Govt. shutdown

[SteelerInLebanon]

No I'm not. This would have been difficult to get funded in 2017 but the beginning of last year this could have gotten funded. The bill last year only included 1 billion towards the initial construction. The House Republicans asked for 10 billion up front. That number fell all the way to 1.6 billion and then to about a billion. At least 14 GOP Senators voted against the initial bill twice last year because of the DACA framework. That's one thing I will give Trump credit for is he wasn't initially trying to just build this wall and not reform the immigration laws. And people already here doing "bad things" does ******* matter. It matters when you have a sitting President putting things in the context of fear and trying to scare people into doing something based on false boogeyman bullshit. I've not once heard the President vow to try and clean up crime as a whole that isn't tied to some dog whistle about illegals or terrorists. This will be a mess if it gets pushed through like this. I heard a report the other day on Fox News about the 2006 Secure Fence Act and how Democrats voted for that and how this is the same thing only now it's Trump and blaa blaa blaa. Will people go look at the context of these two situations and do research for themselves. Nope. Will they just open up and get fed the bullshit? Yep. That bill called for two layers of reinforced fencing (which later was reduced to one layer) along with more checkpoints, manpower and materials. I believe that bill only authorized about 700 miles of fencing. The alternative was a bill that would make any undocumented immigrant a felon regardless of whether an actual crime was committed or not. I'm not going to get into the history of immigration in this country here because I'd be wasting my time but that's probably one of the most unamerican ideas that there is.

You are so full of ****.

 

[Tibs]

So Trump is looking to find a way to declare a 'national emergency' and use wartime powers to get his way? By lying to and deceiving the American public? All because, for over two years running he's failed miserably in convincing a GOP-majority in Congress to fund his fantasy wall? With southern border crossings at historic lows? With no discernable terrorist threat? And his supporters are okay with this? Would this not clearly be an abuse of power, which would fast-track impeachment proceedings against him?

Trump himself is the national emergency. He is a clear and present danger to the country.

 

[Tibs]

Here's a handy bingo card for tonight's 'Trump Unhinged' national tv address. Have fun!

 

[CharlesDavenport]

No my point is he can't come out not and try and make this a "Democrats don't want security" thing when he hadn't gotten it funded through half of his term already. If that's the case then a lot of Republican's don't either by his logic. This whole situation is ridiculous and he's out here pulling numbers out of his *** trying to justify his tantrum. This is absolutely ridiculous. Border security does need to be improved. But building this wall will not be the end all for that. That money could be used to actually make legitimate improvement and lasting ones. Another problem is a lot of terrorists aren't undocumented. They are already here or come here legally. People are stupid enough to be convinced into thinking that only people who sneak into this country aim to harm this country or the people in it. There are plenty of people here already who are doing plenty of that. I don't recall any illegals shooting up kids in a school.

Again, how is it Trump's fault that the Dems don't want the wall funded? I saw that you capitalized MAJORITY, as if you think a simple majority would have gotten wall funding into the budget. Study up a bit. I agree that we should have put a bill forward with it to expose the dems formally, but without a supermajority, which was not going to happen with the dems, it would not have passed the Senate. It is ridiculous to argue that it isn't the dems fault. It's funny that you talk about legitimate and lasting border security improvements. That's a wall. We've seen how legitimate and permanent border legislation is. Your boy Obama completely ignored existing immigration laws. I'd say that makes them illegitimate and far from permanent.

 

[Tibs]

Again, how is it Trump's fault that the Dems don't want the wall funded?

Because nobody wants Trump's stupid wall. This whole meltdown and hissy fit is due to his narcissism and ego. Nobody is buying his bald-faced lies. Everyone wants border security and immigraton control, including the Dems. There is a smart way to tackle a 21st century problem and there's a dumb(****) way. The country does not want Trump's medevial wall. It seems his die-hard supporters will be the last ones to come to grips with this. Maybe they never will, who knows? Who cares?

 

[SteelChip]

Because nobody wants Trump's stupid wall. This whole meltdown and hissy fit is due to his narcissism and ego. Nobody is buying his bald-faced lies. Everyone wants border security and immigraton control, including the Dems. There is a smart way to tackle a 21st century problem and there's a dumb(****) way. The country does not want Trump's medevial wall. It seems his die-hard supporters will be the last ones to come to grips with this. Maybe they never will, who knows? Who cares?

