The Hypocrisy of Hollywood

[NCSteelerfan]

Just this week I have had my back rubbed once while I was working by a woman in the office and also a few times last week. She has also rubbed my chest several times when I walk past her and has made countless sexual comments to me. I don't encourage her but I don't freak out about it either. I won't report it to my superiors, but if I did they would laugh their ***** off and say "get the **** out of here". Partly because I am a male, but also because it's well known at work and is an office joke that she is kind of nutty and has no professional boundaries. It doesn't demoralize me or make me feel like less of a person. It makes me feel like she has some issues.

All of this you have described should not be taking place in a work setting. I understand the inside jokes and being situationally aware of who you can say what to, but putting hands on someone is wrong man or woman. I get you don't feel demoralized or less than, I wouldn't either, but what I don't do is let it continue because it would piss me the **** off. I'm not a touchy feely person and certainly don't want unwanted **** like that. If your superiors don't take complaints seriously then that will just set them up down the road for a huge failure that may cost their jobs. Of course, you not saying anything is why she will continue to do it to you and others until someone gets over it and does report her ***.

How about this......everyone keeps their ******* hands to themselves in the work place, or outside if you are not sure the person wants to be touched. How about if you are unsure of how certain people around will take off color comments you may make in the work place, you don't make them. Just around those you are sure understand you and don't take offense. Holy ****, I am not easily offended by comments, but even I get you can't just say whatever the hell you want in a professional setting or you can get in trouble.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

I wasn’t talking about the true victims. I’m talking about the people who are using the #metoo platform to ***** and moan about the slightest thing. As for getting harassed at work, again, it’s a gray area. Should men walk on eggshells and not speak any more because ANYTHING can be construed as harassment? No. It’s bullshit. I’m all for the real victims speaking up, but all this other fake victim **** makes it hard for anyone to be taken seriously.

So, do you get to decide who the real victims are? What constitutes a real victim to you, and I'm not talking about the dumb *** millennial you brought up prior. What if a boss asks a female subordinate out for drinks, and not in a "hey, let's be buddies" way, and alludes to her promotion depending on it, or perhaps her career. ......and yes I have seen this happen, not to me but to a co-worker. He didn't touch her, he didn't assault her, but he did hold her career over her head. She went to HR, does that make her wrong? I mean, she wasn't touched or assaulted. Does a boss have the right to hold someones career over their head based on factors that have nothing to do with how they can do the job or handle it? Does a co-worker have the right to make unwanted sexual innuendos towards other co-workers. No touching, just comments. What if they have told said co-worker to cut the **** and said co-worker still continues?

I'm just trying to give some different perspectives. I get the whole worry about false statements and **** like that, but honestly some of the what ifs in this thread are typical arguments of people that just want everyone to deal with bullshit. What you consider harassment may be different to someone else, does it really make that person wrong.

 

[Troglodyte]

Just this week I have had my back rubbed once while I was working by a woman in the office and also a few times last week. She has also rubbed my chest several times when I walk past her and has made countless sexual comments to me. I don't encourage her but I don't freak out about it either. I won't report it to my superiors, but if I did they would laugh their ***** off and say "get the **** out of here". Partly because I am a male, but also because it's well known at work and is an office joke that she is kind of nutty and has no professional boundaries. It doesn't demoralize me or make me feel like less of a person. It makes me feel like she has some issues.

OK, now imagine she was your unattractive superior who was often critical of your job performance and decided if and how much of a raise you got. Do you still think it wouldn’t bother you?

 

[oneforthebus]

One of my coworkers (a millenial) felt compelled to share her #metoo story with me. She was in college and eating at McDonald's alone. An older guy stared at her while he was in line. He then had the audacity to sit one booth over from her. She said she felt violated and reported it to the manager.

But hey!!!! This is sexual assault now. Sitting a booth over from a woman dining alone.

Should a man be forced out of his job because of an incident like this? NO. But is it happening? YES.

