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Can a defensive player win the Heisman Again? Coolie Pimps Ed Oliver

Wow, that big and that quick. Dude is going to be a game changer!
 
No way in hell unless catastrophic season,.......... but I'd take him in 1st round heartbeat at #1 overall.




Salute the nation
 
Reports are that Major Applewhite plans to show his versatility and play some offense this season. He already has one TD he scored in short yardage in the bowl game last year...

Hopefully they don't get too crazy and mess up his season
 
so, yeah his odds are severely long to win...but UH is getting his name out there...this was sent as promotional material to a bunch of media folks....bobble head Ed and his horse Oreo
 

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4 games played this season for Oliver. He has ZERO sacks vs weak competition. ( Rice, Arizona, Texas Tech, and Texas Southern )

More problematic, Houston is winning by large margins, which means the other team has to pass a lot, giving Oliver plenty of chances to beat a guard or center not likely to play in the NFL for a sack.

Coolie is going to lose this bet. No team is going to spend a top 10 pick on an under sized DT that can't rush the passer well. At least I have not seen that in years. Oliver reports say is generously listed at 6'3" tall. How tall is he and how long are his arms?

Oh come on Coach, he's a marked man? Who will be the first to say that? My comment in advance is which top defender isn't a marked man to stop?
 
Oliver hardly even played this past weekend since they were playing a very weak opponent. Almost no starters played the second half saturday.

I've asked before and you ignored it...find another player with 39.5 TFLs over two years in college football. I won't even restrict it to his first two years..much less his true Freshman and Sophomore years.

I've also asked, since you have supposed seen him play, what is the best way to locate him when he is on the field, but again...no response.

Oliver has not had any sacks yet...this season, but he has been pressuring the QB and disrupting the running game.

UH led big against Arizona and Oliver sat most of the third quarter which is when they finally got on the score board.

I've already discussed the Tech game..

UH is not just leaving Oliver in to pad his stats when they have a big lead or play an inferior opponent like this past weekend. They are not going take unnecessary chances and risk an injury when the game is decided. Scouts will take note of that and they will watch his film and have been watching his practices since training camp. Unlike some on this board.
 
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CoolieMan said:
Oliver hardly even played this past weekend since they were playing a very weak opponent. Almost no starters played the second half saturday.

I've asked before and you ignored it...find another player with 39.5 TFLs over two years in college football. I won't even restrict it to his first two years..much less his true Freshman and Sophomore years.

I've also asked, since you have supposed seen him play, what is the best way to locate him when he is on the field, but again...no response.

Oliver has not had any sacks yet...this season, but he has been pressuring the QB and disrupting the running game.

UH led big against Arizona and Oliver sat most of the third quarter which is when they finally got on the score board.

I've already discussed the Tech game..

UH is not just leaving Oliver in to pad his stats when they have a big lead or play an inferior opponent like this past weekend. They are not going take unnecessary chances and risk an injury when the game is decided. Scouts will take note of that and they will watch his film and have been watching his practices since training camp. Unlike some on this board.
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There's a guy on Houston with 4.5 more sacks, and one more tackle for a loss. Hmmm....

Scouts will take not that Oliver's pass rush attempts per sacks is very low. You can't get around that point. Most top players sit when the game is over in the 3rd quarter. What you are saying can apply to anyone.

Yes I have seen him play. Like I said he's a undersized gap shooting type of DT. How he'll hold up vs the RUN in the NFL is a question. I'll tell you what, if he's on local, I'll give a full game write up very similar to what I did for Burns when he was drafted.

Oh, but coach his tackles for losses. Yes-- it is important.

You might want to look at our very own Hargrave. He was Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (MEAC) Defensive Player of the Year, capping a dominant senior year with 22 tackles for loss, 13.5 sacks, and two forced fumbles. All this in one year! How's he doing in the NFL?

I'll give you another Steeler example. I agree tackles Rookie Matt Thomas had 21.5 tackles for a loss over his past two seasons playing better competition. He went un-drafted.

These tackles for losses vs the run just don't happen as often in the NFL because the OL and backs are much better. They happen far more often with a sack.

This question will tell me everything, do you think Oliver is off to a slow start or not?
 
