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Target Down 5 Billion Since Embracing Trans Bathroom Policy

Truth.

Pretty powerful write-up from a rape survivor. Her views. Of course, the heartless will discount her.

http://thefederalist.com/2015/11/23/a-rape-survivor-speaks-out-about-transgender-bathrooms/

She is using bathrooms alongside transgender people right now...and lesbians...no one is screening them, for the condition of their genitals or for their intentions...the only difference is she doesn't know who they are and isn't be aware of their presence.
 
Obama's advisor on Federal Bathroom Policy:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/6k2FkUF41AA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

:beer:
 
She is using bathrooms alongside transgender people right now...and lesbians...no one is screening them, for the condition of their genitals or for their intentions...the only difference is she doesn't know who they are and isn't be aware of their presence.

Which isn't the point and hasn't been since the beginning of this thread. She has no issues with transgenders. She herself said that. She has a problem with predators. And with this law, that opens the door to those predators. Makes it easier for them to commit their crimes. And she's right. And she's afraid, correctly so.
 
How urgently is a cop supposed to respond to that call? Especially after he humiliated both himself and the all-state softball player because some over-zealous confused granny panicked.

Can you once, please, not answer a question with a question? We've been down this path a thousand times.

How important is a life lost when a small girl is stabbed in a dressing room, in a situation where people who were suspicious failed to raise the alarm or say anything (like the neighbors of the San Bernadino Muslim terrorists)?

So you're saying a person's feelings usurp the safety of another person's well-being?

Isn't the old adage, better to be safe than sorry?

If it saves just one life, isn't that worth it?

Why do you hate women?
 
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From our rape survivor - she pointed out a few good additional anecdotes:

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/cross-dressing-man-arrested-for-exposure-at-walmar/nQddG/

Cross-dressing man arrested for exposure at Walmart

A 51-year-old man wearing women's clothing was arrested for allegedly undressing in front of children at Walmart.

Police say Norwood Smith Burnes, 51, of Rome, has a long record of indecent exposure and was on probation for public indecency when the latest incident occurred in the women's bathroom at Walmart in Calhoun, the Rome News-Tribune reported.

Burnes was in "stages of undress while on the stone floor and would do this in the presence of several young children," witnesses told police. When police arrived, they found Burnes wearing a short skirt and jacket, black leather coat, high heels, red nail polish, green eye shadow and jewelry.

-----------------------------------------------------------

This anecdote strikes home in this thread. Read on...

http://komonews.com/archive/police-man-in-bra-and-wig-found-in-womens-bathroom

Police: Man in bra and wig found in women's bathroom

EVERETT, Wash. - A man wearing a bra and wig was arrested Friday after he was spotted in a women's bathroom at Everett Community College, police said.

Officers responded to the scene at about 1:30 p.m. after a college staff member said she saw the man go into the women's rest room and alerted security personnel.

An investigation found that the suspect had gone into the rest room while two women were inside, according to a police report. The women were later interviewed and said they had no idea that the man was there.

When police interviewed the man, he claimed that he had gone into the bathroom to use the facilities.

But the investigating officer noted that the man was wearing a wig and bra. A search also turned up a pair of woman's panties in his front pocket, according to the police report.

The man, later identified as Taylor J. Buehler, 18, of Lake Stevens, was placed under arrest.

He admitted to officers that he was the suspect in an earlier voyeurism incident at Everett Community College on Monday, police said.

In the earlier incident, he said he took a shower in the girls' locker room for sexual gratification, acccording to the police report.

This was in 2012. Antennae went up when a man entered a woman's restroom. The resultant behavior: Call security. Result: Predator apprehended.

This is exactly what we've been saying is the problem with this new wave to support 700,000 people, a scant portion of our society. 700,000 feelings are protected while the safety, privacy and well being of the rest are put at risk. Brilliant.

