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Target Down 5 Billion Since Embracing Trans Bathroom Policy

I'm not seeing it now but days ago I read something about a southern legislator (SC?) stating that young girls would have to learn to be comfortable with seeing men's junk. This was in response to the locker room aspect of the decree by our dear leader. WTF! I just can't even process this ****.
 
onefor ... would you feel comfortable with Bill Cosby relieving himself in the stall next to you, and you two are the only people in the restroom?

Since I wouldn't be looking into his stall I probably would never know he is there. (I wouldn't take a drink he offered me).

I have used restrooms and fitting rooms alongside men before. Neither was a big deal to me. But then I don't view all men as serial predators desperate for a peek at me pissing.

onefor has sons, so she couldnt give a **** less about someone's damn daughter.

I have two daughters and a son. My 16 year old daughters think the idea that a transgender girl should have to use a men's room is absolutely ridiculous. They also think I am a terrible bigot because I don't agree that transgender is just one more normal way of being.

As I said before, the youth in this country by and large feel differently about this issue.
 
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My only major concern with this (aside from it being an edict from Der Fuhrer) is the whole "I Identify with a man/woman" thing and they don't even have to be transgender. I'm not uncomfortable using a men's room...and I don't care who's next to me in a stall. I DO care that those who ARE uncomfortable with this are the ones villified if a person of the opposite sex walks in and uses the restroom just because they identify.
 
No. I don't believe that a gun free zone is a barrier to a person intending to commit a mass shooting.

Using the same reasoning, I don't believe the threat of a misdemeanor offense for ignoring a symbol of a women on an unlocked door is a barrier to a person intending to commit a felony.

You again miss the point and make a poor analogy.

A gun free zone is not a barrier to entry for a man with a gun. But an armed security guard at the school is as one example. Or someone with a concealed carry permit. The signs are irrelevant on the bathroom doors and for gun free zones. It's the systems or people in place to stop someone ignoring those signs that matter.

Historically, women have been able to protect themselves and one another when a person would disobey the signs by screaming, yelling, and calling out for help. And help would come. Not always, but that retaliation option was there. It is now being silenced.

A better comparison to gun free zones would be as follows. Both the restrooms and the gun free zones are "protected" by signs. We all know both are bullshit. Using your analogy, the sign won't stop the perv at the bathroom door AND the people inside can no longer summon help (as supported by evidence provided - help won't come). Analogous would be a gun free zone posted school where the police don't respond to calls from the school that a person entered with a weapon.

That's a direct comparison.
 
I'm not seeing it now but days ago I read something about a southern legislator (SC?) stating that young girls would have to learn to be comfortable with seeing men's junk. This was in response to the locker room aspect of the decree by our dear leader. WTF! I just can't even process this ****.

That article ran in the Charlotte Observer I believe.
 
The thing I most love about this thread is the fact six months from now none of us will believe we spent 20+ pages discussing where people can pee or not pee.

Tim Steelersfan will by then have found a new OCD topic to fret about, however minute in relevance it has to actual, day to day life.
 
My only major concern with this (aside from it being an edict from Der Fuhrer) is the whole "I Identify with a man/woman" thing and they don't even have to be transgender. I'm not uncomfortable using a men's room...and I don't care who's next to me in a stall. I DO care that those who ARE uncomfortable with this are the ones villified if a person of the opposite sex walks in and uses the restroom just because they identify.

Bingo. Exactly. Thank you.

All of these leftist movements that move to "grant rights" to these uber minorities in return destroy the rights of others as a means of granting them.

As the woman at the Ross dressing room said, "What about my feelings?"

Lady, you're a straight female American. Your rights to privacy are ******. You are uncomfortable being at Planet Fitness and a non-transgender male says "I, this moment, identify as a female" and is let into the showers to shower with you, you just have to deal with it. You have no rights to showering with only women any longer. You feel self conscious because you just gave birth 3 months ago, you had a C-section, stretch marks, and are working to try to shed those pounds and have to shower in front of this suddenly-identified man-woman? Too ******* bad. Next weekend when you take your daughter to Liberal State University and you show up to find her Freshman roommie is a male who identifies as female, guess what your rights are? A nice, hot cup of shut the **** up.

