Derek Chauvin Trial

[Stainless]

Isn’t there also an unintentional clause? That’s what I see here.

 

[Stainless]

Based upon what I’m reading, he was actually charged with 2nd degree unintentional murder.

 

[oneforthebus]

Isn’t there also an unintentional clause? That’s what I see here.

From my reading of the statute, second degree unintentional murder means you cause someone's death during the act of committing a felony, even if you didn't intend to kill the person. The felony in this case according to the prosecution was assaulting George Floyd.

 

[Tibs]

Guilty on all three charges.

1. Guilty The second-degree unintentional murder charge alleged Chauvin caused Floyd's death "without intent" while committing or attempting to commit felony third-degree assault.

2. Guilty The third-degree murder charge alleged Chauvin caused Floyd's death by "perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life."

3. Guilty The second-degree manslaughter charge alleged Chauvin caused Floyd's death by "culpable negligence whereby the person creates an unreasonable risk, and consciously takes chances of causing death or great bodily harm."

Let us hope that George Floyd's death was not in vain and that this becomes a watershed moment in American history, whereby the justice system begins to truly work equally for all. Looking forward to further legislation on police reform on the local, state & federal level.

Also, I'm hopeful the judge will do the right thing and consider the extreme cruelty & utter lack of regard for human life on Chauvin's part and fully maximize the available jail sentence.

So glad they got this one right. We can all breathe a sigh of relief. A breath, sadly, that George Floyd is unable to take.

May George Floyd rest in peace and his family find some semblence of solace and comfort.

 

[Buster]

I never realized that someone could be charged with 2 counts of murder and manslaughter in the death of one person. Seems redundant.

 

[oneforthebus]

Chauvin convicted of 2nd degree murder, which required a showing of intent to kill.

2020 Minnesota Statutes
Section 609.19
609.19 MURDER IN THE SECOND DEGREE.

Subdivision 1. Intentional murder.

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:

(1) causes the death of a human being with intent to effect the death of that person or another, but without premeditation.

There is intentional second degree murder and unintentional second degree murder in Minnesota. He was convicted of unintentional.

609.19 MURDER IN THE SECOND DEGREE.​

§

Subdivision 1.Intentional murder; drive-by shootings.​

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:
(1) causes the death of a human being with intent to effect the death of that person or another, but without premeditation; or
(2) causes the death of a human being while committing or attempting to commit a drive-by shooting in violation of section 609.66, subdivision 1e, under circumstances other than those described in section 609.185, paragraph (a), clause (3).

Subd. 2.Unintentional murders.​

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of unintentional murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:
(1) causes the death of a human being, without intent to effect the death of any person, while committing or attempting to commit a felony offense other than criminal sexual conduct in the first or second degree with force or violence or a drive-by shooting; or
(2) causes the death of a human being without intent to effect the death of any person, while intentionally inflicting or attempting to inflict bodily harm upon the victim, when the perpetrator is restrained under an order for protection and the victim is a person designated to receive protection under the order. As used in this clause, "order for protection" includes an order for protection issued under chapter 518B; a harassment restraining order issued under section 609.748; a court order setting conditions of pretrial release or conditions of a criminal sentence or juvenile court disposition; a restraining order issued in a marriage dissolution action; and any order issued by a court of another state or of the United States that is similar to any of these orders.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

So glad they got this one right. We can all breathe a sigh of relief. A breath, sadly, that George Floyd is unable to take.

Like I said, he was going to be dead in another half hour anyway by his own doing with no help from anyone else. Had three times the lethal level of fentanyl in his system.

 

[CoolieMan]

tibbie floyds family got more out of his death than he ever gave him in life. He was a useless human being who likely would not have lived much longer

yes chauvin was wrong for kneeling on his neck, but don't act like this turd was anything other than a ******* turd.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

There is intentional second degree murder and unintentional second degree murder in Minnesota. He was convicted of unintentional.

609.19 MURDER IN THE SECOND DEGREE.​

§

Subdivision 1.Intentional murder; drive-by shootings.​

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:
(1) causes the death of a human being with intent to effect the death of that person or another, but without premeditation; or
(2) causes the death of a human being while committing or attempting to commit a drive-by shooting in violation of section 609.66, subdivision 1e, under circumstances other than those described in section 609.185, paragraph (a), clause (3).