Here's how the Taylor Buehler situation would be handled now: Taylor enters woman's bathroom. Antennae may or may not go up. But..fear of being PC and fear of offending someone and fear of being labeled a bigot and fear of being sued will lead suspicious people to turn away and not say anything. Taylor will get access to that stall without being questioned, film countless hours of videos, and most likely walk out (unless someone notices his pinhole camera). Countless women could be publicly exposed all over the internet doing very private things if Taylor shares his videos on pornography sites.

It's ok though. Those women's feelings don't matter. We may have just saved the feelings of one precious transgender person, which does matter. His/Her feelings and rights are more important than the rights of all of those innocent women who were unknowingly violated.

Just like in San Bernadino, when neighbors had grave suspicions, but fears of being labeled bigots had them keeping their mouths shut and people died, people will now keep their mouths shut for fear of being labeled a bigot or worse, and countless women will be victims, in grave ways or others.

Just watch. Wait and see. I'm not a prophet. It's just common sense.
 
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OMG, another anecdote...

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...gory-philip-Schwartz-san-diego-248669861.html

Man Who Dressed as Barbie in Alleged Bathroom Attack Pleads Not Guilty
Gregory Philip Schwartz, 40, is accused of attempting to sexually assault a woman while wearing a Barbie doll dress inside a Big Lots bathroom, according to police

A man accused of a brazen and bizarre sexual assault inside the bathroom of a San Diego Big Lots, while wearing a stolen dress which made him look like a Barbie doll, pleaded not guilty in court Wednesday.

Gregory Philip Schwartz, 40, faces several felony charges stemming from the incident which occurred on Friday evening inside a women’s restroom at a Big Lots store located in Clairemont, according to police.

Schwartz was caught on surveillance footage entering the restroom wearing a dress he had stolen, according to San Diego Police Lt. Chuck Kaye.

When a woman walked into the restroom and went into a stall, Schwartz climbed under the stall, grabbed the woman, and attempted to sexually assault her, police said.
The woman fought back and was able to escape and run to a store employee.

Schwartz reportedly ran out soon after and was confronted by a security guard who he then threatened with what appeared to be a screwdriver.

He then fled the store, police said.

What?? He stole a dress, pretended to be a woman, tried to sexually assault the woman in her bathroom stall (but wait, stalls protect us!?!), ran out, and then tried to attack security with a screw driver.

Move along, nothing to see here.
 
OMG, another anecdote...

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...gory-philip-Schwartz-san-diego-248669861.html

Man Who Dressed as Barbie in Alleged Bathroom Attack Pleads Not Guilty
Gregory Philip Schwartz, 40, is accused of attempting to sexually assault a woman while wearing a Barbie doll dress inside a Big Lots bathroom, according to police



What?? He stole a dress, pretended to be a woman, tried to sexually assault the woman in her bathroom stall (but wait, stalls protect us!?!), ran out, and then tried to attack security with a screw driver.

Move along, nothing to see here.

If only it was illegal for him to walk into that bathroom in a dress, I'm sure this never would have happened. Because someone who steals dresses and assaults people will certainly always obey bathroom access laws.
 
If only it was illegal for him to walk into that bathroom in a dress, I'm sure this never would have happened. Because someone who steals dresses and assaults people will certainly always obey bathroom access laws.

Not the point.

It's not whether they will follow the laws OFTB. It's whether or not the community can raise up alarms to protect one another (as in the girls swim team and no one calling the authorities for fear of 'offending a possible TG'). It's about increasing the number of incidences like these by increasing the opportunity for the predators. It's as simple as the fox and the hen house. You believe more chickens won't get eaten if the door is left open. We know they will get eaten by the wily foxes.

These positions are making these crimes easier to commit. To date, women have been conditioned to yell, scream and/or seek help when a man enters the ladies room. Now, people are going to keep their mouths shut, and more incidents, like this next anecdote will occur.

You're just driving more political correctness that will backfire like San Bernadino. Being PC led to that girls swim team having to watch a man twice expose himself to them.

