I knew it was a commin'

[Ironcitysteelers]

Okay when was the last time the KKK tried to topple a statue of MLK?

May be coming soon

 

[Troglodyte]

I just have one question, where are all the calls for removing the Robert Byrd statues?

Whataboutism. It's an actual thing.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Since you butted in, answer the question. Is it possible to associate with Nazis and white supremacist and still be a "fine person"?

And then go read up on the history of "whataboutism".

Yep. That's simple. A lawyer interfaces with convicted felons. That doesn't make him a felon. I interface and coached with a man for years that was in prison. That doesn't make me a criminal. People attend Catholic churches all the time where the priest may be a pedophile. That doesn't make them pedophiles and they are still fine people.

Could go on for days. You can associate with the lowest forms of life on this planet and be a fine person.

Now back to mine: "What if murdering abortionists staged a protest and marched and Alt Right Pro Lifers show up armed and ready to fight? Are these Pro Lifers who had the courage to go toe to toe with murdering abortionists heroes like AntiFA is to you and Tibs? Wouldn't they courageously be standing up to the hideous and heinous acts of child murder? What could be more noble?" and "Why shouldn't the Nazis, KKK, et all have been allowed to march? "

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

And Trog....stop reading HuffingtonPost and other liberal trade rags that are making "whataboutism" the new rage of discussion.

YOU didn't know what it was till you read HuffPo. You're not an expert. And you didn't find it first. SMH. LOL

 

[Elfiero]

Yep. That's simple. A lawyer interfaces with convicted felons. That doesn't make him a felon. I interface and coached with a man for years that was in prison. That doesn't make me a criminal. People attend Catholic churches all the time where the priest may be a pedophile. That doesn't make them pedophiles and they are still fine people.

Could go on for days. You can associate with the lowest forms of life on this planet and be a fine person.

Now back to mine: "What if murdering abortionists staged a protest and marched and Alt Right Pro Lifers show up armed and ready to fight? Are these Pro Lifers who had the courage to go toe to toe with murdering abortionists heroes like AntiFA is to you and Tibs? Wouldn't they courageously be standing up to the hideous and heinous acts of child murder? What could be more noble?" and "Why shouldn't the Nazis, KKK, et all have been allowed to march? "

So then those Dems. in Chip's picture associating with Byrd aren't racists.......right? Then what is chip's point?

 

[deljzc]

I thought this was a good op-ed piece is USA Today.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...dment-rights-robert-shibley-column/573719001/

I've for the most part stayed out of this 30+ pages of back and forth. It's a tough situation and I see both sides. All that said, I can't imagine ANYONE not agreeing with the growing tendency of police to be non-interactive and let criminality go at these protests as a bad trend. This started predominantly as left-leaning protests by BLM and the college left protests of politically charged speakers but now we are seeing what happens when Police fail to hold to the rule of law and fail to enforce the law when right-leaning groups (however dreadful in their message) are being confronted by strong counter protests looking for a fight.

Nothing good is going to come out of Police "letting things escalate". And I think the article has some good points to how maybe this is being directed by politicians as a way to promote their agendas (violence leads to coverage and the easy blame game).

We need to do better and start policing these riots/gang fights in everything but name only.

 

[Steelerfan]

Yeh, me too 'D'. The snowflakes are too indoctrinated to realize that they are coming across as total morons.

Democrats can officially say that their Party has now been taken over by radical socialism and single minded racial rhetoric.

Hit

 

[oneforthebus]

So as a descendant of oppressors you want to relive that moment, and you want the descendent's of people who were tortured, raped, murdered, and exploited till death to also relive it?

Forget about being quite the history buff....you're quite the human being...........................

Tried to have a rational conversation with you but I should have known better. No, not relive it in the sense of bringing it back. Relive it in the sense of immersing yourself in a time period to understand it better. Poor choice of words maybe but I think you know what I meant...

I am not the descendant of oppressors by the way, my ancestors were Irish, Polish and Croatian immigrants so more likely to have been oppressed than be oppressors.

 

[Elfiero]

Tried to have a rational conversation with you but I should have known better. No, not relive it in the sense of bringing it back. Relive it in the sense of immersing yourself in a time period to understand it better. Poor choice of words maybe but I think you know what I meant...

I am not the descendant of oppressors by the way, my ancestors were Irish, Polish and Croatian immigrants so more likely to have been oppressed than be oppressors.

And a statue does that for you? Do you know how weak your argument sounds to truly rational ears? You are trying to argue for a side, just because they stand opposite that other side you don't like, but who happens to be totally and unambiguously correct in their position concerning this matter.

In the words of Freud; " Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

 

[BAS]

And a statue does that for you? Do you know how weak your argument sounds to truly rational ears? You are trying to argue for a side, just because they stand opposite that other side you don't like, but who happens to be totally and unambiguously correct in their position concerning this matter.

