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"Najee Harris ain't it". NAJEE 3.0 It's time to go, yo....

bigben said:
Statistics are facts, everything else is just opinion. Comparing statistics is comparing statistics.
It only feels like bashing to you because the facts do not and never have supported you're opinion.
1000 yards a season is a lame argument in a 17 game season when he has had more volume than everyone except Derrick Henry. Henry had 1200 more rush yards in 10 fewer games over the past 4 seasons.
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Please, please, PLEASE tell me that you are NOT comparing our OL or running game to Baltimore's??? Yes, Derrick Henry is still beastin'; but, ANYONE, who watches football, knows that their offense is top tier - heavily based on their massive OL and athletes at RB/QB.

The floor is now yours...
 
stillwright said:
Harris is what you want from a player on and off the field. I stated my reasons at least a dozen plus times. At even $9 mill a year what they asked of him would be a bargain. Plus add into his locker room presence. Wanting to be a leader. When as a team we sumply don't have one. None. Zero. A new team first culture could have been started.

Defensively I was referring to Slay and Cam from last year getting his 3 year extension at $15 per. Watt will also most likely get $40 mill plus.
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Totally understand all of the good guy reasons for Najee. He is a great guy! Slow slow slow to anywhere unless it is a wide open field, and he might still try to spin or juke :). The toss plays were ridiculous, but that was OC idiocy, in fact even most of the screens by the time he turned to run, half of the defense was standing there. The guy can not see the hole, or he can not get to it in time. That became blatantly obvious the more he was on the field. No contest on being a great guy, but glad he is gone. Let's get someone with some electricity left in his legs and leave the leadership role to a more stable position...if there is such a thing anymore.
 
bermudasteel said:
I sighed because no matter what 'proof' is presented - some of you think every RB is supposed to be Barry Sanders...comparing Najee to Terrell Edmunds is, well, just asinine; but, it is your opinion.
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Again, I guess we'll see this year.

Any predictions on his output with the chargers?

My guess is that he gets fewer rushing and total yards because he won't get the touches he got here and he produces on volume.

I think his per carry / per touch and success rates will all remain consist as they have over the 1250 touches he had with us (although his success rate was down somewhat sharply this last season).

I also think he won't break a 40 yard run.

He's had more than enough touches to know what he is imo.
 
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BringBackBubby said:
Totally understand all of the good guy reasons for Najee. He is a great guy! Slow slow slow to anywhere unless it is a wide open field, and he might still try to spin or juke :). The toss plays were ridiculous, but that was OC idiocy, in fact even most of the screens by the time he turned to run, half of the defense was standing there. The guy can not see the hole, or he can not get to it in time. That became blatantly obvious the more he was on the field. No contest on being a great guy, but glad he is gone. Let's get someone with some electricity left in his legs and leave the leadership role to a more stable position...if there is such a thing anymore.
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As slow slow slow as he was....he still got 1000 yards and a 4 yard average behind a horrible OL and even worse offensive philosophy and scheme. What would have been acceptable numbers for you? 1300 yards? 4.3 ypc....4.5 ypc?
 
stillwright said:
As slow slow slow as he was....he still got 1000 yards and a 4 yard average behind a horrible OL and even worse offensive philosophy and scheme. What would have been acceptable numbers for you? 1300 yards? 4.3 ypc....4.5 ypc?
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Najee is slow, Najee barely got 1,000 yards, his longest run is 40 yards...How come no one takes into account that the offense itself barely gets "expected" numbers from a 17 game season? It's always Najee vs Warren when we use them differently. I personally think that he's going to have a career year in LA. They have a QB, an offense that fits his skillset, a coach that knows his skillset and will use him accordingly.

What I also know is, Najee gets hammered on this board for the 100 yard game stat. How about this stat, in the 4 years Najee was with the Steelers, there have been SIX total 300 yard passing games. Three of those games were in his rookie year with Ben, his best statistical year. The offense has been **** for years, we all know it. The scheme is archaic, elementary, easily defended, the offensive line underperforms, the WR's besides GP have been less than stellar, but Najee sucks. Make it make sense. We're supposed to have an all pro back, putting up 1300-1400 yards with this offense?
 
stillwright said:
Harris is what you want from a player on and off the field. I stated my reasons at least a dozen plus times. At even $9 mill a year what they asked of him would be a bargain. Plus add into his locker room presence. Wanting to be a leader. When as a team we sumply don't have one. None. Zero. A new team first culture could have been started.