------------------------------------------

Gavin Scott is a cross-dressing Australian who, in January 2013, sexually assaulted three female workers in clothing stores. The first victim was a 17 year old girl. He entered the store dressed as a woman, approached her, and asked for her help while trying on clothing. He asked her to assist him zipping dresses, which she did. But she began to be uncomfortable, and her intuition was correct: Scott pinched her on her bottom, then left the store. In another store, Scott crabbed a female employee’s bottom and said, “You have a nice bottom.” Sometime later he returned to that store and groped a female assistant’s bottom and groin. Scott ultimately pled guilty to sexually assaulting these women.

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/l.../cross-dresser-sentenced-for-sexual-assaults/
 
oh no, more bad news. Another anecdote just came across the news desk folks. This time, it involves female victims at a university:

In 2013, Rodney Kenneth Petersen was arrested for dressing as a woman to enter a woman’s dormitory and take pictures of the coeds at Loma Linda University in California. An investigation revealed that Peterson had previously dressed as a woman and entered other female-only facilities, trying to take photos of women and girls with a cell phone he had hidden in his purse.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/25/rodney-kenneth-petersen_n_3496651.html

Rodney Kenneth Petersen Dressed As Woman To Take Photos Of Female Students

A crossdressing man was arrested for striking a college security guard with his car as he tried to drive off the Loma Linda University campus near San Bernadino, Calif., where he was allegedly trying to take surreptitious photos of female students, the Los Angeles Times reports.

The San Bernardino County Sheriff’s Department told the Times that on June 4 Rodney Kenneth Petersen, 46, dressed as a woman and attempted unsuccessfully to enter areas of a women’s dormitory on the Loma Linda campus that were restricted to students.

Campus staff confronted Petersen, the Press-Enterprise in Riverside, Calif., reports, who then headed to his vehicle in the parking lot. Security guards tried to stop Petersen, but he allegedly drove off and struck a campus officer with his car in the process, causing minor injuries, authorities told the Pasadena Star-News.

Police also allege that Petersen dressed as a woman to enter several other women’s facilities in Rancho Cucamonga and Yucaipa “in an attempt to photograph unsuspecting women using a cellphone he had hidden in his purse,” Sgt. Ed Finneran said in a statement.
 
One more this morning. This anecdote is particularly disturbing as it involves a convicted sex offender guilty of frequently accessing restrooms, fitting rooms, locker rooms and the like. The number of women victimized by this predator is unknown:

In 2011, transgender Thomas Lee Benson, a convicted sex offender for having sexual contact with a minor girl, dressed as a woman so he could go into the women’s locker room at a swimming pool in North Clackamas, Oregon. There were young girls present in the locker room changing into their swimsuits while Benson was inside. Previously, Benson had dressed as a woman to enter a women’s dressing room at a pool in Portland, Oregon. Young girls where changing into their swimsuits in that dressing room, too.

Benson says that he now wants to live life as a woman and he is not a threat to girls. The spokesman for the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office disagrees. He had this to say about Benson:

Mr. Benson has been known to dress as a female to gain access to undressed minor females by frequenting restrooms, dressing rooms, changing rooms, aquatic centers and pool locker rooms. Mr. Benson has been known to use money, candy and threats to gain access to his victims.

http://www.oregonlive.com/milwaukie/index.ssf/2012/05/cross-dressing_sex_offender_re.html

Cross-dressing sex offender released to community supervision

Thomas Lee Benson, 39, who dressed as a woman to enter the women's locker room at North Clackamas Aquatic Park last July, while he completes probation in October 2016.

Benson was convicted of sexually abusing children 18 years ago and has a history of dressing as a woman. He was convicted in October of second-degree criminal trespassing, unlawful entry into a motor vehicle and frequenting a place where children regularly congregate -- a crime for predatory sex offenders.

Sgt. Adam Phillips, Clackamas County Sheriff's Office spokesman, said Benson was convicted of first-degree sexual abuse and paying to view child pornography. In 2001, he was convicted of second-degree trespassing for entering a locker room at an aquatic center. Seven years later, he was convicted of unlawful contact with a child.

