Which of these things can any if us change. I'm not asking for perfection I d just not prefer a lifetime appointment to a guy who won championships with another coaches talent and leftover coaches
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It seems like with podcasts and media and the reality TV pulling back the veil with this generation we are certainly starting to see more of a focus on Tomlin the person or Tomlin the man. After so long together, a good percentage of the Fanbase seems wed to him at this point for better or for worse. And I think there is at least an unconscious effort to trumpet his likable or desirable personality traits as a counterpoint to his increasingly watered down résumé that gets more and more diluted every year.
I think that’s why we are seeing a lot more of these puff pieces or puff stories out there about him.
It’s almost like because we can no longer be proud of his postseason record, Let’s virtue signal about what a great man he is and What a special coach we are blessed to have.
Honestly I’d take a Jimmy Johnson type ahole right now if it meant winning playoff games and Super Bowls!
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Yeah, like his coaching tree is superb. Who? Kippy Brown? Plus his 3 SB were built on pre Free Agency. The guy divorced his wife after starting coaching Dallas because he purportedly wanted 100% focus. He quit coaching because of burnout, but also no one wanted to work with him. He got his cushy Fox job, so he didn't need to.
Gheez, it’s fine to want Tomlin gone, everyone has their opinions. But to make a statement like wanting Johnson instead is laughable. Opinions are all they are, unless there is someone on here who will publish their CV and it includes professional football coach experience, no one can tell Tomlin “I can do better“. Every year is a reset for all coaches and franchises. Plain and simple. Tomlin will have to show what he can do with a lot of youthful players. That’s for sure. If he is successful in getting something out of this group, would be curious how many still will have the same opinion.
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Well put. All I'm saying is it's not like the guy has no coaching skills or he's the worst. He has some very good qualities. I just feel like the organization has really over reached some things here and put way too many eggs in that basket. Ad to me the idea that the guy is a great tactician or teacher of technique is simply false. We will see what Flores does with the linebackers this year. And to me I expect substantial improvement. And to me there is the proof there. To me Tomlin solves problems with talent injections in the off season. Not by teaching guys better like he claimed in the video.
So I see no one wants to touch that rumor with a ten-foot pole. Interesting.
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Fickle is the mob Ike, Coach Tomlin does better (play off win(s)) and a lot will be forgotten.
It's like that with all coaches, win and in but lose and out. Tomlin has been able to circumvent the lose and out part for a long, gauranteed time due to how this franchise does busines.
Can he do better, YES................. Can he do worse, YES....................... Fickle is the MOB (movie Gladiator).
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Oh I know how fickle the mob can be Drink. We all partake in the practice. Especially against the players. What I’m talking about is the model that has been used since Dan Rooney started it. Stability from the top promotes the drive of individuals towards the team‘s success. It works, and will continue to do so, until such time smarter heads than ours deems it doesn’t. The comments I’ve made is just in reference to philosophical differences of how the coach gets his team to win. It isn’t as easy as just saying “he sucks, end of story get him out of here”.
Obviously I set the standard with Chuck Noll. But I know of course he didn’t have they complications of the modern NFL. We have no idea how he would have done in this era. But I know the mid to late eighties the clubs were just a shell of his work throughout the seventies and early eighties. I was hopeful as a fan, but knew change was needed. Dan Rooney probably held on to Chuck longer than necessary out of respect.
All the negatives (and the positives) towards Tomlin from us fans are most of the time anecdotal but twenty years ago, the same things were being harped about with Cowher. Chin is revered by most Steeler fans (I among them), but man, for the most part everyone was tired of always being close, but not getting to the show. On this freaking board back then, hell even in the late nineties, there were those would say “I‘d rather we sucked *** like Detroit than keep butting our head against what Cowher brings….close but no cigar“. The board had the same complaints that is being mentioned now. Doesn’t know X/Os (which is laughable), offense is to predictable (Chin didn’t call plays either), the D breaks down to much (like no other teams defense had lulls). There were still some folks wanting Cowher gone after winning XL, saying it was all Ben.