Defensively I was referring to Slay and Cam from last year getting his 3 year extension at $15 per. Watt will also most likely get $40 mill plus.
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Harris is what you want from a teammate, as a player on the field he’s rather mid and very replaceable. If we’re paying for performance his contract should be mid as well (see the contract he was able to attain in the free market)

Gotcha thought I may have missed a defensive signing. At least Cam earned his money last year, hopefully he does it again and defies Father Time. For what Cam did last year he earned every bit of it…will he repeat the performance is a BIG IF tho.

The TJ extension seems like it could be problematic as he isn’t even used properly so it definitely seems like it could become a horrid waste of funds.
 
Fiji Mariner said:
Harris is what you want from a teammate, as a player on the field he’s rather mid and very replaceable. If we’re paying for performance his contract should be mid as well (see the contract he was able to attain in the free market)

Gotcha thought I may have missed a defensive signing. At least Cam earned his money last year, hopefully he does it again and defies Father Time. For what Cam did last year he earned every bit of it…will he repeat the performance is a BIG IF tho.

The TJ extension seems like it could be problematic as he isn’t even used properly so it definitely seems like it could become a horrid waste of funds.
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Like making Minkah the highest paid safety after watching him be a game changer, and then just having him play centerfield, I'm so glad our Coach is smarter than everyone else.
 
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insaniti said:
Najee is slow, Najee barely got 1,000 yards, his longest run is 40 yards...How come no one takes into account that the offense itself barely gets "expected" numbers from a 17 game season? It's always Najee vs Warren when we use them differently. I personally think that he's going to have a career year in LA. They have a QB, an offense that fits his skillset, a coach that knows his skillset and will use him accordingly.

What I also know is, Najee gets hammered on this board for the 100 yard game stat. How about this stat, in the 4 years Najee was with the Steelers, there have been SIX total 300 yard passing games. Three of those games were in his rookie year with Ben, his best statistical year. The offense has been **** for years, we all know it. The scheme is archaic, elementary, easily defended, the offensive line underperforms, the WR's besides GP have been less than stellar, but Najee sucks. Make it make sense. We're supposed to have an all pro back, putting up 1300-1400 yards with this offense?
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No question the offense as a whole has been bad.

It will be interesting to see how he does with a good QB. But there's also pretty close to a 0% chance he gets the number of touches he got in his rookie year.

It's not that Najee is bad. He isn't bad. He's average on the field. And above average because of his durability.

He's a valuable piece in a good offense.

But we tried to make him the centerpiece of the offense. We wanted / needed him to be Henry, or Barkley, or Chubb in their primes.

And he's simply not a big time play maker like those guys are.

I think we were using him more of less properly last year. As the 60 in a 60/40 split. Maybe would have been a 50/50 split if Warren was healthy all year.

This is an "everyone sucks here" kind of thing. The coaches for forcing him to try to be something he isn't is a big part of this. Canada was terrible for everyone (hired my Tomlin with Rooney too slow to allow the firing).

I have my thoughts on how he'll do with the Chargers. But they are just guesses. It will be genuinely interesting to see what happens there.
 
stillwright said:
As slow slow slow as he was....he still got 1000 yards and a 4 yard average behind a horrible OL and even worse offensive philosophy and scheme. What would have been acceptable numbers for you? 1300 yards? 4.3 ypc....4.5 ypc?
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I agree, he has heart, talent and medium speed for the NFL. I hope he flourishes elsewhere, he could be a beast running North and South. Maybe the only thing to do with it, that we may never know, is that his fate on this team was decided on February 2, 2024. If a new OC is coming to town, would he not have any say in the future of the offense? Najee did have a few good games that he decided to run north and south, ( I say decided... as a positive, He ran to the hole, made a decision, and committed. Not something he consistently does, or did for whatever reason) but right after that..his weaknesses were exposed, what seemed like relentlessly. What other reason would Smith keep calling those plays, with Najee? Was it his intention to remind the front office why Najee was not the rb that he wanted to move forward with?
 
