Tomlin had nothing to do with Arians Leaving

[antdrewjosh]

I think you guys are putting way too much emphasis on the coach. Ben had to mature. When he was young he depended on his physical gifts. Wasn't the most studious. He matured and has calmed down on the hero ball and now trust his coaches and teammates. He is more wiling to dump it off and let his teammates make plays too. As a coach it's hard to reel in a player of Ben's stature when he knows nothing is going to happen and his job is no danger. Ben had to mature as a player and man

 

[ark steel]

I think you guys are putting way too much emphasis on the coach. Ben had to mature. When he was young he depended on his physical gifts. Wasn't the most studious. He matured and has calmed down on the hero ball and now trust his coaches and teammates. He is more wiling to dump it off and let his teammates make plays too. As a coach it's hard to reel in a player of Ben's stature when he knows nothing is going to happen and his job is no danger. Ben had to mature as a player and man

While true, it is the coach's job to teach them the proper way to play and, even if slowly, instill those habits. When the "improper" way is winning, I would think it hard for a coach to want to get in the way of that, too.

In this whole discussion, I forgot that this is based upon something said in an interview and, therefore, should be dismissed out of hand.

 

[antdrewjosh]

While true, it is the coach's job to teach them the proper way to play and, even if slowly, instill those habits. When the "improper" way is winning, I would think it hard for a coach to want to get in the way of that, too.

In this whole discussion, I forgot that this is based upon something said in an interview and, therefore, should be dismissed out of hand.

Arians had check downs in his offense Ben ignored them and chose to run around. I remember thinking we Mendy could be a big weapon on swing passes and saw him Alot of times wide open clapping his hands. As a coach it's hard to change a player of Ben's caliber who has had success early in his career. Cause you can't sit him cause who else is going to play.

 

[Confluence]

Arians had check downs in his offense Ben ignored them and chose to run around. I remember thinking we Mendy could be a big weapon on swing passes and saw him Alot of times wide open clapping his hands. As a coach it's hard to change a player of Ben's caliber who has had success early in his career. Cause you can't sit him cause who else is going to play.

And yet that ******* Haley has managed to do just that. Clearly something about the change in OCs triggered something in Ben and/or his approach. The results demonstrate this. It really doesn't matter whether the issue was Ben, FG Bruce or a combination of both. It has been positively resolved for all concerned.

Yapping about it after all involved are retired is just fine.

Yapping about it now is questionable at best because it is of no benefit to FG Bruce or the Steelers, or Ben.

 

[POP]

UPDATE:

They just showed clips of upcoming interview of BA on NFLN. Among the highlights shown....

1.) Mrs. Brucie cried in front of Bruce for the 1st time in her life when she heard he was fired. She said she was a huge fan of Tomlin's and was shocked by it. (If it wasn't Mike's call, she wasn't aware of it.)

2.) BA made no bones that he was flat out pissed when it happened. Very pissed.

3.) He said he was fired probably because he was too close to Ben and they didn't run the ball enough.

4.) Commentators on the show said it was not a MT call, and this move came from above, as many of us believed.

 

[antdrewjosh]

And yet that ******* Haley has managed to do just that. Clearly something about the change in OCs triggered something in Ben and/or his approach. The results demonstrate this. It really doesn't matter whether the issue was Ben, FG Bruce or a combination of both. It has been positively resolved for all concerned.

Yapping about it after all involved are retired is just fine.

Yapping about it now is questionable at best because it is of no benefit to FG Bruce or the Steelers, or Ben.

Ben has matured as a player and as a man. He resisted Haley at first too.. called the offense dink and dunk. Plus he knows he can't run around like he used because he has gotten older.

 

[POP]

And yet that ******* Haley has managed to do just that. Clearly something about the change in OCs triggered something in Ben and/or his approach. The results demonstrate this. It really doesn't matter whether the issue was Ben, FG Bruce or a combination of both. It has been positively resolved for all concerned.

