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Prediction for the off season

dumb ****, comparing a middling coach like Tomlin to the greatest coach in NFL history shows your absolute stupidity and Tomlin nut hugging.


Did Noll have a franchise QB for the last 10 years of his career like the mediocre Tomlin has had for his entire career, dumb ****

Has Tomlin ever built a team from scratch NO., has he run down the great team he was handed YES

You are acting like I disagree with anything you just said, which in my opinion makes you the dumb ****. As I said before, the desire to prove you are right and I am wrong so you can stroke your e-peen has warped your common sense, if you have any.
 
No you are a dumb **** because you lack the rudimentary understanding of basic football, coaching and cause and effect. Noll was 12-30 his first 3 years rebuilding the worst team in the NFL and then he has more playoff wins, more playoff appearances and more Super Bowl wins in his first 8 years than the idiot Tomlin did even though he was handed a Super Bowl winning roster and franchise QB. If you are too stupid to keep comparing the mediocre Tomlin to the great Noll then keep proving you are the dumb **** everyone reading this thread agrees you to be.
 
First of all, it's pretty disingenuous (that'a a fancy word that means you're lying) that you just discard those inconvenient first three years and say that Noll "won four Super Bowls in his first eight years."

And what did he do after the first 11 years? Was he... on a decline?
 
Dumb ****, I never said he won 4 Super Bowls in his 1st 8 years, I said even with rebuilding the worst team in football he still won 2 Super Bowls in his 1st 8 years, dumb ****.


Those 'INCONVENIENT first 3 years he used to build the greatest team in NFL history , you know by drafting Greene, Bradshaw, Greenwood, HAM, ETC., dumb ****
 
Oh we'rre STILL playing the great comparison game?? Jupiter, its not an apples-to-apples discussion, give it a rest
 
First of all, it's pretty disingenuous (that'a a fancy word that means you're lying) that you just discard those inconvenient first three years and say that Noll "won four Super Bowls in his first eight years."

And what did he do after the first 11 years? Was he... on a decline?

yeah dumb ****, how dare he not win any more Super Bowls than the record 4 he already has you selfish dumb ****.
 
Oh we'rre STILL playing the great comparison game?? Jupiter, its not an apples-to-apples discussion, give it a rest

No this dumb **** is now comparing the mediocre Tomlin to the greatest head coach in NFL history.
 
Oh we'rre STILL playing the great comparison game?? Jupiter, its not an apples-to-apples discussion, give it a rest

I've never said it was an apples-to-apples comparison. I've said from the very beginning that it's clear that Tomlin is a poor coach who is running what was a good team into the ground, yet his statistics are inexplicably better than Noll's or Cowher's. All I'm saying is that those figures have got to weigh into the Rooneys' evaluation of how to deal with Tomlin. If they were to can him based on the body of work to date, it would be entirely uncharacteristic compared to the previous 35 years. It's not my fault if steelprick insists on telling me that I'm saying things that I'm not.
 
No they are not INEXPLICABLY better than Noll's or Cowher's . You refuse to acknowledge Noll took over the worst franchise in the NFL and he was 1-13, 5-9 and 6-8 before the playoffs and Super Bowls came at an unprecedented rate. Cowher also took over a poor team and went to the playoffs his first 6 years without a franchise QB like Tomlin was handed. You are too big a dumb **** to understand context and real football.
 
So not winning a Super Bowl in 13 years (it was 12 years, by the way) and getting to the playoffs once in 8 years is excusable due to "capital and gravitas" but missing the playoffs for a couple of years means Tomlin should be taken out behind the practice facility and shot. Got it....

Don't you know?: You have to get some "*****" in there to make a point.

And a few "dumbs" before them will give your argument even more oomph.

Jeez...
 
