Your Judgement, NFL Marketing division on Social Justice

[1976steelers]

Actually it's 1/4 of the season in, but our team has fallen soldiers and fallen police officers names on their helmets,

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[SteelBuckeye]

I don't think African-Americans born and raised in the United States are from a "different culture," blitzburgh. They, like me, are Americans. For God sake, they are fans of the NFL, a purely American sport.

And as Steelr4evr pointed out, the problem is NOT a discussion about racism; the problem is vilifying police while simultaneously holding up rapists, thugs and career criminals as examples of great people. They're not. Sorry.

Finally, and I know this thread gets close to belonging on the political forum, but you have to realize that the facts matter. They do. If a player wants to talk about racism he encountered and how to deal with it, or how to expose it, that is a conversation worth having.

But I will NOT be lectured to by some multi-millionaire woman who attended Princeton and is giving me the lecture from her $20 million mansion in Martha's Vineyard. Seriously, it would be NO DIFFERENT than some trust fund millenial lecturing you on the value of hard work.

I imagine the finger-wagging in that instance would probably not go over well with you.

You have an interesting viewpoint. I can even understand how, not being African-American in the U.S., you could arrive at it. Being African-American, and still not being qualified to speak for ALL other African-Americans, I will only say that I, personally disagree with you on some (many) (most) of your observations. If you would like to, feel free to PM me for further discussion. I never go to the political section of the board, and really wonder, now that this thread has become a political/social thread more than a FOOTBALL thread, why it is still hanging out in The Stadium.

 

[slashsteel]

I think if someone has good points you would want to share them with the rest of the people in this thread. Awareness comes with overall communication not individual. Just my opinion.

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[Stewey]

How pathetic that was. The Steelers honoring a dead thug in the name of "social justice", an illusion. Even Maurkice Pouncey thought so.

"Social justice" is just another bullshit leftist term. There's no such thing.

There is either justice or there is injustice.

"Social justice" also pertains to issues such as the cycle of poverty, or the so called gap between rich or poor, education...none of which has anything to with justice.

Social justice is concerned with the just relationship between individuals and their society, often considering how privileges, opportunities, and wealth ought to be distributed among individuals…so there you have it.. "Social Justice" a lefty code word for socialism.

"Social justice" says you must favor the poor man in a dispute over the rich man in a court of law.

[B]Justice, in its broadest sense, is the principle that people receive that which they deserve [/B]

There is either justice or injustice, not social justice. So lets hand down some justice to the Brownstains this week.

 

[Drink IRON City]

NOT one single person has come forward and said they are NOT watching due to the way the NFL has handled the movement. That says the NFL MARKETING MUST BE DOING THE RIGHT THINGS TO KEEP viewership up. Good for them but the ratings need a little more time to confirm that as they are up and down without steadying yet. Let's check again at 1/2 way point of season. I think we will find near the same thing, not any certain determination.

Personally, I think the ratings will be down slightly with a lot of the savior viewership being Covid-19 stranded at home viewers. I think many have found other things to do. The FF crowd has sustained the NFL enough to ride this storm out. There will NOT be a better product next season or the season after unless you count catering to FF League altering rules for more offense. I'm willing to venture that the NFL expands format so FF players will also draft defensive players and earn points off their individual stats...... It's headed that way because everything else is used up. $$$$$$speeks$$$$$$$






Salute the nation

 

[Djfan]

NOT one single person has come forward and said they are NOT watching due to the way the NFL has handled the movement. That says the NFL MARKETING MUST BE DOING THE RIGHT THINGS TO KEEP viewership up. Good for them but the ratings need a little more time to confirm that as they are up and down without steadying yet. Let's check again at 1/2 way point of season. I think we will find near the same thing, not any certain determination.

Personally, I think the ratings will be down slightly with a lot of the savior viewership being Covid-19 stranded at home viewers. I think many have found other things to do. The FF crowd has sustained the NFL enough to ride this storm out. There will NOT be a better product next season or the season after unless you count catering to FF League altering rules for more offense. I'm willing to venture that the NFL expands format so FF players will also draft defensive players and earn points off their individual stats...... It's headed that way because everything else is used up. $$$$$$speeks$$$$$$$






Salute the nation

I am not watching because of the way the league is handling the movement.