Yapping about it after all involved are retired is just fine.

Yapping about it now is questionable at best because it is of no benefit to FG Bruce or the Steelers, or Ben.

Wait, you think us chatting about the subject on a message board impacts any of the parties in any shape, form or manner? You think that is how the universe works?

Wow.

Wow.

Wow.

Just wow.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

I think you guys are putting way too much emphasis on the coach. Ben had to mature. When he was young he depended on his physical gifts. Wasn't the most studious. He matured and has calmed down on the hero ball and now trust his coaches and teammates. He is more wiling to dump it off and let his teammates make plays too. As a coach it's hard to reel in a player of Ben's stature when he knows nothing is going to happen and his job is no danger. Ben had to mature as a player and man

Haley managed to reel him in pretty quickly. That was his job.

I have no idea what you think coaches do. You give Tomlin no blame at all for roster decisions. Playcalling, not his area. Now you have the most important player on the team not studying his plays and playing like an idiot, nope, nothing a coach can do about that. Just have to hope Ben works it out himself.

They may as well hire a guy out of the stands to coach the team

 

[t-man]

Mr 7 ******* step drop on a blitz, we don't use a fullback, David Johnson can block, can go **** himself. His all or nothing approach is routinely getting his quarterbacks killed in AZ just like it did here, and he's too ******* stupid to see it.

Always seemed like a guy I'd wanna have a beer with, but I'm glad that ****** isn't calling our plays anymore.

Joe

 

[POP]

Mr 7 ******* step drop on a blitz, we don't use a fullback, David Johnson can block, can go **** himself. His all or nothing approach is routinely getting his quarterbacks killed in AZ just like it did here, and he's too ******* stupid to see it.

Always seemed like a guy I'd wanna have a beer with, but I'm glad that ****** isn't calling our plays anymore.

Joe

Not only does he have no problem causing his QBs to get hit, he wears it like a proud metal on his chest. He jokes that it's the QB's job to stand back there and take hits, if need be.

Kind of in an arrogant way, too.

If I were Carson Palmer, I'm not sure I would like his attitude about it.

 

[SteelerFan448]

I think you guys are putting way too much emphasis on the coach. Ben had to mature. When he was young he depended on his physical gifts. Wasn't the most studious. He matured and has calmed down on the hero ball and now trust his coaches and teammates. He is more wiling to dump it off and let his teammates make plays too. As a coach it's hard to reel in a player of Ben's stature when he knows nothing is going to happen and his job is no danger. Ben had to mature as a player and man

Umm, what are your expectations of a coach then if it isn't to get the most out of their players?

 

[POP]

Umm, what are your expectations of a coach then if it isn't to get the most out of their players?

Yea, I think that is kind of on top of the list of what coaches are supposed to do. What else does the term "coach up" mean then?

 

[SteelerFan448]

Yea, I think that is kind of on top of the list of what coaches are supposed to do. What else does the term "coach up" mean then?

It seems like 90 percent of the guys coming into the league need to mature yet still find a way to improve.

 

[ark steel]

Umm, what are your expectations of a coach then if it isn't to get the most out of their players?

This was my biggest issue with Arians as an OC (and others who have been here). I don't think his offensive philosophy was bad, but he intended to run that offense regardless of personnel or position on the field. Everyone and their brothers knew our OL featured less than stellar players, but by-God, we are running these plays! If you know your OL is substandard, you design your offense accordingly. I, sometimes, get the historical figures wrong, but, I think the worst offender of this might have been Mularky. I think it was Gailey who did a pretty good job with the personnel he was given and didn't try to do too much.

