WW lll

[DBS1970]

I don’t know who needs to hear this again today but here goes: The US has no business getting involved in this conflict because we have no interest in this region. The Ukraine is not a client state or a treaty partner of the USA. Being against involvement in a war that we have no interest in does not mean that we support Putin. If you are pushing for the United States to go to war because the Russians defending their interests hurts your Fee Fees then you are stuck on stupid and I can’t help you.

 

[Djfan]

If this gets into a shooting war, leave a penny on my grave bud.

If this becomes a shooting war over here, I'm in. Until then, no thanks.

 

[Steelr4evr]

I don’t know who needs to hear this again today but here goes: The US has no business getting involved in this conflict because we have no interest in this region. The Ukraine is not a client state or a treaty partner of the USA. Being against involvement in a war that we have no interest in does not mean that we support Putin. If you are pushing for the United States to go to war because the Russians defending their interests hurts your Fee Fees then you are stuck on stupid and I can’t help you.

Totally agree. I wouldn't trade one American life for it. Did anyone not see what Biden did in Afghanistan? Biden couldn't lead himself across the room, let alone matters of life and death.

 

[jiminoh]

I don’t know who needs to hear this again today but here goes: The US has no business getting involved in this conflict because we have no interest in this region. The Ukraine is not a client state or a treaty partner of the USA. Being against involvement in a war that we have no interest in does not mean that we support Putin. If you are pushing for the United States to go to war because the Russians defending their interests hurts your Fee Fees then you are stuck on stupid and I can’t help you.

Agree. But if Putin starts dropping nukes out of desperation and the radiation causes big problems for let's say, Poland, then we're suddenly in it. At least, that's the way I understand the treaty and NATO is discussing such things right now.

Also, I don't understand how bombing civilians and maternity hospitals is defending Russia's interests. Will you further explain your last sentence? Because I honestly don't know what you're getting at. (And no, I'm not trying to be a smartass or sound like Bob)

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

I think dbs is talking about having Ukraine become nato and having bases and other west military next door. How would we react it China puts a base in Cuba? We good?

 

[jiminoh]

I think dbs is talking about having Ukraine become nato and having bases and other west military next door. How would we react it China puts a base in Cuba? We good?

Yeah, thanks and that does make sense.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

Found this interesting. No idea of factually but very interesting geography history / culture of Russia

 

[Tim Steelersfan]

Another reason Xi and Putin no longer fear us.

 

[DBS1970]

Agree. But if Putin starts dropping nukes out of desperation and the radiation causes big problems for let's say, Poland, then we're suddenly in it. At least, that's the way I understand the treaty and NATO is discussing such things right now.

Also, I don't understand how bombing civilians and maternity hospitals is defending Russia's interests. Will you further explain your last sentence? Because I honestly don't know what you're getting at. (And no, I'm not trying to be a smartass or sound like Bob)

Most people who haven’t served in the military don’t understand the importance of Ukraine geographically and terrain wise to that part of Europe. Ukraine is basically like the great plains in the Midwest, it’s rolling Hills with a lot of wide open space that is basically a perfect invasion route straight to Moscow. Putin doesn’t want our troops, planes and theater nukes stationed there. And no Ivan isn’t indiscriminately attacking civilian areas. What you’re going to find is the Ukrainian Forces are operating in or near civilian areas which makes those areas legitimate targets. But the Ukrainian propaganda apparatus is spoon feeding it as bloodthirsty Russians killing women and children without provocation to our media and our media is eating it right up.

 

[jiminoh]

Most people who haven’t served in the military don’t understand the importance of Ukraine geographically and terrain wise to that part of Europe. Ukraine is basically like the great plains in the Midwest, it’s rolling Hills with a lot of wide open space that is basically a perfect invasion route straight to Moscow. Putin doesn’t want our troops, planes and theater nukes stationed there. And no Ivan isn’t indiscriminately attacking civilian areas. What you’re going to find is the Ukrainian Forces are operating in or near civilian areas which makes those areas legitimate targets. But the Ukrainian propaganda apparatus is spoon feeding it as bloodthirsty Russians killing women and children without provocation to our media and our media is eating it right up.

Thanks for explaining that. It's no shock we're being spoon fed once again. And terrain-wise, I certainly understand Russia's concern.

 

[jiminoh]

Found this interesting. No idea of factually but very interesting geography history / culture of Russia

Thanks for putting that up. Very interesting.

 

[Steelr4evr]

Another reason Xi and Putin no longer fear us.

That **** is ridiculous. I'm still in disbelief at just how many people are so easily misled and still brainwashed. They probably started slipping subliminal messages into again. Which they've probably been doing it all along anyway.

 

[Djfan]

This is interesting.

Russian Brigade Commander ‘Killed Deliberately By His Own Troops’ Over Staggering Losses In Ukraine: Report

 

[JMM]

This is interesting.

Russian Brigade Commander ‘Killed Deliberately By His Own Troops’ Over Staggering Losses In Ukraine: Report

Interesting if true...Not sure I'd believe anything coming from either side unless Im there to see it.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

Ahh how cute. Trying to get Ukrainian votes now I see.

