• Please be aware we've switched the forums to their own URL. (again) You'll find the new website address to be www.steelernationforum.com Thanks
  • Please clear your private messages. Your inbox is close to being full.

Who Should Pay for the US Military Budget?

Then why ask me a question if it doesn't matter? Why are you even on here discussing it? Are you campaigning? I'm not.

Let me put it another way. Conservatives running for office don't touch current social security spending with a ten foot pole.

The social security "cuts" have been future spending cuts, not current spending cuts. Kick the can down the road.

Show me someone willing to cut current spending.
 
Let me put it another way. Conservatives running for office don't touch current social security spending with a ten foot pole.

The social security "cuts" have been future spending cuts, not current spending cuts. Kick the can down the road.

Show me someone willing to cut current spending.

Troglodyte, I explained earlier why Republicans are unwilling to get hammered and pummeled by Dems and the media for setting forth particulars as to how to fix the funding problems. The Republicans had specific proposals ready for voting just 10 years ago.

The Democrats are the sole reason for the absolute unwillingness of the Republicans to re-visit this issue right now. Seriously, do you believe that Rubio or whoever could propose legitimate, well-founded ways to address the funding issues in social security and Medicare? If he did so, Hildabeast goes on a rampage, with full support from the fawning media covering her.

So until the Dems are willing to take this issue on, it will not be addressed. And for heaven's sake, don't tell me, "The Republicans owe it to the American people to get destroyed because they have legitimate, well-founded ideas to fix social security and Medicare and should be willing to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous criticism for proffering those ideas because, noble."

**** that. The Dems have made this a political hand grenade. They can dive on the ******* grenade since they pulled the pin.
 
Troglodyte, I explained earlier why Republicans are unwilling to get hammered and pummeled by Dems and the media for setting forth particulars as to how to fix the funding problems. The Republicans had specific proposals ready for voting just 10 years ago.

The Democrats are the sole reason for the absolute unwillingness of the Republicans to re-visit this issue right now. Seriously, do you believe that Rubio or whoever could propose legitimate, well-founded ways to address the funding issues in social security and Medicare? If he did so, Hildabeast goes on a rampage, with full support from the fawning media covering her.

So until the Dems are willing to take this issue on, it will not be addressed. And for heaven's sake, don't tell me, "The Republicans owe it to the American people to get destroyed because they have legitimate, well-founded ideas to fix social security and Medicare and should be willing to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous criticism for proffering those ideas because, noble."

**** that. The Dems have made this a political hand grenade. They can dive on the ******* grenade since they pulled the pin.

We're talking about current spending, not funding or future spending. The problem is now. The solutions, even from conservatives, are to kick the can down the road.
 
We're talking about current spending, not funding or future spending. The problem is now. The solutions, even from conservatives, are to kick the can down the road.

You just haven't read a thing he's written.

Why are the solutions from Conservatives, now, to kick the can down the road?

Hint: The answer is in Steeltime's writings. Try reading it.
 
We could cut in half, and we'd still double the spending of China and Russia combined. You could trim fat off this government everywhere with a damn broad sword.

And while what you say is true, is it enough to defend the nation?
 
Show me someone willing to cut current spending.

I'll show you someone with no chance of being elected. Americans and immigrants alike have become addicted to taxpayer funded free ****. That horse is out of the barn. It ain't going back in until there is no one else's money to give away.
 
You just haven't read a thing he's written.

Why are the solutions from Conservatives, now, to kick the can down the road?

Hint: The answer is in Steeltime's writings. Try reading it.

Ah! you mean this:

Among those he cited as "on the table" were:
limiting benefits for wealthy retirees;
indexing benefits to prices rather than wages;
increasing the retirement age; and
discouraging taking Social Security benefits early.

Yes, if implemented immediately those could cut current spending but I bet they would be grandfathered in.
 
I'll show you someone with no chance of being elected. Americans and immigrants alike have become addicted to taxpayer funded free ****. That horse is out of the barn. It ain't going back in until there is no one else's money to give away.

Should I just move to Greece now since the weather is better and get a head start?
 
Yes, if implemented immediately those could cut current spending but I bet they would be grandfathered in.

My guess is you would have to Grandfather in...especially folks over 48 who have put into the system for some 30 years. Most of these folks at the time didn't go in thinking 401K or IRAs because it was the retirement system in place. To me, anyone under 40 gets a reduced benefit and those under 30 even more....
 
The SS system is a Ponzi scheme .... It's just taken far longer than most to evidence itself as such. Did anyone even read what Kerry's response to bush was? He references young people " taking money out" of SS.... Total bs.... It's their money and the idea posited is that they never put it in but invest it somewhere solid and profitable.
 
