Questions for the Draft

[BLITZ]

I can see and agree with this logic. People forget reports had Trice looking better than Porter in camp. He’s still relatively an unknown commodity but the coaching staff might feel comfortable with him to compete for a spot. And Jackson is a nice insurance policy if Trice can’t take the opposite outside cb of Porter. Having two starting cbs on rookie contracts would be advantageous in keeping other veterans the next couple of seasons.

I personally think Khan has done a good job not having any glaring holes on this roster going into the draft. I think we can all agree upgrading RT, OC, and #2 WR should be on the radar and to a lesser extent CB, S, and perhaps a developmental Quarterback. But as a whole the team doesn’t have glaring needs. I feel Dylan Cook and Spencer Anderson wouldn’t be much if any drop over Chuks. If herbig can snap he’s not a drop from Cole. I cant see Trice and Jackson being much worse than Pat Pete. Elliott should be an upgrade ver Neal. Calvin Austin might be a drop off over DJ but getting George more targets should mitigate that. And Russ and Fields are light years better than Pickett and Trubisky.

I think Center is a glaring hole.

 

[FordFairLane]

I think Center is a glaring hole.

Do you think Herbig is a big drop off from Mason Cole? Personally, I don’t. Could definitely use an upgrade but it’s not like Herbig is a liability either.

 

[slashsteel]

I think Center is a glaring hole.

It is. Herbig didn't perform that well last year. They definitely shouldn't take stock that it would be a sound upgrade or even equal to Cole for that matter. If he was an upgrade they would have inserted him .

They would be wise not to roll that dice.

 

[ZonaBurgh]

Do you think Herbig is a big drop off from Mason Cole? Personally, I don’t. Could definitely use an upgrade but it’s not like Herbig is a liability either.

The comparison right there is a scary thought.

 

[SteelerFan448]

Do you think Herbig is a big drop off from Mason Cole? Personally, I don’t. Could definitely use an upgrade but it’s not like Herbig is a liability either.

That's still implying that Herbig is a dropoff from Cole. There isn't much room to reach the bottom of the NFL in performance based on what we saw from Cole in 2023.

 

[MT~Forged]

My opinion is that they have one glaring hole and 3 serious upgrades that are needed. Other upgrades would be nice.

Glaring need - C. There could be an option already on the roster, but since Cole wasn‘t replaced at any point last year, I doubt it. Hopefully this can be addressed in the Draft, no later than pick 2.

Serious upgrade needed - RT, WR, DL. I would hope that Mims makes it to #20, if he does, AND all 3 top C’s are still on the board, then he is my pick. If a C is taken before #20, then I take a C @ #20. I believe that WR is deep enough that they can get a quality guy who can challenge for WR2 in the 3rd or later. If I were lucky enough to get Mims and Frazier with picks 1&2, then I look at DL with pick 3, UNLESS there is a WR head and shoulders better.

Nice to have upgrades - CB, ILB, S & QB. Hopefully Trice takes the CB2 or CB3 spot, making that a less position of need, but too many starting calibre CB is never a problem. It would be nice to add a young LB to play next to Queen for the long haul. I also think Queen is going to be Farrior type of signing, and will pay dividends for years to come. With the Queen signing hopefully the S’s can go back to actually playing SAFETY. In a best case scenario they need a B/U QB next year, as both Wilson and Fields will not be on the team in 2025. Worst case they need a starting QB in 2025, maybe even late 2024, so a QB in round 3 or 4 is not a bad option.

I am really hoping they hit it with the first 3 needed picks and 1-2 with the rest.

 

[slashsteel]

My opinion is that they have one glaring hole and 3 serious upgrades that are needed. Other upgrades would be nice.

Glaring need - OC. There could be an option already on the roster, but since Cole wasn‘t replaced at any point last year, I doubt it. Hopefully this can be addressed in the Draft, no later than pick 2.