Thank God the 700,000 transgenders and the countless predators have the freedom to do what they want without repercussion though.

Liberal America - Fixing Problems Only to Create Even Greater Problems
 
The thing I most love about this thread is the fact six months from now none of us will believe we spent 20+ pages discussing where people can pee or not pee.

Tim Steelersfan will by then have found a new OCD topic to fret about, however minute in relevance it has to actual, day to day life.

When the next little girl is stabbed in a dressing room, or worse yet, killed in a dressing room because the perp was able to walk in under cover of "identifying as a female", you'll be the absolute first I point it out to Tibs.

Somehow I think you're probably disappointed that your daughter wasn't a part of that swim team in the Washington locker room. I'm sure she missed out on a learning opportunity watching that exhibitionist not once, but twice, expose himself to those young women.

No worries! More of these educational events will follow!
 
A beautiful article.

https://www.aei.org/publication/yes...e-but-were-going-about-it-in-a-dangerous-way/

Yes, we should protect transgender people but we’re going about it in a dangerous way

Allowing biological men to use women’s restrooms and changing rooms — what could possibly go wrong?

Plenty.

As a compassionate society, we believe that transgendered people should be protected from discrimination. We also believe that women and children should be protected from sexual exploitation and assault. Creating a new “right” for biological men to use women-only facilities is an open invitation to sex predators pretending to be transgender in order to get access to victims at their most vulnerable.

It is happening already even without an invitation. Take the case of Taylor Buehler, a man who was arrested in 2012 after entering a women’s bathroom at Everett Community College in Washington state dressed in a bra and wig. He claimed that he was just there to use the facilities, but under police questioning, Buehler “admitted to officers that he was the suspect in an earlier voyeurism incident … [in which] he took a shower in the girls’ locker room for sexual gratification.”

Or take the case of Norwood Smith Burnes, a 51-year-old Rome, Ga., man who was arrested for undressing in front of children in a Walmart women’s room. According to the Atlanta Journal Constitution , Burnes was wearing a short skirt, high heels, red nail, polish, and green eye shadow and was found in “stages of undress . . . in the presence of several young children.” After his arrest, the paper said, police discovered that he “had a long record of indecent exposure and was on probation for public indecency.”

Under the new norm that the Obama administration wants to establish, all either man would have had to say to avoid arrest was that he “identified” as a woman and was exercising his civil right to use the facility corresponding to his preferred gender. Moreover, each of these alleged predators was caught because women complained that there was a man dressed as a woman in the women’s room. If the Obama administration had its way, the women might never have complained for fear they would be accused of being bigots or violating civil rights.

Don’t believe it? Just look to our neighbor up north, where in 2012, the province of Ontario changed its Human Rights Code to bar discrimination against anyone because of “gender identity” or “gender expression” — giving anyone who claimed to be transgender the legal right to use women-only facilities. That allowed Christopher Hambrook to dress like a woman and sign into several Toronto area women’s shelters, where he sexually assaulted women seeking refuge from domestic violence. Police later discovered that he had been convicted in Montreal of sexually assaulting a 5-year-old girl and a mentally challenged 27-year-old woman. He was not transgender; he was a sex predator pretending to be transgender. But nobody dared to question him, because to do so would have been a violation of his “human rights.”

It used to be that authorities judged who belonged in which bathroom by an objective criteria: their anatomy. But in its recent “guidance ” to public educational institutions, the Obama administration declared that “gender identity” is determined by “an individual’s internal sense of gender.” It’s all about how you feel. And no one can question those feelings. Indeed, the Obama administration said, doing so is unlawful. The Justice and Education departments declared that in public educational institutions “there is no medical diagnosis or treatment requirement that students must meet as a prerequisite to being treated consistent with their gender identity” and that “requiring students to produce such identification documents . . . may violate Title IX.”

