Steelers Release CB Steven Nelson

[topseed]

I keep bringing up the rest of the league because that's what matters. You play against opponents, not against a mirror. You seem to be evaluating the steelers against some ideal roster where a position either has a star player or is deficient. That's just not how it works. No team is like that.

They can't find the next Ogden at 24? They don't need an Ogden, they just need a good player. that;'s the point i'm making to you. Your standard is way too high. I'm not expecting some hall of famer. Maybe they'll get lucky and find one but if they get a guy who plays like Kelvin Beachum, it will be a big upgrade.

This draft class is pretty deep at OT. The steelers do have a very good chance to get a starter at 24, maybe even in Rd 2.

The OL plays as a unit. If you have 3 of 5 guys above the line you should be OK provided the other 2 are terrible. Finney isn't terrible. Chukes and Banner aren't terrible. It will also help if they get a TE that can block some. Vance was awful last year.

OK, you want to talk about the rest of the league...fine. Let's talk about Cleveland. The Browns return a first-team all-pro RT in Conklin. They return second-team all-pros at both guard positions in Bitonio and Teller. They have an accomplished 8-year veteran with 74 career starts at center in Tretter, and a top ten pick in 2020 out of Alabama at LT in Wills.

This isn't some "ideal roster" I invented in my head, it's the starting five for an AFC North rival. That's what I would call a good offensive line. Not what the Steelers plan to trot out there, hoping and praying they pick up a "good" rookie somewhere along the way.

And any OL with 3 "above the line" guys trying to cover for two "terrible" players is not going to be "OK." That's just nonsense. Any NFL defense is going to exploit those holes relentlessly. Well, maybe any defense besides one coached by Tomlin and Butler, that is.

 

[Litos]

OK, you want to talk about the rest of the league...fine. Let's talk about Cleveland. The Browns return a first-team all-pro RT in Conklin. They return second-team all-pros at both guard positions in Bitonio and Teller. They have an accomplished 8-year veteran with 74 career starts at center in Tretter, and a top ten pick in 2020 out of Alabama at LT in Wills.

This isn't some "ideal roster" I invented in my head, it's the starting five for an AFC North rival. That's what I would call a good offensive line. Not what the Steelers plan to trot out there, hoping and praying they pick up a "good" rookie somewhere along the way.

And any OL with 3 "above the line" guys trying to cover for two "terrible" players is not going to be "OK." That's just nonsense. Any NFL defense is going to exploit those holes relentlessly. Well, maybe any defense besides one coached by Tomlin and Butler, that is.

Not fair to compare to a team with a QB on a rookie contract, of course they'll have a lot more money available. How many years of suckitude the browns have had to be in a position to keep taking top talent in the draft?
To have top 10 tackles you gotta draft early and have a lot of cash available to be able to keep them. Let's see after they have to resign mayfield if they can keep that Oline intact.

 

[Drink IRON City]

Not fair to compare to a team with a QB on a rookie contract, of course they'll have a lot more money available. How many years of suckitude the browns have had to be in a position to keep taking top talent in the draft?
To have top 10 tackles you gotta draft early and have a lot of cash available to be able to keep them. Let's see after they have to resign mayfield if they can keep that Oline intact.

ALSO, they won't be restocking using their perinial top ten pick either. It hasn't been that long ago when the had two 1st round HIGH draft picks. When was the last time PITTSBURGH has had a top ten pick ????

18 years ago the got close with a #11

Salute the nation

 

[SteelerInLebanon]

In all honesty i think scheme and play calling might end up mattering more than who is in the game. The play calling last year made the line look far worse Han they actually were and I don’t think a line full of al pros would have helped that **** show of an offense Randy the Sphincter designed. He might have been an ok QB coach but he was terrible at calling plays and disguising his intent. My wife who is a neophyte a football strategy was predicting the plays accurately the whole season. Ben calling the plays was the only time it was better but he was still hamstrung by the personnel packages and installed game plan to a degree. When you are asked to block for quick passes the whole game it is very hard to then try and flip a switch and get in the run blocking mindset. I speak from personal experience. When they would try it would become painfully obvious what was coming and even a poor defense can make a line look bad when they know the play.

