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Maybe he was Watkin's fluffer?
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Maybe he was Watkin's fluffer?
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or the Cards.
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I agree that Bryant is a bit raw, and he certainly doesn't have as much experience as Sammy Watkins, but that's kind of the whole "Ben isn't as good of a leader as Peyton" thing. Like - no ****
But the thing that bothers me is the "playing in college isn't like playing in the NFL" . Well, of course it isn't. Every single rookie in the history of the NFL has had to start out as a rookie. Jerry Rice was a rookie. Nobody plays 4 years in the NFL then makes the leap to the NFL. So can we stop acting like "playing in college isn't like playing in the NFL" only applies to certain guys?
But the thing that bothers me is the "playing in college isn't like playing in the NFL" . Well, of course it isn't. Every single rookie in the history of the NFL has had to start out as a rookie. Jerry Rice was a rookie. Nobody plays 4 years in the NFL then makes the leap to the NFL. So can we stop acting like "playing in college isn't like playing in the NFL" only applies to certain guys?
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When Archer comes out against the first team defense, and looks good, doesn't fumble, and doesn't get broken in half- it's "well, it's only one preseason game, let's not get ahead of ourselves"
When the guy most named worth of Archers draft spot comes out against scrubs, has two fumbles, and one of them kills the last chance we have to win the game, it's "well, we knew he was raw, this isn't a surprise" blah blah blah.
Double standards, gotta love em.
Joe
Ike is proving this every time he drops an INT in camp...
Two different WR's - Watkins is, as we all know pretty polished already - Bryant, not so much; but, I wouldn't count out the kid because he was a 4th round pick...
I bet AB will support my comment.
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You're right it's not the same, and every college player will go through growing pains. Watkins will have his fair share. But to say that he and Bryant are starting off on a level playing field is a bit ridiculous as well. Watkins was gameplanned for, Bryant was not. Watkins started all three years he was at Clemson, he has more experience. The adjustment that Bryant has to make is a lot bigger than the adjustment that Watkins will have to make.
I'm not counting the kid out at all, I'm actually defending him. He's raw, he will need time. I'm sure he will give us some valuable minutes this year and contribute, but he's also not going to put up monster stats and challenge for one of the top 3 WR spots just yet either. I bet AB will support my comment as well, as if that means anything...
I w anted Cody Latimer a more polished WR and then DE Brent Urban to replace Kesiel, I really hope Tuitt turns to be like a Richard Seymour/ Ty Warren/Brett Kesiel 34 end.
I see Heyward to emerge as a top 5 34 DE a player at the same level as the jets Muhammad Wilkerson , both are about the same size, nasty, physical and hard to move.
I see Heyward to emerge as a top 5 34 DE a player at the same level as the jets Muhammad Wilkerson , both are about the same size, nasty, physical and hard to move.
From a Bills writer:
Steelers knock Bills back in joint practice
By Mike Rodak | August 13, 2014 6:55:13 PM PDT
LATROBE, Pa. -- After an hour bus ride to St. Vincent College, the Buffalo Bills got hit by a truck early in Wednesday's joint practice with the Pittsburgh Steelers.
Convening on a single practice field for simultaneous 11-on-11 sessions, the Buffalo Bills' offense was knocked around early in a spirited series of reps that featured live tackling.
EJ Manuel's first pass was caught by Robert Woods, but the ball was stripped and recovered by Steelers defensive backs, who were flying around early in the practice. On the next play, C.J. Spiller fought back, butting helmets with linebacker Jason Worilds after a run up the middle.
Then came Manuel's next pass, over the middle to Sammy Watkins. In a rare moment for the rookie, he pulled up as he anticipated contact from a safety, with the ball careening off his hands.
Later, with the second-team offense on the field, fullback Evan Rodriguez got into a large scuffle with several Steelers after a play. That was quickly followed by a Steelers defender delivering a hard hit on fullback Frank Summers after a catch in the flat.
The intensity in that first period set the tone for what was by far the Bills' most physical practice of training camp. Manuel and the Bills' offense seemed rattled for the rest of the day.
Some of Manuel's throws came in early to receivers, and about a half-dozen others were overthrown or underthrown. On his passes that were accurate, Manuel didn't always get help from his receivers.
On his next target after his early fumble, Woods tried to catch a Manuel pass on a short pattern with one hand. It didn't work. Two plays later, Mike Williams couldn't corral a well-thrown pass over the middle. Since that period of practice didn't feature live tacking, Steelers defensive backs heckled Williams for the drop, reminding him that they "weren't going to hit" him.
The chirping from the Steelers secondary continued throughout the practice, with some Bills receivers butting heads with safety Mike Mitchell and others. At one point, Woods dove forward but couldn't catch an underthrown Manuel pass and was serenaded by the Steelers' defensive backs as he returned to the opposite sideline.