Is there a reported case of a guy being forced out of his job for doing something like this?

Look, I agree we don't want to go overboard but most of the reported cases involve far more egregious behavior. Groping. Demanding sex acts. Exposing oneself. I haven't heard any reports of someone losing their job over something as minimal as staring at or sitting next to anyone.

 

[oneforthebus]

Just this week I have had my back rubbed once while I was working by a woman in the office and also a few times last week. She has also rubbed my chest several times when I walk past her and has made countless sexual comments to me. I don't encourage her but I don't freak out about it either. I won't report it to my superiors, but if I did they would laugh their ***** off and say "get the **** out of here". Partly because I am a male, but also because it's well known at work and is an office joke that she is kind of nutty and has no professional boundaries. It doesn't demoralize me or make me feel like less of a person. It makes me feel like she has some issues.

So you think people should just put up with it? Let the nutty person be nutty? My daughter should just let some creepy old man at work fondle her and make sexual comments to her because it's really no reflection on her, it's a reflection on him?

Yeah, no.

 

[oneforthebus]

I just found out yesterday that girls poop. I am officially traumatized.

Fake news.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

I just found out yesterday that girls poop. I am officially traumatized.

I poop a lot depending on what I ate the night before. You know what else I do............I sometimes fart, really loud.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

Is there a reported case of a guy being forced out of his job for doing something like this?

Look, I agree we don't want to go overboard but most of the reported cases involve far more egregious behavior. Groping. Demanding sex acts. Exposing oneself. I haven't heard any reports of someone losing their job over something as minimal as staring at or sitting next to anyone.

I think we are headed that direction with all this hysteria. And that is sad.

I’m sure I’ve been harassed in my life, but it never bothered me enough to say anything. I guess I’m wired differently. Now if a person has had a career threatened because of harassment, by all means he/she should report it. There is a difference (to me) between an innuendo over looks or whatever and having your career threatened. That being said- there should be a presumption of innocence, not guilt.

(Forgive the disjointed thoughts and all- Im proctoring a test at school and I can’t focus.)

 

[Sarge]

The biggest problem I see, is that if a person is accused of something, then later found to be innocent of that which they were accused, that stigma tends to stay with them. And that is true of any crime or whatever. It is hard, nay, impossible to get your reputation back.

 

[IndySteel]

The biggest problem I see, is that if a person is accused of something, then later found to be innocent of that which they were accused, that stigma tends to stay with them. And that is true of any crime or whatever. It is hard, nay, impossible to get your reputation back.

I agree. Someone once accused Tibs of blowing goats. Is that right, Tibs? Be honest...

 

[Supersteeler]

OK, now imagine she was your unattractive superior who was often critical of your job performance and decided if and how much of a raise you got. Do you still think it wouldn’t bother you?

No, leveraging someone who is below you on the totem pole or holding things over your employees head's is wrong no matter what. That's a misuse of power and not what I was referring to in my situation.

 

[Supersteeler]

So you think people should just put up with it? Let the nutty person be nutty? My daughter should just let some creepy old man at work fondle her and make sexual comments to her because it's really no reflection on her, it's a reflection on him?

Yeah, no.

I think everyone is different. No, I'm not saying your daughter should put up with anything she doesn't want to put up with. Yes, as you say, in my case, I am choosing to let the nutty person be nutty because it isn't hurting me physically or emotionally. The other handful of guys she does it to all feel the same way and laugh it off like I do. In the grand scheme of things, it's nothing worth shaking up the whole place over. Again, that's just me. Every situation is different. I'm telling you place and simple though.....at most jobs a male employee would still get laughed out of the room or at the very least get a lot of eye rolls for reporting this type of thing. Like it or not, that's just how it is.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

The biggest problem I see, is that if a person is accused of something, then later found to be innocent of that which they were accused, that stigma tends to stay with them. And that is true of any crime or whatever. It is hard, nay, impossible to get your reputation back.