NorthernBlitz said:
No question the offense as a whole has been bad.

It will be interesting to see how he does with a good QB. But there's also pretty close to a 0% chance he gets the number of touches he got in his rookie year.

It's not that Najee is bad. He isn't bad. He's average on the field. And above average because of his durability.

He's a valuable piece in a good offense.

But we tried to make him the centerpiece of the offense. We wanted / needed him to be Henry, or Barkley, or Chubb in their primes.

And he's simply not a big time play maker like those guys are.

I think we were using him more of less properly last year. As the 60 in a 60/40 split. Maybe would have been a 50/50 split if Warren was healthy all year.

This is an "everyone sucks here" kind of thing. The coaches for forcing him to try to be something he isn't is a big part of this. Canada was terrible for everyone (hired my Tomlin with Rooney too slow to allow the firing).

I have my thoughts on how he'll do with the Chargers. But they are just guesses. It will be genuinely interesting to see what happens there.
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Barkley wasn't Barkley until he got a real OL in front of him.
 
BringBackBubby said:
I agree, he has heart, talent and medium speed for the NFL. I hope he flourishes elsewhere, he could be a beast running North and South. Maybe the only thing to do with it, that we may never know, is that his fate on this team was decided on February 2, 2024. If a new OC is coming to town, would he not have any say in the future of the offense? Najee did have a few good games that he decided to run north and south, ( I say decided... as a positive, He ran to the hole, made a decision, and committed. Not something he consistently does, or did for whatever reason) but right after that..his weaknesses were exposed, what seemed like relentlessly. What other reason would Smith keep calling those plays, with Najee? Was it his intention to remind the front office why Najee was not the rb that he wanted to move forward with?
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Not really his weakness. Our Offense's weakness. Constantly running into stacked boxes. Defenses knew we would run 99% on first down. 85% on second down. They knew when we threw the ball the middle of the field was off limits. No play action was used. The weakness was the play calling. The game plan. The non adjustments we would make. And yet....he still was able to grind out a 1000 yards with a 4 yard avg per season. Harris is who he is. They drafted him to carry the load and built a running game that didn't fit him. Yet poster lame the blame on Harris. Go figure.
 
stillwright said:
Warren is under contract for one season. The guy from Philly for one season. Patterson for one more season. If we draft a RB....we have him four 4 years if he is drafted outside the 1st round. We won't have anyone under contract but them after this season. Yeah. I was being short sighted.
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Warren is probably signed to a new contract, with najee you'd still have him in a one year contract but with more usage on those wheels
 
Fiji Mariner said:
Harris is what you want from a teammate, as a player on the field he’s rather mid and very replaceable. If we’re paying for performance his contract should be mid as well (see the contract he was able to attain in the free market)

Gotcha thought I may have missed a defensive signing. At least Cam earned his money last year, hopefully he does it again and defies Father Time. For what Cam did last year he earned every bit of it…will he repeat the performance is a BIG IF tho.

The TJ extension seems like it could be problematic as he isn’t even used properly so it definitely seems like it could become a horrid waste of funds.
Click to expand...
Cam racked up the sacks. Since his sack numbers have risen....our run has suffered. Maybe he forgot part of his job is stuffing the run. Or maybe it simply is an afterthought anymore in this Tomlin defense. Watching the Ravens run 12 straight runs down our throat and eventually score a TD was putrid. He is not a $15 mill a year player. Maybe half that.
 
stillwright said:
Cam racked up the sacks. Since his sack numbers have risen....our run has suffered. Maybe he forgot part of his job is stuffing the run. Or maybe it simply is an afterthought anymore in this Tomlin defense. Watching the Ravens run 12 straight runs down our throat and eventually score a TD was putrid. He is not a $15 mill a year player. Maybe half that.
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Or the fact we had our LBs gunning for Henry regardless of who had to ball. Also can't forget the lack of using more DL or big bodies. Hard to blame Cam when we are putting people in position to fail
 
stillwright said:
Not really his weakness. Our Offense's weakness. Constantly running into stacked boxes. Defenses knew we would run 99% on first down. 85% on second down. They knew when we threw the ball the middle of the field was off limits. No play action was used. The weakness was the play calling. The game plan. The non adjustments we would make. And yet....he still was able to grind out a 1000 yards with a 4 yard avg per season. Harris is who he is. They drafted him to carry the load and built a running game that didn't fit him. Yet poster lame the blame on Harris. Go figure.
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" Yet poster lame the blame on Harris. Go figure. " You know, I put the date that Smith was hired in my post for a reason right?
 
