Yep because Tomlin has so much in common with those coaches pre 1969. Doing and winning absolutely nothing the whole time he has been coach. Yep just like those times.
Tomlin....he's driving a proud organization straight in to the ground.
- Thread starter In Ben We Trust
- Start date
Yep because Tomlin has so much in common with those coaches pre 1969. Doing and winning absolutely nothing the whole time he has been coach. Yep just like those times.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 7,497
- Reaction score
- 5,032
- Points
- 113
Sorry but you are wrong. Cowher could draft, evaluate talent and coach up players like Kordell (who had no business being in 2 AFCC games). Tomlin hasn't shown any of that. And as has been said 10000 times but always ignored, Tomlin was given a team 1 year removed from a SB. Cowher had many struggles that Tomlin has never had. There wasn't a better situation for a coach to come into than the one Tomlin came into. I guess the Cowboys team from the early 90's.
I'm sure the Rooney's are going to keep Tomlin for many more years. But IMHO if things don't change then they'll never sniff another SB.
Agree to disagree as usual.
but when provided context that you simply do not agree with since it does not mesh with your own ideals, you refuse to see it for what it is and **** all over it.
It was not "okay" for Cowher's teams to lose 4 AFCCG. Recall the old board? The anger and vitriol from those losses would make ISIS freaks shake their heads and say, "Wow, man, calm down."
However, Cowher went to the playoffs 6 straight years after taking over a team that had been the playoffs once in the preceding 5 seasons (1989), and that only after a 9-7 record and an incredible series of events the last weekend to get them into the playoffs. He re-tooled the defense in 2 drafts. He revived a very good running offense.
And he did this with slightly above-average play at QB (O'Donnell), and worse QB play (Tomczak and Stewart).
As Vader has pointed out very convincingly, Cowher also built the team by acquiring players who fit his mold. DL who could fill two gaps and occupy 4 or even 5 offensive lineman; OLB'ers who hunted the QB; defensive backs who were decent in coverage and brutal in stopping the running game; receivers who could block and were tough as nails; very, very, VERY good offensive lineman, not bloated mediocrity in the 2nd round.
Meanwhile, Tomlin took over a team that had been to the playoffs 4 times in the previous 6 seasons, with a franchise QB, an elite S, and coming off a dominant playoff run (beat the #1, #1, #2, and #3 seeds - never happened before or since) just 2 years earlier. He has overseen and been directly responsible, at least in significant part, for poor draft selections, 1st round busts, and players who don't fit the @#$%damn system.
I used to think that TMC was too hard on the Steelers draft choices, since they just did not fit the system. I thought that maybe Ziggy could be a DE, or maybe Timmons could add strength and use his speed on the edge to turn into an OLB'er, or Jarvis Jones would get stronger and turn into a pass rusher ... TMC kept saying, "No, these players just don't fit."
TMC was right. I thought that Tomlin and company had a better idea as to what the hell they were doing than TMC.
I was wrong.
I would suggest looking at the needs of this team now vs the needs of the team 8 years ago and see if the needle is pointing up. I would suggest that if you think it is pointing up it is because of the wind as the team is right now in a free fall and picking up speed.
I
Idioteque
Guest
I can't name one position that's a clear upgrade over the 2006 team. Probably Bell over Parker at RB. There are no others.
Our best players back then are our best players today, plus Brown and Bell. Most ate much much worse. Both lines have gone from elite strengths to major major weaknesses. Same with the pass rush. Our secondary was iffy back then and is poor today (weird, because Tomlin is a defensive coach with a DB history).
The same guy who let Bubby walk to Denver where he got a SB ring first.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 7,497
- Reaction score
- 5,032
- Points
- 113
You've give no context to anything. You just say they are alike because of stats then **** all over every bit of context to the contrary. You want Tomlin = Cowher so no matter the circumstances that's what you are going to believe.
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2014
- Messages
- 32,750
- Reaction score
- 34,782
- Points
- 113
- Location
- between $2 short & ten buck two
When compared to each of their first 8years, Cohwer comes out on top, NO QUESTION !!! Even a blind fool can see that. Really was Cohwers 8th team as week as this one? NOT even close.
Salute the nation
Salute the nation
Once again the point is missed by the regurgitating of circular arguments. They both have faults people. They were both successful, both had a slide, Cowher was allowed to right the ship, and Tomlin is a bum. That's what I'm getting here.
Point to Cowher all you want about building a defense, and I'll point to Tomlin about building an offense. We were in a defensive league back then, and rightfully so, Cowher helped direct and evaluate defense. Now we're in an offensive league, and Tomlin is building an offense that can move the ball and has talent. Some might not want to see it, but I see it and I enjoy watching them progress. When they correct the small mistakes and penalties, they can be prolific.
Point to Cowher all you want about building a defense, and I'll point to Tomlin about building an offense. We were in a defensive league back then, and rightfully so, Cowher helped direct and evaluate defense. Now we're in an offensive league, and Tomlin is building an offense that can move the ball and has talent. Some might not want to see it, but I see it and I enjoy watching them progress. When they correct the small mistakes and penalties, they can be prolific.
so Cowher was handed Troy Edwards by Donahoe, but I've been told that NONE of the players on this team would be there without Tomlin's blessing??? Not sure how a great coach like Cowher could have a player "handed" to him by the GM, but the bum Tomlin has FULL authority
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2014
- Messages
- 3,929
- Reaction score
- 7,465
- Points
- 113
I'll say this...Cowher was a fan coach. When someone pissed up on the field and we as fans were screaming at our televisions the camera crew would pan to Cowher, jaw jutting out a mile, brow squeezed so tight the skin was white and spittle flying as he screamed "WHO!!!!!" It gave us satisfaction that Cowher was about to light up a fool. GET 'EM COWHER!!!!
