<iframe src="https://giphy.com/embed/Ln2bmTKXqt69MK32Vl" width="480" height="480" frameBorder="0" class="giphy-embed" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="">via GIPHY</a></p>
Why Mike Tomlin is a Hall of Fame Coach
- Thread starter Steeler Nation
- Start date
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 15,029
- Reaction score
- 13,381
- Points
- 113
- Location
- Lebanon, OH (Near Kings Island)
I would venture to say that the majority of people in and around the NFL all think Tomlin is a great coach and a future HOF except a significant segment of his teams fans. I have said it before I will say it again. I don't think we appreciate just how hard it is to win the SuperBowl. The fact we still are tied for the most tells you something if you really think about it. There are 32 teams trying to win it, ok maybe 28 as 4 don't really seem to try hard, we have been in a very significant percentage of the big games. We have high expectations to the point I don't think we always properly appreciate what we have had in Mike Tomlin.
I have seen him this year being a bit different in his communication with a few less Tomlinisms. I have also heard stories about his coaching players up and setting down the law very vocally behind the scenes, just not in front of cameras. I can respect that. It isn't always the best idea to be dressing someone down on gameday in front of the camera. Just because we don't see the coaching from him actively on gameday doesn't mean he isn't doing as some assert. His biggest weakness seems to be challenges lol.
I have seen him this year being a bit different in his communication with a few less Tomlinisms. I have also heard stories about his coaching players up and setting down the law very vocally behind the scenes, just not in front of cameras. I can respect that. It isn't always the best idea to be dressing someone down on gameday in front of the camera. Just because we don't see the coaching from him actively on gameday doesn't mean he isn't doing as some assert. His biggest weakness seems to be challenges lol.
Let's reflect on LAST SEASON, shall we??? Because, had it not been for the NFL front office, we would have secured the #1 seed and should have advanced further in the playoffs.
Week 4 - Steelers vs. Titans. We eventually won the game but gave up our bi-week.
Week 11 - Steelers vs. Ravens. This game was shopped around and moved so much it should have been on Amazon or Ebay...Steelers win but have play 11 straight weeks WITH NO BYE.
I guess Coach Tomlin didn't do enough grandstanding to get the games forfeited or to get his bye week???
GTFOH!!! While he may not be a first ballot HOFer - he's definitely a lock. And another thing---if you think that he didn't revise and renew our defense after Coach LeBeau left - BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! If we could have retained Coach Munchak I see better results in the past as well.
No back to our regularly scheduled "Fire Coach Tomlin" thread...
Week 4 - Steelers vs. Titans. We eventually won the game but gave up our bi-week.
Week 11 - Steelers vs. Ravens. This game was shopped around and moved so much it should have been on Amazon or Ebay...Steelers win but have play 11 straight weeks WITH NO BYE.
I guess Coach Tomlin didn't do enough grandstanding to get the games forfeited or to get his bye week???
GTFOH!!! While he may not be a first ballot HOFer - he's definitely a lock. And another thing---if you think that he didn't revise and renew our defense after Coach LeBeau left - BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! If we could have retained Coach Munchak I see better results in the past as well.
No back to our regularly scheduled "Fire Coach Tomlin" thread...
Let's reflect on this. The defense had pro bowl to all pro level talent at 2 of the defensive line spots 3 of the linebackers and 2 of the secondary. 8 of the 11 were first rounders. They lost two key components and became average. On offense they came out strong. UNTIL teams realized the run was smoke and mirrors and then they were ******. and for the third year in a row the team fell apart in December.
Oh and excuses are tools of the incompetent. Your guys words.
Last edited by a moderator:
Cowher already called Tomlin a HOF coach in his HOF speech.
MT is a lock for Canton.
MT is a lock for Canton.
Ok sure agreed. Question being do you think his message is stale here and do you think he will win another SB in Pittsburgh. I do not.
I'd still like the bye week. No excuse there...
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 15,029
- Reaction score
- 13,381
- Points
- 113
- Location
- Lebanon, OH (Near Kings Island)
No I don't and yes I do.
For sure but was a bye week going to fix their offensive line? And complete inability to run. Even to the point where third and 2 was an obvious pass down? Like that is ****** death right there.
I do not put them anywhere near championship contention this season. So you are talking about the next QB which if they draft next year could be ready for that in what 3 years after that. And that's if you hit a home run with the next QB. I think there is almost 0 chance Tomlin will win another SB with the Steelers.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 15,029
- Reaction score
- 13,381
- Points
- 113
- Location
- Lebanon, OH (Near Kings Island)
Nope I feel they have an absolutely legitimate shot this year. I think with just a few breaks this could be a great team THIS YEAR. Motivation and young hungry players can overcome a lot ot other issues.
Motivation and young hungry players may develop a middle of the pack Oline. They might be able to create a decent run game. They are paper thin in almost every unit.