Subd. 2.Unintentional murders.​

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of unintentional murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:
(1) causes the death of a human being, without intent to effect the death of any person, while committing or attempting to commit a felony offense other than criminal sexual conduct in the first or second degree with force or violence or a drive-by shooting; or
(2) causes the death of a human being without intent to effect the death of any person, while intentionally inflicting or attempting to inflict bodily harm upon the victim, when the perpetrator is restrained under an order for protection and the victim is a person designated to receive protection under the order. As used in this clause, "order for protection" includes an order for protection issued under chapter 518B; a harassment restraining order issued under section 609.748; a court order setting conditions of pretrial release or conditions of a criminal sentence or juvenile court disposition; a restraining order issued in a marriage dissolution action; and any order issued by a court of another state or of the United States that is similar to any of these orders.

I'm no lawyer but a cop does not fit the definition in either section. Subd 2-1 means you kills somebody while committing a felony. That doesn't fit. Chauvin was making an arrest. The only issue is whether he was allowed to use the tactic and it came out in trial that it was taught. He was not attempting to commit a felony.

Subd 2-2 defines Perpetrator (Chauvin) as somebody who is under an order of protection. A cop does not fit that definition. Basically it means if you kill somebody who has a restraining order against you.

Seems to me there is a case for the manslaughter but not the other charges.

 

[CoolieMan]

no way in hell that jury wasn't going to come back with guilty on all charges they knew they would be terrorized otherwise

 

[oneforthebus]

I'm no lawyer but a cop does not fit the definition in either section. Subd 2-1 means you kills somebody while committing a felony. That doesn't fit. Chauvin was making an arrest. The only issue is whether he was allowed to use the tactic and it came out in trial that it was taught. He was not attempting to commit a felony.

Subd 2-2 defines Perpetrator (Chauvin) as somebody who is under an order of protection. A cop does not fit that definition. Basically it means if you kill somebody who has a restraining order against you.

Seems to me there is a case for the manslaughter but not the other charges.

The prosecution argued that Chauvin committed a felony assault. They argued the force was excessive. Numerous police officers including the Minneapolis chief of police testified that Chauvin's actions did not fit with their training. Perhaps the initial restraint was acceptable but not keeping up with it after the suspect was handcuffed, prone and no longer resisting. (Certainly not after he was unconscious and had no pulse.)

I guess the jury agreed.

I don't think Sub 2-2 is relevant to this case.

 

[Steeltime]

There is intentional second degree murder and unintentional second degree murder in Minnesota. He was convicted of unintentional.

609.19 MURDER IN THE SECOND DEGREE.​

§

Subdivision 1.Intentional murder; drive-by shootings.​

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:
(1) causes the death of a human being with intent to effect the death of that person or another, but without premeditation; or
(2) causes the death of a human being while committing or attempting to commit a drive-by shooting in violation of section 609.66, subdivision 1e, under circumstances other than those described in section 609.185, paragraph (a), clause (3).

Subd. 2.Unintentional murders.​

Whoever does either of the following is guilty of unintentional murder in the second degree and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 40 years:
(1) causes the death of a human being, without intent to effect the death of any person, while committing or attempting to commit a felony offense other than criminal sexual conduct in the first or second degree with force or violence or a drive-by shooting; or
(2) causes the death of a human being without intent to effect the death of any person, while intentionally inflicting or attempting to inflict bodily harm upon the victim, when the perpetrator is restrained under an order for protection and the victim is a person designated to receive protection under the order. As used in this clause, "order for protection" includes an order for protection issued under chapter 518B; a harassment restraining order issued under section 609.748; a court order setting conditions of pretrial release or conditions of a criminal sentence or juvenile court disposition; a restraining order issued in a marriage dissolution action; and any order issued by a court of another state or of the United States that is similar to any of these orders.

The second subdivision does not apply, OFTB. That section covers a subset of felony murder and a very particular crime for causing harm while violating a restraining order.

That's why I did not include it.

