played center a couple games in college,and throwing him out as a C day one in the NFL.
Facts. I could go on.
 
Steelmann said:
Myself and many others were calling for the switch of sides well before Tomlin even considered it. As in at least a season. Dupree had played the right side through college and you could see he constantly took the wrong angle on his unnatural side. I would hardly give Tomlin any credit whatsoever in this. In fact a major fail. It’s kind of like a guard that played center a couple games in college,and throwing him out as a C day one in the NFL.
Facts. I could go on.
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Dupree, Watt, Dotson, Green at center, Timmons at OLB rather than ILB. Yeah, there are a lot of them over the years.
 
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