I think you see this with Haley, too, but it may be less obvious or less often or individual players (other than Ben) are not as crucial? It seems to have happened some with Batch/Leftwich under center.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

This was my biggest issue with Arians as an OC (and others who have been here). I don't think his offensive philosophy was bad, but he intended to run that offense regardless of personnel or position on the field. Everyone and their brothers knew our OL featured less than stellar players, but by-God, we are running these plays! If you know your OL is substandard, you design your offense accordingly. I, sometimes, get the historical figures wrong, but, I think the worst offender of this might have been Mularky. I think it was Gailey who did a pretty good job with the personnel he was given and didn't try to do too much.

I think you see this with Haley, too, but it may be less obvious or less often or individual players (other than Ben) are not as crucial? It seems to have happened some with Batch/Leftwich under center.

If Tomlin had any sense or balls he should have fired Arians after the loss to an awful Cleveland team when he kept passing all day in below-zero weather and said "We don't let the weather determine our play calling".

Mrs. Haley's husband isn't perfect but he's much better at working with the talent he has and taking what the defense gives him instead of airing it out no matter what. The Bruce was an OC who liked to air it out all the time, paired with a QB who liked to air it out all the time, so dammit we're gonna air it out all the time.

 

[cpollock]

http://pit.247sports.com/Bolt/Bruce...lf-to-blame-for-firing-in-Pittsburgh-45913315

Arians has only himself to blame according to this article and this seems more to the point ! The fact that he is STILL talking about it after he continues to do well is stupid ..

Let's get something established right off the bat: Bruce Arians got himself fired by the Pittsburgh Steelers.

Tonight, HBO will air an interview in which the Cardinals' coach will blame Mike Tomlin for his unceremonious ending in Pittsburgh, where Arians was the team's offensive coordinator from 2007-11. In reality, it was Arians--not Tomlin--who got himself fired after refusing to listen to management, something the Rooney family finally got tired of dealing with.

Ed Bouchette of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette has often reported that--on multiple occasions-- the Steelers' brass asked Arians to change the offense to take better care of Ben Roethlisberger, who was sacked 215 times during Arians' time as offensive coordinator. Arians refused and, despite Pittsburgh's 24-8 regular season record during his final two seasons with the team, Pittsburgh did not renew Arians' contract at the conclusion of the 2011 season.

Tomlin, fulfilling his role as head coach, had the unenviable task of giving Arians the news, and offered to fly to Arians' location to give him the news personally. In so many words, Arians told him not to bother, abruptly ending his time with the Steelers. And despite his recent successes in the years following his time in Pittsburgh--he was named NFL Coach of the Year in both 2012 and 2014--Arians is obviously still bitter about how his time with the Steelers came to an end.

Arians can be mad at the Steelers for not renewing his contract. He can be mad at Tomlin for not giving the Steelers the "keep Arians or I go" ultimatum, but he can't blame Tomlin for how his career in Pittsburgh ended. Arians' time in Pittsburgh ended because he refused to change the offense, which ultimately cost him his job.

Bruce Arians likes to run the show. He's doing just that in Arizona, where Cardinals' management gives him full rein to make decisions that he feels is best for the team. But, quite frankly, Arizona isn't Pittsburgh, where the team has to protect their future Hall of Fame quarterback (not to mention $100 million investment). The Steelers also have the Rooney family, who for decades have made decisions that have led to six Vince Lombardi Trophies. The Cardinals have won five playoff games in the last half century. Arians also wasn't the head coach in Pittsburgh, and he shouldn't have made Tomlin the middle man when he wouldn't just do what his bosses asked him to do.

In this situation, Arians has no scapegoats. He did a good job in Pittsburgh--the team won Super Bowl XLIII with Arians as the team's offensive coordinator. But his inability to follow authority led to the ending of his time in Pittsburgh. Arians still doesn't grasp this, and it continues to muddy his reputation in Pittsburgh, and further exhibit the arrogant and petty behavior that got him fired in the first place.

 

[SteelerFan448]

The last line is fire! Great stuff!

 

[antdrewjosh]

Umm, what are your expectations of a coach then if it isn't to get the most out of their players?