Coach said:
There's a guy on Houston with 4.5 more sacks, and one more tackle for a loss. Hmmm....

Scouts will take not that Oliver's pass rush attempts per sacks is very low. You can't get around that point. Most top players sit when the game is over in the 3rd quarter. What you are saying can apply to anyone.

Yes I have seen him play. Like I said he's a undersized gap shooting type of DT. How he'll hold up vs the RUN in the NFL is a question. I'll tell you what, if he's on local, I'll give a full game write up very similar to what I did for Burns when he was drafted.

Oh, but coach his tackles for losses. Yes-- it is important.

You might want to look at our very own Hargrave. He was Mid-Eastern Athletic Conference (MEAC) Defensive Player of the Year, capping a dominant senior year with 22 tackles for loss, 13.5 sacks, and two forced fumbles. All this in one year! How's he doing in the NFL?

I'll give you another Steeler example. I agree tackles Rookie Matt Thomas had 21.5 tackles for a loss over his past two seasons playing better competition. He went un-drafted.

These tackles for losses vs the run just don't happen as often in the NFL because the OL and backs are much better. They happen far more often with a sack.

This question will tell me everything, do you think Oliver is off to a slow start or not?
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He was on Nationally when they played Arizona....I even let you know ahead of time. Oh and why does Chambers have more sacks? Could it be that Oliver draws a ton of pressure off the other guys???

I have seen many times where star players stay in just to pad stats for a Heisman run when they are playing inferior opponents or just have a big lead over a decent team.

say what you like...it is week 4 and UH hasn't even started league play yet. He sat out at least a quarter against Arizona and much of the game this week against TSU (Texas Southern University) who UH only added to the schedule as pay back for allowing them to use their basketball facilities while UH's new arena was being built.

He does more than shoot gaps, if teams try to use just one blocker he can drive that guy to where the ball is. Of course, like most top players, he is double teamed routinely and he can stand those two blockers up and still keeps his head up to find the ball and get loose to make a play.

Also the Mid-Eastern American Conference is NOT close to the American Conference. Some of Oliver's best games were against the best competition...he has multiple sacks against Baker Mayfield and Lamar Jackson.

please find the stats to prove RBs are tackled for a loss less often than QBs are sacked....

Oliver had a great first game, played well against Arizona, Tech was able to neutralize him by using their quick passing game to keep him from getting pressure and having to chase WRs at the sideline all day and this past week, he hardly played because it was not necessary to insure a victory against a weaker opponent. He will get sacks before the season is over,

still not sure why if you have seen him play a whole game you can not state what stands out about him on the field....it is an EASY question
 
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CoolieMan said:
He was on Nationally when they played Arizona....I even let you know ahead of time. Oh and why does Chambers have more sacks? Could it be that Oliver draws a ton of pressure off the other guys???

I have seen many times where star players stay in just to pad stats for a Heisman run when they are playing inferior opponents or just have a big lead over a decent team.

say what you like...it is week 4 and UH hasn't even started league play yet. He sat out at least a quarter against Arizona and much of the game this week against TSU (Texas Southern University) who UH only added to the schedule as pay back for allowing them to use their basketball facilities while UH's new arena was being built.

He does more than shoot gaps, if teams try to use just one blocker he can drive that guy to where the ball is. Of course, like most top players, he is double teamed routinely and he can stand those two blockers up and still keeps his head up to find the ball and get loose to make a play.

Also the Mid-Eastern American Conference is NOT close to the American Conference. Some of Oliver's best games were against the best competition...he has multiple sacks against Baker Mayfield and Lamar Jackson.

please find the stats to prove RBs are tackled for a loss less often than QBs are sacked....

Oliver had a great first game, played well against Arizona, Tech was able to neutralize him by using their quick passing game to keep him from getting pressure and having to chase WRs at the sideline all day and this past week, he hardly played because it was not necessary to insure a victory against a weaker opponent. He will get sacks before the season is over,

still not sure why if you have seen him play a whole game you can not state what stands out about him on the field....it is an EASY question
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No way coach has watched one complete game, I am calling it. Might have seen a youtube highlight if that. And glues in on his statistics.