Serious upgrade needed - RT, WR, DL. I would hope that Mims makes it to #20, if he does, AND all 3 top C’s are still on the board, then he is my pick. If a C is taken before #20, then I take a C @ #20. I believe that WR is deep enough that they can get a quality guy who can challenge for WR2 in the 3rd or later. If I were lucky enough to get Mims and Frazier with picks 1&2, then I look at DL with pick 3, UNLESS there is a WR head and shoulders better.

Nice to have upgrades - CB, ILB, S & QB. Hopefully Trice takes the CB2 or CB3 spot, making that a less position of need, but too many starting calibre CB is never a problem. It would be nice to add a young LB to play next to Queen for the long haul. I also think Queen is going to be Farrior type of signing, and will pay dividends for years to come. With the Queen signing hopefully the S’s can go back to actually playing SAFETY. In a best case scenario they need a B/U QB next year, as both Wilson and Fields will not be on the team in 2025. Worst case they need a starting QB in 2025, maybe even late 2024, so a QB in round 3 or 4 is not a bad option.

I am really hoping they hit it with the first 3 needed picks and 1-2 with the rest.

With how they have so many needs I wouldn't be surprised if they trade down. Or even up if they are enamored with a player in 1 or 2.

For me they should trade down in 1 and up in 2. Maximize their picks and get a top C.


But ultimately I will be happy if they address T, WR, and C early...

 

[MT~Forged]

I still stand by my initial thoughts on the Draft, and hope that the Steelers share those thoughts.
1. Top RT, but only if all 3 top C’s are still on the board, otherwise the top remaining C
2. Top C available, because hopefully they were able to secure a blue chip RT (Mims ?)
3. DL or WR at this point, ILB if rated higher.
4. QB, WR, DL, ILB, CB, depending on the #3 pick.
- Rest of the Draft, repeat #4

Any chance they could trade the HC for a couple #1 picks and an up and comer? That would be the greatest coup of the Draft.

 

[Confluence]

My opinion is that they have one glaring hole and 3 serious upgrades that are needed. Other upgrades would be nice.

Glaring need - OC. There could be an option already on the roster, but since Cole wasn‘t replaced at any point last year, I doubt it. Hopefully this can be addressed in the Draft, no later than pick 2.

Serious upgrade needed - RT, WR, DL. I would hope that Mims makes it to #20, if he does, AND all 3 top C’s are still on the board, then he is my pick. If a C is taken before #20, then I take a C @ #20. I believe that WR is deep enough that they can get a quality guy who can challenge for WR2 in the 3rd or later. If I were lucky enough to get Mims and Frazier with picks 1&2, then I look at DL with pick 3, UNLESS there is a WR head and shoulders better.

Nice to have upgrades - CB, ILB, S & QB. Hopefully Trice takes the CB2 or CB3 spot, making that a less position of need, but too many starting calibre CB is never a problem. It would be nice to add a young LB to play next to Queen for the long haul. I also think Queen is going to be Farrior type of signing, and will pay dividends for years to come. With the Queen signing hopefully the S’s can go back to actually playing SAFETY. In a best case scenario they need a B/U QB next year, as both Wilson and Fields will not be on the team in 2025. Worst case they need a starting QB in 2025, maybe even late 2024, so a QB in round 3 or 4 is not a bad option.

I am really hoping they hit it with the first 3 needed picks and 1-2 with the rest.

if the C position is over-drafted because of need from a team before pick 20, why would you then overdraft another one, at leat 20/30 picks ahead of most draft boards, at 20? Isnt that a panic response likely to disappoint?

 

[MT~Forged]

if the C position is over-drafted because of need from a team before pick 20, why would you then overdraft another one, at leat 20/30 picks ahead of most draft boards, at 20? Isnt that a panic response likely to disappoint?

No, my draft philosophy just differs from others.
I really don’t subscribe to the so called “value” assigned to individual players. I believe that when you have needs you address them with a higher level of attention. In this case, I believe the greatest need is a starting Center, followed by a Starting RT. Since the odds favor the T’s going sooner, I take the tackle 1st, unless the top 1-2 C’s are off the board. You are not likely to get the top 3 T’s at 20, but you may get a top 3 C @ 51. If a C goes off the board by 20, the likelihood of one remaining @ 51 drops considerably, and I want one no matter what. So what if you take the 10 year starting C earlier than what their “value” is. I would rather get them early, than miss out all together. Kind of like it is better to get rid of a player a year early, rather than a year or two late.

