Covid Vaccine

[Troglodyte]

I don't recall anyone making that statement, perhaps you can enlighten me.

Grant Wahl, Jamie Foxx, Lisa Marie Presley, Damar Hamlin, the Stanford soccer player, Mathew Perry, etc. You don’t recall any of that?

Let me try a different approach, the wife and I raise Golden Retrievers. She does volunteer work at Phoenix Children's with therapy dogs for the kids. I have a 2 year old male that's just finished a cross country tour of AKC shows that may garner me some serious stud money. But, I regress. Goldens are susceptible to hemangiosarcoma and I've lost 2 dogs in the last 3 years to it before they were 7. It's a nasty cancer that comes on fast and is always fatal.

But to my point, these 2 dogs were not genetically related, but they both had allergies, also common in Goldens. They were both treated with Apoquel, which does control the allergies, but also suppresses the immune system. I discussed this with my veterinarian today and she said that while there's no absolute proof that the Apoquel led to the cancer, there is evidence (suppressing the immune system) that it could lead to it. And that's enough for me, I'll be switching my 5-year-old female to cyclosporin.

What I'm trying to say is that there are no absolutes in medicine, and although it's just my opinion, you seem hell bent in saying that there is.

And if Apoquel had been administered billions of times and there was world wide scientific agreement on its safety and effectiveness? You have to weigh the “no absolutes” vs plausibility.

 

[Troglodyte]

The Covid shots are extremely bad drugs that did not have standard phase 1,2,3 or 4 clinical studies, have not been manufactured in accordance with the EUA they received and will come to known as tge greatest $$$$ fraud ever put upon humanity.

Another “just wait”.

 

[diver]

Covid, and everything surrounding it, became political when someone realized it could be used to get rid of Trump. No if, ands or buts about that. I don't think that was just Democrats, either. Many Repubs played along happily. And by no means am I the biggest Trump guy out there, but you have to see it for what it is and cut through the bullshiit.

 

[Troglodyte]

But a number of people lost their jobs for not getting the shot. That part doesn’t seem to matter to YOU, but it sure did matter to those families.

Jobs come with requirements, that’s not new. Some people made the decision that not getting vaccinated was more important than their job. That’s on them.

 

[Troglodyte]

So it takes going to jail to qualify as being extreme?

Well, it's in the books.

Could People Be Jailed, Fined for Refusing COVID-19 Vaccine in US?​

Claim:
Individual U.S. states would be legally authorized to impose criminal penalties on individuals who refused to undergo a mandatory COVID-19 vaccination.
Rating:

True


People being fired, including health care workers for not getting the jab is not extreme to you?

Thousands of workers are getting fired for refusing the …​

WebOct 24, 2021 · Washington state reports that so far, nearly 1,900 state workers, including the head football coach at Washington State University,


How about having to show your "papers" before being allowed to enter public venues.
Heil Hitler.

AEG's Live Music Venues Will Require Vaccines Or Negative COVID Tests - NPR​

WebAug 12, 2021 · One Of The Biggest Live Music Companies Will Require Full Vaccination. The Roxy Theatre in West Hollywood, CA will be one of 48 venues across the country affected by AEG's new policy. Some of the ...​

• NYC mandates proof of vaccination for many indoor settings - New York Post​

  WebAug 3, 2021 · New York City is mandating proof of COVID-19 vaccination to enter certain indoor businesses — including all indoor restaurants, entertainment venues and gyms, Mayor Bill de Blasio announced Tuesday.
• 
  https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=f954...hY2NpbmUtcmVxdWlyZW1lbnQtY292aWQtdGVzdA&ntb=1
  
• 
  
  Los Angeles Times
  https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-10...
  

  L.A. to require proof of COVID vaccination at indoor restaurants ...​

  WebOct. 6, 2021 Updated 3:51 PM PT. The Los Angeles City Council on Wednesday approved a new ordinance that requires proof of vaccination against COVID-19 to enter indoor restaurants,

• https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=afe8...ob3ctcHJvb2Ytb2YtdmFjY2luYXRpb24uaHRtbA&ntb=1

The claim is about criminal penalties imposed by states and the response addresses being being fired by their employers. WTF?