I've never said it was an apples-to-apples comparison. I've said from the very beginning that it's clear that Tomlin is a poor coach who is running what was a good team into the ground, yet his statistics are inexplicably better than Noll's or Cowher's. All I'm saying is that those figures have got to weigh into the Rooneys' evaluation of how to deal with Tomlin. If they were to can him based on the body of work to date, it would be entirely uncharacteristic compared to the previous 35 years. It's not my fault if steelprick insists on telling me that I'm saying things that I'm not.

do you think that the rooneys will also consider the fact that this team is trending downward and the overall makeup of the team is not nearly what it was 5-6 years ago? do you think that the Rooneys will take into consideration that this team no longer has any sort of identity, and is as soft as they've ever been in the last 30 yrs? Or will it just be wins vs. losses and everything will be hunky-dory with tomlin for the next decade? I would like to think that the Rooneys are smarter than that.
 
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As great as Noll was, Lombardi has to be ahead of him on the all-time list.

Just one dumb ****'s opinion.

Really ? Lombardi coached in an era where there were only 12 teams and to win a championship you won ONE playoff game, Noll had a much tougher league to win it all.
 
do you think that the rooneys will also consider the fact that this team is trending downward and the overall makeup of the team is not nearly what it was 5-6 years ago? do you think that the Rooneys will take into consideration that this team no longer has any sort of identity, and is as soft as they've ever been in the last 30 yrs? Or will it just be wins vs. losses and everything will be hunky-dory with tomlin for the next decade? I would like to think that the Rooneys are smarter than that.

Absolutely, the Rooneys will consider LOTS of things.

The bottom line is, whether you like Tomlin or not, speaking from a statistical perspective he has a very impressive record, and that fact is not likely to be lost on the Rooneys. I'm not making any judgments about whether he took over a Super Bowl team and is running it into the ground, just like I'm not making any judgments about how Noll took over a terrible team and built it into a dynasty - I'm only trying to make a point about statistical performance. There are numerous other factors that go into both of those things, such as the fact that Noll had the benefit of some very high draft picks to help him build that team, while Tomlin has had the mixed blessing of running a team with a record that typically puts it in the bottom half of the draft order, quite often very near the bottom. We all know there's a huge gap in talent between the first 10 picks (most of whom are immediate starters) and the last 10 picks in the first round (many of whom are busts). The down side of being a winning team in the age of NFL parity is that sustaining that performance over many seasons through the draft is harder to do when you are not a big player in free agency. The Rooneys made that bed and have to sleep in it, and I'm sure they're aware of that, and it will factor into their considerations as well.

I think in all of this discussion, people want to take their opinion (that Tomlin is a bad coach, which I agree with), and say that it is a "trend" without substantiating that claim with objective evidence. For instance, a lot of people feel like Tomlin is terrible at using challenges, but he's better than 50% (26-23) over his career (in fact, coming into this season, he LED all active coaches in success rate - http://misterelevant.com/2014/08/12/the-coaching-challenge-challenge-flag-success-rates/). According to PFR, Belicheat is 39-58. John Harbaugh is 31-38. Jim Harbaugh is 12-22. But don't let facts cloud anyone's judgment that he's terrible at challenges.

And I'll ask you the same question I asked before... with two consecutive 8-8 seasons, if we go 9-7 this year, is that "trending down" or "trending up?" How are you defining "trend?" I realize that the Rooneys want their team to be winners, and win championships, but I would guess that they are mainly motivated by profits, and as long as people don't stop buying tickets and merchandise, they don't see the same "trend" as you and I. Tomlin's record is not a direct reflection of his coaching ability, but the same problems that the team is having (poor drafting, strings of mediocre seasons without playoff appearances) have been ridden out by Noll and Cowher as well, because the Rooneys are not known to panic and make drastic changes.

