• Please be aware we've switched the forums to their own URL. (again) You'll find the new website address to be www.steelernationforum.com Thanks
  • Please clear your private messages. Your inbox is close to being full.

Jacob Blake shooting

I don't know why anyone continues to resist or fight with the cops. It's not going to end well. He had kids and his wife in the car. Why not live to see another day? I will never understand that.

I understand it completely. For years now the lying, vile narrative has been, "cops are bad, cops are dangerous, cops will murder you. Resistance is brave, those resisting arrest are heroes!!"

******* George Floyd, one of the most useless bags of skin ever to walk the earth, a scum who helped beat up a pregnant woman and threatened to murder her baby, a guy who was high beyond measure and wanted to drive a car, is portrayed with wings and a halo.

iu


Yeah, an angel.

So when vile scum - and sorry, that is what George Floyd turned out to be - is made out to be a hero, an angel, every lowlife, scum criminal thinks resisting arrest is a great thing. You get away with it, you are a hero, you get some public money if things go south.

What is the downside to resisting arrest nowadays?
 
I understand it completely. For years now the lying, vile narrative has been, "cops are bad, cops are dangerous, cops will murder you. Resistance is brave, those resisting arrest are heroes!!"

******* George Floyd, one of the most useless bags of skin ever to walk the earth, a scum who helped beat up a pregnant woman and threatened to murder her baby, a guy who was high beyond measure and wanted to drive a car, is portrayed with wings and a halo.

iu


Yeah, an angel.

So when vile scum - and sorry, that is what George Floyd turned out to be - is made out to be a hero, an angel, every lowlife, scum criminal thinks resisting arrest is a great thing. You get away with it, you are a hero, you get some public money if things go south.

What is the downside to resisting arrest nowadays?

if you don't care to see tomorrow and your family will be well off for life, nothing.
 
I think you are completely missing - and I mean COMPLETELY missing - what is actually happening in our society. For more than 240 years, we were taught that we as citizens needed to obey law enforcement. End of story.

I'm not sure how you think he is completely missing anything other than you don't agree with what he stated. I'm not sure I totally agree with blindly obeying all law enforcement. Seems it would kind of depend if they were trampling on my constitutional rights or not. As this story isn't clear everything that happened that led up to the shooting........I will wait till it call comes out.

You know what the legal defenses are to resisting arrest? There are none. Take the issue up before a judge. If we allow every criminal to get into a wrestling contest over every arrest - as black males now seem to believe is the way to go - this is what happens.

So, only black males resist arrest......or they are mostly the ones resisting arrest? No defense for resisting.......yes, it can be taken up with the judge and I know several people that have had the charges thrown out because of what the cop called "resisting"

Further, the simple, ugly truth is this: The endless criticism of police and policing has encouraged criminals to fight and resist and get into physical altercations. The criminals are now portrayed as victims, and law enforcement as evil. Why the **** are you surprised that more and more black males are ignoring simple commands from the police and getting into fights instead? They are glorified for doing so.

Why can't police be criticized? Are they above this? The population at large isn't looking at criminals as victims. Of course the media is feeding this to the public that way and certain people are lapping it up on both sides. Again, only black males ignore "commands" from the police? Them being glorified for it is your opinion.
Most black people aren't glorifying those types of actions.


Also, and I cannot believe this needs to be discussed, are you saying the cops should never shoot a suspect in the back, under any circumstances? How about where the suspect has already grappled with two cops, was not slowed by the taser, ignores commands to stop moving, moves towards his car, ignores further commands to stop, goes to his car, brushes off the cop trying to get him to stop, opens the back door, and reaches in? His back is to the cop, so I guess you expect law enforcement to wait for the guy to turn and see how many rounds he can put in your face before responding.

There are probably cases where it was warranted to shoot in the back, but not many. Right now it doesn't look good on either side of this case, but we don't have all of the facts yet. No one knows if there was a weapon in the car. The guy did stupid **** and should not have gone to the car, but does that mean he deserved to be shot. Not sure of that yet. I'm going to have to check the video out again, but how many cops were there and they couldn't restrain him before he got up to go to the car?
Just some things I'm questioning right now.


Yes, that is exactly what you are saying. Exactly. Maybe the guy is getting a note pad to document his strenuous objections to the police behavior. Maybe he is getting lipstick, fearful it is melting in the heat. Maybe he is getting a knife or a gun, to kill the officer after wrestling with him, ignoring commands, brushing off the taser, going to the car to get something over the direct and very loud orders to stop.

So, Occam, with your life on the line, which do you think is more likely?

