This is police brutality

[thesteelcity]

If he didn't resist, we are not talking about this. Every move after the field sobriety tests proved costly. I would like to hear from the mayor and ex-Police Chief in ATL how it should have been handled. I'm not avocating that he should have been shot in the back and killed, but I would like to hear other logical ways it should have been handled.

 

[IndySteel]

Not to mention, if you miss those shots and those bullets ricochet off of the concrete/asphalt now you put innocent bystanders at risk.

Mayor Hogshitt is making an announcement today about revamping IPD. I'm sure it's going to handcuff them even more. Whatever it takes to continue to let the city get destroyed by thugs...

 

[Steeler Pride]

Mayor Hogshitt is making an announcement today about revamping IPD. I'm sure it's going to handcuff them even more. Whatever it takes to continue to let the city get destroyed by thugs...

Anytime you have Mayors and/or council members that have NEVER served in Law Enforcement or the Military making policies for the Police Department, especially when talking about lethal force, they have no experience to support their decisions. That is a huge problem. The other problem is the fact that you have a large group of citizens, ANQUEEFA, CBLM, and Dims that want a Utopian society where there are no ramifications for your behavior. There is no accountability for your actions. All of these police policy overhauls are aimed at blaming the police for individual actions so that they have no accountability for what they do. Anyone that makes policies based on no statistical or historical data to support their decisions is more dangerous than anyone holding a firearm. Welcome to the entitled and "everyone gets a trophy" generation reaching adulthood...never saw this coming.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Anytime you have Mayors and/or council members that have NEVER served in Law Enforcement or the Military making policies for the Police Department, especially when talking about lethal force, they have no experience to support their decisions. That is a huge problem. The other problem is the fact that you have a large group of citizens, ANQUEEFA, CBLM, and Dims that want a Utopian society where there are no ramifications for your behavior. There is no accountability for your actions. All of these police policy overhauls are aimed at blaming the police for individual actions so that they have no accountability for what they do. Anyone that makes policies based on no statistical or historical data to support their decisions is more dangerous than anyone holding a firearm. Welcome to the entitled and "everyone gets a trophy" generation reaching adulthood...never saw this coming.

 

[Steeltime]

Man you know I'm on your side and we see eye to eye. Question though - have you ever shot a pistol? At a target?

This isn't the Lone Ranger, where people can fire shots from their pistols while riding on horses and knock apples off people's heads. Asking a cop to hit a person's legs while running is a TOUGH, low probability ask when hearts are pumping, etc.

Bingo. And what most who have never fired a weapon in self-defense or have never trained to do so fail to consider is the very, VERY real possibility of causing unintended harm if the officer "shoots at the gun" or "fires at the legs."

Specifically, shooting at the legs of the guy in Atlanta, who by the way was (1) so ******* loaded he passed out in a goddamn drive-through, (2) resisted arrest, (3) punched an officer, (4) could have ******* KILLED the guy by punching him several times when he was on the ground, (5) grabbed at the cop's pistol, (6) took the guy's taser, a weapon, and (7) ******* POINTED A WEAPON at the officer ...

I digress. So shoot at the felon's legs. K. Miss. I guess .45 ACP now simply magically disappears, right? Huh, seems the ammo actually ricochets off the pavement and goes ... who the **** knows? I don't. You don't. The cop doesn't. So it ricochets and hits a mother, or her child. Kills them.

Know why cops don't carry ****** plinking ammo - 115 grain 9mm for example - in their service weapons? Because that ammo goes too goddamn fast and the chances of a through-and-through and hitting some innocent bystander are TOO ******* HIGH.

But yeah, sure, we should have officers "aim for the weapon" or "nick the firearm" or "shoot for the legs" of a fleeing felon. No chance of the round simply continuing on and killing some 7-year old kid, right?

People who know less about firearms than they do space travel should perhaps shut up about "hitting the gun" or "shooting for the legs" and such stupidity. You shoot a weapon for ONE - ONE, JUST ONE, ONLY ONE, REPEAT ONE, MEANING ONE, SINGULAR, AS IN ONE - reason: to kill the target.

 

[Vader]

I can't believe this is a real topic. You can't shoot for the legs. That's Hollywood BS. I've been around firearms my entire life. I can take some of them apart and put them back together blindfolded because I've done it so many times. I also know about human anatomy... The legs contain these things called arteries. Blasting a person in the leg can sever the main artery and the person will bleed out and die if the bleed isn't stopped ASAP. Then you'll have idiots screaming for people to be shot in the feet or hands. It's ridiculous.