Biden lashes at Putin, calls for Western resolve for freedom

WARSAW, Poland (AP) — President Joe Biden delivered a forceful and highly personal condemnation of Russia’s Vladimir Putin on Saturday, summoning a call for liberal democracy and a durable resolve among Western nations in the face of a brutal autocrat.

apnews.com

 

[Steelr4evr]

Interesting if true...Not sure I'd believe anything coming from either side unless Im there to see it.

Yeah, I'm the same way. This smells to high heaven and really don't put any faith in the information coming out being correct. I certainly don't trust our news media, because they're completely unworthy of trust.

 

[MTC]

Interesting if true...Not sure I'd believe anything coming from either side unless Im there to see it.

I think we’re going to see the ukrainian version of isis in the future after all this is said and done. I don’t believe it either but I also do realize russia’s military has looked like a total flop in all this, no matter which media source you consume.

 

[Superman]

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

Here is my question. Is Russian military really this broken down(equipment), lack or leadership, poor planning, troop disdain,…etc or is Ukrain/nato more equipped than led to believe?

It’s almost like Putin took a page out of Biden’s exit from Afghanistan on how to operate

 

[Sarge]

Here is my question. Is Russian military really this broken down(equipment), lack or leadership, poor planning, troop disdain,…etc or is Ukrain/nato more equipped than led to believe?

It’s almost like Putin took a page out of Biden’s exit from Afghanistan on how to operate

Their biggest problem is logistics. Trucks don’t move without fuel, troops don’t eat without food and you don’t defeat any enemy without bullets. On top of that, Russia has been unable, for whatever reason, to modernize its military.

Aside from the hypersonic missiles, can you name anything that they’re using in combat that wasn’t their primary equipment 20 years ago? They were supposed to field a new tank in 2016, it got pushed off to 2025. They’re still using T72’s, 80’s and 90’s. Relics of a bygone era. It’s why they’re pissed we are giving the Ukrainians weapons. Even with minimal training, our **** is just better.

 

[Sarge]

The Ukrainians are smart. They’re fighting a guerilla war. History shows that the US and Russia can’t fight that kind of war. Neither of us has been able to adapt. We did better in Afghanistan than our historical norm, but that bar was pretty low.

 

[Badcat]

The Ukrainians are smart. They’re fighting a guerilla war. History shows that the US and Russia can’t fight that kind of war. Neither of us has been able to adapt. We did better in Afghanistan than our historical norm, but that bar was pretty low.

We were WAY better in Afghanistan than we've ever been in Guerilla warfare. we were sending in operators who were trained instead of ******* POGs. We didn't think a naval plastering of the hills would soften it up for grunts to take high ground. It was more surgical than ever. To your point, we still have a lot to learn and train on, but the Russians...they have no ******* clue what they're doing.

 

[Sarge]

We were WAY better in Afghanistan than we've ever been in Guerilla warfare. we were sending in operators who were trained instead of ******* POGs. We didn't think a naval plastering of the hills would soften it up for grunts to take high ground. It was more surgical than ever. To your point, we still have a lot to learn and train on, but the Russians...they have no ******* clue what they're doing.

We still softened **** up, we just used AC-130H's instead of ships. And as far as surgical, I can't agree. Better for sure, but the ROE never allowed us to be surgical. Trained Operators certainly played a role, but the majority of the heavy lifting was done by regular infantry and scout units, especially during the surge.

When we got to the last 4-5 years of any real fighting(2014-2019-ish), it was all done by SEALs and ODA, as regular units mostly simply defended their positions rather than seek out engagement, the only exception being army aviation. In the last year or two of that stupid war, we passed a ton of our responsibilities primarily to Czech and Polish special forces, but others had small roles. In fact, I helped 7th Group (the last ODA to deploy to Afghanistan) out of country in 2019, and they were replaced by SFAB's. SFAB's are a concept too stupid for words, but it did enable us to give the SF guys a much needed break.

As for the Russians, it appears they are still using their cold war era playbook. The tactics are similar if not identical. It's that outdated doctrine that got them hemmed up in Afghanistan and Chechnya, and they have failed to adapt. We at least tried and as you stated we have improved. If we had only been allowed to fight to our military's full capability, it wouldn't have lasted anywhere near 20 years. Politicians and lawyers ****** our military over in more ways than the American public will probably ever know, and our guys still kicked ***.

 

[SteelChip]

If this becomes a shooting war over here, I'm in. Until then, no thanks.

You be in sparse company DJ

 

[Sarge]

You be in sparse company DJ

And that’s pathetic. How could anyone not feel this country is worth fighting for? I’m not a millionaire, but I do ok. I’m not rich or even well off, but I have everything I need. I love this nation, even with all the nonsense. If it comes to it, as long as I’m able, I will fight for her. I took an oath, and that oath is life long, until my dying breath. Anyone that would run deserves nothing America gives.