My guess is you would have to Grandfather in...especially folks over 48 who have put into the system for some 30 years. Most of these folks at the time didn't go in thinking 401K or IRAs because it was the retirement system in place. To me, anyone under 40 gets a reduced benefit and those under 30 even more....

Should a 40 year old who has paid into it for 24 years and already isn't eligible until age 67 (maybe older?) get screwed out it before the 85 year-old worth $5 million who has been collecting it for 20 years?
 
Everything, across the board, needs to be cut. We are just spending way to much on everything.

Defense needs to get by with fewer dollars. The Social Security age should be raised by 1 year immediately and probably a 2nd or 3rd year down the line. We need to cut medicare/medicaid in some way.

My method of health care reform is to socialize all BASIC, CHEAP, STANDARD care: doctors visits, standard check-ups and blood work, any drug that's generic now. And each person (either through employees or themselves) has to have an "emergency" insurance policy that covers the extremes. And that policy (and price) is completely based on how healthy you are (based on things you can control). None of this "packaged" group bullshit. Everyone gets the same price based on their health and risk factors. You smoke, your emergency policy is more expensive. You eat like a pig and weigh 250 lbs? Your emergency policy goes up. Kind of like life insurance.

Basically, the government will give you the basics for free, but you have to insure against the big ****.

Once you hit retirement age (per Social Security), then you go on Medicaid or "old age health care". But it you can't stay healthy until then, that's on you and you got to pay for it somehow, someway.

We got to be a lot tougher on disability benefits, a lot tougher on welfare. Get people back to work. Don't have a system that encourages babies in poor folks. You can't afford a baby, don't have a baby. The government shouldn't give you more money per kid. Cap that **** at two babies and that's it. You can't afford another baby put it up for adoption, have an abortion, I don't give a ****. Too many stupid adults bringing kids into this world they can't take care of.

Education needs a total revamp. I HATE (and I mean HATE) the idea employees that work for the government or paid by taxpayer dollars can unionize and strike. That's bullshit. If you aren't happy with your pay working for the County or being a teacher or doing a VITAL job for the country (like being a nurse), you can't strike. You can't group negotiation your salary. If you don't like the pay, tough. Vote out the people in charge and vote for people that want to pay more. If vital service jobs don't have enough good people that want to work, governments will adjust. This idea being a teacher or country sewage inspector is some lifelong job security is crazy.

The legal system needs totally reworked. Civil litigation needs changes. The criminal courts needs to find better ways to streamline decisions. Changing our drug policies will help. No more than 2 appeals. None of this death row for 10 years ****. Death row should be MAX 1 year. Then kill them. Punishments need to fit the crimes better. Good lawyers shouldn't impact the process as much.

Lots and lots of stuff to fix.
 
I know one surefire way to save money - pull our 100,000 troops out of Europe and close all those bases.

Post-WWII era is over - Let the Europeans pay for their own defense and get the heck out of there

1951, Dwight D. Eisenhower, on NATO-: "If in 10 years, all American troops stationed in Europe for national defense purposes have not been returned to the United States, then this whole project will have failed."
 
I HATE (and I mean HATE) the idea employees that work for the government or paid by taxpayer dollars can unionize and strike. That's bullshit.

I never had any desire to be a school teacher, if I had to do it all over again, I'd be a school teacher.

Every imaginable holiday off. Weekends off. A week off for Christmas, 2 1/2 months off in the summer, unreal pensions, possible early retirement.
 
Should a 40 year old who has paid into it for 24 years and already isn't eligible until age 67 (maybe older?) get screwed out it before the 85 year-old worth $5 million who has been collecting it for 20 years?

Right there ... you turned discussion of changes to social security into an attack. Until that stops - by all concerned - no worthwhile change will take place.

The solution to the impending social security bankruptcy is to move citizens off a government-financed retirement system and into a privately-funded and paid system. The United States simply cannot pretend that the current approach will work and will not result in bankruptcy, for two reasons.

First, the system is now funded on what current employees are paying into the social security program. But the labor force is shrinking and fewer employees are therefore paying into the system:

the-labor-force-participation-rate-is-now-at-a-35-year-low.jpg


Second, Americans are living longer with every passing generation:

life-expectancy.jpg


These numbers are not "talking points," or shill-liners from a political hack; they are the simple facts. A system that relies on pay-as-you-go, with fewer and fewer paying in, more and more drawing out, and those drawing out doing so for a longer time will go bankrupt.

The solutions are basically what George W. Bush proposed:

  • Privatize for younger employees.
  • Remove those employees from the "drawing from the pool" group.
  • Sorry, but then wait for the "drawing out" pool to die off.
  • Have retirement funded by what we pay in ourselves.

No other change works. Increasing retirement age will be overcome by the declining labor pool. Making the program "means tested" is almost certainly unconstitutional, under what is called the "Contracts Clause" under Article 1, Section 10 of the Constitution: "No State shall ... pass any Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts." Courts read this as restricting the rights solely of governments to unilaterally alter their contractual obligations.