Finally, if you were in Afghanistan, encountered a young male who was overtly hostile to you, got into a wrestling contest with the guy who simply shrugged you off and walked away, where you then pointed your weapons at him, ordered him (in his native language) to stop moving, ordered him to stop moving towards a vehicle, he continued on to the vehicle, and reached into the back seat, would you simply wait to see if he pulled out a an ice cream cone or a gun or a grenade?


I said it before and I will say it again..........both sides acted stupidly, and this probably did not need to end with this guy getting shot in the back in front of his kids. One can think that the guy shouldn't have fought and went to the car, as well as question the cops actions and how they handled it and if it could have been handled better.
 
I don't see how the cops acted stupidly here. Unless you think they should have waited for the guy to turn around with whatever he grabbed from his car. Which basically means you think the cops should just stand there and possibly get shot or worse yet, watch this guy shoot his own kids then himself.

Is that the standard now? Cops must actually get shot first before they can use force? Maybe not even that anymore because Breona Taylor was killed because her boyfriend shot at cops and they returned fire. So apparently the standard now is cops just let everybody go
 
I hate this line of argument more than any other.

"Why'd you shoot him seven times?"

Because he was still standing after six.

You shoot a guy to disable him, including killing him. No other reason. You keep shooting until the criminal is done. That took seven rounds.

Bc I didn’t have 8
 
I don't see how the cops acted stupidly here. Unless you think they should have waited for the guy to turn around with whatever he grabbed from his car. Which basically means you think the cops should just stand there and possibly get shot or worse yet, watch this guy shoot his own kids then himself.

Is that the standard now? Cops must actually get shot first before they can use force? Maybe not even that anymore because Breona Taylor was killed because her boyfriend shot at cops and they returned fire. So apparently the standard now is cops just let everybody go

Not sure that anyone said the cops should get shot first before acting. I think it should be acceptable and normal to question things that happened. Are you saying we shouldn't question how it was handled by the cops at all? I'm saying from what is being shown at this point there is room to question the actions of both sides. We all still don't know the whole story, and until then it's just a discussion.

As for Breonna Taylor, that is a whole different discussion on no knock warrants and the process behind getting one, and if they should even be a thing. Her boyfriend fired because he thought people were trying to break in as he stated.....the police did not announce they were the police (corroborated by several residents of the apartment complex) so he fired. The police returned fire. I don't agree that the cops should be arrested for that...........this is about the whole procedure before it got to that point. Not sure how anyone can be behind no knock warrants.
 
I'm not sure how you think he is completely missing anything other than you don't agree with what he stated. I'm not sure I totally agree with blindly obeying all law enforcement. Seems it would kind of depend if they were trampling on my constitutional rights or not. As this story isn't clear everything that happened that led up to the shooting........I will wait till it call comes out.

"Blindly" following law enforcement is what you do when the cops are telling you things like, "sit down" or "stay in the car" or "don't punch me."

If you think that the police have "trampled your constitutional rights," then talk to a lawyer. Your method involves a battle in the streets, which leads to people getting shot, which leads to dumb people doing dumb things.

Go to court for **** sake. Our entire goddamn system is built on protecting rights through a process, not lighting a car on fire or grappling with police. You want to know the one process referenced more than any other in the bill of rights? The process of going to court to assert or defend your rights.

Unfortunately, the vast majority of Americans are now so woefully ignorant of the Constitution and the process for protecting rights that scuffling in the street is seen as a valid alternative.

It's not. Seriously, the country is 130 years removed from gunfights in the street to assert or protect rights, and now we have a bunch of people, you included it seems, that want to return to that way of doing things.

So, only black males resist arrest......or they are mostly the ones resisting arrest? No defense for resisting.......yes, it can be taken up with the judge and I know several people that have had the charges thrown out because of what the cop called "resisting"

First off, why don't you tell me the last time cities burned and businesses were looted because of what happened to a white guy during an arrest. Oh, none. So I focus on the actual issue, not a make-believe, i.e., anybody other than black suspects getting injured, shot. If and when cities burn, businesses are looted, citizens are attacked and killed, because of the arrest of a white guy, let me know.

Or do you want to argue fictional situations instead? Okay, sure. When I flap my arms and fly, I need a loose-fitting tee shirt. How about you?

Second, you talk about people you know who went to somewhere and had rights vindicated. A parking lot for a brawl? A boxing ring? A cage match? Huh, seems like somewhere else. Let me see ... nope, can't think of anywhere else to resolve these issues. Wait, did one of the participants wear a robe? Like this?

58013557b6e31.image.jpg


Why can't police be criticized? Are they above this? The population at large isn't looking at criminals as victims. Of course the media is feeding this to the public that way and certain people are lapping it up on both sides. Again, only black males ignore "commands" from the police? Them being glorified for it is your opinion. Most black people aren't glorifying those types of actions.