 

[Drink IRON City]

I am not watching because of the way the league is handling the movement.

Noted and counted BUT I thought you had quit watching a couple years ago, prior to the movement.




Salute the nation

 

[Djfan]

Noted and counted BUT I thought you had quit watching a couple years ago, prior to the movement.




Salute the nation

No, I just lost a lot of interest. The way the league favored teams like the cheats, the rules making offense the only game on the field, the inconsistent calling of penalties, and non calls, the hero worship of a few, etc. It seemed like our Steelers got the short end of most of those. It was stupid.

This last PC political stuff, making thugs into heroes was the last straw.

 

[steel dino]

Did anyone watch this? Walker is Breanna Taylors boyfriend...

King's exclusive interview with Walker airs Wednesday on "CBS This Morning" at 7 a.m

 

[bermudasteel]

I've gotten to know a bunch of black guys over time, and I've never needed to ask a single one about why he was "so angry." Why? Because they were not angry. They also weren't worried about any racial fights or atrocities -- they were concerned with making a living to support their families, serving their country, or just enjoying life in general. You know, human stuff.

The "fight," as you put it, exists mostly among the minorities from the inner cities, because their lives are immersed in a never-ending cycle of poverty, crime, violence, and fatherless children. And it has come to exist more and more in the woke minds of their sympathizers of all colors. Just one white man's opinion, of course.


And DIC, to answer your question: I've been pleased to see that the NFL has backed off the spotlight since week one. I could do without the helmet statements, but it doesn't bother me too much. I've been watching the Steelers and the NFL since I was ten years old, and I'll continue to do so.

I can understand your comment 100%. Many blacks, that do not live in the inner cities, are angry. We are upset about equality.

It's really not a hard thing to fix but, I know it never will be because it's not just a black vs. white thing.

Like I said, I'm an open book. Just ask...

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[Hines57]

I don't think anything the NFL is doing is going to change society. People need to stop being sheep and voting for the same politicians every cycle. The local levels where mayors and city councils oversee the local police departments are areas that need to be changed. You wonder why all of a sudden this is an issue and then see politicians on the national level who have been in office, 20-40 years. If you think those people are the answer to society's issues, than you best be prepared for more of the same. We need the flush out these politicians and hold their replacements accountable.

I believe the single worst issue we face in this country is public education funding or lack thereof. These idiots are always taking money from schools first to fund other projects. Education funding should be sacred and we should never allow them to steal from our kids. We need our kids to be brilliant so they can be better than we are. When they take money from the schools they are undermining our future as a country.

 

[SteelBuckeye]

I can understand your comment 100%. Many blacks, that do not live in the inner cities, are angry. We are upset about equality.

It's really not a hard thing to fix but, I know it never will be because it's not just a black vs. white thing.

Like I said, I'm an open book. Just ask...

Sent from my SM-N960U using Steeler Nation mobile app

Ever go into work and get pissed off about something? Say maybe the boss's kid ***** something up and you have more work to do now because of it. In that situation, most folks keep their mouths shut until they get home because they don't want to lose their job. it's kinda like that. Black folks, a majority of us, have learned to just not talk about certain things in front of White folks because the response is usually something along the line of "I have plenty of Black friends who aren't angry", 'You're playing the race card", "Go back to Africa" (A personal favorite of mine, since I've never BEEN to Africa). But understand, we do talk, joke about and express our feelings about social issues amongst ourselves quite frequently.

As far as "Culture" goes. It amazes me that folks are proud of their Italian-American heritage/culture, Polish-American heritage/culture, Albanian-American heritage/culture, etc., yet when Blacks talk about their culture, it's "Your culture is American culture. Same as mine." Sure, there is a general American culture. But, amongst that culture there are sub-cultures based on ethnicity, race, heritage, etc. And Black culture has contributed greatly to the overall "American" culture.

Personally, I don't think much of **** will change because the top 1-2%, the richest of the rich have us right where they want us. Fighting among ourselves like mice in the cupboard while they get the best of the best. I'm not a supporter of 45, but, I do realize that the division in this country was sowed well before he took office and fostered by EVERY administration during my lifetime. The goal? Keep folks divided based on race, income, living conditions, etc. so they don't start to look around and notice the inequality based on wealth that is happening around them.