Other than someone in the spotlight or a high profile case like Duke, how would the stigma stay with them? In a work setting it's fairly confidential when you are let go due to harassment and they can't disclose it to future employment prospects other than answer the question of whether they would be re-hired or not. Quite frankly, this really hasn't been a major issue. How many actual cases can you think of, other than Duke, where someone was let go and their reputation smeared from a false sexual harassment allegation where they proved innocence? When they were found innocent were they truly persecuted and unable to find a job or really had a reputation issue?

 

[NCSteelerfan]

I think everyone is different. No, I'm not saying your daughter should put up with anything she doesn't want to put up with. Yes, as you say, in my case, I am choosing to let the nutty person be nutty because it isn't hurting me physically or emotionally. The other handful of guys she does it to all feel the same way and laugh it off like I do. In the grand scheme of things, it's nothing worth shaking up the whole place over. Again, that's just me. Every situation is different. I'm telling you place and simple though.....at most jobs a male employee would still get laughed out of the room or at the very least get a lot of eye rolls for reporting this type of thing. Like it or not, that's just how it is.

Any company worth working for would not laugh off a complaint from a man for this as it would open them up to a lawsuit.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

Other than someone in the spotlight or a high profile case like Duke, how would the stigma stay with them? In a work setting it's fairly confidential when you are let go due to harassment and they can't disclose it to future employment prospects other than answer the question of whether they would be re-hired or not. Quite frankly, this really hasn't been a major issue. How many actual cases can you think of, other than Duke, where someone was let go and their reputation smeared from a false sexual harassment allegation where they proved innocence? When they were found innocent were they truly persecuted and unable to find a job or really had a reputation issue?

Happened to a teacher when I was in elementary school. Older man, strict. A fifth grade teacher. A few kids decided they didn’t like him, and concocted a story that he molested them. He lost his job, was charged in the court. It came out at trial that the kids lied and made it up. He was exonerated...but wias never able to teach again because of the stigma. He died with the allegations of molestation still hanging over him.
It was such a sad situation.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

Happened to a teacher when I was in elementary school. Older man, strict. A fifth grade teacher. A few kids decided they didn’t like him, and concocted a story that he molested them. He lost his job, was charged in the court. It came out at trial that the kids lied and made it up. He was exonerated...but wias never able to teach again because of the stigma. He died with the allegations of molestation still hanging over him.
It was such a sad situation.

That is sad, and shame on the school systems for not allowing him to work again when he was found innocent. I wasn't saying false accusations aren't laid out, but it is no where on the scale as people want to believe and not even close to actual truthful accusations. I think we can all come up with at least one or two cases where someone was just being an ******* and vengeful, but I guarantee for every one or two of them there is a hell of a lot more that are warranted.

I think the main point here that people keep forgetting is that when you are at work not everything you say at home is appropriate. Not everyone is thick skinned, and everyone has different thresholds of what is acceptable. It doesn't make them wrong just because you would put up with someone saying something derogatory, and it doesn't mean they have to put up with it either. My rule of thumb is not to have any kind of sexual or even close to sexual conversation with people I work with. We still joke around and have fun, and I keep aware of what can be said to which person and what people you just can't joke with. It's called being situationally aware. It keeps me out of trouble.

 

[Buster]

#MeToo.

Yes, it's true, I was a victim of sexual assault. About 10 years ago at a bar in Montreal a guy sitting next to me grabbed and squeezed my upper thigh. Apparently that's **** code for wanting to hook up. I said "if you touch me again I'm going to slam your head into this bar top 40 times." What really bothered me was how could anyone think that I could possibly have the ghey? It's preposterous, confounding. I later found out that it was fruit night at that bar, so I didn't feel too bad.

In today’s liberal world your *** would be in jail for threatening him.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

That is sad, and shame on the school systems for not allowing him to work again when he was found innocent. I wasn't saying false accusations aren't laid out, but it is no where on the scale as people want to believe and not even close to actual truthful accusations. I think we can all come up with at least one or two cases where someone was just being an ******* and vengeful, but I guarantee for every one or two of them there is a hell of a lot more that are warranted.