Also the reason why they want you to shoot center mass is because shooting someone that is running while the cop is full of adrenaline and his heart is pounding 200 BPM isn't an easy thing to do. You can't have bullets flying all over the place because the cop is trying to hit roughly 30% of a body that is in constant motion. I'm sorry but this is just Joe Biden type ignorance.

 

[IndySteel]

Bingo. And what most who have never fired a weapon in self-defense or have never trained to do so fail to consider is the very, VERY real possibility of causing unintended harm if the officer "shoots at the gun" or "fires at the legs."

Specifically, shooting at the legs of the guy in Atlanta, who by the way was (1) so ******* loaded he passed out in a goddamn drive-through, (2) resisted arrest, (3) punched an officer, (4) could have ******* KILLED the guy by punching him several times when he was on the ground, (5) grabbed at the cop's pistol, (6) took the guy's taser, a weapon, and (7) ******* POINTED A WEAPON at the officer ...

I digress. So shoot at the felon's legs. K. Miss. I guess .45 ACP now simply magically disappears, right? Huh, seems the ammo actually ricochets off the pavement and goes ... who the **** knows? I don't. You don't. The cop doesn't. So it ricochets and hits a mother, or her child. Kills them.

Know why cops don't carry ****** plinking ammo - 115 grain 9mm for example - in their service weapons? Because that ammo goes too goddamn fast and the chances of a through-and-through and hitting some innocent bystander are TOO ******* HIGH.

But yeah, sure, we should have officers "aim for the weapon" or "nick the firearm" or "shoot for the legs" of a fleeing felon. No chance of the round simply continuing on and killing some 7-year old kid, right?

People who know less about firearms than they do space travel should perhaps shut up about "hitting the gun" or "shooting for the legs" and such stupidity. You shoot a weapon for ONE - ONE, JUST ONE, ONLY ONE, REPEAT ONE, MEANING ONE, SINGULAR, AS IN ONE - reason: to kill the target.

Come on now, Steeltime. Everyone knows that it's this easy....

 

[Steeltime]

Meanwhile, twice as many innocent people murdered by a violent protester as were killed by cops in Minneapolis, and not ONE. *******. WORD on CNN, NBC, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, PBS, PUREBS, etc.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/2-missin...rs-found-murdered-in-florida-suspect-arrested

Huh, wonder why. Maybe because this is the perpetrator:

Black lives matter ... but only if murdered by whitey, preferably whitey in uniform.

Otherwise? Pffft, nobody gives a ****, certainly not blacks alive.

 

[thesteelcity]

I can't believe this is a real topic. You can't shoot for the legs. That's Hollywood BS. I've been around firearms my entire life. I can take some of them apart and put them back together blindfolded because I've done it so many times. I also know about human anatomy... The legs contain these things called arteries. Blasting a person in the leg can sever the main artery and the person will bleed out and die if the bleed isn't stopped ASAP. Then you'll have idiots screaming for people to be shot in the feet or hands. It's ridiculous.

Also the reason why they want you to shoot center mass is because shooting someone that is running while the cop is full of adrenaline and his heart is pounding 200 BPM isn't an easy thing to do. You can't have bullets flying all over the place because the cop is trying to hit roughly 30% of a body that is in constant motion. I'm sorry but this is just Joe Biden type ignorance.

This argument always amuses me. To shoot someone in the leg, who is running away, takes a great amount of skill and precisian. That doesn't take in account that the cop is running and moving too.

 

[Steeltime]

This argument always amuses me. To shoot someone in the leg, who is running away, takes a great amount of skill and precisian. That doesn't take in account that the cop is running and moving too.

One of the most amazing things on earth is the degree of absolute, unbridled idiocy among those who most want to control and criticize firearm use and yet know NOTHING at all, whatsoever, about firearms. Examples:

• "Shoot the gun out of his hand." Like the old Lone Ranger television show.
• Except more likely to kill some kid in a building across the street than hit the suspect's gun.
• "Shoot him in the leg or arm."
• Oh, so I presume the suspect will follow directions and not move his leg or arm, allowing for the shot? If the guy is following orders, why not just order the ******* to get on the ground? Oh, he's still moving and not following orders? Well then ...
• If the suspect is, oh, I don't know, still moving, then chances of hitting kid in building across the street go up exponentially. Cops tend to carry 147 gr. hollow point if packing a 9mm, 180 grain hollow point for the.40 caliber, and 230 grain hollow point for the .45 ACP. The 147 grain 9mm hollow point is heavier than most 9mm rounds and hollow point for two reasons: Hurt the target and lower chances of a through-and-through.
• Every person firing at a living target aims center mass for two reasons: (1) Increase the chance of hitting the target and (2) reduce the unwanted through-and-through where the bullet continues on for an unknown distance, imperiling anybody and anything in its unintended path.
• "Don't shoot him where it is likely to kill him."
• That would limit the target area to ... the guy's arms and hands? Goddamn femoral artery is in the upper leg. So maybe limit the target to the hand, wrist, and calf? Great ******* idea. Fortunately, bad guys will play by the same rules and not target an officer's head, or center mass. Right? RIGHT???
• "Why'd the police shoot him eight times?"
• Because he was still standing after seven, dumbshit. Do you think the shooter walked over and put a couple extra rounds in him as he was lying on the ground?!?