None of this is a defense of Tomlin's coaching ability, which I've always felt is suspect at best. But I don't see how the Rooneys will break character and fire him despite the fact that, although the team has missed the playoffs the last several years, he still hasn't had a losing record. With parity, injuries and a host of other factors both in and out of the control of the coach, I see plenty that causes me as a fan to say "He's a bum, fire his ***." But I can also step back and look at it dispassionately, and recognize that, all things considered, there isn't a strong enough pattern of poor performance to suggest that the Rooneys will do anything other than stay the course. They didn't panic when Cowher put up a 6-10 season. They didn't blink when Noll went four years without a playoff appearance in the 80s. Tomlin, against all our hopes and dreams, will weather this storm and will coach the Steelers until he decides to retire, or until this team strings together some truly abysmal seasons in a row, not just some 8-8 or 9-7 seasons. That's the pinnacle of Steeler privilege - with the franchise's history of championships, we look at an 8-8 season as unmitigated disaster, while lots of other teams would love to do even that well on a regular basis. So I think, all things considered, no matter what my personal feelings are about Tomlin, it's way premature to say that his performance has worn out his welcome with the ownership.
 
Really ? Lombardi coached in an era where there were only 12 teams and to win a championship you won ONE playoff game, Noll had a much tougher league to win it all.

That's why the Super Bowl trophy is called the "Noll."
 
TMC will come back and show you newbies how lame you really are...
 
Like I've said before, playoff team to SB winning team to SB losing team to losing to Tebow in playoffs to no playoffs and 8-8 two years running.
The arrow would seem to be pointing down.
Oh, and except for WR and RB they can't draft for ****.
 
Absolutely, the Rooneys will consider LOTS of things.

The bottom line is, whether you like Tomlin or not, speaking from a statistical perspective he has a very impressive record, and that fact is not likely to be lost on the Rooneys. I'm not making any judgments about whether he took over a Super Bowl team and is running it into the ground, just like I'm not making any judgments about how Noll took over a terrible team and built it into a dynasty - I'm only trying to make a point about statistical performance. There are numerous other factors that go into both of those things, such as the fact that Noll had the benefit of some very high draft picks to help him build that team, while Tomlin has had the mixed blessing of running a team with a record that typically puts it in the bottom half of the draft order, quite often very near the bottom. We all know there's a huge gap in talent between the first 10 picks (most of whom are immediate starters) and the last 10 picks in the first round (many of whom are busts). The down side of being a winning team in the age of NFL parity is that sustaining that performance over many seasons through the draft is harder to do when you are not a big player in free agency. The Rooneys made that bed and have to sleep in it, and I'm sure they're aware of that, and it will factor into their considerations as well.

I think in all of this discussion, people want to take their opinion (that Tomlin is a bad coach, which I agree with), and say that it is a "trend" without substantiating that claim with objective evidence. For instance, a lot of people feel like Tomlin is terrible at using challenges, but he's better than 50% (26-23) over his career (in fact, coming into this season, he LED all active coaches in success rate - http://misterelevant.com/2014/08/12/the-coaching-challenge-challenge-flag-success-rates/). According to PFR, Belicheat is 39-58. John Harbaugh is 31-38. Jim Harbaugh is 12-22. But don't let facts cloud anyone's judgment that he's terrible at challenges.

And I'll ask you the same question I asked before... with two consecutive 8-8 seasons, if we go 9-7 this year, is that "trending down" or "trending up?" How are you defining "trend?" I realize that the Rooneys want their team to be winners, and win championships, but I would guess that they are mainly motivated by profits, and as long as people don't stop buying tickets and merchandise, they don't see the same "trend" as you and I. Tomlin's record is not a direct reflection of his coaching ability, but the same problems that the team is having (poor drafting, strings of mediocre seasons without playoff appearances) have been ridden out by Noll and Cowher as well, because the Rooneys are not known to panic and make drastic changes.