I notice he didn't answer about those TFLs. Coach only picks and chooses the stats he feel is important to his agenda.
 
Come on Coach, you're creating a false argument here. Since when are NTs supposed to rush the passer each and every down? That never happens. Their job is to stop the run, clog the middle, and disrupt the pocket. When you're a freakish athlete like Ed, you end up getting sacks and TFLs when you are just doing your job.

Another huge point on Oliver, they scheme block, and he's going to his spot each and every time. So when he stunts with the RT he's on outside contain and isn't rushing in, the opposite when he stunts left. The thing that blows me away about him is that he immediately diagnoses WR screens, and gets to the edge to make plays, from the center of the field!

I could see Oliver excel as a 3 tech in the NFL, and with his leverage, still be disruptive as a 1 tech. Either way, that talent is going early in the draft. You don't get people on the D line often that can track down WRs, RBs, and athletic QBs from behind, to make plays.
 
SO, just to be clear......... Can each of you, Coolie & Coach post the BET perameters with out come win/loss/stakes.

I just want a very clear picture here. Thank you





Salute the nation
 
Coach said:
So an injury that sidelines him two game means you get an out? Seriously, Coolie, you don't want this wager!

But just to give you one more chance if he misses more than two games to injuries ( Bowl games do not count if he opts to sit out ) there is NO winner or loser. Re-read that twice.

If he misses less than three games, and goes in the top ten of the 2019 draft, you win ( slim chance ) but if misses less than 3 games but goes outside the top ten in the 2019 draft I win. ( As expected )

I've made several concessions for you here. If you're serious here's the chance to show the board.
Click to expand...

CoolieMan said:
the only concession you've made is eliminating the season ending injury, so stop acting like you are bending over backward for this

I'll take the bet..
Click to expand...
.

the bet is if I win, I ban Coach for a month, if I lose I don't post for a month ( I will still log in to moderate the board, but will not post any random comments)
 
Cope said:
Come on Coach, you're creating a false argument here. Since when are NTs supposed to rush the passer each and every down? That never happens. Their job is to stop the run, clog the middle, and disrupt the pocket. When you're a freakish athlete like Ed, you end up getting sacks and TFLs when you are just doing your job.

Another huge point on Oliver, they scheme block, and he's going to his spot each and every time. So when he stunts with the RT he's on outside contain and isn't rushing in, the opposite when he stunts left. The thing that blows me away about him is that he immediately diagnoses WR screens, and gets to the edge to make plays, from the center of the field!

I could see Oliver excel as a 3 tech in the NFL, and with his leverage, still be disruptive as a 1 tech. Either way, that talent is going early in the draft. You don't get people on the D line often that can track down WRs, RBs, and athletic QBs from behind, to make plays.
Click to expand...

As I said, he's not a 3-4 NT all the time. More than likely he's 4-3 on 3rd and long, or on obvious passing downs. His completion regales of the spin Collie is attempting is weak.
 
Coach said:
As I said, he's not a 3-4 NT all the time. More than likely he's 4-3 on 3rd and long, or on obvious passing downs. His completion regales of the spin Collie is attempting is weak.
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I have no clue what this is supposed to mean


until you watch a game you have no idea of where he lines up on any given play
 
Drink IRON City said:
SO, just to be clear......... Can each of you, Coolie & Coach post the BET perameters with out come win/loss/stakes.

I just want a very clear picture here. Thank you

Salute the nation
Click to expand...


I wanted Coolie to PM me to accept terms. He never did. Instead I aired out terms and he just accepted in this thread.

If Oliver goes in the top ten of the 2019 draft, he wins. If not I win.

The amount of times a interior DL ( , DT or NT ) has gone in the top ten in the past 8 draft is as follows

2018 0 times
2017 0 times
2016 0 times
2015 0 times
2014 0 times ( Arron Donald went 13th )
2013 0 times
2012 0 times ( Poe went in pick 11, Cox in pick 12 )
2011 1 time. Yes it happened, Marcell Dareus was the DT to break the streak. Of course Marcell Dareus was a house 330 pounds, and SEC battle tested. Oliver likely not 6’3, and under weight for a NT at 290 pounds playing in a weaker conference.