As to our current line I think Decastro played hurt most of the year severely hampering his play, Dotson will be a stud if used correctly and was far better in pass pro than I expected. Banner is an unknown but should be a run blocking upgrade over Al and the free agent we signed was an above average starter until he had injury issues with the Colts, he could be better than expected. Center will be our biggest ?

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

If banner plays LT, Ben dont make it past the 3rd game.

 

[SteveA]

this team has enough holes to fill the Albert Hall.

At least we now know how many holes it takes to fill the Albert Hall

 

[F83]

If Dickerson with his long medical history falls to our 3b worth the risk if not the small school Wisconsin water kid sounds good like a under the rader Dotson. As far as cb butler going to az hope we try to trade for Gilmore, I think the vet they have in mind is McKenzie Alexander as they took a hard look at home before settling for burns. Would not mind Dre Kirkpatrick either or who knows now Nelson sees what the market is we could bring him and Vince after the draft

 

[slashsteel]

If Dickerson with his long medical history falls to our 3b worth the risk if not the small school Wisconsin water kid sounds good like a under the rader Dotson. As far as cb butler going to az hope we try to trade for Gilmore, I think the vet they have in mind is McKenzie Alexander as they took a hard look at home before settling for burns. Would not mind Dre Kirkpatrick either or who knows now Nelson sees what the market is we could bring him and Vince after the draft

Alexander's signed with a team he isn't a free agent anymore.

 

[topseed]

Not fair to compare to a team with a QB on a rookie contract, of course they'll have a lot more money available. How many years of suckitude the browns have had to be in a position to keep taking top talent in the draft?
To have top 10 tackles you gotta draft early and have a lot of cash available to be able to keep them. Let's see after they have to resign mayfield if they can keep that Oline intact.

It is fair to compare them.

I was posed this question by tapeANaspirin2it: "Again i ask, which NFL team has 5 above average starters AND quality depth behind it? If that is your standard for a "good" OL then prepare to be disappointed."

So, yes, I would once again declare that the Browns' OL would meet my definition as a "good" offensive line, regardless of how they got to Cleveland, or if their backups can provide quality depth or not.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

OK, you want to talk about the rest of the league...fine. Let's talk about Cleveland. The Browns return a first-team all-pro RT in Conklin. They return second-team all-pros at both guard positions in Bitonio and Teller. They have an accomplished 8-year veteran with 74 career starts at center in Tretter, and a top ten pick in 2020 out of Alabama at LT in Wills.

This isn't some "ideal roster" I invented in my head, it's the starting five for an AFC North rival. That's what I would call a good offensive line. Not what the Steelers plan to trot out there, hoping and praying they pick up a "good" rookie somewhere along the way.

And any OL with 3 "above the line" guys trying to cover for two "terrible" players is not going to be "OK." That's just nonsense. Any NFL defense is going to exploit those holes relentlessly. Well, maybe any defense besides one coached by Tomlin and Butler, that is.

You managed to pick 1 team that has a ton invested in the OL because their QB is on a rookie deal. They got Conklin because the Titans couldn't afford to keep him. The browns have had a shitload of top picks in recent years.

The Browns have amassed a lot of talent with those high picks but the bills will come due soon.

The Raiders just got rid of their C Rodney Hudson because he was too expensive. They had too much tied up in the OL.

Seattle had a great OL too a few years ago, then they had to start paying WIlson and some other stars and the OL went downhill fast.

Tretter is a 4th rounder and they just drafted Jedrick Wills in the 1st last year. So as i have been saying, what if the steelers draft a starting LT in the 1st and then find themselves a Tretter in Rd 4? That would fix the OL pretty quickly. That's the only point i'm making is that this OL can be fixed in 1 offseason.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

It is fair to compare them.

I was posed this question by tapeANaspirin2it: "Again i ask, which NFL team has 5 above average starters AND quality depth behind it? If that is your standard for a "good" OL then prepare to be disappointed."

