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Pickens a no show at Russ' throwing drills

Greg Lloyd said:
I'd like to think it's just youth but he seems like another Tomlin problem player just waiting to blow up. Sure, I was "young and dumb" - I did most of the dumb stuff younger people do, but I've never done anything like not bother to block a defender right in front of me. And certainly not on a level of in an NFL game. You'd think just natural instincts would take over of wanting to help out the team. Like he had to try to be a problem, selfish player to do that. I don't know, with Shades' track record of fostering diva players...I just don't know. Always with the "I'm your buddy" agenda. Just great, Shades, way to be. I don't know of any "great" coaches with such a "buddy, buddy" agenda. As a matter of fact, I've heard other truly "great" coaches say they decided on having to be the opposite (Parcells, Hoodie, Jimmy Johnson).
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All this about how Tomlin handles guys differently, or lacks consistency...he probably does. What coach doesn't? What should have Parcells done with Lawrence Taylor? LT was not a model player by any stretch of the imagination. Do you think Parcells handled him differently then say Phil McConkey? Do you think he over looked things with Taylor that he wouldn't with other players? He sure as hell must have with what we have learned about Taylor over the years.

How about Jimmy Johnson. Those Cowboys teams. Are you kidding me? The White House? Oh yeah, Jimmy Johnson was Captain Discipline.

Hoodie? Aaron Hernandez? Does a guy who is so great with discipline...cheat?

Look, if the argument is that it is different because they won with those types of situations and Tomlin didn't...fine. But do not advance the idea that they didn't have those situations because they were such great disciplinarians. That is just wrong.
 
Drink IRON City said:
This is the part of the Tomlin coaching I truly dislike. N o rhyme or reason on many things. Clearly a coach who doesn’t seem to have the little things covered.

Someone here said in a post that they went to a game and noticed how unorganized the pre-game warm-ups are as compared to the other teams. That is nothing new, it’s been that way since about as long as the players realized they didn’t have to be accountable to that. The more the “Cowher” disciplined player retired or moved on, the more lackadaisical the team became. Why the hellA wouldn’t you want to play for a coach who seems to let you just get by and not seem to have much disciplinary structure for the team.

Coach Tomlin, make us all a believer, win 4 consecutive play off games.


Salute the nation
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He coaches with his gut. He really does. There really is no rhyme or reason all gut.
Every coach handles stars differently. Lets not kid ourselves here. Its just when it gets so blatent. The guy ****** recorded you giving a post game speech and broadcasted it to the world. Like if you can't even respect the room....... Same with that clear half assed effort by DJ and Pickens. Canrt win with those guys.
 
Steelr4evr said:
If you can't do the little things right, you'll never get the big things right.
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If you can't adjust on the fly you will find yourself with mediocre results.

That is where this franchise is, and has been. Not sure if a new OC changes that, we'll see. As MT is very much a creature of habit who isn't an offensive minded coach.
 
Kahn & Wiedl are two things different and also what we have going for us.

If anyone expects a 180 degree turn around in the Tomlin coaching prowess, you'll be disappointed.

If Art 2 laid down a little law, it will be in a direction Tomlin is unfamiliar with, causing indecisiveness or soft kick-back to old habits.

On the plus side, the Tomlin may adapt well, may get things a little better in that players will be in more suited positions they play. All that will help the end results of continuing the non[losing season awards and hope fully improve upon a playoff win along the way.

There are adjustments made through out the entire game, 1/2 time is usually the more concentrated due to more time to make them.


Salute the nation
 
slashsteel said:
If you can't adjust on the fly you will find yourself with mediocre results.

That is where this franchise is, and has been. Not sure if a new OC changes that, we'll see. As MT is very much a creature of habit who isn't an offensive minded coach.
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That's for sure. We've watched it over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. You can't fix it.

So far it's been a fatal flaw.
 
Step back a minute and listen to us. Brown recorded a post game speech and put it out there...DJ and Pickens didn't complete plays. These are the pressing issues. C'mon. Pretty minor stuff all told. In the '70s, Ernie Holmes was shooting at helicopters. Joe Gilliam was strung out on cocaine. Joe Greene got pissed off late in the '74 season and walked out on the team. Walked out on the team! The Cowboys had the White House. Hoodie had Aaron Hernandez. Parcells had LT.