None of this is a defense of Tomlin's coaching ability, which I've always felt is suspect at best. But I don't see how the Rooneys will break character and fire him despite the fact that, although the team has missed the playoffs the last several years, he still hasn't had a losing record. With parity, injuries and a host of other factors both in and out of the control of the coach, I see plenty that causes me as a fan to say "He's a bum, fire his ***." But I can also step back and look at it dispassionately, and recognize that, all things considered, there isn't a strong enough pattern of poor performance to suggest that the Rooneys will do anything other than stay the course. They didn't panic when Cowher put up a 6-10 season. They didn't blink when Noll went four years without a playoff appearance in the 80s. Tomlin, against all our hopes and dreams, will weather this storm and will coach the Steelers until he decides to retire, or until this team strings together some truly abysmal seasons in a row, not just some 8-8 or 9-7 seasons. That's the pinnacle of Steeler privilege - with the franchise's history of championships, we look at an 8-8 season as unmitigated disaster, while lots of other teams would love to do even that well on a regular basis. So I think, all things considered, no matter what my personal feelings are about Tomlin, it's way premature to say that his performance has worn out his welcome with the ownership.


Hell of a post
 
My prediction is Tomlin and Haley stay. DL "retires". I see the Steelers letting Worilds walk or at least test FA since there should be more big name guys this year than last. We resign Ben to a new contract which puts him up there in the top 5 for QB's but cap friendly enough. No big FA acquisitions just a few spot fillers.

Draft goes like this.

RD1- Cedric Ogbuehi OT Texas A&M
I know everyone wants a CB or DE/rush OLB but I just don't think one falls to us since we likely pick in the 20's. Cedric Ogbuehi is quick, agile, and a good technician. After watching Rodgers get 4-7 seconds a snap it made me realize the only games Ben gets 3+ seconds a snap he throws for 6 TDs.

RD2- Hauoli Kikaha OLB/DE Washington
Yes, again I know people are going to be calling for a CB but a good pass rush makes CB look better. Hauoli Kikaha has 18 sacks so far this year. We could really use a few of them.

RD3- Senquez Golson CB Ole Miss
I know he is only 5-9 176lbs but he also has more interceptions than our entire team this year. Drafted as a center fielder Golson plays CB like it and has 9 int's to show for it. In todays no touch NFL you need guys who can break on the ball and catch it. Right now we are lacking that ability.

RD4- Erick Dargan S Michigan St
Not sure what happened to Shamarko but TP isn't getting younger and Mitchell hasn't impressed.

RD5- Quinten Rollins CB Miami(OH)
More of your prototypical sized CB but a bit rough around the edges. Gives us three years of 5th round CB's so maybe one can make the roster! Was a basketball player and only one season at CB put has good athleticism and nice hands.

RD6- Miles Dieffenbach OF PSU
Smart, gritty interior lineman I feel would work well in Munchaks zone scheme.

RD7- Terrance Magee RB LSU
Good between the tackles, north south runner with nice vision, a little wiggles, and enough speed.
 
My prediction is Tomlin and Haley stay. DL "retires". I see the Steelers letting Worilds walk or at least test FA since there should be more big name guys this year than last. We resign Ben to a new contract which puts him up there in the top 5 for QB's but cap friendly enough. No big FA acquisitions just a few spot fillers.

I would re-sign Worilds to a friendly number but I wouldn't get into a bidding war over him. If someone else wants to pay more then let them. Be interesting to see how much any other team wants to pay him.
 
What some you don't seem to understand when making comparisons is that Noll started from scratch and built a dynasty. Cowher pretty much did the same inheriting a Noll team with lots of missing pieces and built it up to a super bowl team. Then in the late 90's early 2000's took a dip in talent but built the team up again to win a super bowl in 2005. Cool Shades has built what? He inherited Cowher's team that got to two more super bowls but this team now belongs solely to him. Need I say more! He has built the worst defense in 30 years for this team.
 
But his record is above the line and since that is what the balchinians like to harp about it must be the only thing that matters.
 
we have two threads discussing the exact same thing (regarding if Tomlin sucks or not)
 
I guess that means it is a popular topic although I believe in one he is the main focus and in the other he is just one facet of the discussion.

dead-horse.gif

But I am thinking you wish to imply the above to this discussion.
 
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