Pieces of **** - Republicans in Congress - Hello? Donald?

[CharlesDavenport]

http://hosted2.ap.org/APDefault/*/A... Overhaul/id-2054d84aa147460c80d17025a79dfd32

WASHINGTON (AP) — The latest GOP effort to repeal and replace "Obamacare" was fatally wounded in the Senate Monday night when two more Republican senators announced their opposition to legislation strongly backed by President Donald Trump.
The announcements from Sens. Mike Lee of Utah and Jerry Moran of Kansas left the Republican Party's long-promised efforts to get rid of President Barack Obama's health care legislation reeling. Next steps, if any, were not immediately clear.
Lee and Moran both said they could not support Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's legislation in its current form. They joined GOP Sens. Susan Collins of Maine and Rand Paul of Kentucky, both of whom announced their opposition right after McConnell released the bill last Thursday.

Yeah, that's because McConnell and Ryan won't draft good legislation that challenges the Schumer filibuster threat even though we (they) have the power to change procedures to run right over it. Either they have a standing deal in place with the Dems that they put in place when they thought Hillary was going to be the pres, or they think such machinations would look bad - to the media I guess - and worry their re-election prospects, or they just want Donald to fail. In any case, these ******* are not keeping faith with the voters.

Where is the President in all of this? He is putting all of his marbles in this opaque Ryan|McConnell process, and every time it is a shitburger. Enough Bud. Time to lead. Tell the people what you want. Tell them Ryan and McConnell are losers. Bully pulpit time. Eight ******* years of bitching about Obamacare, and we have nothing to propose. This ******* sucks.

 

[Tibs]

I feel your pain Charles. When Trump won, with a full-majority House and Senate, I presumed it would be clear sailing on Republican legislation, certainly in the first couple of years. Who would have thought after the GOP spent so many years waiting in the wings, with time to prepare and fine-tune a new health care plan, we'd be watching this **** show instead? Who would have thought after Trump's incessant promises of Repeal & Replace on the campaign trail, that we'd be left with nothing but hot air?

And let's be brutally honest. Trump ran on the notion that as the greatest CEO that ever walked the earth, his business acumen and leadership would re-energize and consolidate the Republican party. Finally, a strong leader who would cut through the gridlock and get **** done. This has simply not been the case. Where has our strong-willed leader been? On the golf course, that's where.

 

[Spike]

Repeal now...replace later



President Trump, Mitch McConnell Call for Clean Repeal of Obamacare Now, Replacement Later

President Donald J. Trump is calling on congressional Republicans to drop their failed efforts to repeal and replace Obamacare in one fell swoop and instead pass a clean repeal of the failed health care overhaul from the previous administration now and push through a bipartisan replacement plan later.

McConnell is now saying he will support Trump’s idea of passing clean repeal of Obamacare now and a replacement of Obamacare later.

The legislation for a clean repeal of Obamacare has already passed both chambers of Congress in 2015, with a majority in the House and in the Senate voting for it.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...clean-repeal-obamacare-now-replacement-later/

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2 year delay to replace?

Puts the Dems on the spot for 2018, I like it

 

[DBS1970]

Repeal and replace with nothing.

The issue is that much of the Republican voting base wants the things included in Obamacare. They just don't want the big intrusive government or the big cost. But you can't separate one from the other. And people just can't grasp that.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Repeal and replace with nothing.

The issue is that much of the Republican voting base wants the things included in Obamacare. They just don't want the big intrusive government or the big cost. But you can't separate one from the other. And people just can't grasp that.

It isn't what the republican base wants. It's what the RINOs think they need in there to use the reconciliation process. The voting base wants repeal and open market competition.

 

[21STEELERS21]

If you want a real open market, you need to eliminate the business deduction for health insurance.
When most employers drop health insurance as a benefit, you'll have a real open market.

Currently a legitimate family health insurance plan starts at 15K per year. Only families with at least 60K annual
income can legitimately afford to pay that kind of money.

 

[Spike]

Cruz Rescues Republicans on Obamacare

Republicans are finally getting smart on Obamacare. It took one of the savviest Republican senators -- Ted Cruz of Texas, with an assist from Mike Lee of Utah -- to get the GOP to figure out how to replace Obamacare, reduce premiums and save money for the government, all without alienating millions of voters. He's pulled the Republicans' fannies out of the fire, flipping a losing strategy into a big-time winner.