"Mr. Benson has been known to dress as a female to gain access to undressed minor females by frequenting restrooms, dressing rooms, changing rooms, aquatic centers and pool locker rooms," Phillips said. "Mr. Benson has been know to use money, candy and threats to gain access to his victims."

Phillips said Benson is prohibited from having contact with anyone under the age of 18.
 
How many of these are you going it post Tim? This is pointless and it's going in circles. Show me a place where transgendered people have been granted legal access to bathrooms and it has resulted in a significant statistical increase in the number of sexual assaults. Until then your stories have no point, as I've said repeatedly no one says it has never or would never happen. It has happened in the past, when it was still generally understood that men were not allowed in women's restrooms, it will continue to happen in the future, regardless of whether these people are technically allowed access to these bathrooms or not.

The question is would a law such as NC's reduce the frequency of these incidences, or would lack of such a law increase the frequency of them. You have presented no evidence of either of those things. I'm sorry if I like to deal in facts and not hysteria.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/sexual-ass...ns-debunk-bathroom-predator/story?id=38604019

“Over 200 municipalities and 18 states have nondiscrimination laws protecting transgender people’s access to facilities consistent with the gender they live every day,” according to the coalition. "None of those jurisdictions have [sic] seen a rise in sexual violence or other public safety issues due to nondiscrimination laws. Assaulting another person in a restroom or changing room remains against the law in every single state.”

Strangio also noted that allowing transgender people to use the bathroom corresponding to their gender identity “doesn’t increase in any way public safety incidents.”


The only people who we know would really affected by this law in any meaningful way are law abiding people who just want to use the restroom without being harassed or humiliated. Don't forget also that you are forcing someone who identifies as a MAN but was born a woman to use a WOMAN's rest room...subjecting the women in the rest room to the same lack of privacy and fear that you say they are perfectly correct to have. Is that woman who is living as a man going to have to show her genitals to use the women's room? Or is she just SOL? It makes no sense, it's completely unenforceable and attempting to enforce it would be the biggest invasion of anyone's privacy.
 
How many of these are you going it post Tim? This is pointless and it's going in circles. Show me a place where transgendered people have been granted legal access to bathrooms and it has resulted in a significant statistical increase in the number of sexual assaults. Until then your stories have no point, as I've said repeatedly no one says it has never or would never happen. It has happened in the past, when it was still generally understood that men were not allowed in women's restrooms, it will continue to happen in the future, regardless of whether these people are technically allowed access to these bathrooms or not.

The question is would a law such as NC's reduce the frequency of these incidences, or would lack of such a law increase the frequency of them. You have presented no evidence of either of those things. I'm sorry if I like to deal in facts and not hysteria.

Does one need to provide evidence of the following?

- When snow storms are predicted, the # of auto accidents will rise
- When a heat wave occurs, the # of people vulnerable to heat will die
- When alcohol is mixed with throngs of people at a competitive sporting event, the incidences of violence will increase
- When a male inmate is put into a female prison population, sexual impropriety will occur

Likewise, and as simply, we know that if you leave doors open to restrooms, when you allow either sex to enter whatever bathroom they choose, incidences like those we've posted (and those that continue to come in via the news) will increase.

Just as simply as knowing when it rains, cars crash at a higher frequency.

You have presented zero evidence that Target allowing men and women to share dressing rooms will yield (statistically) the same or fewer # of crimes in those facilities. I can provide anecdote after anecdote (and will continue to do so) of men pretending to be women (abusing these laws) to prey on innocent female victims.

You're also welcome to provide anecdotes of true transgenders who used a facility and no harm came from the encounters.

Finally, per your article, it is quite limited in its view. It doesn't take into account surreptitious filming, as one example. Only sexual assaults. 8 out of 10 victims know their attackers. I bet 0 out of thousands of women filmed without their consent in a shower or in the toilet didn't know their assailant. And the article does a really poor job of focusing on the views and rights of transgenders, but discounting the views and rights of the women and children harmed.

Thanks, I'll steer clear of ABC's Liberal (yes they are) agenda and heed the words of an actual female rape survivor.
 
