Drop algebra to improve graduation rate

[CharlesDavenport]

Can't make this stuff up.

Political scientist Andrew Hacker of Queens College in New York insists the difficulty of learning algebra is responsible for a higher dropout rate when students find they can’t grasp the discipline. The course should be excluded, Hacker says, because the math is just too hard for students today.

“One out of 5 young Americans does not graduate from high school. This is one of the worst records in the developed world. Why? The chief academic reason is they failed ninth-grade algebra,” Hacker says in his new book The Math Myth and Other STEM Delusions.

from - http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...s-algebra-is-too-hard-schools-should-drop-it/

He continues -

“At the very time we should be honing and sharpening quantitative reasoning skills we punch students into algebra, geometry, calculus. The Math People take over and ignore much simpler needs. Arithmetic is super essential — we quantify everything,” Hacker told The New York Times.

Yes, because we want kids to have the same kind of reasoning skills that you do, ya moron. Listen professor, the problem is with your teaching profession. You idiots keep dicking around with proven teaching techniques. And how about you poly sci majors refrain from public discourse about "difficult" STEM curriculum. Personally, I'd like some difficult curriculum required for an education degree because there are amazingly stupid people out there trying to teach our kids.

 

[Supersteeler]

What schools are actually doing is the exact opposite. They have now dropped everything LEADING UP to Algebra from the curriculum, i.e. Pre Algebra and Developmental Math for slower students no longer exist in most schools. Every single 9th Grader MUST start with Algebra I regardless of their ability level and every student MUST have Algebra I, Geometry and Algebra II in high school. It is to meet the State requirements and raising the bar for all students, which is great in theory, but in reality all kids do not learn at the same speed and ability level. It's more of the same from the government...just take every kid, regardless of their ability, intelligence, or learning disability and cram them into the same box. And it's for no other reason than to look good on paper in the state reports that all kids are "achieving" in the field of Mathematics. What's actually happening is that the kids who all should be in Pre Algebra are failing Algebra I repeatedly and falling behind.

 

[SteelChip]

I don't know about teachers in general Chuck, because if we look at the profession as a whole, they tend to be proficient and dedicated. My opinion is that due to the public union presence, there a too many bottom feeders that should have been weeded out long ago but now are emboldened by tenure to vocalize their stupidity.

]

 

[CharlesDavenport]

I don't know about teachers in general Chuck, because if we look at the profession as a whole, they tend to be proficient and dedicated. My opinion is that due to the public union presence, there a too many bottom feeders that should have been weeded out long ago but now are emboldened by tenure to vocalize their stupidity.

]

True, generally good but there are some doozies. I can only describe some of my meetings with a couple of teachers as..breathtaking. These were not tenured vets. Fairly new products of the university system.

 

[Steelerfan]

I have no problem dropping Algebra. I've never used it after graduation, LOL.

 

[Steeltime]

I have no problem dropping Algebra. I've never used it after graduation, LOL.

From this site: http://www.mathworksheetscenter.com/mathtips/algebra.html

Prerequisite for advanced training

Most employers expect their employees to be able to do the fundamentals of algebra. If you want to do any advanced training you will have to be able to be fluent in the concept of letters and symbols used to represent quantities.

Science

When doing any form of science, whether just a project or a lifetime career choice, you will have to be able to do and understand how to use and apply algebra.

Everyday life

Formulas are a part of our lives. Whether we drive a car and need to calculate the distance, or need to work out the volume in a milk container, algebraic formulas are used everyday without you even realizing it.

Analysis

When it comes to analyzing anything, whether the cost, price or profit of a business you will need to be able to do algebra. Margins need to be set and calculations need to be made to do strategic planning and analyzing is the way to do it.

Data entry

What about the entering of any data. Your use of algebraic expressions and the use of equations will be like a corner stone when working with data entry. When working on the computer with spreadsheets you will need algebraic skills to enter, design and plan.

Decision making

Decisions like which cell phone provider gives the best contracts to deciding what type of vehicle to buy, you will use algebra to decide which one is the best one. By drawing up a graph and weighing the best option you will get the best value for your money.

Interest Rates

How much can you earn on an annual basis with the correct interest rate. How will you know which company gives the best if you can't work out the graphs and understand the percentages. In today's life a good investment is imperative.

Writing assignments

When writing any assignments the use of graphs, data and math will validate your statements and make it appear more professional. Professionalism is of the essence if you want to move ahead and be taken seriously.

 

[Steelin]

I use Algebra all of the time. I can't imagine dropping it from the required curriculum. We might as well stop trying to meet any world standards. Maybe that's what they want.