 

[CharlesDavenport]

Maybe 10 or so years ago something triggered similar outrage and I was sure that non-lethal weapons companies would be a great investment but there weren't that many public companies in the space and the few that I looked at didn't move much. Taking a look now I see AAXN and BYRN have spiked recently. I missed it..

 

[Steeltime]

Some realistic proposals to lower the incidence of police violence upon people of pigmentation:

• Special bullets, trained to avoid major organs and blood vessels. Designed to injure muscle tissue only. Ammo may cost $1 million per round, but obviously worth it. START THE TESTING!
• Enlist superheroes - Spiderman, Superman. Non-lethal experts.
• But no evil version of the superhero.
• Get the wizards on board, for crying out loud! Muggles need the help!
• Magic nets that can fit into a pocket, but in times of danger, simply toss it and BOOM! It becomes as big as a tuna fishing net and simply envelopes the bad guy.
• New supermagnets to gather up bad guy guns. Turn on the magnet and BLAM - bad guys disarmed.
• Need to keep good guys armed, so research and investment in ceramic guns and non-magnetic casings. Brass only, no steel casings.
• [The no steel casing thing is actually true ...]

 

[thesteelcity]

One of the most amazing things on earth is the degree of absolute, unbridled idiocy among those who most want to control and criticize firearm use and yet know NOTHING at all, whatsoever, about firearms. Examples:

• "Shoot the gun out of his hand." Like the old Lone Ranger television show.
• Except more likely to kill some kid in a building across the street than hit the suspect's gun.
• "Shoot him in the leg or arm."
• Oh, so I presume the suspect will follow directions and not move his leg or arm, allowing for the shot? If the guy is following orders, why not just order the ******* to get on the ground? Oh, he's still moving and not following orders? Well then ...
• If the suspect is, oh, I don't know, still moving, then chances of hitting kid in building across the street go up exponentially. Cops tend to carry 147 gr. hollow point if packing a 9mm, 180 grain hollow point for the.40 caliber, and 230 grain hollow point for the .45 ACP. The 147 grain 9mm hollow point is heavier than most 9mm rounds and hollow point for two reasons: Hurt the target and lower chances of a through-and-through.
• Every person firing at a living target aims center mass for two reasons: (1) Increase the chance of hitting the target and (2) reduce the unwanted through-and-through where the bullet continues on for an unknown distance, imperiling anybody and anything in its unintended path.
• "Don't shoot him where it is likely to kill him."
• That would limit the target area to ... the guy's arms and hands? Goddamn femoral artery is in the upper leg. So maybe limit the target to the hand, wrist, and calf? Great ******* idea. Fortunately, bad guys will play by the same rules and not target an officer's head, or center mass. Right? RIGHT???
• "Why'd the police shoot him eight times?"
• Because he was still standing after seven, dumbshit. Do you think the shooter walked over and put a couple extra rounds in him as he was lying on the ground?!?

Spot on! Enjoyable reading, for sure.

 

[Stoney]

...the most obvious take away from this - don't drive drunk, don't resist arrest, don't assault a police officer, don't flee, and definitely don't point something at an officer while doing all the previous things.

What a novel concept.


I used to work with a guy whose favorite phrase was, "If you **** around, you'll lay around". I think that fits the situation at hand.

 

[Booted]

Some realistic proposals to lower the incidence of police violence upon people of pigmentation:

[*]Magic nets that can fit into a pocket, but in times of danger, simply toss it and BOOM! It becomes as big as a tuna fishing net and simply envelopes the bad guy.

 

[oneforthebus]

Once again, not a peep about the most obvious take away from this - don't drive drunk, don't resist arrest, don't assault a police officer, don't flee, and definitely don't point something at an officer while doing all the previous things.

That's so racist! Because we now have a video of one guy who was killed while not obviously resisting so therefore resisting violently is perfectly valid and logical. That's what CNN is telling me anyway.

