The End of the Race-Norming System in the NFL: Black Players are Watching

[Ike Kelly]

I wonder if this goes back to Najee taking a **** in that girl's closet back in the day. Sorry had to lighten the mood. I have no recollection of the Henry player and I usually havea pretty good memory for ex players.

LOL Sask, he will forever be remembered for that act. Would’ve liked the writer to know about the players more when discussing them. Kevin (pronounced Keevin) Henry was not a LB, but DE during his entire career. All in Pittsburgh.

All these guys got entrance into college and had to write SATs. Why don't they look at that as the norm reference?

You mentioned it yourself Sask, there is the baseline doctrine that’s used, however we all know that athletes, through actions outside of their own (I’m looking at you Alumni boosters) find ways to get around college entrance exams. Additionally, The schools themselves have different level of entrance requirements academically. Stanford has a greater requirement than say, Central Michigan. Yet those who graduate from Stanford can have a far greater academic enrichment just based upon the quality of education received. Quality loosely driven on the cost. But you can’t expect a graduate from the Stanfords universities to have the same baseline academically as someone who graduated from schools with lower entrance acceptance requirements.

Of note, Davenport went to the University of Miami (FL) and Henry went to Miss State. Two huge schools, and great in their own rights, but I wouldn’t categorize them as higher academically as say Stanford or Vanderbilt.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

I'm not making any real commentary on this but will say this. I reserve judgement until I fully understand the difference in treatment of African American and White players. Just because old Dookie Davenport launches a lawsuit doesn't make it so. Anyone can fire off a legal complaint. How was the testing threshold different and if it was why?

This describes the use of race norming for diagnosis of cognitive decline and how they used it to approve payouts.

To qualify for a dementia payout, former players must prove that they've suffered from cognitive decline. But the testing is graded on a curve, known as a race norm -- and under those race norms, Black players are assumed to have started with lower intelligence than White players. That means a Black player has to prove a greater amount of cognitive decline in order to get the same payout as a White player.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

Exactly. You dont know the underwriting/ actuary work that they come up with the formula. Its insurance. I dont know either. The low hanging fruit that bermudasteel chooses is that its a simply racist thing. MAYBE it is! And that would be bullshit. Just like berm jumping in and making his popcorn meme and claiming the 3/5ths person bullshit from 1840. But no we cant discuss it,, tell each other what we know... what we learned.. Why they do it/did it this way.. No.... Youre a ******* race baiting jack off. It has nothign to do with veteran status, and everything to do with victim mentality.

You should probably try reading and looking into things more before spouting off. I already posted this in response to someone else, but this was the use of race norming when it came to payouts for cognitive decline for white and black players.

To qualify for a dementia payout, former players must prove that they've suffered from cognitive decline. But the testing is graded on a curve, known as a race norm -- and under those race norms, Black players are assumed to have started with lower intelligence than White players. That means a Black player has to prove a greater amount of cognitive decline in order to get the same payout as a White player.

 

[Badcat]

Sadly race relations seemed to be much better and more harmonious all through the 80's and 90's than they are today. The real question we all should be asking ourselves is what the **** happened and how did we allow ourselves to be led here in 2022?

I disagree, at least where I grew up in Western Pa and even when I was stationed in Texas, Racism was horrible. The KKK was burning crosses and had meetings at the local football field. I got into a major fist fight at the Abilene shopping mall after a group called my bud a stupid "Spick" as we walked past them. I can even remember being in line at a shoe store as a kid and the clerk wouldn't ring up the Black family ahead of us. Man, did my mother let that piece of **** have it. I feel like, and it's just my perception as a pale *** white dude, that racism isn't as bad as it was in the 80's or 90's.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

I disagree, at least where I grew up in Western Pa and even when I was stationed in Texas, Racism was horrible. The KKK was burning crosses and had meetings at the local football field. I got into a major fist fight at the Abilene shopping mall after a group called my bud a stupid "Spick" as we walked past them. I can even remember being in line at a shoe store as a kid and the clerk wouldn't ring up the Black family ahead of us. Man, did my mother let that piece of **** have it. I feel like, and it's just my perception as a pale *** white dude, that racism isn't as bad as it was in the 80's or 90's.

I disagree with the sentiment as well - it wasn't better in the 80s and 90s. Folks probably think that because they were pretty much in their bubbles of where they lived, and we didn't have instant information, social media, etc. I remember the act of just walking with a black guy that happened to be a good friend of mine, got openly racist comments thrown around - "Look, salt and pepper" "disgusting, stick to your own kind" "Swirl" "status symbol" - and those were the tame ones.\

Bermuda brought up the 3/5ths of a man sentiment from the past - but it is still prevalent in some areas. Race norming in this case absolutely shows that, and it's disgusting.