Manuel had particular trouble connecting with Woods. We counted six targets to Woods from Manuel, all incomplete except for his fumble on the first play. A few passes were underthrown or overthrown, and Woods was dragged down by a Steelers defender (no penalty flag) on another.
The Bills offense punched back later in practice when Manuel connected with tight end Scott Chandler down the middle of the field for a big gain. Steelers defensive coordinator Dick LeBeau, 76, who was vocal throughout practice, particularly chided his defense for allowing that play.
Chandler's catch was one of the few offensive highlights from a practice that should serve as a wake-up call for the Bills. In some ways, this was part of the plan for the Bills: Enter hostile territory and if you get pushed around, push back.
The Bills will have their chance to respond Thursday evening when the teams meet again.
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/b...6dd1524b"}
Steelers knock Bills back in joint practice
By Mike Rodak | August 13, 2014 6:55:13 PM PDT
LATROBE, Pa. -- After an hour bus ride to St. Vincent College, the Buffalo Bills got hit by a truck early in Wednesday's joint practice with the Pittsburgh Steelers.
Convening on a single practice field for simultaneous 11-on-11 sessions, the Buffalo Bills' offense was knocked around early in a spirited series of reps that featured live tackling.
EJ Manuel's first pass was caught by Robert Woods, but the ball was stripped and recovered by Steelers defensive backs, who were flying around early in the practice. On the next play, C.J. Spiller fought back, butting helmets with linebacker Jason Worilds after a run up the middle.
Then came Manuel's next pass, over the middle to Sammy Watkins. In a rare moment for the rookie, he pulled up as he anticipated contact from a safety, with the ball careening off his hands.
Later, with the second-team offense on the field, fullback Evan Rodriguez got into a large scuffle with several Steelers after a play. That was quickly followed by a Steelers defender delivering a hard hit on fullback Frank Summers after a catch in the flat.
The intensity in that first period set the tone for what was by far the Bills' most physical practice of training camp. Manuel and the Bills' offense seemed rattled for the rest of the day.
Some of Manuel's throws came in early to receivers, and about a half-dozen others were overthrown or underthrown. On his passes that were accurate, Manuel didn't always get help from his receivers.
On his next target after his early fumble, Woods tried to catch a Manuel pass on a short pattern with one hand. It didn't work. Two plays later, Mike Williams couldn't corral a well-thrown pass over the middle. Since that period of practice didn't feature live tacking, Steelers defensive backs heckled Williams for the drop, reminding him that they "weren't going to hit" him.
The chirping from the Steelers secondary continued throughout the practice, with some Bills receivers butting heads with safety Mike Mitchell and others. At one point, Woods dove forward but couldn't catch an underthrown Manuel pass and was serenaded by the Steelers' defensive backs as he returned to the opposite sideline.
Manuel had particular trouble connecting with Woods. We counted six targets to Woods from Manuel, all incomplete except for his fumble on the first play. A few passes were underthrown or overthrown, and Woods was dragged down by a Steelers defender (no penalty flag) on another.
The Bills offense punched back later in practice when Manuel connected with tight end Scott Chandler down the middle of the field for a big gain. Steelers defensive coordinator Dick LeBeau, 76, who was vocal throughout practice, particularly chided his defense for allowing that play.
Chandler's catch was one of the few offensive highlights from a practice that should serve as a wake-up call for the Bills. In some ways, this was part of the plan for the Bills: Enter hostile territory and if you get pushed around, push back.
The Bills will have their chance to respond Thursday evening when the teams meet again.
http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/b...6dd1524b"}
You can't knock the hundreds of hours put into the pre-draft analysis by our de facto Mel Kipers on the board. You know the one's whose opinions are the only ones that count. Yeah **** those guys.
Couple years ago the Steelers' opponent lined up for an onsides kick. Bill Hillgrove (local radio guy) notes that Ike Taylor is on the "hands team" and me and the wife both busted out laughing.
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It's not a double standard, its the over the top Archer fans pointing to one play and saying "see I told you so", then turning around and getting on Bryant for his mental lapses. While the side that's NOT SAYING ARCHER IS A BAD PLAYER, just that he has a big hill to climb points to the fact that it is in fact just ONE preseason game, and the first for both rookies, and that neither is anything to get too high or too low about.
It's one side trying so desperately to be right, while the other side is seeing the reality of the situation, and isn't ready to put labels on either player after one preseason game... This **** is seriously getting old.
Where have you seen one over the top Archer fan saying i told you so? Besides Tibs ******* around. I havent seen it.
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I think you see things differently than I do.
I think Bryant can turn into a damn good starting NFL WR if he works his *** off (if he has 75% of the work ethic that Antonio Brown has). But it's going to take awhile. I don't think he starts until year 3. I don't think he gets a hat for the first 4-5 games of the season (assuming the top 4 WRs stay healthy). Then he will slowly start getting some looks in red zone packages. I saw nothing in the first preseason game to change my mind even 1%.