 

[Steeltime]

I use Algebra all of the time. I can't imagine dropping it from the required curriculum. We might as well stop trying to meet any world standards. Maybe that's what they want.

Idiocracy continues its unimpeded march to supremacy in the United States.

 

[Max Power]

Kids these days are all kinds of screwed up. Let's not pile it on. Make them learn it, it's just a life skill.

Oh and if they fail simple Algebra, let's just give them a hall pass and directions to the Welfare Office. It would tell me they don't want to learn and be a productive member of society.

 

[warriors42]

I was out of school for more than THIRTY YEARS when I went back to college. I have taken or have to take.Finite math, Pre-cal algebra, pre-cal trig, cal I and II , physics I and II, Chem I,and II, organic chem I and II, optics, mechanics, Biology, organismal biology, cell biology, five different English and lit classes, five history classes and three psychology classes, not counting teaching classes. It is not how hard the class is it's how hard you are willing to work.

I have thirty credit hours left (after this semester) until I graduate with two majors (secondary education, comprehensive science), and two minors ( English, and history). If I can do all of this in my fifties these kids can sure as hell learn Algebra.

 

[IndySteel]

My 5th grade daughter pretty much already knows algebra and my 4th grader is learning it now. I also saw one of her papers yesterday where she was working with pi. ****, I've only used pi once in my entire adult life. That reminds me, a chemist that used to work for us had the first 8 digits of pi as his password. Nerd alert!

 

[deljzc]

This is exactly what will start to happen if Sanders makes "college free" as well.

College will just be 13th grade, they will dumb it down so people can graduate and having a college degree won't mean the paper it's printed on. All it will do is keep more people out of the work force that SHOULD be working and sucking off their parents and society to take care of them.

I'm starting to reconsider mandatory military service for this country. Require 1-year of service from every able bodied man and women before their 24th/25th birthday or something like that so people can decide to take it after high school or after college. Use them in times of peace for improving our infrastructure, securing the border, disaster relief, etc. Just having all those fat **** kids go through basic training might be a good thing and having every kid (poor and rich) might change some of our foreign policy decisions as well.

 

[Tibs]

This is exactly what will start to happen if Sanders makes "college free" as well.

Boy, that's a strawman argument if there's ever been one.

You realize university education is free (or very low cost) in countries like Germany, France, Denmark, Finland, Norway, Sweden, Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Italy, Spain, etc.

Must be a bunch of dumb ************* in those countries, with their dumbed-down "free" higher education.

 

[Steelin]

I have a PTO/RTO calculation and earnings program I wrote that projects earnings and allows scheduling time off 6 months into the future. New employees state that they've never worked with a better system. The Algebra involved is CRAZY. One of my better achievements. That is without ever taking an Algebra I or II class.

I guess success is possible without taking a formal Algebra class. It's just not as likely in my opinion.

 

[Steelin]

Idiocracy continues its unimpeded march to supremacy in the United States.

It's scary how the pace is accelerating too.

 

[Supersteeler]

Thinking back on my adult life, I can't think of one single time I used any concept from Algebra in the past 25 years. The four basic functions are all I have ever needed or used.

 

[jitter77]

My friend was very smart in the top 10% of the class and he got straight A's and an F on his report card once. The F was in algebra or pre-calc. Some people just dont seem to grasp it. I do not see how dropping alegbra would help anyways. In my school they had regular math, advanced math, and then the remedial math. I do not think the remedial math really touched much in algebra.
On a side note I received an award as top math student, but yet I was never selected for SEAL (advanced learning program) and I never got picked to go to the various math competitions. We even had a guy that got accepted to MIT....I have never understood how I won that award over some others. I took upper level math in college, but kinda hit a wall once I got to differential equations. I liked algebra, calc, and dealing with matrices, etc etc, but differential equations was mostly about proofs. I absolutely hated proofs in geometry and differential equations.

 

[Steeltime]

Boy, that's a strawman argument if there's ever been one.

You realize university education is free (or very low cost) in countries like Germany, France, Denmark, Finland, Norway, Sweden, Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Italy, Spain, etc.

Must be a bunch of dumb ************* in those countries, with their dumbed-down "free" higher education.

The greatest universities in the world, by nearly every relevant measure, are Oxford, Cambridge, Princeton, Harvard, Yale, MIT, Berkley, Cal-Tech, Stanford, Columbia, Cornell, Penn, Imperial College (London), McGill (Canada), and University of Toronto.

Hmmm ... those universities seem to share a trait. What can it be, what can it be. I graduated college before majors with the word "studies" even existed, so I should know this one. Let's see ...

Oh yeah, none of those universities is in a country with "free education."

Just coincidence, right, Tibs?