I just feel that if you have identified a player you want, and they fill a required need, you take them. That doesn’t mean I am opposed to taking a calculated risk to fill two needs though. As a legitimate contender, I would use a different strategy, and they are not currently a legitimate contender. If you don’t address your needs in FA, you need to do that in the Draft.

 

[Confluence]

It was only 5/6 years ago that ILB Devin White went 5th overall, Steelers panicked and moved up for Devin Bush because of the scenario you described with the clear hole left by Shazier.

The Steelers have need at WR and DL and CB too, so if there were more OT/C's taken early, it would be more likely that they take the BPA, because that one spot, OC, does not make them a SB contender.

 

[slashsteel]

It was only 5/6 years ago that ILB Devin White went 5th overall, Steelers panicked and moved up for Devin Bush because of the scenario you described with the clear hole left by Shazier.

The Steelers have need at WR and DL and CB too, so if there were more OT/C's taken early, it would be more likely that they take the BPA, because that one spot, OC, does not make them a SB contender.

I think if they are hellbent on a C outside of Barton they need to trade down. I think Barton being able to play multiple positions and with his athleticism it isn’t a reach at 20 if he is there.


A week and a day our questions will be answered on their C approach. I think they either draft Barton in 1 or trade up in 2 for a C.

 

[Confluence]

I think if they are hellbent on a C outside of Barton they need to trade down. I think Barton being able to play multiple positions and with his athleticism it isn’t a reach at 20 if he is there.


A week and a day our questions will be answered on their C approach. I think they either draft Barton in 1 or trade up in 2 for a C.

Yep. If the OT/WR/DL isn't there at 20, it would seem like trading it for a 30/35 and another later 2 or early could get a better group. Hell the Bears could want an OL in 1 to go with the QB and Edge....

 

[Drink IRON City]

No, my draft philosophy just differs from others.
I really don’t subscribe to the so called “value” assigned to individual players. I believe that when you have needs you address them with a higher level of attention. In this case, I believe the greatest need is a starting Center, followed by a Starting RT. Since the odds favor the T’s going sooner, I take the tackle 1st, unless the top 1-2 C’s are off the board. You are not likely to get the top 3 T’s at 20, but you may get a top 3 C @ 51. If a C goes off the board by 20, the likelihood of one remaining @ 51 drops considerably, and I want one no matter what. So what if you take the 10 year starting C earlier than what their “value” is. I would rather get them early, than miss out all together. Kind of like it is better to get rid of a player a year early, rather than a year or two late.

I just feel that if you have identified a player you want, and they fill a required need, you take them. That doesn’t mean I am opposed to taking a calculated risk to fill two needs though. As a legitimate contender, I would use a different strategy, and they are not currently a legitimate contender. If you don’t address your needs in FA, you need to do that in the Draft.

I’m here as well, there are variables along the way, but why settle for someone not your guy.

C is by far the biggest need, but RT is a pretty big need as well. Makes sense to get RT in the 1st if he is there and then get C in the 2nd. Here is the variable part,…………… When the C’s start moving.


Salute the nation

 

[keslerclan]

This is a hell of a great post tape and I agree wholeheartedly:

So i got questions that i wish i knew the steelers answers

1. OL coach Pat Meyer was retained despite a struggling unit. The OL coach has to teach the blocking scheme to fit the offense. Do the steelers think Meyer was yet another steeler handcuffed by Canada? Does Smith think Meyer can teach his system?
A: I think Meyers still sucks BUT I'm hopeful that Arthur Smith (being a former OL coach has some sway on how he wants our OL to execute.