There's more, but I've said enough, more than I started out to say and probably too much for some of y'all. In the end, I come to this board for football related discussion. Steelers related discussion. Jokes. Fun. And to relax among folks who are like-minded in their obsession over our Steelers.

 

[bermudasteel]

I suppose you're including me in your WASP category. I'm not "fragile," and certainly not threatened or intimidated by different people or cultures. I've been all around this world. For your edification, I was simply relaying my personal experience with the black guys I've befriended in my own life. It's my opinion that the inequality which exists in this country has much more to do with environmental factors and upbringing, and much less to do with the color of someone's skin. You're welcome to disagree with me.

Come back and visit again when YOU have a more open mind.

Add me to this conversation because I do not agree with the underlined comment above....

 

[Djfan]

I believe the single worst issue we face in this country is public education funding or lack thereof. These idiots are always taking money from schools first to fund other projects. Education funding should be sacred and we should never allow them to steal from our kids. We need our kids to be brilliant so they can be better than we are. When they take money from the schools they are undermining our future as a country.

I respectfully disagree. I was there for 18 years. I have seen up front how idiotic the educational complex is. I hope we can completely overhaul that sewage pit somehow. The whole idea of K-12 education is a new thing in human history, and has caused more issues than it solved. There is absolutely no need for the average kid to know algebra II, trig, etc. Give a child a basic education, and leave the higher ed for those who seek it. Let them foster a career at the 8th grade level and beyond, and leave it there.

Also, most univeristies need to shut down. VERY FEW PEOPLE need a college education. We are strapping these non-academicians with debt and obligation that cannot be sustained. But, the education system and the post secondary education system trains good little socialists / commies, and costs us BILLIONS. It's retarded.

God on high, I hate the educational complex.

 

[Djfan]

The goal? Keep folks divided based on race, income, living conditions, etc. so they don't start to look around and notice the inequality based on wealth that is happening around them.

Very well said. The fact is that there is a lot of power to be gained by some, from the division of the population. It's diabolical.

 

[slashsteel]

Ever go into work and get pissed off about something? Say maybe the boss's kid ***** something up and you have more work to do now because of it. In that situation, most folks keep their mouths shut until they get home because they don't want to lose their job. it's kinda like that. Black folks, a majority of us, have learned to just not talk about certain things in front of White folks because the response is usually something along the line of "I have plenty of Black friends who aren't angry", 'You're playing the race card", "Go back to Africa" (A personal favorite of mine, since I've never BEEN to Africa). But understand, we do talk, joke about and express our feelings about social issues amongst ourselves quite frequently.

As far as "Culture" goes. It amazes me that folks are proud of their Italian-American heritage/culture, Polish-American heritage/culture, Albanian-American heritage/culture, etc., yet when Blacks talk about their culture, it's "Your culture is American culture. Same as mine." Sure, there is a general American culture. But, amongst that culture there are sub-cultures based on ethnicity, race, heritage, etc. And Black culture has contributed greatly to the overall "American" culture.

Personally, I don't think much of **** will change because the top 1-2%, the richest of the rich have us right where they want us. Fighting among ourselves like mice in the cupboard while they get the best of the best. I'm not a supporter of 45, but, I do realize that the division in this country was sowed well before he took office and fostered by EVERY administration during my lifetime. The goal? Keep folks divided based on race, income, living conditions, etc. so they don't start to look around and notice the inequality based on wealth that is happening around them.

There's more, but I've said enough, more than I started out to say and probably too much for some of y'all. In the end, I come to this board for football related discussion. Steelers related discussion. Jokes. Fun. And to relax among folks who are like-minded in their obsession over our Steelers.

Here is the thing. Most people welcome all culture differences. I always get the feeling people are only viewing racists as white, when that is the farthest from the truth. Besides the country divide, there exists a lot of white hatred. It is why it was easy for a large group not to focus in on black on black crime. There is existing underlying racists. really equal in that aspect of color group. whites,& blacks. Disliking each other. Some masking their dislike by pointing fingers.When it really is just a matter of two sides with issues compounded by agenda from the top. Yeah not wanting there to be middle class.

When you bring up statistics things seem to always get quiet with those who feel they are encountering white racism.