Some key black leaders commenting well after the rioting, burning and looting started:

“When the fires were burning, and people were chanting, I just felt liberated for a brief moment, and I felt for one of the only times in my life that the government had no control over me," said [BLM leader] Newsome.

“You look at the protests and that was a far more representative cross-section of America out on the streets peacefully protesting who felt moved to do something because the instance they had seen injustice,” Obama said. “That didn’t exist in the 1960s, that kind of broad coalition.”

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">My statement on the death of George Floyd: <a href="https://t.co/Hg1k9JHT6R">pic.twitter.com/Hg1k9JHT6R</a></p>— Barack Obama (@BarackObama) <a href="https://twitter.com/BarackObama/status/1266400635429310466?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 29, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

MadMax: "We talked about this state of mind and atmosphere people find themselves in. Then on top of that, you get this very, very unsettling display of a police officer using the power of that gun and that badge to literally kill somebody in plain daylight with people watching and begging him to stop, on top of all of what we’ve been experiencing in last few months: Breonna Taylor, Ahmaud Arbery, then that incident with what they call Karen [Amy Cooper calling the police on Christian Cooper in Central Park in late May]; the first thing I thought about that was Emmett Till, and all these stories of white women who have accused men of being sexually aggressive and been hung and been killed. The stories of blacks incorporate that story; and we all learn very early on, it’s talked about a lot in the black community. There is all of that frustration, and yes, we remember what happened to Eric Garner who died from a choke hold, Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown, and on and on and on."

"So you have young people who have decided that they’re just not gonna take it anymore, and it’s not just young blacks. It’s young whites deciding to defy their mothers and fathers and families to be out in these streets. That’s telling us something — that it’s not only black people fed up with the police Establishment."

I said it before and I will say it again..........both sides acted stupidly, and this probably did not need to end with this guy getting shot in the back in front of his kids. One can think that the guy shouldn't have fought and went to the car, as well as question the cops actions and how they handled it and if it could have been handled better.

Oh for **** sake, any situation where somebody ended up dead "could have been handled better."

I am going out on a limb here and say you have never lived a day in your life where you could not have done something better. Neither have I.

But these Monday morning QB comments about how cops should do this or do that or wait to see what they guy takes out of the car or should have tackled him (they tried) or should have tazed him (they did) and all the rest are the tinder for the fires now burning across America. You of course have ******* right to criticize and say basically anything you want, but maybe you should think about whether or not because you can do something means that you should.

You and a ton of others are certainly comfortable heaping disdain on cops. You are front-and-center as to what the cop did wrong.

While sitting at a computer, comfortable, protected by those police - until you're not because the hatred directed at police, the violence they face every day, the risk of injury or death, of being in a wheelchair at age 45, of now being prosecuted, means a whole lot less very good people who wanted to be cops are no longer going to be cops.

Finally, if you think BLM gives a flying **** about anything other than destroying police and then getting paid billions for mob protection - the modern, government and media-backed Cosa Nostra - you are not living in reality.
 
Not sure that anyone said the cops should get shot first before acting. I think it should be acceptable and normal to question things that happened.

So please enlighten all of us with your considerable knowledge of proper police procedures:

What exactly should the officer have done differently? You just eliminated "wait to see what the guy pulls from the back seat," which I had thought was your point until challenged on it.

So what should the cop have done? Tell us.
 
So please enlighten all of us with your considerable knowledge of proper police procedures:

What exactly should the officer have done differently? You just eliminated "wait to see what the guy pulls from the back seat," which I had thought was your point until challenged on it.

So what should the cop have done? Tell us.

I'm not piling on NC, but I asked the same general question. I want to know how anyone lets him go into his car and pull out whatever he is grabbing after tackling and taser didn't work on him.
 
Last edited:
I'm not piling on NC, but I asked the same general question. I want to know how anyone lets him go into his car and pull out whatever he is grabbing after tackling and taser didn't work on him.

Maybe a time machine? If you're the cop, go back four hours and ******* call in sick.
 
I'm not piling on NC, but I asked the same general question. I want to know how anyone lets him go into his car and pull out whatever he is grabbing after tackling and taser didn't work on him.

Cops need those shock sticks from Judge Dredd that instantly knock people out. Or they could go back to cracking skulls with good old knightsticks when thugs resist arrest.
 
So please enlighten all of us with your considerable knowledge of proper police procedures:

What exactly should the officer have done differently? You just eliminated "wait to see what the guy pulls from the back seat," which I had thought was your point until challenged on it.

So what should the cop have done? Tell us.

Never made the point of "wait to see what the guy pulls from the back seat" so not sure how I could have been challenged on that. I was looking at what was done prior to him making it to the vehicle. That is hard to tell from the 2nd grainy shaky video shown of the incident. I even said, the guy was stupid for fighting with the cops. Not sure why he would do something like that, but he chose wrong. I'm questioning why 3 officers couldn't take one man down without using their guns. He didn't look like a linebacker or anything like that. Perhaps training is an issue on that part, not sure. We don't know all the details yet, just a couple of videos and opinions.
 