But they won. And that is the difference. And I believe that's fair. Tomlin's teams haven't won, and he deserves criticism for that. And it's gonna come his way when he has a situation like Brown or DJ and Pickens. If he won in those years with Brown we wouldn't even be discussing this.

But just don't advance the narrative that Tomlin is the only coach who has this, or struggles to deal with it or whatever. Or doesn't win because of it. You can win amidst chaos. It isn't ideal, but it can be done. He hasn't been good enough to do it. That is a completely fair criticism.
 
diver said:
All this about how Tomlin handles guys differently, or lacks consistency...he probably does. What coach doesn't? What should have Parcells done with Lawrence Taylor? LT was not a model player by any stretch of the imagination. Do you think Parcells handled him differently then say Phil McConkey? Do you think he over looked things with Taylor that he wouldn't with other players? He sure as hell must have with what we have learned about Taylor over the years.

How about Jimmy Johnson. Those Cowboys teams. Are you kidding me? The White House? Oh yeah, Jimmy Johnson was Captain Discipline.

Hoodie? Aaron Hernandez? Does a guy who is so great with discipline...cheat?

Look, if the argument is that it is different because they won with those types of situations and Tomlin didn't...fine. But do not advance the idea that they didn't have those situations because they were such great disciplinarians. That is just wrong.
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Sure you can nitpick at players from Jimmy and Parcells, but guess what? Players from both of those coaches speak about the absolute fear they were in when those coaches were in the room, just like Tomlin, errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, not. Tomlin is more likely to break out his new dancing to a racist rap song than he is to discipline anyone. And I don't recall any players pulling an AB and just refusing to pay for Parcells or Jimmy. Not even close.



Tomlin is everyone's buddy and they often play like it.
 
Drink IRON City said:
This is the part of the Tomlin coaching I truly dislike. N o rhyme or reason on many things. Clearly a coach who doesn’t seem to have the little things covered.

Someone here said in a post that they went to a game and noticed how unorganized the pre-game warm-ups are as compared to the other teams. That is nothing new, it’s been that way since about as long as the players realized they didn’t have to be accountable to that. The more the “Cowher” disciplined player retired or moved on, the more lackadaisical the team became. Why the hellA wouldn’t you want to play for a coach who seems to let you just get by and not seem to have much disciplinary structure for the team.

Coach Tomlin, make us all a believer, win 4 consecutive play off games.


Salute the nation
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You hit the nail on the head here. When a ROOKIE QB makes a public comment that practices need more discipline, you have a discipline problem.
 
Greg Lloyd said:
Sure you can nitpick at players from Jimmy and Parcells, but guess what? Players from both of those coaches speak about the absolute fear they were in when those coaches were in the room, just like Tomlin, errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, not. Tomlin is more likely to break out his new dancing to a racist rap song than he is to discipline anyone. And I don't recall any players pulling an AB and just refusing to pay for Parcells or Jimmy. Not even close.



Tomlin is everyone's buddy and they often play like it.
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Bull. Just total bull. The Cowboys players had no fear of Jimmy Johnson. If they did, they wouldn't have done some of the stuff they did. True respect is if you show respect by your actions when the coach, or the parent or whatever isn't looking.

Was Noll Ernie Holmes "buddy?" Was he Joe Greene's "buddy?" He put up with their stuff because they were outstanding players. He got rid of Holmes when he got too out of shape and he could replace him with someone else. Sound familiar?
 
Tomlin's deal (be a man I treat you like a man) works real well for the majority. But much like his coaching if you are not good enough I will replace you in the offseason.....whole seasons get sunk by bad actors.
 
diver said:
Bull. Just total bull. The Cowboys players had no fear of Jimmy Johnson. If they did, they wouldn't have done some of the stuff they did. True respect is if you show respect by your actions when the coach, or the parent or whatever isn't looking.