Here is what pisses me off about the Mike Tomlin situation. They came out to a big start last year.....but anyone with football eyes could see the cracks in the facade. They lost an edge rusher and middle linebacker and their defense became average. Injuries are GOING to happen. They had no run game and their offensive scheme went from slightly innovative to atrocious. Both the guys that they promoted this year were in THE BUILDING last season. So the fact that they stuck with Sweet Feet and Fichtner was all on Tomlin. At the end of the season that he essentially tanked they are fired and he is extended.
Here is what pisses me off about the Mike Tomlin situation. They came out to a big start last year.....but anyone with football eyes could see the cracks in the facade. They lost an edge rusher and middle linebacker and their defense became average. Injuries are GOING to happen. They had no run game and their offensive scheme went from slightly innovative to atrocious. Both the guys that they promoted this year were in THE BUILDING last season. So the fact that they stuck with Sweet Feet and Fichtner was all on Tomlin. At the end of the season that he essentially tanked they are fired and he is extended.
I think we have the talent to pull it off. To me the thing holding us back would be Tomlin. But the defense is good enough, and im excited to see what canada can do.
- Joined
- Apr 19, 2014
- Messages
- 1,529
- Reaction score
- 2,162
- Points
- 113
I have my criticisms of Mike Tomlin, just like everyone else.
Do I think the Steelers should have reached (and won) a Super Bowl between 2014-2018: YES.
Do I think decisions by Mike Tomlin to blame? YES, but it's shared blame.
First, there should be credit given where it's due that the team rebuilt so fast from the 2000s mini-dynasty to the 2010s Steelers - the "rebuild" took only a pair of 8-8 seasons. Kevin Colbert/Art Rooney II is also to credit - and blame. It's easy to say that it's because they had Ben Roethlisberger, but it was much more than that. Hiring Haley and Munchak while drafting/free agency at OL, RB and WR led to the offense was outstanding. Roethlisberger had his peak years and the offense was just the best in football. Ben is always at his best with a supporting running game and Le'Veon Bell was unstoppable at RB, but the problem was RB when they needed it in the playoffs.
On defense, despite the weakness in secondary, they kept drafting LBs in first round. They kept not producing - especially at OLB. Probably not a coincidence that Dupree emerged when Joey Porter was dismissed as OLB coach. Ryan Shazier was coming into his own to be a full blown NFL star before his injury. But with the weakness in the secondary as pronounced as it was, unlike when Colbert was able to maneuver the trade up for Troy Polamalu in 2003, his big acquisition via free agency was Mike Mitchell.
It's like Colbert forgot for a few years how to draft and find good FA or make trades. Letting Keenan Lewis go while retaining Cortez Allen was not a good decision and Artie Burns was 5th CB selected in 2016 (13 picks later was Xavien Howard). It wasn't until Joe Haden fell into their lap and he got aggressive with trading up for Bush and Fitzpatrick did the defense truly begin to blossom - but it was too late after the Killer Bs peak.
Do I think the Steelers should have reached (and won) a Super Bowl between 2014-2018: YES.
Do I think decisions by Mike Tomlin to blame? YES, but it's shared blame.
First, there should be credit given where it's due that the team rebuilt so fast from the 2000s mini-dynasty to the 2010s Steelers - the "rebuild" took only a pair of 8-8 seasons. Kevin Colbert/Art Rooney II is also to credit - and blame. It's easy to say that it's because they had Ben Roethlisberger, but it was much more than that. Hiring Haley and Munchak while drafting/free agency at OL, RB and WR led to the offense was outstanding. Roethlisberger had his peak years and the offense was just the best in football. Ben is always at his best with a supporting running game and Le'Veon Bell was unstoppable at RB, but the problem was RB when they needed it in the playoffs.
- Tomlin riding Bell too much instead of spelling him when the reserve RBs (LaGarrette Blount and De'Angelo Williams) were capable of being 1000-yard backs themselves - was reckless.
- Releasing Blount in 2014 - who was unhappy over playing time - was just foolish.
- It also cut both ways. Bell was hurt in the week 17 and Blount was immediately picked up by New England, who worked him into the rotation and he was instrumental in not only the Patriots winning the Super Bowl in 2014, but AGAIN in 2016 and with Eagles in 2017.
- What would the Steelers have been like with a healthy running game during those playoffs?
On defense, despite the weakness in secondary, they kept drafting LBs in first round. They kept not producing - especially at OLB. Probably not a coincidence that Dupree emerged when Joey Porter was dismissed as OLB coach. Ryan Shazier was coming into his own to be a full blown NFL star before his injury. But with the weakness in the secondary as pronounced as it was, unlike when Colbert was able to maneuver the trade up for Troy Polamalu in 2003, his big acquisition via free agency was Mike Mitchell.
