Rudolph vs Pickett

[Superman]

Any chance that the Vols stumble and this kid drops to the 2nd? Definitely like his game. Just another reason why we shouldn't have reached this year.

We are probably set on taking a OL/DL in the first round (which is probably the right move)- but a 2nd round QB could be an option if Pickett looks iffy...

why would we want to take a QB in the 2nd next year? Build around Pickett. OL/DL in the 1-2-3 rounds

Pickett doesnt look "iffy" at all. Hooker and Pickett have remarkably similar games. They're also the same age. Both are accurate, can read defenses and are mobile. No reason to take Hooker in the 2nd next year.

 

[slashsteel]

why would we want to take a QB in the 2nd next year? Build around Pickett. OL/DL in the 1-2-3 rounds

Pickett doesn't look "iffy" at all. Hooker and Pickett have remarkably similar games. They're also the same age. Both are accurate, can read defenses and are mobile. No reason to take Hooker in the 2nd next year.

Depends on what the hooker looks like...


Oh the player...

Nevermind.

 

[livingthrudying]

To be fair Kenny is a short body of work, stats aren't going to paint an accurate assessment until end of season 1.

You are debating an unknown what they are going through with KP to a known what the have had plenty of time to see with Rudolph.

That is what the coaches are looking at nothing less nothing more.

I have an autographed Rudy pic if you would like it. I am sure you could find a spot somewhere to hang it after you get it framed

The real question for him is will he still be a steeler fan when Rudolph leaves after this season. What if Rudolph goes to the Ravens or the Browns. Could he still love the steelers and Rudolph? would he feel betrayed by the love of his life if that happened? Could their relationship survive the betrayal and find trust again? Enquiring minds want to know! LOL

 

[FordFairLane]

I was looking at Allen's rookie year. Similar average yards. More INTs than TDs. Pickett still has a chance to end on a similar TD/INT outcome.

Here is the thing sure he probably won't be BigBen but way too early to put a ceiling on the kid. I am not sure what his likelihood outcome is. He could be a pro bowler or a low end starter. My gut is he won't bust and that his potential won't be reached with Canada. But he has shown flashes of every scenerio. The flashes of accuracy and being able to move the ball down the field bodes well in the grand scheme. His mobility will be an asset, just the decision making is my question mark. I really think that will improve if not later in this season, but the next.

In the meantime fans shouldn't bridge jump without the bungee. There will be losses. Good and plenty.

Dude. No. Just no. Josh Allen is a physical freak. 84th percentile height, 92nd weight, 86th wingspan, 86th arm length, 87th hand size, 67th 40 yard, 75th vertical, 87th broad jump, 87th 3-cone and 99th in arm strength.
I had hoped he’d start off like Joe Burrow or even Derek Carr. Not going to happen. Those two are similar size and athleticism wise to KP. My worry is he’s started off more like Jimmy Clausen than either of the 2 before mentioned.

 

[jitter77]

So do you guys think any QB would be successful in this offense? The defense has to only worry about 1/3 of the field until the game is basically out of hand or desperation time. People say the routes are there, but they are not especially if you look at Pickens route tree. There are no slants / seam routes. I saw an article where Trai Essex was bashing the play calling as well especially the 16yrd hook route to DJ. That is a very hard throw normally, but the defense was playing back and could read Pickett from the get go.

 

[Bigappleyinzer]

Yea the Josh Allen comparisons are disingenuous.

J.Allen was known as a project with ELITE arm strength, and above-average athleticism for a kid his size.

He also only had 26 starts at a mid-major and was coming in at 22. Pickett had 49 starts in the ACC, and is coming into the league at 24.

I have no doubt that Pickett will improve, but he is MUCH closer to a finished product than Josh Allen was at a rookie.

 

[livingthrudying]

So do you guys think any QB would be successful in this offense? The defense has to only worry about 1/3 of the field until the game is basically out of hand or desperation time. People say the routes are there, but they are not especially if you look at Pickens route tree. There are no slants / seam routes. I saw an article where Trai Essex was bashing the play calling as well especially the 16yrd hook route to DJ. That is a very hard throw normally, but the defense was playing back and could read Pickett from the get go.