Was Noll Ernie Holmes "buddy?" Was he Joe Greene's "buddy?" He put up with their stuff because they were outstanding players. He got rid of Holmes when he got too out of shape and he could replace him with someone else. Sound familiar?
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Your out of your mind if you don't know that Jimmy caused fear by his players, just out of it. He fired players in the drop of a hat and they knew it. But keeping living in your fantasy world.

https://www.si.com/nfl/cowboys/podc...hnson-like-fear-new-coach-mike-zimmer-podcast
 
Who? Name one player Jimmy Johnson "fired" that was any good.

You are full of it. He didn't fire anyone worth a shiit.
 
The point is that coaches, ALL coaches, put up with players if they are very good. They will tolerate a helll of a lot from great players. Tomlin isn't the only one, nor will her be the last.
 
diver said:
I do not understand the way Tomlin handles players either. Sometimes it makes no sense for an outsiders view. But again, we are outsiders, we are not privy to what is going on in there. Jones should have been starting. It makes no sense the willingness to start Moore, a 4th, as a rookie, right away, and not start the guy you moved up to get in the 1st. All that said, we have no idea what Okorafor said or didn't say. We don't know if there was any lead up to it.
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There’s only so much Tomlin can do. It’s comparable to boss and employee in today’s generation. There’s not really much to do about it.

You can bench them. Cut them. Move on
 
I saw an interview with Jimmy Johnson where he specifically said you give slack to good players. He said if a backup falls asleep in a meeting, you cut him to send a message. If Emmitt Smith falls asleep, you gently tap him to wake him up then continue the meeting.

Belichick was in an interview about the same thing. He said when he worked for the Giants under Parcells, he complains to Parcells about Lawrence Taylor being late to meetings. Parcells looked at him and said - why would you start the meeting before LT got there?

Everyone likes to think of the disciplinarian coach like Gene Hackman in Hoosiers playing with 4 guys to teach a lesson. That’s great but remember that team didn’t win squat until Jimmy Chickwood played.
 
tapeANaspirin2it said:
I saw an interview with Jimmy Johnson where he specifically said you give slack to good players. He said if a backup falls asleep in a meeting, you cut him to send a message. If Emmitt Smith falls asleep, you gently tap him to wake him up then continue the meeting.

Belichick was in an interview about the same thing. He said when he worked for the Giants under Parcells, he complains to Parcells about Lawrence Taylor being late to meetings. Parcells looked at him and said - why would you start the meeting before LT got there?

Everyone likes to think of the disciplinarian coach like Gene Hackman in Hoosiers playing with 4 guys to teach a lesson. That’s great but remember that team didn’t win squat until Jimmy Chickwood played.
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Now you got me sitting here watching scenes from Hoosiers on Youtube. Strap, God wants you on the floor.
 
Greg Lloyd said:
You hit the nail on the head here. When a ROOKIE QB makes a public comment that practices need more discipline, you have a discipline problem.
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Harris had an issue also with the way things were run and asked for change. Comparing it to his college days. Maybe tried to take a leadership role ....Tomlin simply told him to play RB.
 
Greg Lloyd said:
Sure you can nitpick at players from Jimmy and Parcells, but guess what? Players from both of those coaches speak about the absolute fear they were in when those coaches were in the room,
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In today’s world that type of **** does not happen anymore. I don’t think the word “ fear “ is in any dressing room at all in any pro sports when it comes to coaching. Apples to Oranges.
The players just say **** you if they get into that type of situation. The old days are long gone.
 
Yeah. More often than not it brings about a desired outcome. Like brown getting his trade. That rb we had , got trade to patriots. Etc.
 
Just a little trip down Steeler WR Diva Memory Lane…
The Steeler organization has been dealing with wide receivers divas since Roy Jefferson..
The Emporer put up with him for one season and then traded him after a 67 receptions for over 1000 yards and 9 touchdown year…which was exceptional stats for a WR back then..
Obviously Chas Nolls patience was as thin as a Ricky Ricardo mustache ..
 
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Steelmann said:
In today’s world that type of **** does not happen anymore. I don’t think the word “ fear “ is in any dressing room at all in any pro sports when it comes to coaching. Apples to Oranges.
The players just say **** you if they get into that type of situation. The old days are long gone.
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Maybe why Hoodie is unemployed?
 
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