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Steelers select Dri Archer in Round 3

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pretty sure Ben is our best offensive player, and chances are good that he's got the hand size required to catch and secure a ball, but I'd not want him back there returning kicks.
maybe the Kent State coach figured his guys couldn't block for **** and didnt want his best offensive player back there getting the **** kicked out of him.

who knows?
 
I would first like to state I am not complaining about the length of this thread, as I did indeed decide to open it, and read all of it.

But WOW. This is one long thread. I think we're about out of he says/she says till the guy touches a football at least in preseason, aren't we? If not, I will happily read more, it is after all, the offseason, and since it turns out Johnny football isn't actually sending **** picks to chicks, this is just as good for entertainment as anything. :)

Joe
 
Superman said:
pretty sure Ben is our best offensive player, and chances are good that he's got the hand size required to catch and secure a ball, but I'd not want him back there returning kicks.
maybe the Kent State coach figured his guys couldn't block for **** and didnt want his best offensive player back there getting the **** kicked out of him.

who knows?
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Brown is easily our 2nd best offensive player and he has done it for awhile. Also if "getting the **** kicked out of him" is what happens during punt returns, then isn't that what is going to happen to Archer in the NFL?
 
if this thread is any indication as to the longevity of Archer's career, our great great grandchildren will be debating this ****** too.
 
antdrewjosh said:
So a person who is used to defenses gunning for him is all of a sudden going to be scared running the ball I dont see it. CATCHING the ball is the issue. No one else is worried about gunners who arent allowed to hit you until you CATCH the ball. If he gets hit its not his fault is it. Its the players who supposed to be holding those players up. No one has said he WILL BE All Pro punt returner..he could be. The potential is there provided he can catch the ball. His vision, elusiveness are conducive to being a good to great punt returner.
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If playing RB and fielding punts were pretty much the same thing, more RB's would be punt returners. There's a HUGE difference between fielding a punt with 11 guys running down field towards you, with 10 of your OWN guys also running towards you trying to keep those other 11 away from you AND having a full OL in front of you while the QB hands the ball off to you, all the while WR's are running fake routes to take defenders away from the play. Are they still "gunning" for him as a RB? Sure, do they get a 30 yard head start, absolutely not. Are your own teammates running the opposite direction that you want to go, still a no.

As a RB you see how the defense is lined up, the play is designed to go to a certain side of the field, a certain designated path for the most part. You can see it before the snap, see if a blitz is coming, read the defenders, and prepare yourself for what you need to do. On a punt, you are looking up in the air at the ball while all the other team is racing towards you, you have to field the ball, and in less than a second decide which way to go... it's why you see a lot of muffed punts, returners take a "peak" at the coverage and lose site of the ball.

Is this a Archer can't do it post? Absolutely not, I'm on the fence about it right now... but it is calling out all the bullshit trying to compare returning punts to any other part of the game.
 
In no way shape or fashion did i say they were the same. I said a player who is used to running with football is not scared of the people running down field to catch him. The issue is catching punts. He wont be back there cause of fear. He wont be back there cause he cant secure the ball. How many hard hits do returners take every year on the catch. Few and far between.. teams projected him as a returner based on the way he runs. The elusiveness he displays. The issue they are worried about is catching and securing the football.
 
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Superman said:
if this thread is any indication as to the longevity of Archer's career, our great great grandchildren will be debating this ****** too.
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the only thing our great great grandchildren will be debating is whether Archer dominated the NFL more than Jordan dominated the NBA. But the answer will be easy - Archer because that lil ****** is fast.
 
Listen, I'm really trying not to get my hopes up, but has there ever been a 100 page thread before? It's within sight, so don't slow down now!
 
antdrewjosh said:
In no way shape or fashion did i say they were the same. I said a player who is used to running with football is not scared of the people running down field to catch him. The issue is catching punts. He wont be back there cause of fear. He wont be back there cause he cant secure the ball. How many hard hits do returners take every year on the catch. Few and far between.. teams projected him as a returner based on the way he runs. The elusiveness he displays. The issue they are worried about is catching and securing the football.
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And not one person is saying he is afraid to catch the ball with people flying at you. What they are saying is it's very difficult, requires split second reaction and great concentration. Several times in these game films you'll see him go to catch a pass, look away from the ball just slightly before it's there to peak at the coverage, he drops the pass. You can't have that on a punt, that's not an incomplete pass, or a do over, it's a fumble and possible turnover. THAT is the point being made. No one is saying he's a scared little *****, they are saying he is very inexperienced at punt returns, and to throw him to the wolves in the NFL and expect him to be better than an all pro punt returner already on the roster is asking a WHOLE lot.
 
page 64!
can we get this ***** to 70?

come on *******!
 
