More Tomlin and HOT Seat

[Steelerfreak]

Fire Tomlin and Haley. Ben calls his own plays the rest of the year while LeBeau is interim head coach. LeBeau retires at the end of the year. Off season we then get some fresh coaches with different ideas.

This plan works for me.

 

[slashsteel]

Ben USED TO BE a franchise quarterback. Not sure that's the case anymore.

I don't buy that he isn't.

He has a declining Heath (simply not as explosive as he was before his injury), a not really option in Matt, a struggling player in Wheaton, a declining player in Moore, a hands of stone in DHB. Yeah a bunch of scrubs.

And a assistant coach that doesn't know his *** from the hole in the wall.

He has Bell, and Brown. And Blount who splits time with Bell.

Sure Ben has some things to work on too. But I think he is handcuffed in many ways.

One way to find out though.

On a game the O is sucking come half time put his *** on the bench for awhile.


Which is why it always comes back to Tomlin. So many options and none of them are done. None just ******* talk!

Sure light a fire under the players ( if they even still believe in him), but as a coach change some **** up.

Bench for not performing. Tell these coordinators to step up and try some new things.

Because the way it is now isn't ******* working.................

 

[Steelerfan]

I saw that Bleacher Report and a few others before noon yesterday, So, some are stirring the pot but probably no substance to what any of them are saying - purely speculation.

This. Just because some dude has an internet site and posts a rumor people think its gospel. I don't get it.

 

[Steelerfan]

Promote Joey "they shot me in Denver" Porter should be the interim HC. He may equally suck at it for the remainder of the year, but damn would he be fun to watch on the sidelines and listen to in the press conferences.

Word!!!!!!!!

 

[black and gold apex]

I can't jump on the Ben being a problem band wagon as yet. This line allows for no time to throw and many times they are bunched in, where Ben can't step into a throw. Just watching other games and seeing the time and type of pocket the QB's can throw from still point the finger to a bad OL.

 

[steelerscotty]

Lol
Because tricky grandpa Dick's system works so well these days

How does LeBeau's defensive system have any bearing on him taking over as interim coach? Fire Tomlin? ABOSFREAKINGLUTLY! Someone has to take the reigns for the rest of the year . . .LeBeau and Munchack are the two obvious (to coin a phrase) options. Id rather have Munch stay with the O-line. Butler can take over DC duties and Ben and the qb coach can came up with a game plan under LeBeau's supervision. LeBeau HAS to be better at time clock management and key in-game decisions than Tomlin, how could he not be? All the players on both sides of the ball love the guy and i think they would play hard for him. Im not sure if that true with Tomlin. They call him a "players coach" but i suspect most of the steelers players think hes a soft blow-hard and some on them probably dont give more of an effort because they know he's all talk and wont do anything about it.

 

[bermudasteel]

Lol
Because tricky grandpa Dick's system works so well these days

Bingo......

 

[Buddy Dial]

Help me out here, I’m trying to figure out what Steelers on today’s roster, based on their talent level and/or production, could step in and start for some of the top tier teams (not totally injury depleted) in this league. In other words not the “dregs” of the league. Take it a step further and let’s eliminate Cowher’s older guys; Ben, Heath, Troy, Keisel, Harrison, Taylor(injured), all current starters for us but soon to be (if not now) “over the hill“.

What do we have from Tomlin‘s 8 years at the helm?
Offense: AB for sure, Bell for sure, Pouncey probably, DeCastro probably, Blount maybe
Defense: Timmons maybe, Heyward maybe
Special teams: ?????????

Am I forgetting anyone?

 

[slashsteel]

Help me out here, I’m trying to figure out what Steelers on today’s roster, based on their talent level and/or production, could step in and start for some of the top tier teams (not totally injury depleted) in this league. In other words not the “dregs” of the league. Take it a step further and let’s eliminate Cowher’s older guys; Ben, Heath, Troy, Keisel, Harrison, Taylor(injured), all current starters for us but soon to be (if not now) “over the hill“.

What do we have from Tomlin‘s 8 years at the helm?
Offense: AB for sure, Bell for sure, Pouncey probably, DeCastro probably, Blount maybe
Defense: Timmons maybe, Heyward maybe
Special teams: ?????????

Am I forgetting anyone?