Moreover, how you feel can change — because, we are told, “gender is fluid.” According to CNN , “For some people . . . how one identifies can change every day or even every few hours.” For sex predators, that is awfully convenient. If gender identities can change by the day or hour, then what is to stop pedophiles and voyeurs from simply saying that their gender is “fluid” — and they were feeling like a woman that day? And how are police supposed to discern who is actually transgender and who is pretending to be transgender?

Last year, after Washington state passed a law opening public bathrooms to transgender people, a man walked into the women’s changing room at a Seattle public pool and began undressing while young girls were changing for swim practice. He wasn’t even dressed like a woman. When staff asked the man to leave, he told them “the law has changed and I have a right to be here.” The flummoxed staff did not even call police.

By all means, schools should be required to provide access to bathrooms and changing areas where transgender people can feel safe. And there is a simple solution. As one transgender young man put it in The Post this weekend, “Imagine a room with a toilet, a sink and a door with a lock. Suddenly everyone’s problems go away.” But that is not good enough for the Obama administration, which insists that biological males who identify as women have a fundamental right to access to women’s facilities. That is a recipe for disaster.

Sex predators are devious; they will use any excuse to gain access to their victims. Government should not be opening the bathroom door for them. Yes, we should find ways to protect transgender people — but we must do so without endangering everyone else.

----------------------------------------------

That pretty much sums up every point we've been making.

The cases and how they expose this movement.

How women's voices are being silenced, and thus their protections in these facilities are being destroyed.

Logic. Logic that will escape the Left until the problems that result lead to sane change. As the transgender in the article stated - provide a bathroom with a lock. Problem sovled.
 
When the next little girl is stabbed in a dressing room, or worse yet, killed in a dressing room because the perp was able to walk in under cover of "identifying as a female", you'll be the absolute first I point it out to Tibs. Somehow I think you're probably disappointed that your daughter wasn't a part of that swim team in the Washington locker room. I'm sure she missed out on a learning opportunity watching that exhibitionist not once, but twice, expose himself to those young women. No worries! More of these educational events will follow!
In this thread spanning the past few weeks, you've gone from overreacting a little bit, to quite a bit, to a lot, to completely losing your ******* mind. Your singular focus on this 'transgenders in bathrooms' issue has utterly clouded your thinking, which may - or may not - have been rational to begin with. This has become the prism through which you now see the current state of human existance on the planet earth. For the love of God do you really think this now will be the source of all evil? It's like life throughout history - up until they let transgenders into bathrooms - has been some utopian fairy tale, happy little kids skipping through fields of flowers, safe as can be. But now, the wrath of Satan is upon us. I'm not sure I've ever seen the extent of someone overreacting quite like what we've witnessed here. I suggest a long walk, get some fresh air, listen to a Vangelis CD, something, anything to calm your frazzled nerves.
 
In this thread spanning the past few weeks, you've gone from overreacting a little bit, to quite a bit, to a lot, to completely losing your ******* mind. Your singular focus on this 'transgenders in bathrooms' issue has utterly clouded your thinking, which may - or may not - have been rational to begin with. This has become the prism through which you now see the current state of human existance on the planet earth. For the love of God do you really think this now will be the source of all evil? It's like life throughout history - up until they let transgenders into bathrooms - has been some utopian fairy tale, happy little kids skipping through fields of flowers, safe as can be. But now, the wrath of Satan is upon us. I'm not sure I've ever seen the extent of someone overreacting quite like what we've witnessed here. I suggest a long walk, get some fresh air, listen to a Vangelis CD, something, anything to calm your frazzled nerves.

You really do hate women don't you?

When something is clearly this fraught with problems and will clearly lead to further victimizing women and girls, it is worth fighting against.

Didn't you and OFTB both say you were done with this thread, you'd said all you had to say?

So you are ok with girls moving into dorms to find their room mate for the year is a male?
You're ok with girls being forced to share a hotel room with someone of the opposite sex on an overnight field trip?
You're ok with high school girls having to openly shower with males?

These things are fine for you? You see no problems at all?
 