Vader said:
Brown is easily our 2nd best offensive player and he has done it for awhile. Also if "getting the **** kicked out of him" is what happens during punt returns, then isn't that what is going to happen to Archer in the NFL?
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are you equating our special teams guys to being on the same level as the Kent State special teams guys?
seriously? you know that's a reach.
 
insaniti said:
And not one person is saying he is afraid to catch the ball with people flying at you. What they are saying is it's very difficult, requires split second reaction and great concentration. Several times in these game films you'll see him go to catch a pass, look away from the ball just slightly before it's there to peak at the coverage, he drops the pass. You can't have that on a punt, that's not an incomplete pass, or a do over, it's a fumble and possible turnover. THAT is the point being made. No one is saying he's a scared little *****, they are saying he is very inexperienced at punt returns, and to throw him to the wolves in the NFL and expect him to be better than an all pro punt returner already on the roster is asking a WHOLE lot.
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I think he is afraid to catch the ball with people flying at him. There are several pass plays I have watched where he was heading towards the middle of the field with a linebacker or safety coming at him, and he throttled down and short armed the passes to protect himself.

As a runningback, seldom are guys hitting you while you are taking the handoff, you see them, and have time to react. Very different as a receiver and punt returner. What happens the first time he crosses the middle of the field and gets lit up?
 
That happens to every reciever. Brown does it from time to time. Its not just us projecting him..his coaches are. They arent just throwing him to the wolves. He is practicing at it. Its not like he is just learning it.. he was set to do it his senior year. How was he set to do it. Practice. What you are saying it takes to be a punt returner he possesses. Only thing he doesnt have is experience.
 
As a receiver it happens very seldom as a returner. As a returner you can simply signal fair catch. No hit.
 
Holmes was a fair catch/muff machine. But most thought he was a great punt returner based on the handful of punts he returned with 20 yards of running daylight in front of him.

Muffs, btw, don't count as fumbles, as possession has yet to be established. They're just live ball touchings. Those last two sentences alone are enough material for superman to drive this POS thread to 100 pages.

64 pages in and nobody has yet to reference wee Willie Reid? Based on frame and draft slot, I'd think he'd be the most comparable.
 
Superman said:
are you equating our special teams guys to being on the same level as the Kent State special teams guys?
seriously? you know that's a reach.
Click to expand...

What? No, I'm saying that if you believe that punter returner is a position that "gets the **** kicked out of him". What do you think is going to happen to Archer? Is that really difficult to understand?
 
dobre shunka said:
Holmes was a fair catch/muff machine. But most thought he was a great punt returner based on the handful of punts he returned with 20 yards of running daylight in front of him.

Muffs, btw, don't count as fumbles, as possession has yet to be established. They're just live ball touchings. Those last two sentences alone are enough material for superman to drive this POS thread to 100 pages.

64 pages in and nobody has yet to reference wee Willie Reid? Based on frame and draft slot, I'd think he'd be the most comparable.
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Yeah, I thought about Willie Reid, but most here likely won't remember Reid. He was kind of an afterthought after Holmes. He was a little bigger, actually had the build of a smaller WR. Former RB, switched to WR at Florida State, but he was a prolific collegiate return guy. Punt returns was his thing.

Lacked the sack to stand in and hold on in the NFL. But, he was a WR coming out...and punt returner, should have been better suited to handle the live fire. Just wasn't. Did not have the mental makeup or toughness.

Too bad they did not work with him on windy days in shorts. You never know what he could have been. If only.
 
Vader said:
What? No, I'm saying that if you believe that punter returner is a position that "gets the **** kicked out of him". What do you think is going to happen to Archer? Is that really difficult to understand?
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Dave really needs to install a Crayola font.

What I'm saying, and please try to follow along...read it slowly and sound out every word.

Kent State's special teams may have ******* sucked. As in sucked very, very bad. If that is the case, and it is a hypothesis at this point, then it could also be opined that the coach decided to not put his best overall offensive player back there returning punts, considering the likelihood of his teammates not making blocks would or could exponentially increase his best offensive player's chances of committing a turnover or suffering an injury.

It's really not that difficult to understand what I'm saying unless you just want to ******* argue. If that is the case, then I'll end this now by saying Archer is black and anything you say he cannot do stems from your deep-seated racism.
 
Throwing burgers on the grill shortly, everyone welcome to stop over. BYOB.

Wear something sexy, Supe.
 


Go to 2:24 of this video. He does that ALL the time on passes over 15 yards. And, everyone thinks he can stand in during live fire and catch punts. RIGHT.
 
hopefully we don't throw deep to him. kid can run tho...

Nice find, TMC.
 
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