Something I noticed in LA game

[Greg Lloyd]

I realize our OL isn't the best, that's no secret. I also am aware that Canada's playbook is simplistic, uncreative and doesn't seem to get receivers all that open. But those things being said, have you ever noticed Kenny's propensity to not seem to find "where to go with the ball" upon initial drop back?

I'm not sure what the %'s are but it sure seems like 90% of the time, when he drops back to pass, he takes a quick look and then has to "reboot" the play and look for someone to be open. I know every QB does this, as often times upon immediate scanning of the field, there is no one open. But it seems extra numerous in Kenny's case. There was ONE play I noticed where Kenny dropped back, took a look and immediately delivered the ball to an open receiver. And I said, "There you go, that makes things easier."

So, that brings me to the question of "why?" Why, in so many cases, does upon Kenny's initial drop back, that there isn't anywhere to go with the ball, forcing him to have to reboot, usually leading to bad things, such as arrant balls, incompletions or worse. This is a real question. Is it because the plays are so poor that no one is ever open initially? Or is it because Kenny is too picky, or weak-armed to stick the ball into spaces that are just not occurring in the NFL game?

Whatever the cause, this must be fixed, if Kenny is to become the quality QB we all hope he can become. It goes so much "easier" when it goes as simple as "hike, take a look for a second, deliver the ball on target" as opposed to "hike, don't see anything, reboot, run to the right and pray something develops." Any thoughts?

 

[slashsteel]

We have talked about this in previous threads. There is myriad of reasons. But scheme and playcalling reign supreme. Mixed in with Kenny having little time to throw and also getting happy feet and sometimes drifting into pressure. He is still learning on the job as well. I think his arm is good enough. Sometimes his accuracy is spotty too. That improved in this last matchup hopefully that will continue to improve moving forward.

 

[Steelr4evr]

Ok Bob

 

[Steelr4evr]

 

[HCK]

Scheme and Canada's use of the route tree (or lack thereof) is a major cause and one that should concern CMT. It hasn't improved and has always been an issue with this clown. He has been drug thru the mud at every stop he's been to. Send him his final paycheck and get him gone! Heck there is an OC already on staff (Mike Sullivan) that can be a replacement.

 

[Litos]

if 80% of the playcalls' first look is a 2 yards pass to the sideline and they are covering underneath there's not much chance for hike, dropback and let it fly

 

[Ron Burgundy]

I realize our OL isn't the best, that's no secret. I also am aware that Canada's playbook is simplistic, uncreative and doesn't seem to get receivers all that open. But those things being said, have you ever noticed Kenny's propensity to not seem to find "where to go with the ball" upon initial drop back?

I'm not sure what the %'s are but it sure seems like 90% of the time, when he drops back to pass, he takes a quick look and then has to "reboot" the play and look for someone to be open. I know every QB does this, as often times upon immediate scanning of the field, there is no one open. But it seems extra numerous in Kenny's case. There was ONE play I noticed where Kenny dropped back, took a look and immediately delivered the ball to an open receiver. And I said, "There you go, that makes things easier."

So, that brings me to the question of "why?" Why, in so many cases, does upon Kenny's initial drop back, that there isn't anywhere to go with the ball, forcing him to have to reboot, usually leading to bad things, such as arrant balls, incompletions or worse. This is a real question. Is it because the plays are so poor that no one is ever open initially? Or is it because Kenny is too picky, or weak-armed to stick the ball into spaces that are just not occurring in the NFL game?

Whatever the cause, this must be fixed, if Kenny is to become the quality QB we all hope he can become. It goes so much "easier" when it goes as simple as "hike, take a look for a second, deliver the ball on target" as opposed to "hike, don't see anything, reboot, run to the right and pray something develops." Any thoughts?

As was mentioned on the radio today, it seems like everyone Mahomes throws to is open.

 

[stillwright]

Kenny was like 17 of 25 on this past Sunday......so there is that. No?

 

[SteelerSask2]

I don't think the route concepts get anyone very open. I also don't think KP has the experience or freedom to make many sight adjustments. So if the call is bad it's trouble.