Nobody would succeed in this offense. The defense has a 50/50 chance of knowing exactly where the ball is going just about every pass. Left sideline or right sideline. Talk about spotting the other team and handicapping yourself.

 

[slashsteel]

Dude. No. Just no. Josh Allen is a physical freak. 84th percentile height, 92nd weight, 86th wingspan, 86th arm length, 87th hand size, 67th 40 yard, 75th vertical, 87th broad jump, 87th 3-cone and 99th in arm strength.
I had hoped he’d start off like Joe Burrow or even Derek Carr. Not going to happen. Those two are similar size and athleticism wise to KP. My worry is he’s started off more like Jimmy Clausen than either of the 2 before mentioned.

Burrow wouldn't be a bad end if that came about. Allen is more like Big Ben I would think that might be a stretch but I just was looking at his start.

It isn't how he starts it is how he develops and ultimately finishes.

Of course those early interceptions aren't attractive. But one was a Hail Mary the other off a fall down. One can be blamed on a WR. So that is three off the tally.

I thought his worst one was at the end of the game. On the run not putting it where only a WR had a shot at it. Read that he thought DJ would circle back but still a bad decision.

What I want to see is improvement as the season carries on. He has shown yardage capability, drive capability, tight windows capable, accuracy capability, 4th down over the middle capability. Running capability. Standing in the pocket and delivering under intense rush capability. If you look at all avenues there is some things there to like.

 

[FordFairLane]

To be fair Kenny is a short body of work, stats aren't going to paint an accurate assessment until end of season 1.

You are debating an unknown what they are going through with KP to a known what the have had plenty of time to see with Rudolph.

That is what the coaches are looking at nothing less nothing more.

I have an autographed Rudy pic if you would like it. I am sure you could find a spot somewhere to hang it after you get it framed

My whole point is Rudolph in a short body of work was unfairly ridiculed. People seem to have forgotten but Roethlisberger in 2019 started off 0-2 going 35/62 for 351 and 0/1. That was not a very good offensive team. I really don’t care about the naïve fan base that wears their rose colored glasses about Pickett. I’m a realist. Realistically speaking we don’t have our future QB on the roster right now. Sorry to burst everyone’s bubble but that’s a 60% chance. And that’s for all of the first round. If you look at QB’s taken from 16-32 here it is.
2022 #20- Pickett
2020 #26- Jordan Love
2018- #32- Lamar Jackson
2016- #26- Paxton Lynch
2014- #22- Johnny Manziel
2013- #17- EJ Manuel
2012- #22- Brandon Weeden
2010- #25- Tim Tebow
2009- #17- Josh Freeman
2008- #18- Joe Flacco
2007- #22- Brady Quinn
2005- #24- Aaron Rodgers
2005- #25- Jason Campbell
2004- #22- JP Losman
2003- #19- Kyle Boller
2003- #22- Rex Grossman
2002- #32- Patrick Ramsey

So that’s 3/17 or 17.6% of the QB’s taken that did something and 1 future hall of famer. That’s reality folks.

 

[FordFairLane]

Burrow wouldn't be a bad end if that came about. Allen is more like Big Ben I would think that might be a stretch but I just was looking at his start.

It isn't how he starts it is how he develops and ultimately finishes.

Of course those early interceptions aren't attractive. But one was a Hail Mary the other off a fall down. One can be blamed on a WR. So that is three off the tally.

I thought his worst one was at the end of the game. On the run not putting it where only a WR had a shot at it. Read that he thought DJ would circle back but still a bad decision.

What I want to see is improvement as the season carries on. He has shown yardage capability, drive capability, tight windows capable, accuracy capability, 4th down over the middle capability. Running capability. Standing in the pocket and delivering under intense rush capability. If you look at all avenues there is some things there to like.

I’m not giving up on him. I know it’s not how you start it’s how you finish. But more times than not how you start is a good indication of how you finish.