The Cruz amendment -- which has been inserted into the GOP Senate health plan -- is smart, because it doesn't take anything away from anyone. If you want Obamacare, you can have it. You can have the coverage for the 10 "essential benefits"; you can have the subsidies and exchanges that were supposed to save $2,500 per family. It's still there for you.

The Cruz amendment introduces what is called the "Consumer Freedom Option." The Consumer Freedom Option allows insurers who offer Obamacare-compliant plans to offer a range of less costly plans. In other words, it empowers people and families to pick and choose what they want in their own insurance packages. Some families want, and can afford, blanket coverage that insures them for everything from cancer to contraceptives. If you want to pay for that coverage, go for it.

What about people with lower incomes or healthy lifestyles that want the other extreme? They can opt for slimmed-down coverage that protects them from major medical expenses, such as costly ongoing treatments for a serious disease. These families may choose to pay for more routine medical expenses, such as checkups, out of pocket. One benefit is that since more people will pay directly for medical services, they are likely to shop around for the best prices, and this competition will lower prices for everyone.

https://townhall.com/columnists/ste...ruz-rescues-republicans-on-obamacare-n2356051

 

[Steelr4evr]

The government had no damn business getting involved in the first place. None at all. If they wanted to do something good promote healthy living and taking care of yourself. Without a forced mandate. The direction society is heading lifestyle wise can not be fixed with any amount of healthcare insurance no matter how cheap it is. The truly sick not by their own hand could easily be taken care of if we work on the preventive side of life. The objective of commiecare was always to take over by single payer.

I'd like to see a constitutional convention of the states to address this issue and many others. **** congress and the Senate. They need power throttled because they have lost their way.

 

[fedderone]

This is what sucks.
So the ACA was written and constructed to do EXACTLY this.
We were lied to about the ACA, it was rammed down our throats, and we're now seeing the full wrath of this poor policy.
It was supposed to cover everyone ( it didn't ).
It was supposed to lower premiums ( it didn't ).
You were supposed to be able to keep your current plan and doctor ( and both of those were false ).
Obama and most dems said, "In order to get universal healthcare, we need to have a bridge" ( or some variation of that ).

For the record, I'm in favor of the free market healthcare we had prior to the ACA.
BUT, if you're going to do single payor, DO SINGLE PAYOR.
The ACA is neither free market healthcare nor universal healthcare.
It is the worst from both of those bastardized into one gigantic turd....WRITTEN BY INSURANCE COMPANIES!
It was successful in bringing down free market healthcare to convert us to universal healthcare.
It was booby trapped with enough "enticing" things that once enacted it would be impossible to take away because a good chunk of constituents would pitch fits.......and we all know that our elected officials only work to get re-elected. They don't work to serve us......as they should.
This is why it is so tricky and almost now impossible to change/repeal/replace/etc.

I work in the healthcare industry and have for going on 20 years.
I think the pre-existing clause is nonsense. The human body, while a scientific marvel, is also tremendously flawed.
Yes people make poor choices, but that's why you pay money for insurance. It's like auto insurance. Sometimes you make a bad choice, sometimes someone else does. In either case, you are taken care of because you pay into the system. But with auto insurance, you pay for what type of coverage you want.
Insurance for anything should not be required by law. It's called personal responsibility.

And last, please spare me the "people will die" garbage.
I HATE that ridiculous nonsense everytime I hear it.
People weren't dying in the streets before the ACA, and people wouldn't die in the streets if we scrapped it, either.
Nobody has ever been brought to an ER and been turned away.
Nobody has ever walked into a doctor's office and been told no, we won't treat you.
The true indigent can get ALL kinds of charity, be it from the medical provider themselves or from the government.
All of these programs existed before the ACA.

Healthcare is not a right. It's not promised in the Bill of Rights or the Constitution. Much like a tree falling on your house, or a drunk driver hitting you in your car, or a tornado dismantling your home, or a sinkhole opening up and swallowing you in your car on the freeway, or you being struck by lightning, etc. is not visited on your neighbors/society, neither should your ills. Everyone is genetically different. People get sick and die. People have accidents and die. People contract disease and die. All of these things are non discriminatory. They're random. Father time is still undefeated. There is no secret pill that envelops you in bubble wrap and prevents all toxins from entering your body.