Never made the point of "wait to see what the guy pulls from the back seat" so not sure how I could have been challenged on that. I was looking at what was done prior to him making it to the vehicle. That is hard to tell from the 2nd grainy shaky video shown of the incident. I even said, the guy was stupid for fighting with the cops. Not sure why he would do something like that, but he chose wrong. I'm questioning why 3 officers couldn't take one man down without using their guns. He didn't look like a linebacker or anything like that. Perhaps training is an issue on that part, not sure. We don't know all the details yet, just a couple of videos and opinions.

If a taser didn't take him down who knows, may have been whacked out on some kind of drugs.
 
there is absolutely no reason for me to come to SN for politics and religion.
ever
 
If a taser didn't take him down who knows, may have been whacked out on some kind of drugs.

Tasers have a high take down rate, but if not deployed correctly or no good contact on skin they aren't as effective. Drugs can alter the effectiveness as well. So, who knows.
 
the taser was discharged, but malfunctioned - seems I saw that somewhere.

i dont know if that was prior to the struggle where Jacob Blake was quite literally on the ground (so it would seem he'd know the cops were focused on arresting him and only him at that point) or when he managed to get to his feet on the passenger side of the vehicle. Regardless, the cops are telling him to stop. Just because he got off the ground after struggling with the cops does not mean that a separate incident has begun. So he should know that the cops were still focused on him and his actions. When he refused to comply with police commands, he quite literally put himself and everyone else there in danger.

I do believe that shooting the guy 7 times in the back may have been excessive on first viewing, but consider the cop's perspective:

try to cuff suspect
end up struggling with suspect as he resisted
go to the ground with suspect - and your partner - while trying to cuff suspect
suspect continues to resist and manages to get to his feet
you and your partner command suspect to stop
suspect ignores commands
suspect keeps his hands where you cannot see them
suspect says he's getting a gun/weapon
suspect continues to ignore commands
suspect gets to the driver side of car and opens a door with a woman and kids inside

do you:
A) shrug everything off and leave the scene
B) escalate your attempts to subdue the suspect

keep in mind, the guy wasnt arrested yet. had he not had a warrant out for his arrest, the situation likely would have been cleared up quickly and without any bloodshed. also consider that Jacob Blake brought a lot of this on himself.
 
Powerful statement by his mother. Calling for unity, an end to the violence and destruction. Praying for police officers and their families as well as black and brown people. What an amazing woman.
 
Now Crump trying to do the opposite and inflame everyone.
 
there is absolutely no reason for me to come to SN for politics and religion.
ever

Yes, there are opinions different from yours....BEWARE!!!!!!!!!!!
 
there is absolutely no reason for me to come to SN for politics and religion.
ever

Hey, I remember you Ski. You got all redassed in the Trayngel thread and bailed out of this side of the board back then. Well, anyway...hi.
 
I actually think this guy was shot because the cops showed extra restraint due to all the protests against cops. Think about it. They allowed this guy to fight them, then they let him walk away from them and then passively followed him apparently hoping he would give himself up. Then it was too late and they had to make a split second no-win decision.

If you look at the situation honestly, the only way they could have handled it better was to use MORE force. They should have piled on him and got him cuffed on the ground and as soon as he got up, they should have tackled him to the ground. Why didn't they? Because they were all scared of being that next cop on TV for excessive force. So they tried to let him do his thing until it was too late.
 
Never made the point of "wait to see what the guy pulls from the back seat" so not sure how I could have been challenged on that. I was looking at what was done prior to him making it to the vehicle. That is hard to tell from the 2nd grainy shaky video shown of the incident.

According to witnesses and the video, the two cops spoke to him about interfering with their investigation of a domestic violence issue, told him to stay out of it, he was not compliant, insisted on getting involved, the cops told him to leave, he didn't, a struggle ensued when he would not follow directions, the cops wrestled with him, he got up, was tazed, and continued on to the car. Every news report and the available video so far confirms those facts.

Still criticize the cops if those turn out to be the facts?

Here's an idea: How about we wait to see what happens in some sort of controlled setting, where members of the public are free to attend, members of the public decide whom to believe and who did what, and these members of the public - I'll call them a "jury" - render their determination pursuant to the ... oh, I don't know, I'll call them ""laws."

Nope, can't have that. Burning, rioting, assaults and looting are much better. Much.
 
Now these officers haven't been fired yet right? Just put on admin leave. I think that should tell us something. Like maybe their boss didn't see a whole lot wrong with this, maybe. Just saying.
 
Top