Jones and Shazier have potential.

 

[JJ_Steel]

Jones and Shazier have potential.[/QUOTE

Jones is a bum with below average speed, strength , quickness and smarts, Shazier is a stud.

 

[STEELERS R GR8]

This is part of the problem. Who "promised" Butler the DC job? What has he done with the LB corps that makes anyone think he could manage the defense? This team is a steaming pile from top to bottom and I don't think anyone should be safe.

I am not sure who but someone in the organization has told him the d coord job is his that's why he passed on all the other DC jobs like the Dolphins and Cards. I agree nobody should be safe and nobody should just be handed a job but the guy has learned from the best and he should be rewarded for his loyalty. Our problems on this team is bigger then our LB coach, we have had bad drafts and aging players. The salary cap is preventing us from bringing in players we want and settling for players we can afford in the bargain bin. Tomlin or Colbert are to blame maybe even both but something has to change.

 

[Xc944]

I am not sure who but someone in the organization has told him the d coord job is his that's why he passed on all the other DC jobs like the Dolphins and Cards. I agree nobody should be safe and nobody should just be handed a job but the guy has learned from the best and he should be rewarded for his loyalty. Our problems on this team is bigger then our LB coach, we have had bad drafts and aging players. The salary cap is preventing us from bringing in players we want and settling for players we can afford in the bargain bin. Tomlin or Colbert are to blame maybe even both but something has to change.

Don't think shazier is a stud. He also has strength issues and hasn't shown he can cover yet

 

[Drink IRON City]

Don't think shazier is a stud. He also has strength issues and hasn't shown he can cover yet

PRETTY MUCH, like most rookies. Give the guy time, he will fill those shoes you describe.



Salute the nation

 

[JupiterBnG]

I am not sure who but someone in the organization has told him the d coord job is his that's why he passed on all the other DC jobs like the Dolphins and Cards. I agree nobody should be safe and nobody should just be handed a job but the guy has learned from the best and he should be rewarded for his loyalty. Our problems on this team is bigger then our LB coach, we have had bad drafts and aging players. The salary cap is preventing us from bringing in players we want and settling for players we can afford in the bargain bin. Tomlin or Colbert are to blame maybe even both but something has to change.

I get that the loyalty should be rewarded, especially if he's passed on other opportunities to advance his career based on a promise that this job is his one day, but here's the rub: If Dick Lebeau's system isn't cutting it any more, and this guy is essentially Dick Lebeau 2.0, should we expect any improvement, or just more of the same?

 

[Buddy Dial]

I get that the loyalty should be rewarded, especially if he's passed on other opportunities to advance his career based on a promise that this job is his one day, but here's the rub: If Dick Lebeau's system isn't cutting it any more, and this guy is essentially Dick Lebeau 2.0, should we expect any improvement, or just more of the same?

Loyalty should be rewarded when it's in the best interests of the organization. If Butler doesn't have documented agreement with Rooneys, hopefully he's smart enough to know situations change and he has been paid for his work. If he's not the next guy, throw him some $s and send him on his way.

 

[Wingman]

The system maybe just fine. The players that have been needed to play it are not on the team. The players selected are not likely to fit most nfl schemes as starters and difference makers, they have turned out to be just guys.

 

[JupiterBnG]

The system maybe just fine. The players that have been needed to play it are not on the team. The players selected are not likely to fit most nfl schemes as starters and difference makers, they have turned out to be just guys.

Yes, but it's unlikely that, if they turn control over to Butler next year, they will magically have the personnel required to execute the system, for two reasons:

1) Butler, as a Lebeau protege, is likely to enact only minor changes in the system, and it's doubtful that those changes will have a big impact with the current personnel because, if it would, why wouldn't they have considered his input before now? They trust him to be the future DC, but no one will listen to his suggestions on adjustments they can make to better utilize the players they have to work with? I don't buy it.

2) If Butler comes in as DC next year and institutes an entirely new defensive scheme, it's still doubtful that the personnel we'll have can execute it any better than they're executing Lebeau's defense now. Most of the players we have came from college programs or other teams where the 3-4 was featured. Trying to re-cast them into 4-3 players isn't likely to make them better in the short term. I question whether there are any tweaks to the 3-4 that can be made that they can't try right now (see point #1 above).