2. What is the blocking scheme? In Atlanta, Smith used lots of outside zone. Steelers didn't. Are they going to do outside zone? The answer to this can completely change your OL rankings.
A: We have an OL more suited to outside zone, IMO, however they have not done well executing it in the past. I blame that on our OL coach. Hopeful that Smith can get more out of it with better schemed plays. I think he will run a combination of outside/inside zone but also keep some of the "duo" and power/gap concepts to have less predictability than our previous simpleton OC. It DOES completely take some OL off the board though as most big, powerful Olinemen are better suited to phonebooth/power-gap schemes. That's why I like Graham (early) or Limmer/Nourzad (later). IMO, either will start at G and transition to C later.

3. Do they think Dan Moore fits in the new offense and will be an OK starter? The steelers pre draft visits have them talking to OTs so they want an upgrade but is that a luxury or a need? I ask this question ahead of Center because if they think Moore stinks and needs replacement then OT is a bigger need than Center.
A: They definitely think higher of Moore than "the peanut gallery/PFF" crowd but they KNOW something about B.Jones that most don't...he would have performed far worse than Moore on the left side because he "leaves the inside exposed" too often. He did it in college too and gave up some pressures. He only had 22 starts in college and will take some refining which cannot be done by Meyers, IMO. IMO, if we can get a shot at an upgrade swing and not a true RT, we might be better off.

4. How many Centers do they actually like? Do they think a later round guy like Nourzad can start as a rookie? And i don't mean in a cross your fingers sort of way like with Kendrick Green.
A: I think they believe Nourzad can start as a rookie, but like most, will start at G and be moved over after some acclimation. IMO, moving the $4M dollar man to G with Daniels at C makes sense while breaking in ANY rookie C.

5. Are they open to James Daniels moving to C? Center could be scarce. If they don't want to move Daniels then they may have to draft a C in the 1st or possibly trade up in a later round to guarantee they get one. If they're OK with moving Daniels, it opens up the draft pool to G and C so maybe they can wait a bit longer.
A: Totally agree

6. They added DeShon Elliot and Dante Jackson to the secondary. Do they think that gives them adequate starters and only need to draft DB as a want not a need?
A: Like always, they collect personnel before the draft to "hedge" their needs. I still think they will take a SS/NCB later and might have the opportunity to get a shutdown CB early if it presents. They don't get deep in drafts and this year has more than usual. I think SS is a stronger need to draft as NCBs can be drafted late, we just haven't done it.

7. How much does Smith like or trust Pickens in his system? If he loves Pickens then they just need a #2 WR. In this draft they could wait a long time because it's so deep. They may also be able to trade for a veteran to fill that role. If Smith is not sure Pickens fits, then WR is a pretty big need that may have to be addressed in Rd 2 or 3.
A: Again, I think their actions will speak to this. All the talk of a high-profile trade tells me they are "hedging" in case Pickens can't handle the pressure of maturing.

8. What are the thoughts on the DL? Does Cam have a few good years left as a starter or quality role player? Are they done with Leal and Loudermilk? Do they see anybody aside from Benton as a long term future starter? If they think Cam only has 1 year left as a starter and don't see anybody else as a future starter then DL is a pretty big need. Maybe you have to pull the trigger on Johnny Newton or Byron Murphy in rd 1.
A: IMO, Cam is better than any rookie, and he played hurt all last year. It's not indefinite though and we need depth now, for later. If we get a shot at a falling T'Vondre Sweat, we should take it (he cannot be blocked by one guy), otherwise, Braden Fiske (middle) or Eboigbe/G.Hall/Crumedy (later) might be the best bet. I like the potential of Maason Smith, I just don't trust it.

9. Do they plan to sign Freiermuth to a 2nd contract? TE is very important to Smith's offense. Washington may be a good blocker but likely won't be much of a playmaker as a receiver. If they don't see Pat in future plans then TE is a need.
A: This draft is loaded with TE talent. Especially the kind that are a bit more dynamic and have some blocking chops. Freiermuth may be safe this year but will be expendable soon due to his lack of showing either. (Not all his fault) Theo Johnson, Jared Wiley and Tip Reiman could all be future upgrades. Depends on how Arthur Smith sees Heyward and Washington as "useful" in his system.