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Likewise, and as simply, we know that if you leave doors open to restrooms, when you allow either sex to enter whatever bathroom they choose, incidences like those we've posted (and those that continue to come in via the news) will increase.

No, we don't know that. The facts that we have so far (presented above which you ignored) say they won't. Because A) the world is not swarming with sexual predators just waiting for a legal opening to attack strangers as some of you seem to think and B) people who want to assault people will find places to do it, legal or illegal places, they don't care. Assaulting people is already illegal. A public bathroom isn't a fortress protected by heavy security. Anyone can walk into one at any time dressed any way they want.

You're also welcome to provide anecdotes of true transgenders who used a facility and no harm came from the encounters.

LOL, Tim that's a ridiculous and fallacious request and you know it. People using the bathroom without incident generally does not make the news, no articles I can cut and paste about it, but you know and I know it happens hundreds, probably thousands of times a day.
 
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Awww, crap, this guy in the woman's bathroom last week choked a little girl.

Man who choked 8-year-old girl in women’s restroom stokes alarm over transgender access

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/14/man-who-choked-girl-in-womens-restroom-stokes-alar/

The attack by a man on an 8-year-old girl in a women’s restroom last week in a Chicago restaurant is raising alarm about opposite-sex access to public facilities in the name of transgender rights.

Police say the man, 33-year-old Reese Hartstirn, entered the women’s room May 7 at Jason’s Deli in Chicago’s South Loop and choked the girl until she passed out.

The girl’s mother, who was in the adjacent stall, heard her daughter’s screams and rescued her, while restaurant patrons held the suspect until police arrived, according to WLS-TV in Chicago.

Opponents of laws allowing opposite-sex public-facility use argue that they increase the danger of such attacks because they allow men, transgender or not, to enter women’s rooms unchallenged.

“I’m sure his intent was innocent,” said Susan Wright in a Friday post on the conservative website RedState. “I’m sure he really felt that he belonged in the women’s restroom and the little girl was somehow oppressing him, which caused the confusion, resulting in his hands ending up around her neck.”

Chicago bans discrimination based on gender identity in employment, housing and public accommodations. Battles over whether such anti-discrimination ordinances apply to transgender bathroom access have spiked since Houston voters defeated 3-to-1 a so-called “bathroom bill” in November.
 
Awww, crap, this guy in the woman's bathroom last week choked a little girl.

Man who choked 8-year-old girl in women’s restroom stokes alarm over transgender access

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/14/man-who-choked-girl-in-womens-restroom-stokes-alar/

Uh...he's not transgendered...he's just a guy who followed a little girl into a bathroom and choked her...completely illegal in every sense of the word...what aspect of the NC law would have prevented that? You think a guy who's willing to choke a little girl unconscious would have been deterred by a bathroom access law?
 
Uh...he's not transgendered...he's just a guy who followed a little girl into a bathroom and choked her...completely illegal in every sense of the word...what aspect of the NC law would have prevented that? You think a guy who's willing to choke a little girl unconscious would have been deterred by a bathroom access law?

The NC law does prevent that. Bomma's policy will give people like that legal cover.
 
The NC law does prevent that. Bomma's policy will give people like that legal cover.

This is a sicko with an obvious complete lack of regard for laws of any sort.You're seriously saying he would have been deterred but for Chicago's anti-discrimination laws? That's kind of ridiculous, no?
 
So we should change the laws (or create new laws) to make bathrooms more accessible to transgenders, even if it makes it easier for sexual predators to access potential victims, because 'its the right thing to do"? But gun laws...... well, thats different. Liberalism is truly a mental disorder.
 
Uh...he's not transgendered...he's just a guy who followed a little girl into a bathroom and choked her...completely illegal in every sense of the word...what aspect of the NC law would have prevented that? You think a guy who's willing to choke a little girl unconscious would have been deterred by a bathroom access law?

Stealing money from a bank till is illegal. Those who do so face stiff prison sentences.

