Would the 4-3 be worse?

[steelreeling]

If the defensive lineman suck so bad, they cannot control 2 gaps, they cannot stop the run, they cannot rush the passer, why not simplify **** and go to a 1 gap-watered down 4-3 front.

Do we not have more speedy linebackers now? How much worse could these guys play in the 4-3? What do you believe the implications would be for the defensive backs then?

 

[Supersteeler]

You may have a point especially because we don't have a big immovable NT to anchor it, which is what the whole defense is based on. I suppose their is hope for McCullers to develop into that but I don't think they can afford to bet the farm on it.

 

[keslerclan]

I am sure some will agree that THIS has been the plan all along. The ONLY reasonable explanation is that Tomlin has thought Lebeau would retire sooner and has drafted players to fit his scheme.

At this point, it wouldn't be out of the question to see it as soon as next season.

Our DL front would still need a legit pass rushing DE on the right side (which we do not currently employ, IMO)

We could have a decent DL front with Tuitt, McLendon, Heyward and ??? Or maybe even go with Tuitt, McCullers, McLendon and Heyward at RDE.

The LBs should be easier to figure out with Spence at WLB, Timmons at MLB and Shazier at SLB. I would consider switching Timmons with Spence or even putting Williams at MLB and trading Timmons and his salary away in an effort to free up some $. Timmons could play any of the 3 positions BUT not at a level commensurate with his salary, IMO.

We still have problems in our DB but a healthy Thomas would be a better SS than Troy (since he is a LB). We just have to get some help at CB.

We just do not have the pieces to get to the QB from our edges now BUT most of our DL are more 'upfield' kinda players, IMO.

 

[SteelerFan448]

There are players to fit this system, but you still lack defensive ends to rush the quarterback and you'd completely give up on Jarvis, who does not fit at all in a 4-3.

 

[JJ_Steel]

Jarvis does not fit in a 3-4 either

 

[Penguins&Steelers]

I am sure some will agree that THIS has been the plan all along. The ONLY reasonable explanation is that Tomlin has thought Lebeau would retire sooner and has drafted players to fit his scheme.

At this point, it wouldn't be out of the question to see it as soon as next season.

Our DL front would still need a legit pass rushing DE on the right side (which we do not currently employ, IMO)

We could have a decent DL front with Tuitt, McLendon, Heyward and ??? Or maybe even go with Tuitt, McCullers, McLendon and Heyward at RDE.

The LBs should be easier to figure out with Spence at WLB, Timmons at MLB and Shazier at SLB. I would consider switching Timmons with Spence or even putting Williams at MLB and trading Timmons and his salary away in an effort to free up some $. Timmons could play any of the 3 positions BUT not at a level commensurate with his salary, IMO.

We still have problems in our DB but a healthy Thomas would be a better SS than Troy (since he is a LB). We just have to get some help at CB.

We just do not have the pieces to get to the QB from our edges now BUT most of our DL are more 'upfield' kinda players, IMO.

Where is Jarvis?

 

[keslerclan]

Mayock had projected Jarvis to be his top 'Sam' LB for the 4-3. Not saying I agree with it but I don't think he is strong enough to be a force at ROLB in the 3-4.

 

[CharlesDavenport]

If the defensive lineman suck so bad, they cannot control 2 gaps, they cannot stop the run, they cannot rush the passer, why not simplify **** and go to a 1 gap-watered down 4-3 front.

Do we not have more speedy linebackers now? How much worse could these guys play in the 4-3? What do you believe the implications would be for the defensive backs then?

Not any worse.

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

I think Jarvis needs to play ILB in a 3-4. I don't see him ever being a good enough pass rusher for OLB. In a few years, i think he will be next to Shazier inside.

 

[keslerclan]

You're probably right tape BUT he would be filling for the departed Timmons in a 3-4. Timmons was drafted to play OLB and moved inside due to his inability to be effective on the outside. Jones would be no different in this regard.

Guess I don't need to say that BOTH picks at this point would seem like a backwards way of taking 1st rounders.

 

[Spike]

With the stiffs we have playing on the DL?

ha ha

a front 4 has to be able to create a pass rush on their own!

 

[tapeANaspirin2it]

You're probably right tape BUT he would be filling for the departed Timmons in a 3-4. Timmons was drafted to play OLB and moved inside due to his inability to be effective on the outside. Jones would be no different in this regard.

Guess I don't need to say that BOTH picks at this point would seem like a backwards way of taking 1st rounders.

After 2015, i think Timmons and Jarvis will have close to the same guaranteed money left on their deals. If Jarvis shows he can play ILB, they may be able to get him signed for relatively cheap. If Shazier is the impact player we hope, then the steelers won't need an expensive player next to him. They could probably get by with a 2 down Vince Williams type thumper.

 

[keslerclan]

Without going after Justin Houston for 2015, I think the 3-4 is going to be replaced w the 4-3. We simply cannot keep up w the outside zone playing the way we have on the edges.

While Spike may have a point about pressure from the DL, Tuitt had nearly 20 sacks in his last 2 years at ND and Heyward was also adept at getting pressure at OSU. McLendon is a perfect compliment inside to McCullers in that all he has to do is get 'push' which both he and McCullers seem capable of.

Right now, neither can get 'push' moving laterally like what is required in a 3-4 against a 'stretch zone'. Our ILBs and our proxy ILB (Troy) are 'baited' into lanes allowing cut-back runs which leave only the FS to make the play. This didn't work when we HAD Casey at NT and won't work better now. Foote and Farrior were much better at maintaining their depth against the 'stretch' and 'counters' so they wouldn't get swallowed up.