 

[Vader]

One of the most amazing things on earth is the degree of absolute, unbridled idiocy among those who most want to control and criticize firearm use and yet know NOTHING at all, whatsoever, about firearms. Examples:

• "Shoot the gun out of his hand." Like the old Lone Ranger television show.
• Except more likely to kill some kid in a building across the street than hit the suspect's gun.
• "Shoot him in the leg or arm."
• Oh, so I presume the suspect will follow directions and not move his leg or arm, allowing for the shot? If the guy is following orders, why not just order the ******* to get on the ground? Oh, he's still moving and not following orders? Well then ...
• If the suspect is, oh, I don't know, still moving, then chances of hitting kid in building across the street go up exponentially. Cops tend to carry 147 gr. hollow point if packing a 9mm, 180 grain hollow point for the.40 caliber, and 230 grain hollow point for the .45 ACP. The 147 grain 9mm hollow point is heavier than most 9mm rounds and hollow point for two reasons: Hurt the target and lower chances of a through-and-through.
• Every person firing at a living target aims center mass for two reasons: (1) Increase the chance of hitting the target and (2) reduce the unwanted through-and-through where the bullet continues on for an unknown distance, imperiling anybody and anything in its unintended path.
• "Don't shoot him where it is likely to kill him."
• That would limit the target area to ... the guy's arms and hands? Goddamn femoral artery is in the upper leg. So maybe limit the target to the hand, wrist, and calf? Great ******* idea. Fortunately, bad guys will play by the same rules and not target an officer's head, or center mass. Right? RIGHT???
• "Why'd the police shoot him eight times?"
• Because he was still standing after seven, dumbshit. Do you think the shooter walked over and put a couple extra rounds in him as he was lying on the ground?!?

I watched a former general talk about guns. It was a youtube video of how ignorant even some military people are of guns. I've listened to morons talk about .30 caliber clips, guns that shoot 30 rounds in half a second, not know the difference between a semi-auto and a fully auto weapon, and think that AR means assault rifle.

A recently retired bounty hunter is a friend of mine. He always called me when he had a gun question. He was smart enough to know he didn't know everything about them so he'd call me. If I didn't know I'd call someone else smarter than me. But too many people think they know about guns but they really don't. And it drives me nuts to watch or listen to it. I even catch it on TV. Some moron will be talking about "assault" rifles or some other non-sense. Or a movie will start off with a gun holding a revolver and the next scene he's holding a semi-auto. Drives me nuts.

 

[Steeltime]

Have asked others, far less intelligent than the contributors here, so I repeat the question:

What is the end game for these guys, the "no police" crowd? Nobody believes that any society can survive without protecting life and property, and that is basically ALL the police do. It is their one and only responsibility. Know who else does that? Nobody, really. Lawyers to some degree with lawsuits for damages, but that is really about it. End the police, end the value of life and property, kill society.

So the inevitable conclusion is that the mob wants some of that government money for protection they control, that they run. Getting their unqualified, idiot, hack buddies jobs in law enforcement. Do not doubt what I am telling you. The mob and their army of looters want to have those billions of tax dollars funneled to THEM.

Will they actually do the ******* job? Of course not. Get real. Those clowns are like African dictators, begging for food from the developed world. They get the food, feed their armies, starve their enemies. No difference here at all - government-sponsored looting, nothing more.

 

[Roy92040]

Everybody treats this thing like it's a racial issue when it ain't. There was a similar thing happen here locally about 1 1/2 years ago. Guy wrestles with a cop, takes away his taser and gets shot and killed. No one rioted or looted. There were some demonstrations here, but not much. It's a fact of like people. The police departments hire some bullies. And one thing they teach them early is your biggest responsibility is going home safe at the end of your shift.

https://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/2018/09/oregon_police_shoot_and_kill_m.html

 

[Buster]

I watch on the news as they say his daughter Blessing will now have to remember her birthday as the day her father died. I agree. It’s a shame. His selfish decision to run instead of complying led to that memory.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

This would help with inconsistent human response. Agree on the rules with the community, program it, and let it go -

 

[Buster]

Do we know if he had a criminal history? Any other issues which would have caused him to run?

 

[Steeler Pride]

Do we know if he had a criminal history? Any other issues which would have caused him to run?

According to the media, every person that attacks a cop, runs from police, or shoots at cops are all valedictorians and alter boys.

 

[oneforthebus]

Rayshard dindt do nuffin'.

Do we know if he had a criminal history? Any other issues which would have caused him to run?

I have not been able to find any references in the media to his criminal record except for family members talking about how he was trying to get his life back on track. So I would guess that means it was less than stellar.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]