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You really do hate women don't you?
Nope I love and respect women, specifically my wife and two teenage daughters. I also have a lot of love for my 16 year-old son, who is also navigating this dangerous minefield called life, filled with hypocritical, dangerous, far right Christians such as yourself, who are afraid of their own shadows and want to project their paranoid fears on the rest of society.

Didn't you and OFTB both say you were done with this thread, you'd said all you had to say?
Sorry buddy, I know you love the echo chamber where you can spout off your mindless drivel, but I felt like jumping back in. Having said that, a few posters in this thread have been consistently taking you behind the shed on this issue including oneforthebus & Troglodyte. Respect to both of them for making strong, valid points in the name of sanity.

So you are ok with girls moving into dorms to find their room mate for the year is a male?
You're ok with girls being forced to share a hotel room with someone of the opposite sex on an overnight field trip?
You're ok with high school girls having to openly shower with males?
These things are fine for you? You see no problems at all?
If anything, these questions you pose should be a stark reminder how far down the rabbit hole you've fallen.

I don't know what demons are haunting you, but you are one scary mofo. Reading your posts I can't help but think you're a victim of some quirky LSD experiment gone bad. Real bad. Again, my only advice is to try to step back a little, try to regain some sort of perspective and talk yourself into the idea the world is not coming to a screeching halt due to transgender-bathroom legislation currently bandied around. The actual weight of these issues is no more than 0.0003% of what you are making them out to be.

Or try this. Solemnly swear on the Bible that you yourself will not go into a bathroom alone (without adult supervision) or allow your children or loved ones to do the same. Keep your head on a swivel Tim, there are millions, if not tens of millions of perverse transvestites out there ready to pounce at a moment's notice.
 
Yep, I got sucked back in, at first to respond to people claiming I said things I never said, and then yes, to respond to post after post of stories about things happening in bathrooms that have absolutely no relevance whatsoever to the issue, because as far as I can tell not one of these perpetrators gave a rat's *** about breaking whatever bathroom laws existed when they committed their crimes.

Tibs and I rarely agree on much, but the hysterical overreaction to this is cracking me up. The only two actual WOMEN in this thread who also both happen to be mothers do not seem to be too worried about this. It's the men who are skeeved out by transgenders (something I can't deny feeling myself at times) who really have a problem with it. All of this "showering with men or "changing their tampons in front of men" hysteria are the words of people who are not women and don't spend time in public women's facilities. I have never ONCE in 49 years been in a situation where I had no choice but to disrobe in front of another person...man or woman.

Took my daughters dress shopping tonight, at H & M they have unisex fitting rooms, right next to us was a young man trying on suits. All of the kids were coming out of their private stalls and showing the clothes to their MOMS in front of each other. No one thought a thing about it. In fact they asked my opinion on one of his suits and complimented one of my daughters on their dress.

Meanwhile anyone who wanted to could have walked right by the fitting room and seen everything we saw.

It's not Victorian times anymore, where a woman might faint if a man saw her ankles (or a sliver of her back while her mom zipped up a dress for her.) Perverts can go to any beach or pool and get much more of an eyeful than they're ever going to get in a bathroom or fitting room.

This is just not the big deal you guys are making it into, it's not the major issue in most of our lives like you guys seem to think it is, and even if it was the NC law is impractical and impossible to enforce.
 
Tibs and I rarely agree on much...
For whatever it's worth, I've agreed with 100% of everything you've put forth in this thread. As a dad, I too am actively involved with raising my daughters and son - together with my wife. I deal with these same scenarios - going clothes shopping with the kids ie coed fitting rooms, public pools, sports & dance classes, overnight sleepovers, et al. I try to raise my kids to keep an even keel regarding gender issues. I see how society works - be it currently here in Europe or in the States - in that most people are reasonable and have no ill intentions. That's probably what set off my bullshit alarm regarding the level of overreaction in this thread. Victorian times indeed, to put it nicely.