insaniti said:
Barkley wasn't Barkley until he got a real OL in front of him.
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I think this might be a good example of only looking at totals and not looking at rate stats (he got 1,000 rushing yards every year!!!).

Compare their rookie years. Barkley had 200 more yards. But almost 50 fewer carries! That's a huge difference. Najee basically got 6 carries for every 5 Barkley got.

Barkley wasn't the monster he was last year with the Giants. But he was better than Najee's career best year on a per carry basis in 3 of his first 6 years. And he had longs in the 60 and 70 yard range in half those seasons too. Najee hasn't ever run for 40 yards. Never longer than Bettis' long in his final year, when ESPN and company were making fun of the fact that we only put him in when we just needed 1 yard gains.

It's also a good example about how incredible Najee is at being consistently average. Every year his per carry stats are the same. Unlike Barkley, who had some wild swing.

That's why I think it's pretty fair to assume that Najee will get his 3.8 - 4.1 YPC again next year. Because that's what he is. A guy who consistently gives you pretty much right at the break point of a successful run. And pretty much never gives you the huge gamebreaking play.

He's a good back. And a valuable piece. But we tried to make him the centerpiece of the offense. And he isn't that guy.

It's not his fault that we drafted him in the first and put those expectations on him. But the reason he didn't get a 2nd contract here and could only get a 1 year deal with lots of incentives is because it's pretty clear what he is.

And he's a good person. I hope that I'm wrong about him and he tears up the league any time he's not playing us. I don't think it's going to happen.

But he's going to run the experiment with the Chargers. And we'll see what happens.
 
stillwright said:
Cam racked up the sacks. Since his sack numbers have risen....our run has suffered. Maybe he forgot part of his job is stuffing the run. Or maybe it simply is an afterthought anymore in this Tomlin defense. Watching the Ravens run 12 straight runs down our throat and eventually score a TD was putrid. He is not a $15 mill a year player. Maybe half that.
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Can't tell if this is sarcasm or not.

My understanding is that the run defense with and without Cam on the field is significantly different. He's still easily the best run defender on the DL (although I get it if the argument is that the bar there is not high).
 
jitter77 said:
Or the fact we had our LBs gunning for Henry regardless of who had to ball. Also can't forget the lack of using more DL or big bodies. Hard to blame Cam when we are putting people in position to fail
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Yep. You probably are correct. Same might be said for Harris also probably.

The prior game against the Ravens we had our OLBers crashing in on Jackson every play and Henry gashed us. So the playoff game we did the opposite. Either or is fine. Someone else has to account for the opposite of what our OLBers are doing and/or make an adjustment at some point. We seemed to do neither oddly. Shocker. I know.
 
insaniti said:
Najee is slow, Najee barely got 1,000 yards, his longest run is 40 yards...How come no one takes into account that the offense itself barely gets "expected" numbers from a 17 game season? It's always Najee vs Warren when we use them differently. I personally think that he's going to have a career year in LA. They have a QB, an offense that fits his skillset, a coach that knows his skillset and will use him accordingly.

What I also know is, Najee gets hammered on this board for the 100 yard game stat. How about this stat, in the 4 years Najee was with the Steelers, there have been SIX total 300 yard passing games. Three of those games were in his rookie year with Ben, his best statistical year. The offense has been **** for years, we all know it. The scheme is archaic, elementary, easily defended, the offensive line underperforms, the WR's besides GP have been less than stellar, but Najee sucks. Make it make sense. We're supposed to have an all pro back, putting up 1300-1400 yards with this offense?
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Agree 100%. It is mind boggling. And all because he was a "1st round pick". The malcontent say if he was a 2nd or 3rd rounder etc all would be good. So because he was a 1st rounders he sucks. Smh
 
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