 

[deljzc]

TIbs.. if you really don't think the quality of college education will go down if the federal government gets involved and starts paying the bills, you're a lot dumber than I thought.

You're as blind in your Sanders love as any Trump supporter here.

 

[Supersteeler]

Oh and if they fail simple Algebra, let's just give them a hall pass and directions to the Welfare Office. It would tell me they don't want to learn and be a productive member of society.

Whoa....easy there sport. I was a D student in Algebra and came fairly close to failing it in high school. Never took Geometry or any other Advanced Math course in my life. My career interests didn't dictate that I should. It certainly didn't stop me from getting into college where I earned my Bachelor's degree nor did it stop me from getting into Grad school where I earned my Masters degree (Summa Cum Laude - 4.0 GPA no less) and won't stop me from most likely going through a PhD program at some point before I die.

Everybody is not good at everything nor should they be expected to be. I never was any good at abstract Math past the four basic functions and I guess I never saw any value in it that interested me for my career so maybe that was part of the problem. I still have no idea why I need to solve for X or what good it will do for me in my life. As I said I haven't been asked to do it in 25 years so I'm guessing it's never going to happen. Maybe I was onto something when I was in high school after all.

On the other hand, give me a topic to write about and I'll whip you out a coherent 20 page essay in a day. It's where my strength is. My college roommate was was a Math genius and a Computer Science major. He took and excelled at the most advanced Math courses the college offered. When it came time to write a term paper for any of his non Math classes, he was completely hopeless. Guess who he asked to help him write those papers every time? This guy right here. No subject area should be the "Be all, end all" to determine if somebody is capable of being a successful person.

Be careful about judging people off of such a specific criteria because you will underestimate a lot of people in life.

 

[GRBman]

I'm with you Supersteeler... I was terrible at math as well, barely passed college-level Algebra. BUT when it came to Business Calc, Macro and Micro economics, statistics, and other applied math courses, I passed with ease. To me, I guess, it has more to do with the application of the math than the raw theoretical.

I'm also an expert user of Microsoft Excel, people think that I'm a math wiz because of that...I'm not, I became excellent with Excel because i SUCK at math. Writing Excel formulas is writing sentences.

Now, for those on here saying "I've never used Algebra in my life"... you have, you just do it in the back of your mind. The skill is the skill...any time you project a home run total, or a batting average, or when you look at TD projections for the rest of the season, you're doing Algebra. You're not doing quadratic equations mind you, but you are doing Algebra...

Remember this scene from the movie "Big?"

SCENE 62

JOSH: All right, let's say Larry Bird is going to score 10 points in the first quarter.

BOY: Okay?

JOSH: How many is he going to score in the whole game?

BOY: That's easy, that's 40 points.

JOSH: Probably. Okay. And that's algebra.

 

[Supersteeler]

I'm with you Supersteeler... I was terrible at math as well, barely passed college-level Algebra. BUT when it came to Business Calc, Macro and Micro economics, statistics, and other applied math courses, I passed with ease. To me, I guess, it has more to do with the application of the math than the raw theoretical.

I'm also an expert user of Microsoft Excel, people think that I'm a math wiz because of that...I'm not, I became excellent with Excel because i SUCK at math. Writing Excel formulas is writing sentences.

Now, for those on here saying "I've never used Algebra in my life"... you have, you just do it in the back of your mind. The skill is the skill...any time you project a home run total, or a batting average, or when you look at TD projections for the rest of the season, you're doing Algebra. You're not doing quadratic equations mind you, but you are doing Algebra...

Remember this scene from the movie "Big?"

Nah, calculating a batting average is nothing more than long division with decimals, not an Algebraic formula. Like you, I got an A in College Statistics with my eyes closed and it made perfect sense to me. Why? I guess as opposed to Algebra and it's abstract concepts that don't have a regular application in my life personally, Statistics is Math based on concrete every day usage. I don't do well in things that I don't see a real purpose for. If I was in a career that dealt with Algebraic concepts on a regular basis I supposed I would feel differently.

 

[Steel Vanguard]

Civics and critical thinking are far more important.

Most people never use algebra. Calculators and computers do the math for most people.

But, of course, the Religious Right would never allow critical thinking to be taught in school. You can't have the sheep questioning the Shepard.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Not surprisingly Obama has failed at both civics and critical thinking, unless you take the position that he has been purposely working against the country.

 

[DBS1970]

Civics and critical thinking are far more important.

Most people never use algebra. Calculators and computers do the math for most people.

But, of course, the Religious Right would never allow critical thinking to be taught in school. You can't have the sheep questioning the Shepard.

Mathematics is critical thinking.