I think the main point here that people keep forgetting is that when you are at work not everything you say at home is appropriate. Not everyone is thick skinned, and everyone has different thresholds of what is acceptable. It doesn't make them wrong just because you would put up with someone saying something derogatory, and it doesn't mean they have to put up with it either. My rule of thumb is not to have any kind of sexual or even close to sexual conversation with people I work with. We still joke around and have fun, and I keep aware of what can be said to which person and what people you just can't joke with. It's called being situationally aware. It keeps me out of trouble.

It’s the example of the teacher that keeps me from believing everything I hear. Maybe because I’m jaded...maybe because I saw first hand what false accusations can do. I don’t know. But I do know that I will continue to wait until all facts come out and for the accused to be presumed innocent until either an admittance of guilt OR they are proven guilty.

 

[oneforthebus]

I think we are headed that direction with all this hysteria. And that is sad.

I’m sure I’ve been harassed in my life, but it never bothered me enough to say anything. I guess I’m wired differently. Now if a person has had a career threatened because of harassment, by all means he/she should report it. There is a difference (to me) between an innuendo over looks or whatever and having your career threatened. That being said- there should be a presumption of innocence, not guilt.

(Forgive the disjointed thoughts and all- Im proctoring a test at school and I can’t focus.)

I don't see this as "hysteria", I see it as a long overdue housecleaning.

 

[IndySteel]

In today’s liberal world your *** would be in jail for threatening him.

And charged with discrimination. And a hate crime.

 

[NCSteelerfan]

I don't see this as "hysteria", I see it as a long overdue housecleaning.

Exactly!

I think it needs to be remembered that it wasn't all that long ago that sexual harassment wasn't even considered a "thing". In other words, you just pretty much put up with it because there were no consequences for their actions and if you said anything you were the overly sensitive woman that needs to get over herself. Just sit there and look pretty, its your job......and if you want to keep your job be quiet.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

I see it more as a McCarthyism witchhunt.

 

[Sarge]

Other than someone in the spotlight or a high profile case like Duke, how would the stigma stay with them? In a work setting it's fairly confidential when you are let go due to harassment and they can't disclose it to future employment prospects other than answer the question of whether they would be re-hired or not. Quite frankly, this really hasn't been a major issue. How many actual cases can you think of, other than Duke, where someone was let go and their reputation smeared from a false sexual harassment allegation where they proved innocence? When they were found innocent were they truly persecuted and unable to find a job or really had a reputation issue?

Gotta be honest. Aside from a friend being a murder suspect, and he was cleared, I do not personally know anyone accused of either sexual harassment or sexual assault. Dude still can't get a job worth a ****. The majority of the town thinks he did it, and got away with it in spite of the fact someone else was convicted by DNA evidence. Most people think the guy in jail was set up. Dude will never get his reputation back. That said, I watch Dateline, 20/20, stuff like that. And it happens. Not sure of the frequency, but it happens. I mean, I know the only time we hear about it is when it is someone famous, but this sort of thing, if not common, certainly isn't rare.

It just sucks. No person should have to endure sexual indiscretion against their will. Unfortunately, the ones who were truly assaulted will be looked at suspiciously because of the few that lied. And that is the sort of thing that happens when this stuff is tried in the media and on social media before all the facts come out. I don't know what the solution is or if there is one. I mean, how do you prove innocence or guilt on someone's word? I guess I just don't think it is as simple as someone accuses someone, so that someone should be disciplined or fired or whatever. As I said, I don't know what you do. There are no easy answers. If anything, I hope men and women wise up, learn form this and simply don't allow themselves to be in a situation where anything can be misconstrued. Adults acting like adults. But that isn't realistic either.

 

[SteelChip]

 

[Iron95]

Actually a woman did say that she had his baby and they shot her dead in the street. What ever happened to that?