Unless one of the "shut-down" CBs is available at #20 (or a top 3 OT, Alt, Fashanu, Fuaga), I trade down for picks.

 

[FordFairLane]

That's still implying that Herbig is a dropoff from Cole. There isn't much room to reach the bottom of the NFL in performance based on what we saw from Cole in 2023.

Herbig is at the very least a better run blocker. At least as good pass blocker. Snapping is probably the $64,000 question but can he be worse than Cole? I guess it’s possible.
It’s a hole but not glaring. I would say RT is a much bigger hole. You can kick a tackle inside to guard or center and it’s possible that Dylan Cook or Spencer Anderson could be in play for center. There’s no kicking Herbig out to RT. So there’s options at center but only questions at RT. My guess is if there’s a starting RT on the board at 20 we take them. If not then unless a very good value player drops my guess is we’d try to trade back. I personally like Kiran Amegadjie from Yale. Was a LT at Yale but his mauling type play says RT in my mind. I don’t know if he will be there at 51 so perhaps we trade into day two and grab him or trade down with Arizona and take their 27, 35 and 189 for our 20 and 51. We take Jackson Powers-Johnson and Kiran Amegadjie and fix the offensive line finally.

 

[madinsomniac]

JPJ has some significant injury history including multiple concussions. Also, he only has 13 starts at Center 2 at G and 1 at DT. He's inexperienced, and the Pac 12 has mostly crappy defenses. Aside from the Pac 12 schedule, Oregon played Portland State, Texas Tech, Hawaii and a bowl against Liberty.

In looking at the consensus DT rankings he did not face a single DT that is expected to be drafted this year. He looked good at senior bowl practices but got injured on day 2.

The steelers had him for a visit but that may have been to have their Drs take a look at him more than anything.

He has limited experience. He's a decent athlete but not elite. Drafting him in the 1st is not a sure thing.


Then you have another guy the steelers have been linked to, Amarius Mims. He only has 8 starts total at RT. He may not be ready to start as a rookie. But he has elite physical talents. If he stayed in school, he'd probably be a top 5 pick in 25.

Id really like Mims. I would feel better having two potentially great Tackles because while you dont need a great RT to win, it both gives you a great option if the guy can play LT too in case of injury and it stops teams from flipping pass rushers to avoid on great tackle...

I think BJ and mims are both raw guys with extreme potential that may develop into something great... you dont get that in the middle to back end of the draft too often... the last two T classes were just stacked...

 

[MT~Forged]

It was only 5/6 years ago that ILB Devin White went 5th overall, Steelers panicked and moved up for Devin Bush because of the scenario you described with the clear hole left by Shazier.

I don’t believe that they “panicked” and moved up. I believe he was their guy all the way, and when White went off the board they did what they felt they needed to do to be sure to get their guy. You can make the argument that moving up to get the guy was a reach, and you would be right, as proven by how things worked out. It also could have worked out and they got their guy for years to come.

The Steelers have need at WR and DL and CB too, so if there were more OT/C's taken early, it would be more likely that they take the BPA, because that one spot, OC, does not make them a SB contender.

I agree that they ALSO have need at WR, DL & CB. I just happen to rate the need lower than C & RT.
WR - Pickens is WR1 right now, no matter if they pick a WR in the 1st.
DL - The line is functionally solid right now, but you don’t draft early for depth
CB - They are looking for CB2, who may already be on the roster, so again this is a depth pick early situation.

C - There is nobody current on the roster to fill this position that is better than Cole was, otherwise they would have replaced him last year.
RT -There are a couple young guys in the wings that may work out, but again, they were not better than the weak link manning the LT position, since they didn’t play them @ RT allowing Jones to play where he should be playing.

MY OPINION is:
3 are depth moves with a possibility of upgrade
1 is an upgrade possibility
1 is a Starting position need.

I value the picks in this order C, RT, WR/DL, CB, ILB, QB, CB, DL, WR, S

Center is the biggest need, but if things go as I hope, it can wait till round 2 if a RT is available @ 20 with all C’s still on the board. if it works out, they get 2 starters on the OL, and are set for a decade. We can argue about who that RT pick is, Mims, Barton, etc. Make no mistake though, I would take the C in round one if I need to, and not lose a minute of sleep.