I think your overriding point, which you've made time and time again, is that criminals will be criminals regardless of signs on the door of a bathroom or a changing stall. Perverts will be perverts, molesters will be molesters, rapists will be rapists. This issue of gender-neutral public bathrooms is a drop in the ocean and does not move the needle whatsoever when it comes to crimes against women or children. That ****'s been going on since the beginning of time. As a responsible parent, this changes nothing when it comes to looking after our kids, being careful and vigilant day in and day out. At the same time, you cannot live in your fears.

Following Tim's - and others - train of thought, there's no good reason to let our kids to ever leave the house. And as it's been pointed out repeatedly, the real, true danger to our loved ones comes in much less sinister forms. Be it a teacher, coach, clergy, neighbor, family friend or relative that have sick, evil intentions. Unfortunately, there are no signs on the door for that.
 
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The thing I most love about this thread is the fact six months from now none of us will believe we spent 20+ pages discussing where people can pee or not pee.

I posted quite some time back that I did not view this as a major issue (still don't, even if I disagree with some of what OFTB writes), but what I asked originally remains a relevant inquiry:

What in the hell business is it for the President to issue some edict to public schools about bathroom usage? Seriously, the most important man in the world felt it necessary to render this proclamation??
 
What in the hell business is it for the President to issue some edict to public schools about bathroom usage? Seriously, the most important man in the world felt it necessary to render this proclamation??

Because he has made this a human rights issue, ala Kennedy's and segregation. It is because transgenders have been made to drink from different water fountains, and have been kept out of (whatever you call regular genders) schools. Oh, wait......
 
I have said all along I don't think this is something government at any level needs to get involved with. We as mostly reasonable, functioning adults are perfectly capable of figuring this out on a case by case basis, much better than any zero tolerance government policy on either side ever could. We intrinsically know it's wrong to make a 14 year old girl who's living as a boy use the girls' room...we intrinsically know its' wrong to make a man who's living completely as a woman use the mens' room...we know that if a man comes into the women's restroom who does not in any way shape or form seem to be presenting himself as a female we need to be wary...we know that any time when we or our children are in a vulnerable private position of undress we need to be aware and vigilant of who's around us and how they are acting. We can handle this in a way that takes all situations into account and recognizes that while there are not perfect blanket options, there is the best option in each individual unique circumstance.
 
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The idea of trannys using the female bathroom is not the issue for me. It is the selfishness and entitlement mentality that these freaks possess that irks me.

Yes, its compassionate to allow a tranny to use the restroom that coincides with the gender he identifies as, but where's the compassion for the girls who do not wish to have a naked male in their bathroom or locker room? Why is their privacy and feelings of no importance?

People have afflictions far worse than gender dysphoria and are disadvantaged in many ways but manage to deal with it. A blind man is not allowed to drive a car. A schizophrenic isn't allowed join the military...does having to use the restroom that coincides with the equipment you were born with that much of a hardship or inconvenience? Really? Doubt it is, rather they are transgender and believe they are entitled to use the little girls room while having no regard for the feelings of others... is selfish of these men.

As much as Oneforthebus and Tibs believe this to be a hysterical overreaction by those against trannys in female restrooms, I believe its just as much about selfish freaks who couldn't care less about what others feel. Their feelings trumps the feelings of others.
 
I don't know what demons are haunting you, but you are one scary mofo. Reading your posts I can't help but think you're a victim of some quirky LSD experiment gone bad. Real bad. Again, my only advice is to try to step back a little, try to regain some sort of perspective and talk yourself into the idea the world is not coming to a screeching halt due to transgender-bathroom legislation currently bandied around. The actual weight of these issues is no more than 0.0003% of what you are making them out to be.

Or try this. Solemnly swear on the Bible that you yourself will not go into a bathroom alone (without adult supervision) or allow your children or loved ones to do the same. Keep your head on a swivel Tim, there are millions, if not tens of millions of perverse transvestites out there ready to pounce at a moment's notice.

It would make me happy if you'd just answer these questions. These things can and will happen under Obama's edict.

You paint yourself as the loving, caring father of teenage girls and a son.

So answer the questions Tibs. Instead of hurling baseless insults and judgments on a person you now nothing about.