It’s all a matter of perception, unfortunately us posters on this board think they are right and all who disagree the thought are wrong. It would sure be easier if we all thought this was third grade again and it’s as simple as it was then. But the reality is it isn’t. Too many other factors involved. Injuries, the cap, coordinators, the cheats, circumstances beyond our control (Goodell with COVID protocols). Other coaches players, coaching ability, leadership, challenges record, oh my God, how did Dan and Art screw up so badly with hiring this coach? He's only brought us the same amout of SB appearances and wins as Cowher did. So yeah Drink, this board is as fickled as a third grade class sometimes.
How can you say this if you watched the interview? He is comfortable being uncomfortable. He's not seeking comfort through his accomplishments. That is the MO of this coach.
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Excellent post Ike and I thank you for how you expressed what 99% is being said.
I'm glad I got to use the "gladiator" referrence and you definately had a great follow up.
I can take him or leave him (Coach Tomlin) but he has both positive and negative atributes which is what makes him human. Can he do better, hell yes but also realize he can do worse as well.
I'm glad I am not in charge of hire and fire although I'd love to be the owner of the PITTSBURGH STEELERS, just sayiN.
We as the "mob" obviously can't tell Art II what to do but we can fickle our way around this message board..... right or wrong.
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I'm stealing that, love it
deleted most of your post out of respect for band width and tldr people.
Cowher was close ,, so often.. I could see the end game on the horizon. Then he got a qb and he got there. I cant see **** from here.
I have no hope and question my fandom. Thats just me, but i dont think im alone.
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Thanks Drink, and I respect your opinion on Tomlin. I don’t disagree at all that he needs to do better at some things. All coaches do. What kills me is the ideology that some believe they have it figured out what it takes. IMO the closest Coach that was perfect was Lombardi, and he didn’t win all the time. But he was a leader of men on his teams. In addition every member of his team would tell you he was their leader as well. Probably because he was one from the greatest generation, but that’s just my humble opinion.
BTW, one of my all favorite movies, so good to know I was on the same wavelength.
”A man once told me, Death smiles at all of us. The only thing a man can do is smile back.”
Is that unfair to think he doesn't know X and O's? He is relinquishing his defensive play calling duties never took over offensive play calling even when it was atrocious. Struggles to win playoff encounters. I get he is a good coach and a good motivator, but I don't think it is unfair to question certain areas and identify them as weaknesses based on outcomes. I feel if he would have excelled in this area they would be more competitive in the playoffs. Not necessarily winning every matchup but keeping the outcome closer as in a result less embarrassing blowouts.
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Coach Tomlin definately needs to be held accountable in respects of what he does less. ability wise. Him being a lesser Xs & Os type coach is one of the weaknesses.. How do we explain high passing attack against a lower ranked rush defense ? Non field adjustments when our ILB is covering their BEST receiver consistantly?
Any and all coaches are scrutinized in respect of what we, the fans, feel we have the answer to, Tomlin is no exception. The scrutiny from here is expanded greater and magnified glass keener here all because we are so PASSIONATE of our beloved STEELERS.
Tomlin gets no exception and those answers we seem to flaunt are just that, our percieved answer. We only get to answer with what we get to see through media / game tape / and other sources we obtain so we have some input but NOT the whole picture.
LIFE of the fan 101.
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Any and all coaches are scrutinized in respect of what we, the fans, feel we have the answer to, Tomlin is no exception. The scrutiny from here is expanded greater and magnified glass keener here all because we are so PASSIONATE of our beloved STEELERS.
Tomlin gets no exception and those answers we seem to flaunt are just that, our percieved answer. We only get to answer with what we get to see through media / game tape / and other sources we obtain so we have some input but NOT the whole picture.
LIFE of the fan 101.
Salute the nation
Rumors about Steeler players or coaches started by people who want them gone should never be addressed or do you forget the false rumor about Kordell started by a Jacksonville fan to get Steeler fans riled up. Every Kordell hater in the world latched onto that one.