 

[FordFairLane]

So do you guys think any QB would be successful in this offense? The defense has to only worry about 1/3 of the field until the game is basically out of hand or desperation time. People say the routes are there, but they are not especially if you look at Pickens route tree. There are no slants / seam routes. I saw an article where Trai Essex was bashing the play calling as well especially the 16yrd hook route to DJ. That is a very hard throw normally, but the defense was playing back and could read Pickett from the get go.

This argument is trite. Arians, Haley, Fichtner and now Canada. I won’t dignify this argument unless it’s a direct indictment of Tomlin at this point.

 

[slashsteel]

I’m not giving up on him. I know it’s not how you start it’s how you finish. But more times than not how you start is a good indication of how you finish.

Aikman, Manning, Elway, Gannon,Young, Allen, Daniel Jones (who is coming on now) all less than impressive rookie seasons. I think there is enough of both flops and shaky starts to really not get a decide on Kenny. Just ultimately a wait and see. If I had to choose the direction of the pendulum I think it would be tilting up. Which is strictly an opinion.

 

[slashsteel]

My whole point is Rudolph in a short body of work was unfairly ridiculed. People seem to have forgotten but Roethlisberger in 2019 started off 0-2 going 35/62 for 351 and 0/1. That was not a very good offensive team. I really don’t care about the naïve fan base that wears their rose colored glasses about Pickett. I’m a realist. Realistically speaking we don’t have our future QB on the roster right now. Sorry to burst everyone’s bubble but that’s a 60% chance. And that’s for all of the first round. If you look at QB’s taken from 16-32 here it is.
2022 #20- Pickett
2020 #26- Jordan Love
2018- #32- Lamar Jackson
2016- #26- Paxton Lynch
2014- #22- Johnny Manziel
2013- #17- EJ Manuel
2012- #22- Brandon Weeden
2010- #25- Tim Tebow
2009- #17- Josh Freeman
2008- #18- Joe Flacco
2007- #22- Brady Quinn
2005- #24- Aaron Rodgers
2005- #25- Jason Campbell
2004- #22- JP Losman
2003- #19- Kyle Boller
2003- #22- Rex Grossman
2002- #32- Patrick Ramsey

So that’s 3/17 or 17.6% of the QB’s taken that did something and 1 future hall of famer. That’s reality folks.

That is your opinion not sure it is fact. Unless you are Nostradamus.

 

[Gildong Sack]

Nah, man it’s a 100% fact that receivers are 75% more important than o-line and RB is 62% more important

Nice mathematification...you win.

 

[Bigappleyinzer]

If you take a look at this thread, you have:

• Maybe one person calling Pickett a bust
• Three or four posters that are critical of him, but agree that more time is needed for an assessment (Ford, Berm, myself)

EVERYONE else is basically defending Pickett, offering excuses, etc. "We definitely have our QB of the future", "You can already tell he has elite intangibles".

The point is, the odds are already very long when searching for a franchise QB. And his performance so far (QB Rating of 65) does very little to alleviate those probabilities.

 

[paperclip]

lots of facts on page 4

 

[FordFairLane]

Aikman, Manning, Elway, Gannon,Young, Allen, Daniel Jones (who is coming on now) all less than impressive rookie seasons. I think there is enough of both flops and shaky starts to really not get a decide on Kenny. Just ultimately a wait and see. If I had to choose the direction of the pendulum I think it would be tilting up. Which is strictly an opinion.

Might as well throw in Len Dawson and Johnny Unitas. Lets look a little closer to todays NFL. Colleges aren't running the wishbone offense anymore. These kids come from pro style offenses. Heck, some colleges run a more pro style offense than lots of NFL teams (us included.)
Daniel Jones has throw 6 TD's in 7 games. In fact this is his lowest yards a game in his career. The difference is defense and the running game. He is still the same QB just less pressure on him and he is being asked to manage the game and not make mistakes. Which he has done. But I truly hope KP ends up better than that.

 

[FordFairLane]

That is your opinion not sure it is fact. Unless you are Nostradamus.

Those are literal facts. Not opinions. Facts.

 

[FordFairLane]

If you take a look at this thread, you have:

• Maybe one person calling Pickett a bust
• Three or four posters that are critical of him, but agree that more time is needed for an assessment (Ford, Berm, myself)

EVERYONE else is basically defending Pickett, offering excuses, etc. "We definitely have our QB of the future", "You can already tell he has elite intangibles".