So, yes, I would once again declare that the Browns' OL would meet my definition as a "good" offensive line, regardless of how they got to Cleveland, or if their backups can provide quality depth or not.

Fine, so then i guess you figure there is 1 good OL in the NFL and the rest are just below standard. Yet somehow teams win a lot of games without having great OLs.

 

[F83]

Whose remaining I would focus on these guys
Norman
Bouye
Sherman
Dennard
Kirkpatrick
Hayward

 

[topseed]

You managed to pick 1 team that has a ton invested in the OL because their QB is on a rookie deal. They got Conklin because the Titans couldn't afford to keep him. The browns have had a shitload of top picks in recent years.

The Browns have amassed a lot of talent with those high picks but the bills will come due soon.

The Raiders just got rid of their C Rodney Hudson because he was too expensive. They had too much tied up in the OL.

Seattle had a great OL too a few years ago, then they had to start paying WIlson and some other stars and the OL went downhill fast.

Tretter is a 4th rounder and they just drafted Jedrick Wills in the 1st last year. So as i have been saying, what if the steelers draft a starting LT in the 1st and then find themselves a Tretter in Rd 4? That would fix the OL pretty quickly. That's the only point i'm making is that this OL can be fixed in 1 offseason.

Yes, I managed to pick an excellent offensive line with better than average players (including, in fact, 3 all-pros) at every position, even after you insisted that they don't exist in the rest of the league. Imagine that. And I'm sure I could find another good offensive line if I had the time to research the other 30 NFL teams, but you'll just make up more bullshit yeah-buts about how they won't be around for long.

Sure, if they add a quality left tackle and a solid center of Tretter's caliber, the line would improve. Of course it would.

Fine, so then i guess you figure there is 1 good OL in the NFL and the rest are just below standard. Yet somehow teams win a lot of games without having great OLs.

No. As I mentioned, I'm quite certain that there are other good NFL lines. I started with looking at teams in the AFC North, and I didn't have to research any further. However, I did notice that Green Bay also had two OL all-pros last year. And there are surely other below standard lines too -- similar to the Steelers.

 

[Steeltime]

If things were that bad for the Steelers... why is this a problem?

Because some - quite a few - think that the 2021 Steelers should draft to make the team a championship contender this season, and not draft a QB since Ben. I am pointing out that those who think this team is 2-3 upgrades away from being a championship team are not being realistic. At all. In any respect.

Isn't the way you improve a team by replacing starters, especially underperforming ones. Given how bad the running game was, how is losing the starting running back an issue? Also, according to this fourm the LT and C you are complaining about losing weren't performing anyway.

You miss my point completely. My point is that the team is not very good. They have several star players - namely Watt, Fitzpatrick, Heyward, Tuitt, Ben. They are a long way from being a championship team. A. LONG. WAY.

So start improving, not pretending 2021 is going to be a "final run." Also, of course the point is to upgrade the positions where the starters left, but in the real world, replacing six starters never leads to six better players, particularly when several of them are from premium positions (LT, CB, OLB/pass rusher) and the Steelers have no cap room for FA and pick 24 out of 32 to find draft replacements.

Get it?

The Steelers have also replaced the OC and O-line coach which may more than make up for any losses on the offensive side of the ball (although I'm not convinced as it seems regardless of who the OC has been, the Steeler Nation complaints don't seem to change much, so possibly the Offensive issues aren't entirely at the hands of the OC).

Great. Another OC who is responsible for the failure to win a playoff game since January 15, 2017 (following the 2016 season). Awesome. That stupid OC is to blame, just like the prior OC who oversaw a terrible offense that scored a mere 42 points in the January 14, 2018 playoff loss. Hoo-boy, we just keep firing these OC's, eventually we'll find one to blame for ****** playoff performances, teams that collapse in the second half, teams that lose to dogshit like the Not-Redskins and Bungles with the great Ryan Finley at QB. Damn OC's. We all know THEY run the team and should take responsibility for their record of underperformance.

It's not like there's another guy who can be blamed.