So you are ok with girls moving into dorms to find their room mate for the year is a male?
You're ok with girls being forced to share a hotel room with someone of the opposite sex on an overnight field trip?
You're ok with high school girls having to openly shower with males?

When you can offer an 'honest' thought out answer to those three questions, we can debate. Otherwise, your persistent personal attacks are just that.

PS...we are and have been talking about transgenders. Not transvestites. You're a warrior for the left. One would expect you to know better.
PSII...how often to you suspect I go to church Tibs? (the ole' MSNBC says everyone Conservative is a Right Wing, Bible-Thumping nut job Set Up in 3, 2, 1...)
 
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The idea of trannys using the female bathroom is not the issue for me. It is the selfishness and entitlement mentality that these freaks possess that irks me.

Yes, its compassionate to allow a tranny to use the restroom that coincides with the gender he identifies as, but where's the compassion for the girls who do not wish to have a naked male in their bathroom or locker room? Why is their privacy and feelings of no importance?

People have afflictions far worse than gender dysphoria and are disadvantaged in many ways but manage to deal with it. A blind man is not allowed to drive a car. A schizophrenic isn't allowed join the military...does having to use the restroom that coincides with the equipment you were born with that much of a hardship or inconvenience? Really? Doubt it is, rather they are transgender and believe they are entitled to use the little girls room while having no regard for the feelings of others... is selfish of these men.

As much as Oneforthebus and Tibs believe this to be a hysterical overreaction by those against trannys in female restrooms, I believe its just as much about selfish freaks who couldn't care less about what others feel. Their feelings trumps the feelings of others.

The entire reason this ever became an issue was not because of selfish men who want to use the little girls room...it was because of high school students who fear bullying, harassment, and physical danger if they use the boys room while dressed, appearing and living as girls, and vice versa.

It's easy to call people selfish freaks until it's your son or daughter or nephew or friend's kid.

The vast majority of these children do not have any desire to flaunt their naked male parts to girls. They want to live as and be accepted as girls. They are probably more careful about exposing themselves than anyone else in the room.

You talk about compassion but you don't sound like you have any.
 
So you are ok with girls moving into dorms to find their room mate for the year is a male?

I would research where my girls were going to college, find out what the policies were there. and choose housing that my daughter and I felt comfortable with.
You're ok with girls being forced to share a hotel room with someone of the opposite sex on an overnight field trip?

On every overnight field trip my children have been on they choose their own roommates. No one is ever forced to room with anyone else, male or female.
You're ok with high school girls having to openly shower with males?

I have never openly showered with anyone but my husband, my daughters don't even take showers in school but if they wanted to they are individual stalls, they are not communal showers. It's not prison.
 
It's the men who are skeeved out by transgenders (something I can't deny feeling myself at times) who really have a problem with it.

You keep doing this and I'm ashamed of you OFTB. I don't even think you realize you are doing it. I can tell you 100 times I don't care about TGs in the least. So can Supe. So can anyone else. I can tell you have a great friend who is gay, and a gay uncle. This **** doesn't bother or move me in the least.

But like a true Liberal, you continue to attack anyone who disagrees with your position as a bigot. When did you backslide?

Do you see you doing this? Do you recognize it?

For the 93rd time...I have no problems with TGs and I'm least worried about them than any segment of the US population to be honest, save for maybe the Amish.

All of this "showering with men or "changing their tampons in front of men" hysteria are the words of people who are not women and don't spend time in public women's facilities. I have never ONCE in 49 years been in a situation where I had no choice but to disrobe in front of another person...man or woman.

This is you projecting. Your past on people's present. The future is now, and it is changing. You didn't have to shower in HS with other males. You haven't had to take a **** in a stall when a man was in a stall next to you. You haven't had to change into your swimsuit in a public pool locker room right next to a man and right after having given birth and feeling self conscious about your body. You haven't had to shower in the LA Fitness gym next to a man 20 years your younger.

Have you had to do ANY of these things ever OFTB? Have you?

Your prom example is bullshit compared to those posed - which are real now. Have you had to do any of the things I questioned? Because women today now have to accept these situations as being normal in the future.
 
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