Should banks allow customers to get behind the security gate and plexiglass windows to where the money is kept? After all, it is already illegal to steal the money, and if somebody is willing to break the law and risk prison by stealing the money, then a dumb trespassing infraction would not change that.

Is that your argument?
 
No, we don't know that. The facts that we have so far (presented above which you ignored) say they won't.

Those are beliefs, and this is a belief issue. Your article was full of beliefs. Numerous times they said things like 'facts show' without showing any facts. Funny, that. From your article:

" “Over 200 municipalities and 18 states have nondiscrimination laws protecting transgender people’s access to facilities consistent with the gender they live every day,” according to the coalition. "None of those jurisdictions have [sic] seen a rise in sexual violence or other public safety issues due to nondiscrimination laws. Assaulting another person in a restroom or changing room remains against the law in every single state.”

Strangio also noted that allowing transgender people to use the bathroom corresponding to their gender identity “doesn’t increase in any way public safety incidents.”"


Where are the facts supporting that statement? I can make the statement that jurisdictions are seeing a rise in sexual violence and say it's a fact just as easily. Saying it is a fact without facts doesn't make it a fact.

"Laura Palumbo, communications director at the National Sexual Violence Resource Center, told ABC News that people who are looking to sexually assault someone will go into a bathroom regardless if it corresponds to their gender. “It’s problematic to conflate in examples when a person, who is not transgender identified, is trespassing in a restroom exploiting that position to harm others,” she said." -- Again, this is her belief. Not a fact.

"Palumbo said she believes people “must understand the facts about sexual assault,” adding that in 8 out of 10 cases the victim already knows the person who sexually assaulted them, citing Justice Department statistics. However, 64 percent of transgender people will experience sexual assault in their lifetime, she said, citing a study by the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and National Center for Transgender Equality." -- while these are facts, they aren't tied to the entire issue. Men that surreptitiously film women in locker rooms don't know the victims. Nor does the man exposing himself to the girl's swim team. Or countless other examples. Her 'facts' are a very specific use of stats in a very narrow view of the total harm that can come from these situations - assaults only. This is about far more than just assaults.

"“All the data and all the evidence shows protecting transgender people only increase public safety,” Strangio said. He said laws like House Bill 2 imply “that fundamentally people just don’t think of transgender people as humans, and they try to erase trans people from existence.” " -- again, this is a belief. Saying it is a fact, doesn't make it a fact. I've never read an article with data that shows that by protecting transgender people, EVERYONE sees an increase in safety. Without facts, this is still a stated belief.

Because A) the world is not swarming with sexual predators just waiting for a legal opening to attack strangers as some of you seem to think and B) people who want to assault people will find places to do it, legal or illegal places, they don't care. Assaulting people is already illegal. A public bathroom isn't a fortress protected by heavy security. Anyone can walk into one at any time dressed any way they want.

And we've been round and round on this issue, and you won't seem to acknowledge these facts. 5 years ago, if a man walked into a woman's restroom, immediate reaction would have taken place. Screams, yells, women running from the restroom, a call for security. That would have happened in restrooms, dressing rooms, and showers five years ago. To deny this would be laughable. Now, men may walk in and no one can say a word. The dynamic of entry has changed (fact). Anyone objecting stands the chance of being labeled a bigot, raising a false alarm, or worse yet being sued for discrimination. These are realities. Five years ago, a man dressed any way he wanted walking into a female pool shower and showering in a communal shower would have yielded police being called. That's not deniable.

LOL, Tim that's a ridiculous and fallacious request and you know it. People using the bathroom without incident generally does not make the news, no articles I can cut and paste about it, but you know and I know it happens hundreds, probably thousands of times a day.

I don't find it laughable at all. You're asking that we provide evidence that open door policies will and are causing problems. When we provide countless and endless examples, you dismiss them as anecdotes. When we present logic, you accuse of us hating transgender people. Since you won't accept real examples, real news articles, and basic logic, and say 'if you can't prove it it's not true' then I ask you in reverse to support your stance with facts - not opinion articles by people saying 'facts show' without there being any facts included.