The 2019 draft is loaded with edge rushers who can get to the QB. I like my chances based on history, and Oliver's lack of sacks.
 
CoolieMan said:
I have no clue what this is supposed to mean

until you watch a game you have no idea of where he lines up on any given play
Click to expand...

And if I choose to watch a U of Houston game and give a full review, what will you say next? You only saw him once?

I'm not saying he won't play in the NFL, I'm saying he's under sized and not a sack man in college, and scouts will see that. I don't care if Mel Kiper has him going #1 overall.
 
Coach said:
I wanted Coolie to PM me to accept terms. He never did. Instead I aired out terms and he just accepted in this thread.

If Oliver goes in the top ten of the 2019 draft, he wins. If not I win.

The amount of times a interior DL ( , DT or NT ) has gone in the top ten in the past 8 draft is as follows

2018 0 times
2017 0 times
2016 0 times
2015 0 times
2014 0 times ( Arron Donald went 13th )
2013 0 times
2012 0 times ( Poe went in pick 11, Cox in pick 12 )
2011 1 time. Yes it happened, Marcell Dareus was the DT to break the streak. Of course Marcell Dareus was a house 330 pounds, and SEC battle tested. Oliver likely not 6’3, and under weight for a NT at 290 pounds playing in a weaker conference.

The 2019 draft is loaded with edge rushers who can get to the QB. I like my chances based on history, and Oliver's lack of sacks.
Click to expand...

you offered terms in this thread well before you tried to change them via PM. As I stated before, if I am making a bet on a message board, EVERYTHING to do with the bet will be spelled out in public for ALL to see. That way there is no dispute.

but of course you don't spell out the full terms of the bet in your response to Drink...
 
anyone know where I can find any analysis of this player?
 
Coach said:
And if I choose to watch a U of Houston game and give a full review, what will you say next? You only saw him once?

I'm not saying he won't play in the NFL, I'm saying he's under sized and not a sack man in college, and scouts will see that. I don't care if Mel Kiper has him going #1 overall.
Click to expand...

wait..."If you choose"??? You have stated before you have seen him play....which all knew was bullshit.

scouts will see him chasing and making plays way down field or at the sidelines, flushing the qb out of the pocket and into the LBs way catching guys from behind on screen passes...going full bore every single play he is on the field....

they will see him shoot gaps, knock the center or guard or both back into the back field, take on a double team while keeping his eyes on the plan and shedding the OL to get to the ball.

odds are he is not a full 6'3" 290 as listed by UH...but he could easily add 20 pounds to play in the NFL...and still be one of the fasted DL you ever saw

Scouts have been on campus since training camp watching him and how he practices, so they know better than you or I how he does what he does
 
Coach who??????? When will the actual bet take effect???




Salute the nation
 
Ike Kelly said:
It’s Oct 2....and one notable prognosticator still seems to believe Oliver is the real deal. Even with the rhetoric one person is saying about sacks, conference and whatever else he can use.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...quarter-mark-of-nfl-season?share=email#slide1


Sent from my iPhone


Sent from my iPhone using Steeler Nation mobile app
Click to expand...

Matt Miller is a notable prognosticator? Since when?

I question Ed Oliver's height ( under 6'3 " tall ) , arm length ( less than 34" ), weight ( less than 295 pounds ), lack of competition ( fact ) , and production as a pass rusher ( fact ).

In four games played this season he has zero sacks. I'm not sure how he would hold up vs the run in the NFL either as he's going to be giving up a lot of weight vs NFL guards. I plan to watch him in a full game and do a report. I have seen some video clips, he gets into the backfield well, but falls into some easy sacks like say Jason Gildon used to.

I took a look at the DL this year, there are 2 very good DT prospects in Gray - Michigan, and Davis - Alabama, which also offer versatility as 5 technique DL players. Oliver does not project as a DL 5 technique player. Also there are quite a few good edge rushers in Bosa - OSU, Ferrnell - Clemson, and Jackson - Miami. The common theme is almost all of these players are doing it vs top competition.

The NFL is starving for pass rusher, cover corners, and QB's. We don’t even know which underclassmen are going to come out.

I think I will win, but if by chance Coolie is right, well I had a lot of fun with the thread along the way.
 
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