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Right-
He can't field punts
He isn't playing against slow college players now
There will be 10 guys we will wish we had taken instead of him
Wasted pick
Yep, you're right, all those things don't sound ANYTHING like they were saying "he's a bad player" Just a ****** guy to pick for your football team.
By the way, I haven't said ONE bad thing about Bryant, other than to mention that his debut sucked ***. I personally hope he gets better, and if he does, I'm sure we might well end up with a few hundred more pages debating if he in fact SHOULD have been taken first, ala the endless ******* Timmons vs Woodley debates here. Remember those? Yeah, all those guys weren't saying Timmons was a "bad" player either, just that, no way would he ever be as good as Woodley, the guy we were dumb enough to select after him.
I must be one of the few ******* members of this form who has functioning long term memory.
Joe
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******' A....
Not saying there's a double standard in play ... yet; because as you point out, it was a first game for both players. As a fan, I'd hope that Archer continues to flash as he did and that Bryant's performance serves as a wake up call for him. That said, the one game is NOT all that we have to go on. We've all read (or can read) the tweets and reports that came out of camp. Everyday, there were positive reports about Archer from media, fans, fellow players, etc. and every day, there were reports about Bryant that indicated that he was raw and possibly a little lackadaisical in his approach and preparation.
I hope they BOTH succeed, but at this point, based on that one game and what I've been hearing/reading out of camp (which really shouldn't be ignored when it comes to this debate), it appears that Archer is more ready to contribute at this time than Bryant.
I've not seen a credible report that Bryant has been "lackadaisical" (and trust me, I've read everything out there that is credible). Some idiots have painted Bryant with the "Plexico" brush because he is tall like Plex but that's pure bullshit. He has been making plenty of positive plays in camp and certainly did not suffer any sort of hangover from his less than stellar debut.
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Also, he has yet to shoot himself in the leg, not even once. I agree, a totally unfair comparison.
Go back and read through the tweets from Kozora from the Depot and Kaboly, you'll see that in a few they question his sense of "urgency" to paraphrase. And, I didn't say he wasn't making positive plays, but that he was showing that he was raw: i.e, he's missed a few catches that he should have made, ran some wrong routes, had Tomlin get on him, etc. Note that I did not imply that he could not overcome this. As for not suffering any sort of hangover from his "less than stellar debut", that remains to be seen doesn't it? (and, I hope you are right).
I don't see it as an Archer v. Bryant thing. I hope they both turn out to be All-Pros. That said, to me it is apparent that Archer is in a better position to provide some help to the offense AT THIS TIME.
Ok, this was before camp, during OTAs buuut:
http://www.Invalid Link - Check SN Home Page/2014/06/steelers-rookie-wr-martavis-bryant-gets-scolded-lack-work-ethic/
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Just a couple thoughts 1) by all reports he has had good practices this week (he ended one with a couple tough TD catches) which is all I meant in terms of bouncing back from his performance in preseason game #1 and 2) that "article" that you linked is nonsense: Tomlin told the kid he needs to run after the catch in a drill just like Antonio Brown does...that's what OTAs are about, teaching the kids how things should be done...in no way does that instance mean anything about Bryant's work ethic.
Archer is going to touch the ball 5-10 times against the Browns. Bryant will be inactive. So sure Archer is "ahead" of Bryant but really none of that means jack **** in terms of the kind of career each will have.
That's what I meant. Archer will help the team in ways that Bryant is not prepared to do AT THIS TIME. As far as their respective careers, I believe I stated that I would love to see them both become All Pros. But, you are correct in stating (if I may paraphrase) that it's just too damned early to make a determination as to what type of career either will have.
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When our third round pick came up I stated in the draft thread my board had Tiny Richardson on top of it(didn't realize he had medical flags). My guess would be Bryant. But if I would pick it would be Archer. We ended up picking Archer and from what I read it was between Archer and Bryant. I was then thrilled that we still got Bryant in the 4th. The thing that has pissed me off from the beginning is people stating that Archer presents no value. I find that completely asinine. I stated early and often that Archer will have a much better season than Bryant just because he WILL touch the ball and be active on game day. He will return punts and kicks and he will get a handful of runs and pass plays designed for him. Yes, he will never be a 300 carry and 80 catch RB. Never going to happen. But he instantly on his rookie contract contributes to the team on special teams and offense. Bryant might have the better career but his first year or two might be him never seeing meaningful game action. And lets say he becomes a productive player in year three. That means the very next season is his last contractual year with the team so if that is the case we already have to pony up bucks to re-sign him after one year of production. Archer on the other hand (who signed pretty much the same contract as Bryant) will have been productive from day one. That is huge to me. So yes Bryant might have the better career when it is all said and done but Archer will be productive from the get-go.
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Maybe read more of the board instead of just posting links to articles every five minutes and you might see some of those posts. And it's not just Tibs... but hey, we're all just "******* around" right?
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