Every weekend in this country, mothers and fathers council young teenage females as follows - "You know there are going to be boys at this party. There may be alcohol. We know what boys want. Just be careful. There's a high likelihood you may be approached, or God forbid, potentially raped in a situation like this. Alcohol + boys + parties can be a dangerous mix." Good parenting. Preaching caution.

God forbid we say "You know there may be men now entering your showers at school, or the dressing rooms at Target. There are plenty of predators out there looking to prey on the vulnerable. You're vulnerable in those situations. Beware."
 
Uh...he's not transgendered...he's just a guy who followed a little girl into a bathroom and choked her...completely illegal in every sense of the word...what aspect of the NC law would have prevented that? You think a guy who's willing to choke a little girl unconscious would have been deterred by a bathroom access law?

Nope. He's not. Just a predator out to get a little girl. But he was a man in a woman's restroom, correct? Do we know if any women saw him enter? Do we know if the women who saw him enter paid him no attention because, well, transgender. We can't say anything now about any man entering the restroom. Did he walk right past what was once a societal call to alarm - "Look, a man just walked into the ladies room!" unencumbered, which allowed him to carry out his crime? Nope. If he did walk past women who now paid him no attention, he got in and was able to commit a crime that once may have been thwarted by people calling out in alarm.

Now, any so called predator can walk right past women into the showers without anyone daring to say a word. That's what these policies are doing. Opening the door. Muting voices. Providing easier access.

Opponents of laws allowing opposite-sex public-facility use argue that they increase the danger of such attacks because they allow men, transgender or not, to enter women’s rooms unchallenged.
 
Stealing money from a bank till is illegal. Those who do so face stiff prison sentences.

Should banks allow customers to get behind the security gate and plexiglass windows to where the money is kept? After all, it is already illegal to steal the money, and if somebody is willing to break the law and risk prison by stealing the money, then a dumb trespassing infraction would not change that.

Is that your argument?

No...my argument is that posting a sign on the front door that says "robbers not allowed here" is not going to stop anyone from robbing the bank if that's what they want to do. Women aren't locked up in vaults or behind security glass when they use the bathroom. Anyone can walk in...now, for the last hundred or whatever years or so...dressed however they like. The idea that if laws like the one in NC aren't enacted, people are going to watch a man follow a little girl in the bathroom and just ignore it, is ludicrous. As I've said before, this has been a non-issue for decades. Obama shouldn't be interfering, NC shouldn't be interfering.
 
I don't find it laughable at all. You're asking that we provide evidence that open door policies will and are causing problems. When we provide countless and endless examples, you dismiss them as anecdotes. When we present logic, you accuse of us hating transgender people. Since you won't accept real examples, real news articles, and basic logic, and say 'if you can't prove it it's not true' then I ask you in reverse to support your stance with facts - not opinion articles by people saying 'facts show' without there being any facts included.

Every weekend in this country, mothers and fathers council young teenage females as follows - "You know there are going to be boys at this party. There may be alcohol. We know what boys want. Just be careful. There's a high likelihood you may be approached, or God forbid, potentially raped in a situation like this. Alcohol + boys + parties can be a dangerous mix." Good parenting. Preaching caution.

God forbid we say "You know there may be men now entering your showers at school, or the dressing rooms at Target. There are plenty of predators out there looking to prey on the vulnerable. You're vulnerable in those situations. Beware."

I think I've said over and over again, everyone should be aware. They should have been aware before, they should be aware now. Parents of little boys going into men's rooms should be aware too...yet you seem to have absolutely no problem at all with that. Why do you hate little boys? Why do you not care if they are assaulted? Why is it only girls and women who need to be protected from this terrible threat? And should it apply to every place girls and women could possibly be assaulted? As I've said before, your daughter is infinitely more likely to be assaulted on a date than in a public restroom, should we outlaw dating?

Why are you fine with the fact that a woman who lives as a man, looks like a man, is dressed like a man and is attracted to women is not only allowed to shower with women, but is forced by law to shower with women? Simply because he doesn't have a peepee? Or even maybe has one now but didn't at birth?