 

[ZonaBurgh]

As was mentioned on the radio today, it seems like everyone Mahomes throws to is open.

This! Watch really any of the Steelers opponents and their receivers are usually always uncontested, ours not so much.

Still say scheme and coaching more than KP.

 

[SteelerSask2]

Watch concepts in MNF game. Watch what Steelers are doing. Tell me it's KPs fault.

 

[Drink IRON City]

Scheme and Canada's use of the route tree (or lack thereof) is a major cause and one that should concern CMT. It hasn't improved and has always been an issue with this clown. He has been drug thru the mud at every stop he's been to. Send him his final paycheck and get him gone! Heck there is an OC already on staff (Mike Sullivan) that can be a replacement.

I thought I herd / read it that Sullivan isn’t the answer either as he has even less play calling experience. I do think he would do slightly better but also that he would be stuck with this scheme for the rest of season. Possibly a small wrinkle here and there, but NO a significant changes.


Salute the nation

 

[Ron Burgundy]

This! Watch really any of the Steelers opponents and their receivers are usually always uncontested, ours not so much.

Still say scheme and coaching more than KP.

If Shades has his way, after the season Plan A is give Duh a new contract and Plan B is promote Sullivan. Tellin ya, Shades does not like to have to hire new people.

 

[Confluence]

I thought I herd / read it that Sullivan isn’t the answer either as he has even less play calling experience. I do think he would do slightly better but also that he would be stuck with this scheme for the rest of season. Possibly a small wrinkle here and there, but NO a significant changes.


Salute the nation

There are at least 20 guys here, posting regularly, that could call plays better with 30 days to get ready for the season.

 

[jitter77]

I thought I herd / read it that Sullivan isn’t the answer either as he has even less play calling experience. I do think he would do slightly better but also that he would be stuck with this scheme for the rest of season. Possibly a small wrinkle here and there, but NO a significant changes.


Salute the nation

The 4th quarter proved the plays are there just need someone to call them.

 

[HCK]

I thought I herd / read it that Sullivan isn’t the answer either as he has even less play calling experience. I do think he would do slightly better but also that he would be stuck with this scheme for the rest of season. Possibly a small wrinkle here and there, but NO a significant changes.


Salute the nation

You are probably right, but at some point a different voice has to be put in place at least. This is getting ridiculous.

 

[Steeltime]

Steelers offensive concept does not call for Pickett to throw the ball before the receiver breaks to the spot. It just doesn't. Instead, the Cana-DUH scheme is for the receiver to run to the spot, turn around and wait for Kenny to deliver the pass.

The very few exceptions are those plays where Diontae makes an uncontested catch running an out and is hit on the dead run, or Pickens is hit on a slant. For some reason that I cannot and will never be able to fathom, Cana-DUH simply refuses to throw those concepts more than 2-3x per game. I'm sure it's because he is such an offensive genius, it's just that us simple fans and every defense in the NFL fails to recognize that obvious fact.

 

[Greg Lloyd]

This! Watch really any of the Steelers opponents and their receivers are usually always uncontested, ours not so much.

Still say scheme and coaching more than KP.

It may be, that's why I asked. But it is getting really obvious. He almost never just drops back and delivers the ball, and it would sure be helpful if he could. 90% of the time he has to reboot and that brings trouble.

 

[Aussie_Steeler]

There are at least 20 guys here, posting regularly, that could call plays better with 30 days to get ready for the season.

I think there's 11 guys wearing black and gold on the field that could call the plays better.

 

[steelreeling]

Steelers offensive concept does not call for Pickett to throw the ball before the receiver breaks to the spot. It just doesn't. Instead, the Cana-DUH scheme is for the receiver to run to the spot, turn around and wait for Kenny to deliver the pass.

The very few exceptions are those plays where Diontae makes an uncontested catch running an out and is hit on the dead run, or Pickens is hit on a slant. For some reason that I cannot and will never be able to fathom, Cana-DUH simply refuses to throw those concepts more than 2-3x per game. I'm sure it's because he is such an offensive genius, it's just that us simple fans and every defense in the NFL fails to recognize that obvious fact.

lol. Kenny could throw with it anticipation. But given the calls as you mentioned, i don't think it would help.