What we get now is a complacent Omar Epps looking like he's contemplating what his wife is making for dinner. " I hope she's making tacos...mmmmm....I love tacos."
What we get now is a complacent Omar Epps looking like he's contemplating what his wife is making for dinner. " I hope she's making tacos...mmmmm....I love tacos."
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 7,497
- Reaction score
- 5,032
- Points
- 113
Tomlin is building the offense right? Ok. Let see how good he is doing:
2014: 14th in points
2013: 16
2012: 22
2011: 21
2010: 12
2009: 12
2008: 20
2007: 9
So how is that working out? Remember Cowher had Ben for only 3 years. Those three years they ranked: 11th as a rookie, 9th SB winner, 12th after Ben had his accident, appendectomy and concussion. Cowher had the offense ranked at 8th with Maddox, 5th with O'Donnell, and 7th twice with Kordell. He only had 1 year where the offense was ranked in the twenties. Tomlin has had 3 in just 8 years.
So if Tomlin is gearing everything towards scoring points then he has failed miserably. They can rack up yards but they can't score. All offenses are prolific if they do everything perfectly. The fact is that the Steelers offense is an average offense right now and is far below the standard.
I
Idioteque
Guest
Built an offense? Yeesh. One of the league's worst lines for 7 years, only 2 NFL-caliber WRs (one is unproven), no help for Heath, and scoring worse than before. Let's hope for Tomlin's sake building an offense isn't his strong suit.
Nothing circular going on, Cope. Cowher is thoroughly irrelevant in evaluating Tomlin. And as I said.. 8 seasons is far too long for glimpses of hope. Did your boss give you an 8-year grace period while you kept pointing to the last guy's faults?
Nothing circular going on, Cope. Cowher is thoroughly irrelevant in evaluating Tomlin. And as I said.. 8 seasons is far too long for glimpses of hope. Did your boss give you an 8-year grace period while you kept pointing to the last guy's faults?
I
Idioteque
Guest
Man, I love the "Those who don't agree our offense is awesome aren't REAL fans" schtick!
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2014
- Messages
- 3,929
- Reaction score
- 7,465
- Points
- 113
No **** Idioteque. You call a spade a spade, trying to be a realist, and all of a sudden you're just a whiny, bitching, bandwagon fan.
I'll have you know that I survived bubbly brister, Mark Malone, Kordell, Kent Graham, and the worlds best complacent backup QB mike tomszak you **** suckers! I don't want to relive the 80s.
I'll have you know that I survived bubbly brister, Mark Malone, Kordell, Kent Graham, and the worlds best complacent backup QB mike tomszak you **** suckers! I don't want to relive the 80s.
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2014
- Messages
- 3,929
- Reaction score
- 7,465
- Points
- 113
No **** Idioteque. You call a spade a spade, trying to be a realist, and all of a sudden you're just a whiny, bitching, bandwagon fan.
I'll have you know that I survived bubbly brister, Mark Malone, Kordell, Kent Graham, and the worlds best complacent backup QB mike tomszak you **** suckers! I don't want to relive the 80s.
I'll have you know that I survived bubbly brister, Mark Malone, Kordell, Kent Graham, and the worlds best complacent backup QB mike tomszak you **** suckers! I don't want to relive the 80s.
I
Idioteque
Guest
If we spoiled, impatient douchebags would just be patient, we'll see Tomlin's Plan. It takes roughly 8 years to materialize, but it will all make sense someday.
Now that is a quality post
It's funny because I always wonder what the Tomlin supporters do for a living
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 16,128
- Reaction score
- 18,942
- Points
- 113
What are Tomlin's strengths as a coach?
He can beat sometimes (slightly below average percentile) a wounded team and has a mean pair of shades.
Just curious. Were some of you guys this supportive of Cowher when he lost the '01 AFCC after telling his team during the week before to make their Super Bowl arrangements?
I think some of you are being very disingenuous. I remember being on the board in those years. I was one of the few still supporting Cowher. I remember making a smart *** remark about the fact they found that Cowher was on the grassy knoll, too, what with all the blame he got for everything. You woulda thought I slept with a few of those guys wives the way they came at me. Much like the heat the guys are getting now that show even the slightest support for Tomlin.
I think some of you are being very disingenuous. I remember being on the board in those years. I was one of the few still supporting Cowher. I remember making a smart *** remark about the fact they found that Cowher was on the grassy knoll, too, what with all the blame he got for everything. You woulda thought I slept with a few of those guys wives the way they came at me. Much like the heat the guys are getting now that show even the slightest support for Tomlin.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2014
- Messages
- 7,497
- Reaction score
- 5,032
- Points
- 113
I blasted Cowher for several things. Cowher wasn't perfect. But I respected him because he could take a team decimated by FA and win. He could get a border line QB to excel. Yes, he had a couple of down years but look at what he did with the talent he had. Tomlin is the exact opposite. Tomlin has never even made the playoffs with a team that didn't have #1 (once #2) defense. Tomlin doesn't appear to have the ability to coach up teams. And he's had Ben his entire career. If they don't make the playoffs this year then he will have missed the playoffs 50% of his coaching career with a franchise QB.
Similar threads