 

[Stainless]

I always thought unintentional murder was manslaughter. I’m not a lawyer, and I certainly don’t know Minnesota law. On top of that, I don’t really care about Derek Chauvin. He did what he did, he got what he got. Scumbag of a human being. **** that guy.

Yeah, that's what I guess I had always thought as well, but I can't claim to stay on top of criminal law. I pretty much share your sentiments regarding Chauvin, but I wouldn't claim to know him based upon his trial exposure. for all I know, he might be a hell of a guy. In this case, his actions seemed excessive and unnecessary to me, which has to say something about the kind of person he is.

From my reading of the statute, second degree unintentional murder means you cause someone's death during the act of committing a felony, even if you didn't intend to kill the person. The felony in this case according to the prosecution was assaulting George Floyd.

Unintentional murder seems like an easy sell in this case. I didn't even realize that was the charge until after the verdict.

 

[Stainless]

The second subdivision does not apply, OFTB. That section covers a subset of felony murder and a very particular crime for causing harm while violating a restraining order.

That's why I did not include it.

Was 2nd degree unintentional murder not one of the charges levied against Chauvin?

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

Yeah, that's what I guess I had always thought as well, but I can't claim to stay on top of criminal law. I pretty much share your sentiments regarding Chauvin, but I wouldn't claim to know him based upon his trial exposure. for all I know, he might be a hell of a guy. In this case, his actions seemed excessive and unnecessary to me, which has to say something about the kind of person he is.

Unintentional murder seems like an easy sell in this case. I didn't even realize that was the charge until after the verdict.

When you hear unintentional murder, it sounds like a no brainer. But when you read the actual law quoted above, Chauvin just doesn't fit the criteria. It seems to me this charge should not have even been allowed.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

Shapiro breaking down the charges

 

[Sarge]

For me, it came down to this; he kept has fat ******* knee on the guy’s neck for damn near four minutes AFTER fellow officers couldn’t find a pulse. Whatever you think of George Floyd, Chauvin’s duty is to protect and to serve. Regardless of whatever crimes Floyd may have committed or drugs he may have used, Chauvin had a duty to help that man. When fellow officers told him that Floyd had no pulse, Chauvin should have done everything he could to help Floyd. Guy might be a criminal junkie, but he’s still a human being. A little empathy and respect for the oath he swore to uphold probably saves Floyd and Chauvin. The cavalier way Chauvin acted sealed both of their fates. He has no one to blame but himself. As I said, **** that guy. He’s a scumbag.

 

[DBS1970]

I think the jury got it wrong but I respect their decision, The jurors are going to have to live with that decision. I think we will see an exodus of officers from the MPD.

 

[thesteelcity]

Exactly Sarge. I said the same thing to my friend tonight. After GF was unconscious and not moving, why continue to kneel on his neck? That's the part that got me. The officers could see he was basically out, on-lookers were telling him he was not moving and he continued to kneel on the man's neck. I don't know or really care what his intentions were, but the man died on the pavement under his knee with no medical attention. The jury had no choice, but to find him guilty. It was the right verdict.

 

[Phinnster]

Guilty on all three charges.

1. Guilty The second-degree unintentional murder charge alleged Chauvin caused Floyd's death "without intent" while committing or attempting to commit felony third-degree assault.

2. Guilty The third-degree murder charge alleged Chauvin caused Floyd's death by "perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life."

3. Guilty The second-degree manslaughter charge alleged Chauvin caused Floyd's death by "culpable negligence whereby the person creates an unreasonable risk, and consciously takes chances of causing death or great bodily harm."

Let us hope that George Floyd's death was not in vain and that this becomes a watershed moment in American history, whereby the justice system begins to truly work equally for all. Looking forward to further legislation on police reform on the local, state & federal level.

Also, I'm hopeful the judge will do the right thing and consider the extreme cruelty & utter lack of regard for human life on Chauvin's part and fully maximize the available jail sentence.

So glad they got this one right. We can all breathe a sigh of relief. A breath, sadly, that George Floyd is unable to take.

May George Floyd rest in peace and his family find some semblence of solace and comfort.

George Floyd was a career criminal and drug addict who robbed a pregnant woman by holding a gun to her stomach, only a complete scumbag would support someone so evil. I bet that woman popped some champagne the day he died knowing her and her newborn were now safe.