Once our overly liberal friends on capitol hill realize you can't and shouldn't try and protect everyone from everything, and once our heartless greedy conservative friends realize everything doesn't boil down to dollars and cents.......pigs will fly......and we'll all be happier for it.

Sorry for the rant.
Because it's my profession, this grates on me something fierce.
I knew this was coming when I sat down and read the entire ACA back in 2009 - 2010.
I was just as fearful then as I am now as to how this all plays out. No matter what, it won't end well for us.

 

[IndySteel]

The establishment republicans are just as corrupt as the democrats. We need to end all of their income from lobbyists. They get their salary only and a limit of 2 terms. Let's hope for a complete repeal of the Obamacare massive failure. If they try to replace it with something that actually works, then congress has to be part of it. They don't get to opt out of it. They're not better than us. Those shady ******** work for us. If they can't get it done before the elections next year, then we vote for all 3rd party candidates. The democrats have already destroyed themselves and are obsolete. We can do it to the republicans too. Drain the swamp!

 

[Superman]

The establishment republicans are just as corrupt as the democrats. We need to end all of their income from lobbyists. They get their salary only and a limit of 2 terms. Let's hope for a complete repeal of the Obamacare massive failure. If they try to replace it with something that actually works, then congress has to be part of it. They don't get to opt out of it. They're not better than us. Those shady ******** work for us. If they can't get it done before the elections next year, then we vote for all 3rd party candidates. The democrats have already destroyed themselves and are obsolete. We can do it to the republicans too. Drain the swamp!

hardly.

this was the appeal of Trump for a lot of voters.

the Democrats are absolutely NOT changing their M.O. In fact, they are doubling down. Expect Princess Fauxcahontas Lieawatha to be strongly considered for their POTUS candidate in 2020.

the Republican party, by and large, did not want Trump. They allowed him in reluctantly, even wanting to know if he would sue them if the results were not in his favor. Then he tore into all their candidates.

the POTUS has no friends on either side of the aisle.

he's showing those who are paying attention that the two parties are in ... collusion ... with one another.

So, yes, break it down. tear it apart. this is absolutely NOT the government the Founding Fathers envisioned.

 

[ark steel]

If you want a real open market, you need to eliminate the business deduction for health insurance.
When most employers drop health insurance as a benefit, you'll have a real open market.

Currently a legitimate family health insurance plan starts at 15K per year. Only families with at least 60K annual
income can legitimately afford to pay that kind of money.

We have a lot of employees with under 60k income who have family plans. That is BECAUSE the employer helps out. Now you want to **** over those families? Nice job of protecting the middle class, liberal.

 

[Stryker]

I think the GOP is doing a smart strategy by not voting until it is assured to pass, means the bill will still exist if a vote is not taken.

 

[Roy92040]

Repeal now...replace later



President Trump, Mitch McConnell Call for Clean Repeal of Obamacare Now, Replacement Later

President Donald J. Trump is calling on congressional Republicans to drop their failed efforts to repeal and replace Obamacare in one fell swoop and instead pass a clean repeal of the failed health care overhaul from the previous administration now and push through a bipartisan replacement plan later.

McConnell is now saying he will support Trump’s idea of passing clean repeal of Obamacare now and a replacement of Obamacare later.

The legislation for a clean repeal of Obamacare has already passed both chambers of Congress in 2015, with a majority in the House and in the Senate voting for it.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern...clean-repeal-obamacare-now-replacement-later/

-----------------------

2 year delay to replace?

Puts the Dems on the spot for 2018, I like it

Now this makes sense. So far Congress has tried to tip toe around in this thing, trying not to break any eggshells. I think it's time to completely shitcan the old and bring on the new.

 

[jitter77]

The problem is both sides whine about the other but offer no solutions. People who don't like the ACA had several years to come up with something, but sat on their hands. Now they are trying to pass a half *** bill. None of them really have any room to complain because they are all at fault. As for trump he is not doing a whole lot to push it through either. I honestly think it is because he does not understand the bill enough although that doesn't stop him from spewing stuff other times.

 

[21STEELERS21]

Employer subsidized healthcare is not free market healthcare. Its actually government healthcare because allowing the tax deduction
is a government rule that in turn reduces government tax receipts. All US healthcare is government funded, we just do it in a very
convoluted manner than other countries do, which of course greatly increases the cost of administering it.

If doctors and hospitals had to collect directly from the consumer, our healthcare costs would be in free fall.