 

[SteelBuckeye]

I disagree, at least where I grew up in Western Pa and even when I was stationed in Texas, Racism was horrible. The KKK was burning crosses and had meetings at the local football field. I got into a major fist fight at the Abilene shopping mall after a group called my bud a stupid "Spick" as we walked past them. I can even remember being in line at a shoe store as a kid and the clerk wouldn't ring up the Black family ahead of us. Man, did my mother let that piece of **** have it. I feel like, and it's just my perception as a pale *** white dude, that racism isn't as bad as it was in the 80's or 90's.

Since we're discussing incidents of racism that personally affected us, I grew up in a university town in Ohio where my mother was attending college. I was one of 4 Black kids in the school. Got into fights at least 2 times a week (often more) because some kid wanted to call me the N word. As a teenager, I was stopped by the police while leaving the neighborhood 7-11 and asked to show my I.D. since "there aren't any Blacks in this neighborhood and you don't look like you belong here."
Five years ago when I moved to the new town I live in, I was taking a walk and the local police trailed me (driving 5 miles an hour, about 10 car lengths behind me) for two blocks until I reached my house. They watched as I walked up my sidewalk, pulled out my key and only pulled off when I entered my house.
Racism was a part of my early life, my life as a young adult and sadly, it's still rears it's head as an adult.

What gets me is that, at times, when the issue or issues directly relating to it are brought up on this board. As soon as one of us who has identified ourselves as Black says something about it, we can be sure that some *** hat is coming out of pocket to call us a "race baiter". That type of behavior just says that those types are not interested in what folks who have experienced racism have to say on that issue. It's really a personal problem. Some folks only want to hear points of view that reinforce their own views or biases; and as long as those attitudes hold sway, whether they come from minorities or Whites, true advancement towards equality can't occur. So, we sit where the 1% want us. Fighting over scraps while they use race and division against us.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

You should probably try reading and looking into things more before spouting off. I already posted this in response to someone else, but this was the use of race norming when it came to payouts for cognitive decline for white and black players.

To qualify for a dementia payout, former players must prove that they've suffered from cognitive decline. But the testing is graded on a curve, known as a race norm -- and under those race norms, Black players are assumed to have started with lower intelligence than White players. That means a Black player has to prove a greater amount of cognitive decline in order to get the same payout as a White player.

and you should pay attention to what im addressing.

 

[SteelBuckeye]

and you should pay attention to what im addressing.

So what you're saying is that you didn't come to this post with any intention of adding to the dialogue referenced. You saw that Berm posted and thought to yourself "Well, I think he's a race baiter. And, I'm going to call him that." Even if he posts something as innocuous as a meme of a guy eating popcorn (which is universally understood to mean "this should be good" or "can't wait to see the posts on this one"; both of which are definitely NOT racists statements).

Basically, you didn't want to hear the message and decided to hijack the thread with bullshit.
I'm glad there are other folks on this board who bypassed your crap and decided to have a dialogue on the issue presented without resorting to name calling, anger and other crap.

You say you have Berm on ignore. What's the purpose of that if you're just going to take him off to see what he says? Sounds like an obsession to me.

 

[JP1977]

SteelBuckeye is owning this thread. Hard to argue with a single point he has made !!!

 

[SteelBuckeye]

SteelBuckeye is owning this thread. Hard to argue with a single point he has made !!!

Thank You, but owning the thread isn't my intent. I like the idea of free and open dialogue on racial issues. I may not like what someone has to say about it, but I do like knowing where they stand and for them to know where I stand. You can't find common ground otherwise. Besides, I may hear something/a point or point of view that I need to consider in forming my own opinions.

 

[JP1977]

My point was I as a white man have no idea what it is like to live as a black man. I can try to empathize all I want but my life experiences will never allow me to know what you or any black man go through on a day to day basis. I can think I know all I want but the black experience is unique for many factors so anyone not black is only getting a small window second handed by seeing how they are treated when we are with them or around them. For anyone to say otherwise is either stupid or willingly naive.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

So what you're saying is that you didn't come to this post with any intention of adding to the dialogue referenced. You saw that Berm posted and thought to yourself "Well, I think he's a race baiter. And, I'm going to call him that." Even if he posts something as innocuous as a meme of a guy eating popcorn (which is universally understood to mean "this should be good" or "can't wait to see the posts on this one"; both of which are definitely NOT racists statements).