If you can see what I'm saying Ben is a special case. Instant success. Franchise guy. If Ben wasn't special do you think he survives the mistakes he made early in his career. So while a coach can tell a player do this do that. Ben has to to accept that also. We all know Ben was resistant to any type of tough coaching early in his career. Cowher had problems getting to him. His OCs had issues getting to him. Ben had to change and mature as a player and man. Who was going to back the coach or OC if they came out and said Ben is being a prick and not listening he isn't playing this week. That had to come from the Rooney's and it did. We are getting rid of your buddy now grow up and play smart.

 

[antdrewjosh]

Steelers say Mike Tomlin made the decision to fire Bruce Arians
Mike Florio 1 day ago Categories: Arizona Cardinals, Home, Pittsburgh Steelers, Rumor Mill
A new profile of Cardinals coach Bruce Arians has dusted off questions regarding one of the most notorious retirements in NFL history. Arians clearly was fired, and it becomes even more clear from the interview of Arians and his wife from Andrea Kremer of HBO’s Real Sports With Bryant Gumbel that the focal point of their frustration was and is Steelers coach Mike Tomlin.

It nevertheless had been believed by many that Tomlin was simply the messenger, and that the decision had been made about his head. The Steelers say otherwise.

“We did contact the Steelers, and we asked them if they had a comment on this,” Kremer said during a Tuesday visit to PFT Live on NBC Sports Radio. “And they said, ‘Look, this is ancient history for us. Mike’s already talked about this.’ But [they] made it clear that this was Mike Tomlin’s decision, to fire Bruce Arians.”

Kremer also explained that Arians believes Tomlin’s hands were tied. Still, the fact that Tomlin received a contract extension not long after Arians was let go made Arians believe that he’d been sold out — especially since Arians believed that he and Tomlin were tied together.

Cardinals T-shirts currently carry the words “trust,” “loyalty,” and “respect.” Said Arians at one point to Kremer: “Yeah, well, those are words that I don’t think are on the Steelers’ jerseys.”


Who knows this is a waste of time at this point. Haley and Ben are working so who cares at this point.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

“We did contact the Steelers, and we asked them if they had a comment on this,” Kremer said during a Tuesday visit to PFT Live on NBC Sports Radio. “And they said, ‘Look, this is ancient history for us. Mike’s already talked about this.’ But [they] made it clear that this was Mike Tomlin’s decision, to fire Bruce Arians.”[/B]

Technically he wasn't fired. His contract was up and the team simply didn't give him another one. However The Bruce has always said that Tomlin told him not long before that he would give him another contract, then suddenly told him he was out of a job.

 

[bermudasteel]

I'm glad we made the change, personally...

 

[Coach]

When Bruce was here, we had an amazing record. See below:

2011 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers * 12 4 0
2010 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers* 12 4
2009 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers 9 7
2008 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers* 12 4
2007 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers* 10 6

And when he left we had back to back 8-8 seasons.

 

[CorpusDsteelers]

Remember all the Haley hate? There was a lot of it. I'm pretty sure he has a little pull on who they draft on offense. That's obvious with the archer like picks. I blame Haley 100% for the production. He should get props for his coaching and so should the Rooneys for hiring him.

 

[SteelerFan448]

When Bruce was here, we had an amazing record. See below:

2011 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers * 12 4 0
2010 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers* 12 4
2009 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers 9 7
2008 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers* 12 4
2007 NFL Pittsburgh Steelers* 10 6

And when he left we had back to back 8-8 seasons.

Nevermind the performance of the defense during that time versus after.

 

[Coach]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...ce-arians-i-was-pissed-when-steelers-fired-me

In an interview with Andrea Kremer for HBO's Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel, Arians said he felt betrayed by the Steelers after the team did not renew his contract. Steelers coach Mike Tomlin said in March 2012 that he ultimately made the decision to replace Arians with Todd Haley,