 

[Wingman]

Yes, but it's unlikely that, if they turn control over to Butler next year, they will magically have the personnel required to execute the system, for two reasons:

1) Butler, as a Lebeau protege, is likely to enact only minor changes in the system, and it's doubtful that those changes will have a big impact with the current personnel because, if it would, why wouldn't they have considered his input before now? They trust him to be the future DC, but no one will listen to his suggestions on adjustments they can make to better utilize the players they have to work with? I don't buy it.

2) If Butler comes in as DC next year and institutes an entirely new defensive scheme, it's still doubtful that the personnel we'll have can execute it any better than they're executing Lebeau's defense now. Most of the players we have came from college programs or other teams where the 3-4 was featured. Trying to re-cast them into 4-3 players isn't likely to make them better in the short term. I question whether there are any tweaks to the 3-4 that can be made that they can't try right now (see point #1 above).

I would offer to you the premise that scheme can only make up for so much in the way of talent. The team has been managed so poorly over the last few years that it will need to be rebuilt and it will take time to do so. This team is no longer competitive, it has become the team our opponents look at and think they have one in the win column.

 

[JupiterBnG]

I would offer to you the premise that scheme can only make up for so much in the way of talent. The team has been managed so poorly over the last few years that it will need to be rebuilt and it will take time to do so. This team is no longer competitive, it has become the team our opponents look at and think they have one in the win column.

That was my point. I don't think that the DC, be it Lebeau, Butler or some other new hire, is likely to make a short term improvement, because the personnel is what it is. That's not to say that maybe it isn't time for Lebeau to hang it up, or that we shouldn't contemplate a new defensive philosophy, just that none of that will return this defense to dominance without an almost complete gutting of the locker room too. The veteran players are too old, and the young players are (for the most part) too terrible.

 

[AggieSteel]

That was my point. I don't think that the DC, be it Lebeau, Butler or some other new hire, is likely to make a short term improvement, because the personnel is what it is. That's not to say that maybe it isn't time for Lebeau to hang it up, or that we shouldn't contemplate a new defensive philosophy, just that none of that will return this defense to dominance without an almost complete gutting of the locker room too. The veteran players are too old, and the young players are (for the most part) too terrible.

That's what the Cowboys thought last year too

 

[Wingman]

That was my point. I don't think that the DC, be it Lebeau, Butler or some other new hire, is likely to make a short term improvement, because the personnel is what it is. That's not to say that maybe it isn't time for Lebeau to hang it up, or that we shouldn't contemplate a new defensive philosophy, just that none of that will return this defense to dominance without an almost complete gutting of the locker room too. The veteran players are too old, and the young players are (for the most part) too terrible.

Sounds like we are in violent agreement.

 

[Drink IRON City]

I think we have some decent players and some over the hill and crappy players (both offense and defense). Maybe a switch in coaches / coordinators, may not be an immediate "power house" fix, but do you think current coaches are? Gut what you can, draft what you can, its a process / time frame. What we have now doesn't cut it, under new staff, some players m,ay respond better than expected.



Salute the nation

 

[STEELERS R GR8]

I get that the loyalty should be rewarded, especially if he's passed on other opportunities to advance his career based on a promise that this job is his one day, but here's the rub: If Dick Lebeau's system isn't cutting it any more, and this guy is essentially Dick Lebeau 2.0, should we expect any improvement, or just more of the same?

I don't know all the money dealing but if I remember right the Steelers gave Butler more money to stay here and not take a DC job else where. If he is LeBeau 2.0 I am good with that I don't think the problem is LeBeau in general and maybe letting Butler go after keeping him here and learning could be a big mistake. Unless..........we plan on going to a 4-3.

 

[Stlrs4Life]

Look, with the way the NFL is slanted toward offense if they ever come to their senses and clean out the coaching staff, I want a young offensive minded head coach with a coordinator to match. The defensive coordinator has to be able to get pressure with four guys, if that means a complete overhaul then so be it. The dink and dunk **** with the spread offenses that dominate the game only struggle when you can get quick pressure without sending a lot of extra bodies. Quarterbacks don't like pressure, or getting hit. We do neither, so teams walk up and down the field on us at will.

Exactly. Well said Fab.