 

[ZonaBurgh]

Grant Wahl, Jamie Foxx, Lisa Marie Presley, Damar Hamlin, the Stanford soccer player, Mathew Perry, etc. You don’t recall any of that?

And if Apoquel had been administered billions of times and there was world wide scientific agreement on its safety and effectiveness? You have to weigh the “no absolutes” vs plausibility.

Troglodyte said:
Like baselessly concluding that any and all unexpected deaths were icaused by the Covid vaccine because, well, “you can’t prove that they weren’t!”

There's a difference between suspecting the possibility and concluding the absolute certainty.
Which is the difference between you and everyone else here, you refuse to consider the possibility.

 

[Troglodyte]

Troglodyte said:
Like baselessly concluding that any and all unexpected deaths were icaused by the Covid vaccine because, well, “you can’t prove that they weren’t!”

There's a difference between suspecting the possibility and concluding the absolute certainty.
Which is the difference between you and everyone else here, you refuse to consider the possibility.

No, the problem with people here is that refuse to consider possibility vs PLAUSIBILITY because they’re so wrapped up in their delusional beliefs.

I can’t prove the vaccines didn’t cause the deaths just like you can’t prove that Bigfoot and the Loch Ness monster don’t exist. It’s all just very implausible and almost entirely baseless.

 

[Sarge]

The claim is about criminal penalties imposed by states and the response addresses being being fired by their employers. WTF?

That's not what he said. There's a fact check on his initial clam.

Then he asks is firing people for getting the vax extreme. Extreme isn't necessarily criminal. Two different topics.

 

[ZonaBurgh]

No, the problem with people here is that refuse to consider possibility vs PLAUSIBILITY because they’re so wrapped up in their delusional beliefs.

I can’t prove the vaccines didn’t cause the deaths just like you can’t prove that Bigfoot and the Loch Ness monster don’t exist. It’s all just very implausible and almost entirely baseless.

Why do you respond to delusional people?

It's OK, I ask the same question of myself.

 

[Troglodyte]

That's not what he said. There's a fact check on his initial clam.

Then he asks is firing people for getting the vax extreme. Extreme isn't necessarily criminal. Two different topics.

Follow along. I said nobody went to jail. The claim in the fact check referred to criminal penalties and then the fact check made no mention of them despite declaring it to be “true”. Two different topics indeed.

 

[Troglodyte]

Why do you respond to delusional people?

Entertainment

It's OK, I ask the same question of myself.

I sense you’re implying I’m delusional. I’m curious as to what you think those delusions are?

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

No the consensus.

That is NOT what you have said. NO NO NO. You have said the ENTIRE medical community and EVERY MAJOR MEDICAL ASSOCIATION.

No walking it back no Fleggo.

There’s nut jobs out there manipulating people like you.

You mean like someone with these credentials?

Education:
Graduate of Wake Forest
Medical degree from Harvard
PhD in Health Policy from Harvard
Interned a Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center (won the Harvard Med School Resident Teaching award)
Won the Health Services and Outcommes Research from Johns Hopkins

Experience:
Tenured Associate Professor at David Geffen School of Medicine at the University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA)
He primarily clinically cares for hospitalized patients.
He simultaneously still serves as a Professor of Medicine

Research and Publications:
His writings about health policy and public health have appeared in the Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, and USA Today.
His studies have been published in leading medical journals, including The Journal of the American Medical Association, Journal of the American College of Cardiology, and Annals of Internal Medicine.
His research program has been supported by the National Institutes of Health and Robert Wood Johnson Foundation
His research includes clinical trials of interventions for weight loss, smoking cessation, and cardiovascular disease prevention among people with HIV.

Especially ones that don’t understand the difference between mRNA and DNA.Lapado is getting panned by the medical community. If you’d step outside your echo chamber you’d realize that.

Thanks for the admission that you persistently waffle, Fleggo.

So NOW which is it...you trust erryone in Medicine, or only those that follow Branch Covidian doctrine?

Says the guy who speaks of perfect for some yet very dangerous vaccines.

Who has a Fleggo decoder ring? Anyone?

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

The far right made it political? I recall mandates enforced by primarily Democrats and their ilk forcing Americans to take the shot or lose their ability to feed their families. How does it get anymore political than that authoritarian type approach?