Basically, you didn't want to hear the message and decided to hijack the thread with bullshit.
I'm glad there are other folks on this board who bypassed your crap and decided to have a dialogue on the issue presented without resorting to name calling, anger and other crap.

You say you have Berm on ignore. What's the purpose of that if you're just going to take him off to see what he says? Sounds like an obsession to me.

Totally wrong. Im all about understanding why they had it set up that way,, if it was racism or whatever. He shows up with the sole intent of flaming a racism theme. Thats it. Put your gun away this wasnt and isnt about you. Nice of you to come to his defense..............

 

[Badcat]

Thank You, but owning the thread isn't my intent. I like the idea of free and open dialogue on racial issues. I may not like what someone has to say about it, but I do like knowing where they stand and for them to know where I stand. You can't find common ground otherwise. Besides, I may hear something/a point or point of view that I need to consider in forming my own opinions.

And I appreciate that. I will never really know what it's like to life a day in your life, but you help me to understand it a bit more. Thank you.

And anyone declaring someone a race baiter should take a step back and try to understand WHY they want their voice heard on a particular topic. We all ***** and moan about **** going on in our lives so why not hear people out?

Frankly, I can't even fathom how the NFL has allowed this to go on for so long. It's absolutely abhorrent

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

Well I'm having my voice heard on this particular topic. I dont think the way many here are implying. Im just not about to listen to his bullshit everytime a subject comes up..

Thats it.

Now buckeye says i " didn't want to hear the message and decided to hijack the thread with bullshit." Even though im all about understanding and getting to the crux of the matter.
Well thats horse **** too. Anyone else want to make up things.. ? Go ahead.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

This describes the use of race norming for diagnosis of cognitive decline and how they used it to approve payouts.

To qualify for a dementia payout, former players must prove that they've suffered from cognitive decline. But the testing is graded on a curve, known as a race norm -- and under those race norms, Black players are assumed to have started with lower intelligence than White players. That means a Black player has to prove a greater amount of cognitive decline in order to get the same payout as a White player.

Hey great post. Addresses the issue at hand. This is what it should have been from the get go. But it wasnt. No, berm had to go straight for the popcorn and the 3/5 person . Thats my issue. Thats what im tired of. Thats what i addressed.

 

[SteelerSask2]

I don't think any issue should elicit an automatic reaction or position.

 

[SteelBuckeye]

Totally wrong. Im all about understanding why they had it set up that way,, if it was racism or whatever. He shows up with the sole intent of flaming a racism theme. Thats it. Put your gun away this wasnt and isnt about you. Nice of you to come to his defense..............

I like Berm. If I think he's being unfairly characterized, of course I'd come to his defense.

 

[SteelBuckeye]

I don't think any issue should elicit an automatic reaction or position.

You are being entirely too reasonable. But, I agree with ya!

 

[SteelerSask2]

You are being entirely too reasonable. But, I agree with ya!

I think you can judge a lot about yourself by your auto reaction. EVERYONE has prejudice and bias. That is simply being human. But if you won't even listen to another perspective that is a problem and getting us all to place we shouldn't go.

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

I don't think any issue should elicit an automatic reaction or position.

Sask , this an automatic reaction. This has happened over a period of time, as i stated before.

 

[SteelerSask2]

Sask , this an automatic reaction. This has happened over a period of time, as i stated before.

I'm taking no side. However, I think people should research something before taking a position. In my opinion the article is poorly written. It makes it sound like the NFL having different baselines of intelligence for African American and White players is a fact. Where it is really I believe a supposition in a lawsuit. That is my two cents.

 

[bermudasteel]

and you should pay attention to what im addressing.

What are you addressing???

 

[bermudasteel]

Totally wrong. Im all about understanding why they had it set up that way,, if it was racism or whatever. He shows up with the sole intent of flaming a racism theme. Thats it. Put your gun away this wasnt and isnt about you. Nice of you to come to his defense..............

Buckeye and I, as well as NC and others, we speak on topics that could turn into viable dialog.

You, however, assume that once a topic leans toward color--- Bermuda is race baiting.

******* hilarious and ridiculous.

Like I said, it amazes me that you volunteered to be a soldier.

 

[bermudasteel]

Hey great post. Addresses the issue at hand. This is what it should have been from the get go. But it wasnt. No, berm had to go straight for the popcorn and the 3/5 person . Thats my issue. Thats what im tired of. Thats what i addressed.

**** that. You want a bed of roses. I gave you the thorns first.

Suck it up, Nancy...

 

[Black & Gold Bleeder]

**** that. You want a bed of roses. I gave you the thorns first.

Suck it up, Nancy...

You're a buffoon. Go play in traffic.