The biggest problem is the coaching staff not understanding that you need to call what your players do the best.

Any route(s) can be called anywhere on the field and if the defense is in close to an acceptable coverage - the pass has a high degree of being unsuccessful.
Take for example the Tampa 2 call. The D is giving up the short middle of the field & giving a mismatch in the deep middle with the LBer.
If Canada calls a Go for X, a post for the Z, a stick for the Y & a middle safety-valve for the RB - one would think the post or the safety-valve HAS to work b/c they can't cover every area. Wrong.
You see the ILB carrying deep and then he turns in today's NFL and runs downhill fast-as-F and wipes out the RB after like, 2 yards. The post route gets carried by that side's nickle/dime backer and gets contested even thought the look is "middle-field open" and the break is at the edge of the backer's zone.

You had 2 guys running routes into (theoretically) holes in the coverage. What to do?

Well OC's now work with "concepts". Is one of your guys a Tasmanian Devil in the first 25 yards? Is one of your guys an Andean Condor with wingspan? Which one of your TEs has Najeh Davenport genetics? Which WR of yours ran USATF last spring?

How do you use these skills for a "concept"? Okay, how about run a "flood concept" against coverages where you get the safety/ nickel to follow (or bracket) your tall or speedy X on a deep clear/ corner/whatever... while you run the Y right underneath and behind that route on a Drive or a Dig route?

If you can get it to Z in stride, you have punt-return right.

 

[Stewey]

I think there's 11 guys wearing black and gold on the field that could call the plays better.

I'd like for KP to call his own plays.

But that might not bode well because then he'd be the target of complaints and criticisms from his skill player teammates for not getting enough touches.

Or maybe in the huddle have every player take turns calling the play.... but that could result in the skill players always calling their own number no matter what the situation.

Or how about every player taking turns calling the play, but then have an open debate and a vote...but that could result in too many delay of game penalties.

Or how about everyone in the huddle take turns pulling the play out of a hat. That would still get better results than Canada's play calling.
But what to do with the hat?

Or how about firing Canada.
Now that's what you would call a stretch.

 

[HCK]

Steelers offensive concept does not call for Pickett to throw the ball before the receiver breaks to the spot. It just doesn't. Instead, the Cana-DUH scheme is for the receiver to run to the spot, turn around and wait for Kenny to deliver the pass.

The very few exceptions are those plays where Diontae makes an uncontested catch running an out and is hit on the dead run, or Pickens is hit on a slant. For some reason that I cannot and will never be able to fathom, Cana-DUH simply refuses to throw those concepts more than 2-3x per game. I'm sure it's because he is such an offensive genius, it's just that us simple fans and every defense in the NFL fails to recognize that obvious fact.

BULLSEYE! You're 100% correct, at this stage in his career Pickett does not have the in-game experience nor has he been developed to anticipate the throws and timing to run DUH's plays more efficient that the play designer's lack of imagination and cognitive evolution. DUH neeeeeedsss to GO!

 

[Steelerfan81]

Ok Bob

This isn't Bob. No matching IPs. Emailed me from a normal email.

 

[BLITZ]

It may be, that's why I asked. But it is getting really obvious. He almost never just drops back and delivers the ball, and it would sure be helpful if he could. 90% of the time he has to reboot and that brings trouble.

Cant just drop back and deliver if the receiver is not open. I guess he could, but he would be delivering to the wrong color jersey

 

[ZonaBurgh]

I'd like for KP to call his own plays.

But that might not bode well because then he'd be the target of complaints and criticisms from his skill player teammates for not getting enough touches.

Or maybe in the huddle have every player take turns calling the play.... but that could result in the skill players always calling their own number no matter what the situation.

Or how about every player taking turns calling the play, but then have an open debate and a vote...but that could result in too many delay of game penalties.

Or how about everyone in the huddle take turns pulling the play out of a hat. That would still get better results than Canada's play calling.
But what to do with the hat?

Or how about firing Canada.
Now that's what you would call a stretch.

How about using a Magic 8 Ball?