Under the Contracts Clause, if I enter into an agreement with the government, and I perform my part of the contract, the government may not pass a law impairing its obligation under the same contract. That would prevent the government from taking billions of dollars from citizens on the promise that the money would be then returned to them in retirement income, only then to tell hundreds of thousands of those citizens, "Tough titties - you'll get nothing and like it."

How do we fund social security while the beneficiaries die off? The government has a surplus, but is spending the money on other freebies. Just stop that process - that simple. Let the social security revenue pay the benefits until the beneficiaries die off. Have those revenues for younger workers put into private retirement accounts, with no obligation on the party of the government to pay retirees. That is how it should work.

And to fund the shortfall between employee contributions and benefits paid, circa 2030, how about this? How about the entity which @#$%ed up the system so royally sell some of the **** it owns to make up the difference???

In an analogy, if a multi-billionaire faced a coming income shortfall, and was looking at the obligation exceeding revenue by "x" billion dollars per year, would we be willing to manipulate the law, and his payment obligation, so that he can meet his obligation ... while at the same time letting him keep $1 trillion in real estate? Seriously, ask yourself that question.

So, Uncle, how about selling off a tiny portion of your multi-trillion dollar real estate holdings to fund the repair of the @#$%-up you caused? Why should this stupid Uncle get to keep his **** and not pay for his mistakes??
 
I never had any desire to be a school teacher, if I had to do it all over again, I'd be a school teacher.

Every imaginable holiday off. Weekends off. A week off for Christmas, 2 1/2 months off in the summer, unreal pensions, possible early retirement.

Some teachers don't get paid in summers- it depends on how their district divvies up their year's worth of pay. You don't get summers "off." Yes, you don't have students, but many teachers work over the summers or take classes.
 
I would cut a whole lot of stuff far before defense. Cutting defense 50% would be suicidal IMHO. There are plenty of wasteful government agencies and programs that could be cut without the country feeling a blip. Defense isn't one of them.

I would disagree. Our "Defense" budget is really a budget for being the world police, empire and nation building. We can cut our "Defense" budget by 50% and still spend more than the five next countries with the highest defense spending budgets combined. The fact is "Defense" has become a huge cash cow like highway spending.
 
I would disagree. Our "Defense" budget is really a budget for being the world police, empire and nation building. We can cut our "Defense" budget by 50% and still spend more than the five next countries with the highest defense spending budgets combined. The fact is "Defense" has become a huge cash cow like highway spending.
Democrats don't like the military but they do look at it as a jobs programs in their respective Congressional districts.
 
I would disagree. Our "Defense" budget is reaget for being the world police, empire and nation building. We can cut our "Defense" budget by 50% and still spend more than the five next countries with the highest defense spending budgets combined. The fact is "Defense" has become a huge cash cow like highway spending.

And don't forget about the trillions siphoned off for "black ops". Wasn't it Rumsfeld that said they had a couple trillion they couldn't find.
 
Some teachers don't get paid in summers- it depends on how their district divvies up their year's worth of pay. You don't get summers "off." Yes, you don't have students, but many teachers work over the summers or take classes.

Huh? Thats getting the summer off and choosing to do whatever they want. They get a salary, I don't see what difference it makes how it's divvied up.
 
Huh? Thats getting the summer off and choosing to do whatever they want. They get a salary, I don't see what difference it makes how it's divvied up.

No, actually, it's not. It depends wholly on the situation and choice. Many teachers work throughout the summers. Who do you think teaches summer school, as just one of many examples?
 
Huh? Thats getting the summer off and choosing to do whatever they want. They get a salary, I don't see what difference it makes how it's divvied up.

Just a matter that you have to budget your money if your school only pays you 9 months a year. My cousin is retired now but he ran a lawn service every summer since the 1960's. Now that he's retired he still does it. He's 65 going on 19 though and still so hyper that he probably needs to cut ten yards a day just so he can go to sleep.
 
Right there ... you turned discussion of changes to social security into an attack. Until that stops - by all concerned - no worthwhile change will take place.

Dude, WTF? It was a philosophical question that referenced one of Bush's proposals that YOU posted!

And then you proceed to post a ******* dissertation, after accusing me of hijacking a discussion.

Nice!
 
No, actually, it's not. It depends wholly on the situation and choice. Many teachers work throughout the summers. Who do you think teaches summer school, as just one of many examples?

Right, they choose to work and are compensated.
 
Huh? Thats getting the summer off and choosing to do whatever they want. They get a salary, I don't see what difference it makes how it's divvied up.

Working in the summer isn't getting the summer "off." Free from students, maybe, but not "off." Trust me. My mom was a teacher for 30 some years. I work in education. There are no summers "off."
 
Top