Your positions make no logical sense, and you simply ignore all arguments that you can't refute.

I've said all I'm going to say on this. The reality is the youth of this country for the most part do not care about this issue...it will all be a non-issue again in a few years just as gay marriage is rapidly becoming a non-issue. Probably after this election cycle.
 
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I think I've said over and over again, everyone should be aware. They should have been aware before, they should be aware now. Parents of little boys going into men's rooms should be aware too...yet you seem to have absolutely no problem at all with that. Why do you hate little boys? Why do you not care if they are assaulted? Why is it only girls and women who need to be protected from this terrible threat? And should it apply to every place girls and women could possibly be assaulted? As I've said before, your daughter is infinitely more likely to be assaulted on a date than in a public restroom, should we outlaw dating?

No one in this thread is arguing that boys don't face these risks. NONE. You keep bringing that up as if it is somehow justification for increasing risk for women in showers, dressing rooms and restrooms. "Well because boys have had to face these threats, girls should too." Really?

We already have a problem, as you've noted, with boys facing risks in the restrooms. So let's solve that problem by now allowing men into women's restrooms too. Brilliant! If it's broken, don't break it more.

And what about the rights of these women? The ones, unlike you, that really do care. Like this woman:

http://www.dailywire.com/news/5833/...d-strolled-ross-dressing-amanda-prestigiacomo

“I was in the dressing room, when we heard a man’s voice,” said Stickles. The manager “told me that if I felt uncomfortable in the dressing room with him there… I’d have to wait until he’s finished.”

Upsetting Stickles further, the man who walked out of the fitting room “was in no way dressed as a woman,” she said. “He had on jeans, a t-shirt, 5 o’clock shadow, very deep voice. He was a man.”

In Stickles’ view, it was clear that this man was exploiting the transgender bathroom and fitting room policy put in place by Ross, but when asked to comment, a customer service representative refused to address the legitimate concern, only saying that Ross does not “discriminate against the transgender community” and that “customers may use changing rooms that apply to their gender identity.”

“What about me? Or my feelings?” asked Stickles.

Short answer: They don’t matter
.

0.03% of the population's feelings must be catered to. Women that don't want to be naked in front of a man have no rights. Oh wait, they can leave the restroom and wait for the man to be done - kinds the Rosa Parks treatment. That's equitable.

Indeed, what about women's rights. They are being trampled on. Period.

Why are you fine with the fact that a woman who lives as a man, looks like a man, is dressed like a man and is attracted to women is not only allowed to shower with women, but is forced by law to shower with women? Simply because he doesn't have a peepee? Or even maybe has one now but didn't at birth? Your positions make no logical sense, and you simply ignore all arguments that you can't refute.

My positions in this thread have all been based on logic. For instance, to quote myself again, we know that if it rains, auto crashes will go up. We don't have to be prophets to know this. It's really very logical and all of the articles support it - if we allow men unfettered access into women's locker rooms, showers, and restrooms, sexual predator incidents will increase (correction - are already on the rise). What's illogical about the premise? What's illogical about saying this increases risk?

Nothing.

I've said all I'm going to say on this. The reality is the youth of this country for the most part do not care about this issue...

Woah, wait, what? You speak for the youth of this country now? Where did you find these 'facts?' I call a big fat 'bullshit' on that claim. I don't know a single female - not one - that is ok with a male showering with her in the HS locker rooms, as an example. None of my sons' friends in HS, not my nieces who are gradutated/in HS, none. I'm quite involved in our local schools. I don't profess to speak for this country's youths however, but I don't know a single one that is A-OK with this.

it will all be a non-issue again in a few years just as gay marriage is rapidly becoming a non-issue. Probably after this election cycle.

I disagree. It's a bit (though there are some comparisons) apples and oranges. Allowing gays to marry didn't threaten my physical safety. This issue is about personal and physical safety and privacy. It's a whole different argument. And in a few years, as this problem escalates, it will still be on the radar.
 
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