In the words of Freud; " Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

Seems to me you're creating a conflict with someone who has a point.

Didn't answer my question though... which just means you're dodging the issue. So I can infer from that stance that you only find Civil War statues offensive because the media tells you to.

 

[Sarge]

So then those Dems. in Chip's picture associating with Byrd aren't racists.......right? Then what is chip's point?

Chip's point is that Robert Byrd is a ******* racist, and he is held up a hero to your party.

 

[oneforthebus]

And a statue does that for you? Do you know how weak your argument sounds to truly rational ears? You are trying to argue for a side, just because they stand opposite that other side you don't like, who happens to be totally and unambiguously correct in their position concerning this matter.

In the words of Freud; " Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

Your argument is just ridiculous on its face. All physical reminders of negative aspects of history must be destroyed, so that people whose ancestors were hurt by them don't have to look at them? Do you realize how many priceless historic artifacts and architecture that applies to around the world? And I ask you again, you believe African Americans want all physical reminders of slavery destroyed?

Should we torch Gettysburg? Tear down the Lorraine Motel?

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

So then those Dems. in Chip's picture associating with Byrd aren't racists.......right? Then what is chip's point?

If I celebrated and supported the cause of those I associated with, then I would be complicit. If I, the lawyer, supported the criminal's crimes, then I'm no different. If my priest is a pedophile and I support pedophilia, then I am complicit.

There is a difference. I could work with Robert Byrd because I have to in Government, but be wholly against his past and his beliefs.

I'm not expecting you to get it.

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

The Attack on ‘Whataboutism’ Is a Defense of Hypocrisy

President Donald Trump’s opponents have learned a new word: “whataboutism.” Democrats and NeverTrump Republicans alike have embraced the term as a weapon against anyone who objects to the double standards that are routinely applied by Trump’s critics in the mainstream media.
Rather than engage that criticism, Trump-haters on both sides of the aisle simply cry “whataboutism,” as if it were a magic spell to ward off rational thought.

Charlottesville is a case in point. The media’s double standards have been evident in the widespread refusal to report that left-wing “anti-fascist” thugs came with the specific intention of using violence to shut down the free speech of white supremacists and other groups. Pointing that out does not mean condoning that speech, nor the horrific act of domestic terrorism that happened later. But it is an important part of the story, even a crucial one.

Our Constitution demands that we respect the First Amendment even — and especially — when it comes to views most Americans find abhorrent. Had Antifa merely staged a peaceful counter-protest, and had Charlottesville police done their duty, the white supremacists’ demonstration might have ended in mockery alone. Instead, the white supremacists are using the violence to recruit new members and planning future provocations elsewhere.

Moreover, amidst the hysteria about what President Trump said, or did not say, in the aftermath of Charlottesville, it is worth pointing out that President Barack Obama never disavowed Black Lives Matter even when killers inspired by that movement executed police officers in cold blood — including five who were shot by a sniper at a protest in Dallas. That does not justify murder in Virginia, but it ought to temper the destructive hysteria of Trump’s critics.

The charge of “whataboutism” is nothing more than an attempt to shield one-sided criticism of Trump. That is why members of the failed NeverTrump movement love it. During the election, they refused to accept the obvious fact that opposing Trump, or supporting a third-party protest vote, meant helping Hillary Clinton. Today, many refuse to accept that criticizing only Trump means boosting the double standards that are deployed against all conservatives.

Those double standards are deeply corrosive of democracy as a whole. The fact that the mainstream media, for example, overlooked or defended mistakes by Obama that they treat as impeachable offenses by Trump means that legitimate criticism of the administration is often taken less seriously.

Rather than shout “whataboutism,” Trump’s opponents should apply the same standards to all, and protect the principles that we should all hold in common.

 

[SteelChip]

Posted by Elfiero So then those Dems. in Chip's picture associating with Byrd aren't racists.......right? Then what is chip's point?

Whatchoo talkin' bout boy ? I didn't print no Byrd pictures.

 

[Troglodyte]

Yep. That's simple. A lawyer interfaces with convicted felons. That doesn't make him a felon. I interface and coached with a man for years that was in prison. That doesn't make me a criminal. People attend Catholic churches all the time where the priest may be a pedophile. That doesn't make them pedophiles and they are still fine people.

Could go on for days. You can associate with the lowest forms of life on this planet and be a fine person.