For their to be a solution there has to be both sides admitting fault. Not one side trying to focus on cops that statistically a minority of a problem.


The only way to solve these problems is through education,mass education in the school systems which is right now breeding ignorance and poverty of both colors.

people are unwilling to change the structure from the top, so all you can do is educate your own. Your own can be family and friends.

Part of this is getting those statistics to change. Why is their more black on black, black on white, black on police officer crime statistically than vice versa?

So you have a large group of people buying into what they are pedaling.


Sad really.....

 

[Steeltime]

You have an interesting viewpoint. I can even understand how, not being African-American in the U.S., you could arrive at it. Being African-American, and still not being qualified to speak for ALL other African-Americans, I will only say that I, personally disagree with you on some (many) (most) of your observations. If you would like to, feel free to PM me for further discussion. I never go to the political section of the board, and really wonder, now that this thread has become a political/social thread more than a FOOTBALL thread, why it is still hanging out in The Stadium.

Like I said, a lot of the comments here push the limits on football forum discussion. I think the thread remains in the football forum because it was meant to deal with the "social justice" efforts by the NFL.

I will agree 100% with Stewey that "social justice" is an oxymoron. The term "social" means friendly interaction, a meeting of people in a convivial setting, actions meant to promote society. "Justice" means the administration of the law or authority in maintaining society. Social is the gathering of 22 players on the field to play American football; justice is the presence of the 7 referees to enforce the rules so that the game can be played.

"Social" and "justice" are therefore completely at odds with one another. Specifically, if twenty of us gather in a convivial setting and five are minorities, then fifteen might find it perfectly reasonable to demand that a certain five pay for the shindig. That is the definition of "social," since the interaction is friendly, the matter was discussed and a decision was reached.

Justice demands that the outcome further the administration of law or authority to keep society functioning, In the gathering example, that means the 15 have no actual right to pass on the costs to the underrepresented - something in America we call the 5th and 14th amendments, i.e., the law.

Finally, I joined this forum in 1999 following the demise of the Sporting News comment section. I did not first venture over into the political forum until 2012. That forum gets a bit testy at times (go figure), but is a pretty good place for the further discussion you mention.

 

[Steeltime]

Add me to this conversation because I do not agree with the underlined comment above....

Fact: A white male raised in a single-parent household is about six times more likely to grow up in and continue to be in poverty the rest of his life, and ten times more likely to wind up being arrested and going to jail, than an African-American male growing up in a two-parent family.

https://howtoadult.com/data-single-parent-vs-dual-parent-households-15860.html

The problem in America is not skin color; it is family structure. Raise and love your kids in a two-parent household and the odds are 95% plus they are middle class or better.

 

[slashsteel]

Fact: A white male raised in a single-parent household is about six times more likely to grow up in and continue to be in poverty the rest of his life, and ten times more likely to wind up being arrested and going to jail, than an African-American male growing up in a two-parent family.

https://howtoadult.com/data-single-parent-vs-dual-parent-households-15860.html

The problem in America is not skin color; it is family structure. Raise and love your kids in a two-parent household and the odds are 95% plus they are middle class or better.

So much for systematic racism which is just another diversity tool.

 

[bermudasteel]

Ever go into work and get pissed off about something? Say maybe the boss's kid ***** something up and you have more work to do now because of it. In that situation, most folks keep their mouths shut until they get home because they don't want to lose their job. it's kinda like that. Black folks, a majority of us, have learned to just not talk about certain things in front of White folks because the response is usually something along the line of "I have plenty of Black friends who aren't angry", 'You're playing the race card", "Go back to Africa" (A personal favorite of mine, since I've never BEEN to Africa). But understand, we do talk, joke about and express our feelings about social issues amongst ourselves quite frequently.

As far as "Culture" goes. It amazes me that folks are proud of their Italian-American heritage/culture, Polish-American heritage/culture, Albanian-American heritage/culture, etc., yet when Blacks talk about their culture, it's "Your culture is American culture. Same as mine." Sure, there is a general American culture. But, amongst that culture there are sub-cultures based on ethnicity, race, heritage, etc. And Black culture has contributed greatly to the overall "American" culture.