I am constantly amused at the Liberal rhetoric. You accuse,malign, name call and turn all your fantasies into right wing adjectives. The Left has yet to propose one single solution to the illegal immigration problem while apposing every solution Trump comes up with. I have yet to hear what logical reason for the $5B wall project resistance except that it will lessen the flow of potential voters into the Country.

The total cost of illegal immigration to federal, state and local taxpayers for the nation’s 12.5 million illegal aliens has increased to $116 billion annually, according to a new study released Wednesday by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) American taxpayers are forced to bear the costs of the federal government’s failure to secure our borders every time they pay school taxes, local tolls, sales and excise taxes. It also means that illegal migrants get a lot of benefits that they don’t pay for.

The state and local costs of illegal migration are amplified by the fact that illegal immigrants remit much of their earnings to their home nations. FAIR estimates that nearly 20 percent of the average household income of illegal immigrants is remitted back to their home nations. Annually, this totals approximately $7,200 per illegal immigrant household that is not spent in the United States, and therefore is not subject to the sales or excise taxes that fund state treasuries.

Americans are tired of losing billions of dollars every year due to illegal immigration. Ending the incentives that attract illegal immigrants and securing the border are necessary first steps to reversing the growing costs associated with unlawful migration.
https://thehill.com/blogs/congress-...f-illegal-immigration-to-taxpayers-is-growing

There is a solid reason that stands out like a sore thump.....overwhelming the system to cause a welfare crisis. To overwhelm America’s welfare system to the point that the only way out is through the tunnel leading to a centralized social-welfare state, as is seen in many European and South American countries. In addition to expanding the welfare rolls internally, another way to overwhelm the system is to import more welfare recipients with the goal of overwhelming the system. This occurs via immigration, both legal and illegal.

Creeping socialism in other words.

The scum rising to the top on the Left is becoming exceedingly obvious that the goal is just that. Democrats have no ideas or policies appealing to the majority of Americans, so this is their hail mary pass, creating enough chaos to bring down the current system. Big media fans the flames, calling Trump and his supporters racists, xenophobes, and Nazis for wanting to stop wanton illegal immigration. They welcome the chaos as it supports their political agenda without affecting them personally.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Because nobody wants Trump's stupid wall. This whole meltdown and hissy fit is due to his narcissism and ego. Nobody is buying his bald-faced lies. Everyone wants border security and immigraton control, including the Dems. There is a smart way to tackle a 21st century problem and there's a dumb(****) way. The country does not want Trump's medevial wall. It seems his die-hard supporters will be the last ones to come to grips with this. Maybe they never will, who knows? Who cares?

Nobody wants it? LOL. Trump got elected largely because of that promise. Funny how it wasn't stupid when Hillary said it -

Clinton's answer was: "Well, look. I voted numerous times when I was a senator to spend money to build a barrier to try to prevent illegal immigrants from coming in. And I do think you have to control your borders."

- https://www.investors.com/politics/...a-wall-with-mexico-before-she-was-against-it/

“I voted numerous times when I was a senator to spend money to build a barrier to try to prevent illegal immigrants from coming in,” Clinton said “and I do think that you have to control your borders.”

- https://www.latintimes.com/hillary-...er-wall-keeping-out-illegal-immigrants-352631

The Democrats didn't think it was stupid in 2006 -

WASHINGTON — As a senator, Barack Obama once offered measured praise for the border control legislation that would become the basis for one of Donald Trump’s first acts as president.
“The bill before us will certainly do some good,” Obama said on the Senate floor in October 2006. He praised the legislation, saying it would provide “better fences and better security along our borders” and would “help stem some of the tide of illegal immigration in this country.”
Obama was talking about the Secure Fence Act of 2006, legislation authorizing a barrier along the southern border passed into law with the support of 26 Democratic senators including party leaders like Hillary Clinton, Joe Biden, and Chuck Schumer.

- https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/po...ts-embraced/QE7ieCBXjXVxO63pLMTe9O/story.html

You guys are pathetic.

 

[IndySteel]

Here's a perfect example of how stupid and anti-American the democrats are:

https://www.atr.org/dems-eye-33-corporate-rate-hike

 

[ZonaBurgh]

Um, ya think this is nothing but politics then?

No answer required. But it is a shame it trumps actually serving the citizens of this country.