That's dictatorial NOT political!!! /Flogstain

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

So it takes going to jail to qualify as being extreme?

Well, it's in the books.

Could People Be Jailed, Fined for Refusing COVID-19 Vaccine in US?​

Claim:
Individual U.S. states would be legally authorized to impose criminal penalties on individuals who refused to undergo a mandatory COVID-19 vaccination.
Rating:

True


People being fired, including health care workers for not getting the jab is not extreme to you?

Thousands of workers are getting fired for refusing the …​

WebOct 24, 2021 · Washington state reports that so far, nearly 1,900 state workers, including the head football coach at Washington State University,


How about having to show your "papers" before being allowed to enter public venues.
Heil Hitler.

AEG's Live Music Venues Will Require Vaccines Or Negative COVID Tests - NPR​

WebAug 12, 2021 · One Of The Biggest Live Music Companies Will Require Full Vaccination. The Roxy Theatre in West Hollywood, CA will be one of 48 venues across the country affected by AEG's new policy. Some of the ...​

• NYC mandates proof of vaccination for many indoor settings - New York Post​

  WebAug 3, 2021 · New York City is mandating proof of COVID-19 vaccination to enter certain indoor businesses — including all indoor restaurants, entertainment venues and gyms, Mayor Bill de Blasio announced Tuesday.
• 
  https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=f954...hY2NpbmUtcmVxdWlyZW1lbnQtY292aWQtdGVzdA&ntb=1
  
• 
  
  Los Angeles Times
  https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-10...
  

  L.A. to require proof of COVID vaccination at indoor restaurants ...​

  WebOct. 6, 2021 Updated 3:51 PM PT. The Los Angeles City Council on Wednesday approved a new ordinance that requires proof of vaccination against COVID-19 to enter indoor restaurants,

• https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=afe8...ob3ctcHJvb2Ytb2YtdmFjY2luYXRpb24uaHRtbA&ntb=1

That's not the PROPER type of fact check! Soros doesn't fund it so I don't read it! /Fleggo

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

when did you speak to NSW Health to find out why they aren't recommending boosters for under 65?

Oh DEAR GOD don't push this freak. He WILL call!!!

 

[Troglodyte]

That is NOT what you have said. NO NO NO. You have said the ENTIRE medical community and EVERY MAJOR MEDICAL ASSOCIATION.

No walking it back no Fleggo.

Lapado is a major medical association?

Show me that one that is backing him up on his latest nonsense. You can’t.

You mean like someone with these credentials?

Education:
Graduate of Wake Forest
Medical degree from Harvard
PhD in Health Policy from Harvard
Interned a Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center (won the Harvard Med School Resident Teaching award)
Won the Health Services and Outcommes Research from Johns Hopkins

Experience:
Tenured Associate Professor at David Geffen School of Medicine at the University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA)
He primarily clinically cares for hospitalized patients.
He simultaneously still serves as a Professor of Medicine

Research and Publications:
His writings about health policy and public health have appeared in the Washington Post, Wall Street Journal, and USA Today.
His studies have been published in leading medical journals, including The Journal of the American Medical Association, Journal of the American College of Cardiology, and Annals of Internal Medicine.
His research program has been supported by the National Institutes of Health and Robert Wood Johnson Foundation
His research includes clinical trials of interventions for weight loss, smoking cessation, and cardiovascular disease prevention among people with HIV.



Thanks for the admission that you persistently waffle, Fleggo.

So NOW which is it...you trust erryone in Medicine, or only those that follow Branch Covidian doctrine?

No, I’ve mentioned Lapado before as well as others like Malone for spreading misinformation.

You lose so you try to change your opponents argument. Pathetic.

 

[Troglodyte]

That's a pretty absolute statement of fact - when did you speak to NSW Health to find out why they aren't recommending boosters for under 65? I'd imagine the reason they aren't recommending boosters would be cost-benefit i.e. the cost of distributing it plus cost of potential negative side effects outweighs the benefit of preventing and reducing side effects of the virus.

Cost, absolutely. But if the potential side effects of the vaccine outweighed the benefit of preventing mortality and morbidity, they wouldn’t recommend or ask anyone to consider them.

 

[MT~Forged]

Democrats? Americans? Vaccines and mandates were used by many countries all over the world trying to end a pandemic.