It's like Colbert forgot for a few years how to draft and find good FA or make trades. Letting Keenan Lewis go while retaining Cortez Allen was not a good decision and Artie Burns was 5th CB selected in 2016 (13 picks later was Xavien Howard). It wasn't until Joe Haden fell into their lap and he got aggressive with trading up for Bush and Fitzpatrick did the defense truly begin to blossom - but it was too late after the Killer Bs peak.
I think the HC is inextricably involved in the acquisition of talent. Both good and bad. And for the most part I would consider that a strong part of his coaching. The greater part of the job is what you do with the talent. Most reasonably talented coaches can work with 1st round talent. What can you do with 6th rounders and UFAs? That is the real question. I think if Tomlin had an all star assistant and coordinator staff he could win it all. But that just isn't gonna happen. He doesn't get or attract top end assistants and coordinators. He just doesn't.
HCMCS will get into the Hall of Fame for two reasons, really one reason.
1. His stats to this point are substantially similar to Cowher’s, who got in.
2. His notable accomplishments came in his early years when the team was mostly stocked with Cowher’s players and assistants.
Since the team has been all his he has accomplished little.
1. His stats to this point are substantially similar to Cowher’s, who got in.
2. His notable accomplishments came in his early years when the team was mostly stocked with Cowher’s players and assistants.
Since the team has been all his he has accomplished little.
Munch was the biggest Steeler loss in a decade.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 3,473
- Reaction score
- 2,962
- Points
- 113
Superbowls are the ultimate goal, but the more sensible Tomlin critics acknowledge that it isn't realistic every year.
The problem with Tomlin is that he never even gets close anymore. The Steelers' playoff success over the past 10 seasons has been on par with the 1980s, which are widely considered a dark period for the franchise.
The more recent trends are most troubling with three straight late season collapses, and the opposing team having scored 40+ points in each of the Steelers last three playoff games.
His overall record and championship will get him into the HOF, probably first ballot, as though it shouldn't matter, him being the most successful black coach in league history will carry a lot of weight with the writers/voters.
I've just seen little from him to lead me to believe he would not have been just another run of the mill coach with most other teams.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 15,029
- Reaction score
- 13,381
- Points
- 113
- Location
- Lebanon, OH (Near Kings Island)
I am admittedly a glass half type of guy most of the time. I feel he has had some issues of his own making but just as many unforeseen obstacles in these games. Injuries happen and have to be overcome but sometimes the injuries are so key that it makes it incredibly difficult to do.
Last seasons collapse was a direct result of two factors, A. Randy Fichtner on offense which I will give partial blame to Tomlin but also to the organization's way of doing things for better or worse. B. Had the defense not lost so many key contributors and leaders particularly compounded at one position I think we could have made a run of some type in the playoffs and been a higher seed, I blame the league as much as anyone for that. Fichtner was so bad that he should have been let go during the season but they just don't operate that way. I don't know who to blame for that during the season.
The Jacksonville loss was also partially a result of a devastating loss at LB we could not replace on the fly.
I love Ben but he also shares a bit of blame in both for turnovers that were costly. As much as he has lifted Tomlin up he has also hurt us form time to time. I wouldn't want not have him but lets give blame where it is due not just throw it all at Mike.
The last two season I think Tomlin has been masterful at getting as much as he could from a flawed team and a terrible OC. I wish they had made the OC change two years ago. I think Fichtner is as much to blame for the shade many throw at Mason as anything.
In my opinion Munch was the only coach capable of teaching up good to very good and mediocre to good enough. And I would really challenge anyone to name someone hired in the last 7-10 who you could say that about. Tomlin was good when he had experienced people with super chops to handle the chess match. Allowing himself to be more about global things if you will. Since he got the yes man Butler and mediocre assistants and OCs across the board. They have really struggled in big games. Good stats on defense no doubt. But winning big games in big circumstances. Not so much.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 15,751
- Reaction score
- 18,427
- Points
- 113
Good post, Punx. Tomin is a good coach and will likely have HOF credentials when he retires, but you're right. Every season I'd like to go in with high hopes yet expect them to do enough to make the playoffs and lose to a team they should be in the first round.
HOF QB entire time. Coupled with a GM who is lauded as the best in the league.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 15,751
- Reaction score
- 18,427
- Points
- 113
It's easy to blame Fichtner. He was an overmatched offensive coordinator. The big problem with Tomlin and the offense is under his leadership the Steelers year after year would abandon the run and allow Ben to throw the ball 50 times a game. Running the ball is part talent and part emphasizing it in practice and the latter is something Tomlin doesn't do. He does a fine job setting a physical tone on defense and focusing them to create splash plays, but he does not do the same for the offense.
Hopefully Canada and Klemm help steer him in the right direction. You'd think he'd have learned by now though.
- Joined
- Apr 11, 2014
- Messages
- 661
- Reaction score
- 680
- Points
- 93
Todd Haley may have been considered top tier at the time, and Mike Munchak says hello...albeit from Colorado