 

[deljzc]

I feel your pain Charles. When Trump won, with a full-majority House and Senate, I presumed it would be clear sailing on Republican legislation, certainly in the first couple of years. Who would have thought after the GOP spent so many years waiting in the wings, with time to prepare and fine-tune a new health care plan, we'd be watching this **** show instead? Who would have thought after Trump's incessant promises of Repeal & Replace on the campaign trail, that we'd be left with nothing but hot air?

And let's be brutally honest. Trump ran on the notion that as the greatest CEO that ever walked the earth, his business acumen and leadership would re-energize and consolidate the Republican party. Finally, a strong leader who would cut through the gridlock and get **** done. This has simply not been the case. Where has our strong-willed leader been? On the golf course, that's where.

I can't believe you are spinning this as a critique of Trump. What a load of ****.

 

[oneforthebus]

As I said way back when Obamacare was introduced, once you get people hooked on an entitlement there is no yanking it away from them. Never gonna happen.

Look for single payer within the next decade, because that's where we are headed.

Employer subsidized healthcare is not free market healthcare. Its actually government healthcare because allowing the tax deduction
is a government rule that in turn reduces government tax receipts.

So basically, all money belongs to the government, and any of our own money that it lets us keep is funding from the government. Damn, that is some ****** up thinking.

 

[deljzc]

On the health care issue, I'm moving more toward single-payer as well even though I'm strongly conservative.

Have to completely cut off the insurance industry. They are the sickness that is causing the vine to wither and die.

I hate to say this, but I might agree with Bernie Sanders. I think the first step is lowering the age for Medicare to 55.

 

[Tibs]

I can't believe you are spinning this as a critique of Trump. What a load of ****.

Is it? No doubt the GOP Congress shoulders most of the blame, but come on. The incoming president with a full majority can't get the job done? Repeal & Replace was front and center to his campaign. Not to speak of all the supposed leadership skills he was bringing in from the business world. I'm a little surprised you want to sugarcoat this, that this isn't an embarrassing defeat for the president.

Trump on healthcare:

 

[Tibs]

 

[ark steel]

I think the GOP is doing a smart strategy by not voting until it is assured to pass, means the bill will still exist if a vote is not taken.

Their not-smart part is putting for a bill that sucks as bad as Obamacare...

 

[ark steel]

Employer subsidized healthcare is not free market healthcare. Its actually government healthcare because allowing the tax deduction
is a government rule that in turn reduces government tax receipts. All US healthcare is government funded, we just do it in a very
convoluted manner than other countries do, which of course greatly increases the cost of administering it.

If doctors and hospitals had to collect directly from the consumer, our healthcare costs would be in free fall.

Sure it is free market. The "subsidized by the government" is, of course, the liberal lack of understanding that it wasn't the government's money in the first place.

 

[ark steel]

As I said way back when Obamacare was introduced, once you get people hooked on an entitlement there is no yanking it away from them. Never gonna happen.

Look for single payer within the next decade, because that's where we are headed.



So basically, all money belongs to the government, and any of our own money that it lets us keep is funding from the government. Damn, that is some ****** up thinking.

Posts like this are why OFTB makes my pants fit funny.

 

[deljzc]

I guess I'm one of the few Republicans that voted for Trump that long ago realized healthcare is "unfixable" in it's current form. His campaign rhetoric never really meant much to me. Employee-Employer health care is getting worse. Obamacare sucks. Whatever the Republicans propose sucks. It all sucks.

I always remind everyone, what we are arguing about now (Obamacare vs. Trumpcare) doesn't really do a damn thing for how health care is received by a VAST majority of Americans, which is employee-employer benefits. Me and my family are NEVER going to receive health care in any other way.

Obama's expensive medicaid expansion was a Democrat social program that (of course) costs WAY more and is ten times more inefficient than promised. I could have told you that back in 2010 and every liberal here admits to.

Any attempt to roll back a social program no matter how expensive or inefficient is going to make them portrayed as heartless rocks by the liberal media. Of course to make the costs go down you have to stop covering something or take something away. It's simple math.

My understand of Obamacare vs. Trumpcare really just comes down to Federal vs. State dollars. Who's paying for what and who is allowed to roll back some coverages. Basically, Republicans want to make the States the scapegoats and bad guys for rolling back out of control medicaid expansion under Obamacare.

Again, doesn't really effect me at all. And never will.