This is such a cyclical topic that predates the internet and message boards. I can remember shortly after winning 4 SBs there were a subset of people were calling for Chuck Noll to be fired. Bill Cowher was perhaps the most divisive I have seen fans about a HC. You had more vocal fans wanting Bill Cowher fired than MT. They call his coaching style Marty Ball. One thing has proved true - the Steeler way of keeping stability since 1970 (AFC/NFC merger) has made the Steelers the winningest franchise in the NFL - in regular season, in playoffs, and in SBs. I also love how conveniently people forget the severity of injuries the Steelers played with in some of the most recent playoff losses.
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Slash, you know more than most that we can think whatever we want. Lord knows there have been some opinions lofted at you from those who just love to hear themselves talk. And with that we all collectively sigh….boneheaded. I get it. We are all frustrated, we fans of the franchise have raised the bar on what is successful. At the same time, the league continues to make it easier on the offensive side of the ball.
Thinking Tomlin doesn’t know X & O‘s? Thats more likely than not DOA. There are only 32 NFL Head Coaching positions in the world. The guy has been one for 15 years, He was also a D’Coord, and hired by Tony Dungy. Someone who knows his X & Os. I would think it’s pretty disingenuous to even contemplate someone at the highest level of competition in the sport is getting by using smoke and mirrors. Does he has weaknesses? Obviously, he does. Just like all of his contemporaries, Andy Reid, Sean Payton, Pete Carroll. Reid and Payton are offensive minded, and hired someone else to “handle“ the defense.
No, I remember the Kordell rumor. But why would some random Jacksonville fan give that much of a **** about riling up Steelers fans to start it? And if a rumor is indeed completely false, shouldn't it be addressed as such?
What I don't remember is anybody wanting Tomlin gone way back in 2013, when the Seven Springs rumor first surfaced.
I brought up the Jacksonville fan because I was on the CBS AOL Sportsboard when he started the rumor, he was a troll saying tons of stupid stuff like that about every Steeler. Kordell was the only item that gained traction because of the dislike for him. A rumor is just that, a rumor. The fact that Seven Springs rumor came and went almost immediately tells me there was 0 (zero) truth to it, so why address it.
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That rumor of Kordell was started by someone in one of the clubs in Pittsburgh in either 97 or 98. He was struggling for a few games and it occurred after a 3 INT game. Not sure when that was, but some ******* said something about Kordell getting caught by cops with another guy(s) and the police buried it or covered it up. It got picked up and ran with the rumor mill the more he struggled. Pitt PD said there was no record of the incident. The rumor dogged him well after he stopped playing and got married, etc. Some radio guy revisited it on air while interviewing him and I think Kordell sued the guy.
Bettis had a pretty big one too, buy a barfly and her boyfriend. Concocting a story that she and Bettis had rendezvoused in his car. From which her boyfriend blackmailed Jerome. I think the girl confessed and both she and her pimp got arrested for it. In any case that type of stuff (rumor games and or false accusations for grabbing settlement $$) is for low brained individuals.
I'll stop you right there... He doesn't (Matt Canada).
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This is Matt's season for us to find out. Currently he is the biggest concern on the STEELERS team.!
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The
We've just gone 5 years without a playoff win. I'd still take Prime Jimmy over the next 5 years vs this Tomlin. It's not a nomination for Church Elder of Deacon. We know Jimmy was a prick. But he would tighten this team up.
The point is that with the right talent and roster, Prime Johnson will get more out of that roster over a 5 year period than Prime Tomlin. Because Jimmy was tighter on the details and discipline. See Aikman's lamentations about Switzer for the difference. Tomlin's teams have been sloppy on the whole. Unbuttoned.
We've just gone 5 years without a playoff win. I'd still take Prime Jimmy over the next 5 years vs this Tomlin. It's not a nomination for Church Elder of Deacon. We know Jimmy was a prick. But he would tighten this team up.
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By the time the rumor showed up here in SC, the story was he got caught in a car with YT.