You are correct, MANY countries across the globe did do that. Almost every single country that did, was a left leaning , to differing extents.

I have never faulted OUR government for their initial response in the first 1-2 months, as NOBODY SEEMED to know anything. After the 2nd month, it was extremely obvious to a large portion of people, that they all had overreacted. At that point a re-evaluation was called for, but no, they just continued to double down. People saw this and started to fight back. What happened then? They doubled down AGAIN, but this time they also started attacking people personally who resisted. This is why they have ZERO credibility now.

 

[MT~Forged]

Cost, absolutely. But if the potential side effects of the vaccine outweighed the benefit of preventing mortality and morbidity, they wouldn’t recommend or ask anyone to consider them.

You do realize that “consider” means to think about carefully. To carefully think about something means to weigh BOTH/ MULTIPLE available options and come to a conclusion that YOU feel is the appropriate action in regards to the pros and cons.

Yes, the agency might wish that you consider their position more, but that consideration is YOURS.

 

[MT~Forged]

Jobs come with requirements, that’s not new. Some people made the decision that not getting vaccinated was more important than their job. That’s on them.

It’s refreshing to see you, Comrade, display so much sympathy for others.

 

[Troglodyte]

You are correct, MANY countries across the globe did do that. Almost every single country that did, was a left leaning , to differing extents.

I have never faulted OUR government for their initial response in the first 1-2 months, as NOBODY SEEMED to know anything. After the 2nd month, it was extremely obvious to a large portion of people, that they all had overreacted.

I think your time line is out of whack. There was no reaction in the first two months of the pandemic other than “wash your hands and avoid touching your face”. 3 months in, a National Emergency was declared and a month later cases and deaths had taken off and the CDC made its first mask recommendation.

At that point a re-evaluation was called for, but no, they just continued to double down. People saw this and started to fight back. What happened then? They doubled down AGAIN, but this time they also started attacking people personally who resisted. This is why they have ZERO credibility now.

No, they just grew tired of the restrictions and no end was in sight.

 

[Troglodyte]

It’s refreshing to see you, Comrade, display so much sympathy for others.

I certainly sympathize if they regret their decision, otherwise it’s not warranted. Right?

 

[ZonaBurgh]

Entertainment

I sense you’re implying I’m delusional. I’m curious as to what you think those delusions are?

Well, quite frankly, you are. and many at least here will agree to that. I'm not trying to be offensive in any way, just stating what I observe.
The first step in any recovery is admitting that there is a problem, but with you there is no gray area, it's always black and white.
You are right, and everyone else here is completely wrong, or delusional to use your words. There is no leeway for compromise, only the steadfast belief, with absolute certainty that your beliefs are beyond reproach. In my experience, life doesn't work that way, and deflecting direct questions does not help your cause.
If I were to stumble upon this thread, I would assume you were merely trolling and for a while I actually thought that was the case, but now dogmatic comes to mind. I truly hope that isn't the case and that everyone, including you and me, can address this subject objectively and with an open mind, rather than the pissing contest that it's turned into.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Lapado is a major medical association?

Show me that one that is backing him up on his latest nonsense. You can’t.

Ladapo is a distinguished, educated, practiced medical professional. You worship those people.

Until the AP tells you not to.

No, I’ve mentioned Lapado before as well as others like Malone for spreading misinformation.

Yes, we've established over and over and over and over and over again how any distinguished medical professional willing to tell the truth is cancelled by the Soros-funded AltLeft media. It's a documented phenomenon. I mean, Congressional hearings have been held on this dynamic. Have you been living under a rock (errrr, in a bubble)?

You lose so you try to change your opponents argument. Pathetic.

One again RedHerringFlog, in your pathetic you've-got-nothing-else-in-the-wit-tank, you try to use my attacks against me. "So are you but what am I!??" Come on, you're better than that....wait....

I'm not changing a damned thing.

 

[MT~Forged]

I certainly sympathize if they regret their decision, otherwise it’s not warranted. Right?

Not only are you an egotistical prick, now you can add hypocritical unsympathetic sociopath. You have to be the most morally bankrupt piece of **** I have interacted with on the internet. Believe me, that is quite the accomplishmen.