Personally, I don't think much of **** will change because the top 1-2%, the richest of the rich have us right where they want us. Fighting among ourselves like mice in the cupboard while they get the best of the best. I'm not a supporter of 45, but, I do realize that the division in this country was sowed well before he took office and fostered by EVERY administration during my lifetime. The goal? Keep folks divided based on race, income, living conditions, etc. so they don't start to look around and notice the inequality based on wealth that is happening around them.

There's more, but I've said enough, more than I started out to say and probably too much for some of y'all. In the end, I come to this board for football related discussion. Steelers related discussion. Jokes. Fun. And to relax among folks who are like-minded in their obsession over our Steelers.

<iframe src="https://giphy.com/embed/p3WlyWHDyDeJq" width="480" height="404" frameBorder="0" class="giphy-embed" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://giphy.com/gifs/chingy-p3WlyWHDyDeJq">via GIPHY</a></p>

Nuff said...

 

[DBS1970]

The NFL should leave all political statements behind.

 

[Coach]

It could be an inner-city thing. A good friend of mine is African American. We go out in the same social circles ( on hold due to covid 19 ) and be work in the high industry.. He lives in the suburbs. Some might consider him a sell out, but he's really not. He thinks it's mostly a class thing, but doesn't speak of it loudly out of fear of backlash.


His view, you don't see guys with no police record getting roughed up from the cops, and if they are by chance arrested, they are smart enough not to resist—end of.


While the suspects arrested do not deserve to be shot, or injured, if they make it difficult for the cops, fight back, don't listen or make what could be a dangerous move, society isn't going to care much about an x con with assault, burglary, domestic violence on his record. If he's white, the white community reaction is, well, it's a shame it cost him his life, but at least he''s off the street. If he's black most of the inner city reaction is they shot him, its racists.


Like I said new hands-off laws are needed once a person is cuffed, but education on how to be arrested is also required.


An unreal statics. If your born an African American man, your chances of getting shot are 1 in 20. 5%. That is insane. They don't tell you that maybe .0001% of that data is from the police, and most of the 5% is comprised of community shooting.


As for the other part of the equation, I do think it's up to mostly white people to limit the brutality portion where violent arrests either accidentally or intentionally produce a fatality without guns.. Back in school days, pre Millenials there were fights where I grew up. No weapons, but fights with winners or losers. There was a point when the crowd felt, okay, he's had enough get F off him now, and the winner backed down. We need that in these arrests when a guy says he can't breathe or is taking a beating. Right now.

 

[bermudasteel]

It could be an inner-city thing. A good friend of mine is African American. We go out in the same social circles ( on hold due to covid 19 ) and be work in the high industry.. He lives in the suburbs. Some might consider him a sell out, but he's really not. He thinks it's mostly a class thing, but doesn't speak of it loudly out of fear of backlash.


His view, you don't see guys with no police record getting roughed up from the cops, and if they are by chance arrested, they are smart enough not to resist—end of.


While the suspects arrested do not deserve to be shot, or injured, if they make it difficult for the cops, fight back, don't listen or make what could be a dangerous move, society isn't going to care much about an x con with assault, burglary, domestic violence on his record. If he's white, the white community reaction is, well, it's a shame it cost him his life, but at least he''s off the street. If he's black most of the inner city reaction is they shot him, its racists.


Like I said new hands-off laws are needed once a person is cuffed, but education on how to be arrested is also required.


An unreal statics. If your born an African American man, your chances of getting shot are 1 in 20. 5%. That is insane. They don't tell you that maybe .0001% of that data is from the police, and most of the 5% is comprised of community shooting.


As for the other part of the equation, I do think it's up to mostly white people to limit the brutality portion where violent arrests either accidentally or intentionally produce a fatality without guns.. Back in school days, pre Millenials there were fights where I grew up. No weapons, but fights with winners or losers. There was a point when the crowd felt, okay, he's had enough get F off him now, and the winner backed down. We need that in these arrests when a guy says he can't breathe or is taking a beating. Right now.

I'm confused...

 

[slashsteel]

I'm confused...

Any of his posts can do that to yinz.

 

[Drink IRON City]

I'm confused...

berm, gasoline goes in the gas tank, BACON goes with anything, the middle finger goes to the "rog",............ YOU good?




Salute the nation