Truth is, either by 'design' or bad luck, we are better suited for a 4-3 front. Jones could possibly be a Sam but we are ok w Timmons/Williams in the middle. That leaves Shazier our Will. I like it better with either Timmons or Spence at Will (Timmons is a better follower than a signal caller) with Williams(2-downs) and Spence in the middle and Shazier on the Sam. (I suppose we could try Jones at Sam with Shazier in the middle too)

Look at the Bengals 4-3...who do they have really? Geno is a beast in the middle but elsewhere they seem comparable to me:

Dunlap, Peko, Adkins, Gilberry...for us it would be Tuitt, McCullers, McLendon, Heyward

Burfict, Maualuga, Lamur...for us it would be Timmons, Williams/Spence, Shazier

Here is where we need help:

Hall, Iloka, Nelson, Newman...for us it would be Allen, Thomas, Mitchell, Gay (while Allen 'could' turn things around, he's not on Hall's level. Gay could probably 'hang' w Newman, IMO.

If we went into the off-season with a design on going w the 4-3, we still need a competent CB and another 'rush' DE. I think Heyward could do it as well as most but we need a back-up for both sides. (although Josh Mauro was a good DE in college with sacks/TFLs) We also would have our experimental Nick Williams, who looks to be a better fit for a 4-3 DT as well.

 

[Slaine]

The issue is depth. While we could patch together a 4-3 line we can't actually run it for a season without a decent rotation.

 

[Superman]

You're probably right tape BUT he would be filling for the departed Timmons in a 3-4. Timmons was drafted to play OLB and moved inside due to his inability to be effective on the outside. Jones would be no different in this regard.

Guess I don't need to say that BOTH picks at this point would seem like a backwards way of taking 1st rounders.

Timmons was moved inside due to the emergence of Deebo.
I dont see why this is still an issue for people.

 

[TDX27]

Either way, McCullers needs to dress this week and get some snaps. At this point, there is no reason to keep him or Bryant from dressing and playing. The BS we always say about them needing to also play special teams is just that - BS.

 

[kev4heels]

Timmons was moved inside due to the emergence of Deebo.
I dont see why this is still an issue for people.

That and the fact that Timmons was terrible at OLB.

 

[Vader]

They've been drafting 4-3 type players for years. Might as well use them in it. The problem is they don't have enough DL to do it.

 

[wig]

What's sad is that it makes me angry to imagine that the FO may have been neutering the defense over the last few years expecting Dick to retire while slowly giving him more and more substandard players to meet his scheme. If that truly is the case (as it sort of appears to be,) it means that both the FO and Lebeau have stubbornly refused to do what's best for the team currently in hopes of putting the team in a slightly stronger position in an unsure and distant future. The longer Dick waits to retire, the longer these utterly mismatched and seemingly crappy players string out their initial contracts and erode a once decent defense.

One could make a case for Lebeau saying "F.U." to the front office for consistently giving him **** by remaining and putting together a 3-4 made up of undersized and dramatically overmatched players just to demonstrate to the coaching and GM staff how ****** their player acquisition skills are. (If a fella were a conspiracy theorist... ; - )

 

[bigtwnvin]

Hate to drag up "ancient history" but Greenwood, Green, Holmes and White as a front four shut down runs and disrupted pass plays by manhandling O Linemen and literally pushing them into QB's. The personnel presently on the D Line are not that caliber of physical player. In short they are gutless *******.

 

[Superman]

at this point, I'd consider going with the best 7 of our DL and LBs
Heyward, Timmons and Shazier are locks
Tuitt is fringe, but is a rookie. so he'd start.
McCullers is a rookie, but is ******* huge. Talented, raw. Start.

Those are five I'd start and deal with growing pains from Tuitt and McCullers.

from the next group?
Worilds, Moats, Deebo, McClendon, Thomas, Keisel, Spence

Worilds is paid a lot of money. we're not seeing much in ROI, though, obviously.

I believe the best scenario for us is:
Timmons, Shazier, Worilds
Heyward, McCullers, Thomas, Tuitt

at the least, it'd give us some road blocks in the middle

Heyward and Tuitt, imo, can be interchanged in 3-4 and 4-3

When Timmons was at fsu giving Tomlin hardons, he was a OLB in the 4-3.

just a suggestion

 

[keslerclan]

I don't think our defenders are 'gifted' enough to make a switch mid-season. (this year) Hell, they have problems now running out of the 3-4 w assignments. It would be a nightmare, IMO.

Moving into next season though, we could pull it off.

Tuitt-LDE, McLendon-DT, McCullers-DT, Heyward-RDE

Timmons-WLB, Shazier/Spence-MLB, Jarvis-SLB

LCB?, Shamarko-SS, Mitchell-FS, Gay-RCB

Our issue is...still at CB spots. Although we could fix one w signing FA Tarell Brown or Tramon Williams.

Back-ups on the line for rotation would be Mauro and N. Williams

Back-ups at LB would be V. Williams, Moats and Zumwalt

Back-ups at DB would be Webb, Blake, McCain Etc.

 

[Steeltime]

Having seen this defense get shredded by Brian Hoyer - the Browns have scored 55 points in their last 6 quarters vs. the Steelers - I believe now is the time to unleash the hell brought on by the 4-4-4.

It will change football, forever.

 

[Vader]

Having seen this defense get shredded by Brian Hoyer - the Browns have scored 55 points in their last 6 quarters vs. the Steelers - I believe now is the time to unleash the hell brought on by the 4-4-4.

It will change football, forever.

Hell might as well. I saw LeBeau break out the 1-6-4 against the clowns. They still completed the pass. Image how bad that had to be... completing a pass with 10 people in coverage.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Considering that they're getting zero pass rush from the 3-4 I don't see where going to the 4-3 would hurt.