The point is, the odds are already very long when searching for a franchise QB. And his performance so far (QB Rating of 65) does very little to alleviate those probabilities.

Ding Ding Ding. Exactly. I am a fact and stats guy. I can hope all I want but I am a realist. I hope like hell KP is the guy because if he isn't it sets us back 3 years. That is another fact. The other fact no one likes to admit is Mason Rudolph started off way better than KP. That doesn't mean KP won't be better than Rudolph but it also isn't a good indication of where he ends up.

 

[jitter77]

Stats can be manipulated however you want in alot of cases and mason had a different team. I am definitely not a fan of Mason and it is too early to tell about pickett. If you watch them both play Pickett looks much more poised and athletic. If you watch masons highlight tds you can see how open the WRs were compared to now.

 

[Steelr4evr]

Nobody would succeed in this offense. The defense has a 50/50 chance of knowing exactly where the ball is going just about every pass. Left sideline or right sideline. Talk about spotting the other team and handicapping yourself.

Easy like Sunday morning. Anyone with an ounce of brains knows
this. Nothing has really changed much in 3-4 years with the offense actually regressing the last 2 years.

Anyone who's watched the Steelers the last two seasons could write out the plays.

What's truly killed any chance of success in the passing game is they have a joke of a running game. Play up tight on the short passing game and you're golden.

 

[Punxsutawney]

Bingo!!!

Kenny can do no wrong. Even though it took him 5 years to be the man at Pitt.

No need to cry over the spilt spilt milk now...

If I'm Omar Khan, I'm drafting a franchise QB in April with the 4th overall pick. Then grabbing multiple OL players the next 4 picks.

They're NOT drafting a QB next year unless Pickett completely falls apart and shows no progress throughout the season.

Plus, you know damned this terrible team is going to find some ******* way to win enough games to end up picking in the middle of the draf like they always do.

 

[FordFairLane]

Stats can be manipulated however you want in alot of cases and mason had a different team. I am definitely not a fan of Mason and it is too early to tell about pickett. If you watch them both play Pickett looks much more poised and athletic. If you watch masons highlight tds you can see how open the WRs were compared to now.

That is just another poor excuse. I showed the first 130 attempts from Rudolph and the first 127 from Pickett. Those are hard numbers, not opinions.

 

[slashsteel]

Might as well throw in Len Dawson and Johnny Unitas. Lets look a little closer to todays NFL. Colleges aren't running the wishbone offense anymore. These kids come from pro style offenses. Heck, some colleges run a more pro style offense than lots of NFL teams (us included.)
Daniel Jones has throw 6 TD's in 7 games. In fact this is his lowest yards a game in his career. The difference is defense and the running game. He is still the same QB just less pressure on him and he is being asked to manage the game and not make mistakes. Which he has done. But I truly hope KP ends up better than that.

Of course. But he is still guiding his teams to wins. Which is what I want for our team wins. I think KP has enough upside to do that when he shakes of the rookie issues. Allen was included in that list and we have went over that.

I think we will revisit this thread come end season and see if your strong opinions fade.

 

[FordFairLane]

Of course. But he is still guiding his teams to wins. Which is what I want for our team wins. I think KP has enough upside to do that when he shakes of the rookie issues. Allen was included in that list and we have went over that.

I think we will revisit this thread come end season and see if your strong opinions fade.

His only Win Trubisky had to pull his *** out of the fire. We had chances to win against the Jets and Miami he couldn’t get it done. I don’t blame him for the Bills. I mean our offense sucked but their offense is a buzz saw with the best QB in the league.

We can definitely revisit. You’ll probably try to find hard where I blasted Pickett but perhaps look again. I gave him credit where credit is due. But he’s all potential at this point but he was supposed to be the most pro ready qb in the draft. I personally haven’t seen a pro ready qb yet.

The only way to go is up. I think after the by week is where we’d see a jump. I think the defense gets TJ back and probably Canada is gone before then.

Lets hope he ends the season on a high note.