 

[Superman]

Because nobody wants Trump's stupid wall. This whole meltdown and hissy fit is due to his narcissism and ego. Nobody is buying his bald-faced lies. Everyone wants border security and immigraton control, including the Dems. There is a smart way to tackle a 21st century problem and there's a dumb(****) way. The country does not want Trump's medevial wall. It seems his die-hard supporters will be the last ones to come to grips with this. Maybe they never will, who knows? Who cares?

I do.

 

[steel shinin]

You are so full of ****.

Thanks for the informed response. Carry on with your bullshit.

 

[Roy92040]

I do.

I've been wanting it for over 20 years. Ever since Duncan Hunter Sr 1st proposed it.

 

[DBS1970]

Because nobody wants Trump's stupid wall.

I want it.

Only Democrats that want to import welfare voters to "insure future electoral success" don't want it.

 

[Tibs]

Big difference between wanting ‘border security’ and supporting building/funding a huge, monolithic wall/fence along the entire southern border. It's not one or the another. It's not a binary issue, even if Trump is trying to make it that by dumbing down the disscusion to fear-mongering, scare tactics and non-stop lying to the American people. But then again, that’s what the Trump base thrives on, so it’s not shocking that’s been Trump’s m.o.

 

[Superman]

Big difference between wanting ‘border security’ and supporting building/funding a huge, monolithic wall/fence along the entire southern border. It's not one or the another. It's not a binary issue, even if Trump is trying to make it that by dumbing down the disscusion to fear-mongering, scare tactics and non-stop lying to the American people. But then again, that’s what the Trump base thrives on, so it’s not shocking that’s been Trump’s m.o.

there's nothing fear-mongering about it. not a thing.

we continually use technology to update processes in how we do things and accomplish projects. ****, the very keyboard you're typing on and monitor you're looking at as well as the PC/phone you're at are perfect examples of this. While it's 100% true that the wall cannot be placed everywhere along the border, putting a wall up in places where you can place a wall will allow more effective patrolling and monitoring of other points along the border. Which allows the Border Patrol to do their job better and more efficiently. With a wall, the BP can focus on other points of entry as well as try to close some of the main tunnels. Why not allow the BP to do their jobs with every ounce of technology we can?

 

[Steelerfan]

 

[Stewey]

Big difference between wanting ‘border security’ and supporting building/funding a huge, monolithic wall/fence along the entire southern border. It's not one or the another. It's not a binary issue, even if Trump is trying to make it that by dumbing down the disscusion to fear-mongering, scare tactics and non-stop lying to the American people. But then again, that’s what the Trump base thrives on, so it’s not shocking that’s been Trump’s m.o.

No. You hate Trump and lies are what Trump haters thrive on. Lies are all you got. Lies are the new truth to you aholes.

Most democRATs voted for a wall before Trump was elected. For you deranged leftists, this stalemate has zero to do with the cost or the viability of a wall....it has everything to do with not letting Trump win.

Btw...the $5bil is peanuts and a small fraction of the military budget.

Btw...walls work.

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/video-gallery/video-library/walls-work

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Big difference between wanting ‘border security’ and supporting building/funding a huge, monolithic wall/fence along the entire southern border. It's not one or the another. It's not a binary issue, even if Trump is trying to make it that by dumbing down the disscusion to fear-mongering, scare tactics and non-stop lying to the American people. But then again, that’s what the Trump base thrives on, so it’s not shocking that’s been Trump’s m.o.

How do you explain the Democrats' previous support for it? See the quotes/links in my prior post. What has changed? I'll state the obvious answer - Trump is for it, so the Democrats are against it now, and all you useful idiots in the dem party just ape the same **** you're told. Would love to hear other theories.

 

[deljzc]

This is such a stupid argument.

Congress passed a wall bill in 1994 and 2006. The 2006 law, "The Secure Fence Act of 2006" had a price tag (by the CBC) of $50 billion over 25 years. It passed 81-19 in the Senate. Clinton voted for it. Obama voted for it. Schumer voted for it. Biden voted for it.

This is an ongoing thing that is needed on the southern border. We build walls, illegal crossings move and we need to build new walls. We started major wall construction in California in 1995, then we expanded to almost all urban border areas in 2006. Now we need more. Illegal crossing wouldn't move to new locations (without walls) if walls didn't work.

That's what we are arguing over. It's bullshit. Of course it's needed. And $5 billion is an appropriate allocation based on costs in 1994 and 2006. If you want to be a liberal, say $4 billion is appropriate, I don't care.