Now back to mine: "What if murdering abortionists staged a protest and marched and Alt Right Pro Lifers show up armed and ready to fight? Are these Pro Lifers who had the courage to go toe to toe with murdering abortionists heroes like AntiFA is to you and Tibs? Wouldn't they courageously be standing up to the hideous and heinous acts of child murder? What could be more noble?" and "Why shouldn't the Nazis, KKK, et all have been allowed to march? "

FAIL! "Well, if it's required due your job or if you're not aware..." Answer the question in the context In which we are discussing, coward! You're against taking down confederate statues, would you have participated in the Charlottesville march? Is it possible "fine people" participated?

And yes, I believe people can peacefully protest anything, but once they start chanting "Kill all Jews" it turns into intimidation and threats.

 

[steel shinin]

FAIL! "Well, if it's required due your job or if you're not aware..." Answer the question in the context In which we are discussing, coward! You're against taking down confederate statues, would you have participated in the Charlottesville march? Is it possible "fine people" participated?

And yes, I believe people can peacefully protest anything, but once they start chanting "Kill all Jews" it turns into intimidation and threats.

I don;t know how much clearer it can get than this. You come around me with this **** and we're going to have a problem. You can claim peaceful intentions all you want but if that comes out of your mouth and you're draped in a Nazi flag shouting hateful **** around me you may very well get your *** beat. I make no apologies for that. There's zero tolerance for that. I've seen this **** yelled in childrens faces before. Sickening.

 

[Troglodyte]

I don;t know how much clearer it can get than this. You come around me with this **** and we're going to have a problem. You can claim peaceful intentions all you want but if that comes out of your mouth and you're draped in a Nazi flag shouting hateful **** around me you may very well get your *** beat. I make no apologies for that. There's zero tolerance for that. I've seen this **** yelled in childrens faces before. Sickening.

So Trump was wrong to say "fine people" participated?

 

[steel shinin]

So Trump was wrong to say "fine people" participated?

Yeah I would say whatever direction his racist advisers gave in how to handle this wasn't very subtle but this one was the worst if not the worst.

 

[Tibs]

Charlottesville is a case in point. The media’s double standards have been evident in the widespread refusal to report that left-wing “anti-fascist” thugs came with the specific intention of using violence to shut down the free speech of white supremacists and other groups.

Since you didn't post a link or put the text in quotes, I can only presume you wrote all of this yourself. / edit - aha, I see the title links to breitbart, makes perfect sense

Let's just say for a minute this is the only point you're trying to make regarding the events this weekend.

That the KKK & Nazis had a permit to march and the counter protestors showed up and boo hoo, they couldn't hold their rally because of the chaos that ensued.

So, basically, you should be angry with the Charlottesville police for not having the foresight this was gonna be chaotic event with a lot of people involved. They should have upheld the law - the KKK's right to protest with a permit - and provided safety and security on the ground to allow that to happen.

So your gripe can only be with the Charlottesville Police Dept. I wonder, if you've sent them an email or phoned them to raise your voice in protest.

Since according to you, nothing else bad happened in Charlottesville besides the fact the poor KKK and Nazi choir boys were denied their first amendment rights by having their protest truncated by the counter protestors.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Chip's point is that Robert Byrd is a ******* racist, and he is held up a hero to your party.

There are more things in West Virginia named for Sen. Robert Byrd than there are things named for West Virginia.

Sen. Byrd says America is post-racial:

 

[coupon]

Here's what I don't understand; why do rednecks fly American & Confederate flags in the back of their pickup trucks? I mean pick a side, numb nuts


Sent from my iPhone using Steeler Nation mobile app

 

[Tibs]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Our cover this week <a href="https://t.co/lYD3HLXvSC">pic.twitter.com/lYD3HLXvSC</a></p>— The Economist (@TheEconomist) <a href="https://twitter.com/TheEconomist/status/898129991799631872">August 17, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">An early look at next week's cover, "Blowhard," by David Plunkert: <a href="https://t.co/VuBXtwJCUQ">https://t.co/VuBXtwJCUQ</a> <a href="https://t.co/zsDHVOBBQO">pic.twitter.com/zsDHVOBBQO</a></p>— The New Yorker (@NewYorker) <a href="https://twitter.com/NewYorker/status/898270023537508353">August 17, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Ben Jennings on Donald Trump and Charlottesville – cartoon <a href="https://t.co/gnTT0cnnYp">https://t.co/gnTT0cnnYp</a> <a href="https://t.co/k5NTwbPNoR">pic.twitter.com/k5NTwbPNoR</a></p>— The Guardian (@guardian) <a href="https://twitter.com/guardian/status/897510023030607872">August 15, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

Here's what I don't understand; why do rednecks fly American & Confederate flags in the back of their pickup trucks? I mean pick a side, numb nuts


Sent from my iPhone using Steeler Nation mobile app

Same reason someone does a american and a steeler or American and Irish. Country and culture/local

 

[Ron Burgundy]

In the words of Freud; " Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

And a donut without a hole is just a Danish.