 

[MT~Forged]

I’m here as well, there are variables along the way, but why settle for someone not your guy.

C is by far the biggest need, but RT is a pretty big need as well. Makes sense to get RT in the 1st if he is there and then get C in the 2nd. Here is the variable part,…………… When the C’s start moving.


Salute the nation

Maybe they would have to move up to get the C in the 2nd, but hopefully one of the top 3 will be there without moving.

I just don’t want to see another conversion Project. I feel Barton is a luxury pick for versatility @ 20, when he would be another conversion project. Sorry, not the way I would go.

 

[MT~Forged]

Yep. If the OT/WR/DL isn't there at 20, it would seem like trading it for a 30/35 and another later 2 or early could get a better group. Hell the Bears could want an OL in 1 to go with the QB and Edge....

I am not locked in to taking the C @ 20 if a trade option presents that still allows the possibility of getting one between 20 & 51, AND picking up another day 2 pick.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

I will add 1 more question.

Do the Steelers think they can win the Super Bowl THIS YEAR with an improved scheme under Smith, improved QB play, and a few more additions in the draft?

The answer could be Yes. There are Zero great teams in the NFL right now. The Chiefs are the closest and they are beatable. The Steelers have a SB caliber defense right now before the draft. If you add 1 or 2 OL starters the the OL can be very good. The run game will be strong. They have weapons of they get good QB play.

If the Steelers think they have a shot at a SB this year, then maybe you draft a playmaking WR in rd 1. Somebody like AD Mitchell, or Brian Thomas.

 

[Drink IRON City]

Indeed the Chiefs are beatable and more so as the Lambo-man with his 8-Feloney charges seem to indicate another
player MIA (I know the NFL player get special privilege) as his case proceeds forward.

The possible DREAM could happen, so lets dream it this time of year and slowly watch how it plays out.


Salute the nation

 

[bermudasteel]

JPJ has some significant injury history including multiple concussions. Also, he only has 13 starts at Center 2 at G and 1 at DT. He's inexperienced, and the Pac 12 has mostly crappy defenses. Aside from the Pac 12 schedule, Oregon played Portland State, Texas Tech, Hawaii and a bowl against Liberty.

In looking at the consensus DT rankings he did not face a single DT that is expected to be drafted this year. He looked good at senior bowl practices but got injured on day 2.

The steelers had him for a visit but that may have been to have their Drs take a look at him more than anything.

He has limited experience. He's a decent athlete but not elite. Drafting him in the 1st is not a sure thing.


Then you have another guy the steelers have been linked to, Amarius Mims. He only has 8 starts total at RT. He may not be ready to start as a rookie. But he has elite physical talents. If he stayed in school, he'd probably be a top 5 pick in 25.

Tape pimping an SEC player???

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!

 

[bermudasteel]

It was only 5/6 years ago that ILB Devin White went 5th overall, Steelers panicked and moved up for Devin Bush because of the scenario you described with the clear hole left by Shazier.

The Steelers have need at WR and DL and CB too, so if there were more OT/C's taken early, it would be more likely that they take the BPA, because that one spot, OC, does not make them a SB contender.

New FO. I don't see that scenario playing out. The panic that is...

 

[slashsteel]

I will add 1 more question.

Do the Steelers think they can win the Super Bowl THIS YEAR with an improved scheme under Smith, improved QB play, and a few more additions in the draft?

The answer could be Yes. There are Zero great teams in the NFL right now. The Chiefs are the closest and they are beatable. The Steelers have a SB caliber defense right now before the draft. If you add 1 or 2 OL starters the the OL can be very good. The run game will be strong. They have weapons of they get good QB play.

If the Steelers think they have a shot at a SB this year, then maybe you draft a playmaking WR in rd 1. Somebody like AD Mitchell, or Brian Thomas.

I dunno is Mike keeping his hand out of the cookie jar?