But don't bullshit me now as a liberal and say this is against your religion. You voted for it in 1994. You voted for it in 2006. The only reason you're against it now is Donald Trump.

 

[Tibs]

Trump didn't help things by shutting down the government over this. That's the problem. Now he's backed into a corner and is trying to force the hand of Congress. That's not how the federal government works, or should work. This hot mess could have been avoided by good old fashioned, political compromise, the way it's been handled for decades. You know, negotiating in good faith and coming up with a solution, in this case to continue improving existing border security measures. But no, the 'best dealmaker on the planet' had to roll up into a ball and is now demanding to have his way or he'll let the world burn. No wonder nobody wants to work with him or compromise on this issue. He shat in the bed and now must deal with the consequences. And in the meantime, nearly a million federal workers go without pay, including the very TSA agents and air traffic controllers who's job it is to ensure our safety. Nice ******* job, Trump.

 

[83fan]

Trump didn't help things by shutting down the government over this. That's the problem. Now he's backed into a corner and is trying to force the hand of Congress. That's not how the federal government works, or should work. This hot mess could have been avoided by good old fashioned, political compromise, the way it's been handled for decades. You know, negotiating in good faith and coming up with a solution, in this case to continue improving existing border security measures. But no, the 'best dealmaker on the planet' had to roll up into a ball and is now demanding to have his way or he'll let the world burn. No wonder nobody wants to work with him or compromise on this issue. He shat in the bed and now must deal with the consequences. And in the meantime, nearly a million federal workers go without pay, including the very TSA agents and air traffic controllers who's job it is to ensure our safety. Nice ******* job, Trump.

Happy New Year friend. LOL, still trying to converse with the cult huh? Just wondering if you have plans to listen to the lie-athon tonight? Yeah, me neither...why bother. Hope they fact check everything that comes out of that lying sack of ****'s mouth.

 

[IndySteel]

I don't know what's going to be more fun to watch tonight, Trump or the unhinged and out of touch rebuttal by Crazy Nancy and Cryin' Chuck that is sure to be another dagger in the Democraps 2020 chances. Good times...

 

[SteelerInLebanon]

Trump didn't help things by shutting down the government over this. That's the problem. Now he's backed into a corner and is trying to force the hand of Congress. That's not how the federal government works, or should work. This hot mess could have been avoided by good old fashioned, political compromise, the way it's been handled for decades. You know, negotiating in good faith and coming up with a solution, in this case to continue improving existing border security measures. But no, the 'best dealmaker on the planet' had to roll up into a ball and is now demanding to have his way or he'll let the world burn. No wonder nobody wants to work with him or compromise on this issue. He shat in the bed and now must deal with the consequences. And in the meantime, nearly a million federal workers go without pay, including the very TSA agents and air traffic controllers who's job it is to ensure our safety. Nice ******* job, Trump.

You can't compromise with a Party that has only anger and hate as motivation. The Democrats have abandoned all cooperation or bipartisanship in favor of actively resisting anything this President wants no matter how minuscule the cost or needed it is. He would absolutely give ground on some issues to get the wall but Schumer particularly along with the other nut jobs refuses. I applaud someone having the balls to force Congress to do their damn jobs for once and that goes for both sides. ***** about Trump all you want but he puts his reputation on the line taking stands while the petulant spoiled brat children in Congress refuse to take any significant risk to their standing with their base. I am sick of the refusal to do their jobs and then face the voters.

 

[Tibs]

Happy New Year friend. LOL, still trying to converse with the cult huh? Just wondering if you have plans to listen to the lie-athon tonight? Yeah, me neither...why bother. Hope they fact check everything that comes out of that lying sack of ****'s mouth.

Happy New Year to you too 83, hope you enjoyed the holidays.

As far as staying up for Trump's latest public meltdown, no, I only stay up that late for Steelers games. Plus I already know, word for word, all of the lies that will be flying out of his fat, ugly face. I do hope all the networks and news channels do an immediate fact check on all of his bullshit. But his starstruck, adoring fan base won't care. They actually love being lied to, it helps keep their wackadoo, unhinged world view in place.

And I would love for them to explain this graph. Why is there a crisis now when crossings are 1/5 from 2000 levels?

 

[Turd Ferguson]

Ehhh....not worth it.