Unfortunately leftist clowns like you advocate for these criminals which is why innocent people die everyday. You couldn't pay me enough to be a cop in the current environment, I'm glad they're advocating for defunding the police, let the leftist scum kill each other, karma at its best.

BTW- a 7 year old innocent black girl was killed by 7 bullets a few days ago in Chicago, she was a million times more valuable than that waste of skin George Floyd. Maybe his ambulance chasing family who didn't give a flying **** about him til they saw the dollar signs will give that poor little girl a chunk of that 25 million they received but I highly doubt it,.

I suggest you get a life size poster of George Floyd to hang above your bed so you can jerk off to it everyday, you two worthless fucksticks deserve each other.

 

[Phinnster]

Exactly Sarge. I said the same thing to my friend tonight. After GF was unconscious and not moving, why continue to kneel on his neck? That's the part that got me. The officers could see he was basically out, on-lookers were telling him he was not moving and he continued to kneel on the man's neck. I don't know or really care what his intentions were, but the man died on the pavement under his knee with no medical attention. The jury had no choice, but to find him guilty. It was the right verdict.

Onlookers are irrelevant, they have no training in police procedures. Saying that, he was guilty of indifference for sure, no way did he get up that day wanting to kill a black man (contrary to the left wing cult media), but his arrogance and lack of care might've contributed to Floyd's death (though it's quite possible he would've died anyway from the drugs he consumed and swallowed). Chauvin should've been convicted on the lesser charge and sentenced to 5 years max.

 

[Steelr4evr]

Shapiro breaking down the charges

I can always rely on him for common sense evaluation.

The other charges aside from manslaughter are nothing more than angry mob appeasement.

Guilty of manslaughter for sure. Guilty of being a ****** human. Yep. Dereliction of duty.


The other charges? No way.


If I'm on a jury in that town and I have a family, I'm voting guilty no matter what. Only a hermit would not know the massive threat facing you and those close to you.

That's reality when you have torches& pitch forks waiting for you should you not appease the mob.

It is a nice lesson to show your children what the path of drugs and criminality will get you. It doesn't matter what race you are either. It's a road to nowhere and will surely end in your early departure from this planet.

Lifestyle choices are around 50% of our mortality rate.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Onlookers are irrelevant, they have no training in police procedures. Saying that, he was guilty of indifference for sure, no way did he get up that day wanting to kill a black man (contrary to the left wing cult media), but his arrogance and lack of care might've contributed to Floyd's death (though it's quite possible he would've died anyway from the drugs he consumed and swallowed). Chauvin should've been convicted on the lesser charge and sentenced to 5 years max.

That's my issue, they should have taken into consideration the fact that Floyd was going to be dead from a drug overdose within a half hour anyway.

 

[Tibs]

I suggest you get a life size poster of George Floyd to hang above your bed so you can jerk off to it everyday, you two worthless fucksticks deserve each other.

I suggest you go **** yourself.

Funny how this verdict has completely set-off so many on the right, with Tucker Carlson in the lead, along with the entirety of the deranged, right-wing propaganda media. I wonder why that is? Gee, have absolutely no idea, none at all.

Same goes for the inbred ******** here on the board like you, Phinnster. Great example of the dark, satanic forces at play with those on the right. The lack of humanity and empathy and the incessant hate and cruelty is what brings you all together. But really, beyond that it's just utter ignorance. Just being so ******* thick-skulled and stupid, that you buy into the fear, venom, lies & conspiracies that are dumped into your tiny brains. It's almost not fair, you don't stand a chance.

Thankfully, Americans of all walks of life and political persuations are banding together and rising up against bigots & extremists like you, and are countering the hatred, racism and bigotry with what you can't stand the most: love, compassion & empathy. The belief in a better version of America, one that is greater than the sum of its parts. Too bad you'll be left behind, rotting away in the stench of your bile.

 

[Sarge]

That's my issue, they should have taken into consideration the fact that Floyd was going to be dead from a drug overdose within a half hour anyway.

Depends on who you listen to. There were medical experts that weighed in that say that isn't necessarily true. I have seen nowhere where your assertion is universally accepted as fact. Regardless, it doesn't give police the right to treat people that way.