Transgender question......

[oneforthebus]

She was OK with being a girl up until a few months ago when the bullying started. She always has been athletic and a tomboy- hates dresses and all that. But she was always a girl. Then when the pretty girls" as they are called at the school started making fun of her for not wearing girly clothes (never once did they say she was a boy....just that she didn't wear cute clothes) did she decide that she was a boy.

Battle of wills? Who is the parent here? It's not like the girl is 15. She's 5. She needs to know who sets the boundaries and the rules. By giving in, it's saying that SHE sets the rules!!!!

I don't live with them and I don't know enough about what happens inside their home every day or what goes on in their daughter's life/thought processes etc. to decide that they're making the wrong decision.

Demanding that she call herself a girl and wear "girl clothes" if she is dead set against it isn't setting boundaries to me. It's telling her that who she is and who she wants to be is bad and wrong. If in fact she isn't transgender she will figure that out eventually. Trying to force it rarely works and leads to abject misery for a lot of kids.

Just my opinion.

 

[IndySteel]

What do you think the psychiatrist would say?

Help get to the root cause of the issue, because there are some serious mental problems or cry for help involved. No sane, competent person thinks that they are the opposite sex of what they are in reality. And no rational parent would let their kid believe that like nothing is abnormal about it.

 

[oneforthebus]

Help get to the root cause of the issue, because there are some serious mental problems or cry for help involved. No sane, competent person thinks that they are the opposite sex of what they are in reality. And no rational parent would let their kid believe that like nothing is abnormal about it.

No trained psychiatrist will tell her that her desire to be a boy means she's crazy. Not in 2018 anyway.

Personally I'm not sure where my feelings come out on whether it's normal or not. I think some people do this for attention or to be different or weird. I think some people really deeply feel they are the opposite gender inside. Who am I to say they shouldn't go with that if that's what makes them happy? Would you rather your daughter stay a girl and be miserable or live as a boy and be happy? I don't judge any parent for doing what they believe is right in this instance. As I said, as long as they are not the ones forcing it or pushing it on the kid, which is sick.

Where I will always come out is on the side of loving my kids no matter who they are and who they want to be. They don't think and feel and act the way I would always but I don't insist they come around to my way.

 

[IndySteel]

No trained psychiatrist will tell her that her desire to be a boy means she's crazy. Not in 2018 anyway.

Personally I'm not sure where my feelings come out on whether it's normal or not. I think some people do this for attention or to be different or weird. I think some people really deeply feel they are the opposite gender inside. Who am I to say they shouldn't go with that if that's what makes them happy? Would you rather your daughter stay a girl and be miserable or live as a boy and be happy? I don't judge any parent for doing what they believe is right in this instance. As I said, as long as they are not the ones forcing it or pushing it on the kid, which is sick.

Where I will always come out is on the side of loving my kids no matter who they are and who they want to be. They don't think and feel and act the way I would always but I don't insist they come around to my way.

Then I would find one who still does shock therapy. Look, if you're a kid who has a dick and you think you are a female, you're ****** in the head. And vice versa.

 

[oneforthebus]

Then I would find one who still does shock therapy. Look, if you're a kid who has a dick and you think you are a female, you're ****** in the head. And vice versa.

Well, that's your opinion. Again, not sure where I come down on it, the medical community disagrees with you though. I just disagree with forcing the issue one way or the other...you won't fix "the problem" that way and you may create new ones.

 

[Steelr4evr]

Rick Santorum said the same thing a decade ago, it didn’t happen.

What are you talking about ? We're full blown off the scale stupid with garabge. **** just turn on the TV. I would have never dreamed 10 years ago we would have the stuff we do now on TV. That's the norm now. Hell California outdoes itself monthly with absurd garbage.

 

[MTC]

What are you talking about ? We're full blown off the scale stupid with garabge. **** just turn on the TV. I would have never dreamed 10 years ago we would have the stuff we do now on TV. That's the norm now. Hell California outdoes itself monthly with absurd garbage.

Dude, anything west of the Mississippi is going whacky.
NM is becoming California light

 

[Steelr4evr]

Dude, anything west of the Mississippi is going whacky.
NM is becoming California light

Good thing I have no desire to ever live on the left coast or any state that has its head up its *** .

 

[MTC]

Good thing I have no desire to ever live on the left coast or any state that has its head up its *** .

My only complaint is the justice system is really lenient on repeat offenders.
Add in the crazy apologist for every social group, especially in the university area.

If it wasn't for my family living here. I'd move

 

[MT~Forged]

A strong, loving, caring parent would allow her to do as she wants and dress as she wants while CONTINUING to make her understand she is a girl, and what her name really is. You also need to CONTINUE to let her know that even though she is a girl, it in no way has to limit her as she grows up, same as any other PERCEIVED differences. She needs PARENTS, not want to be friend supporters. What do they do when she decides she doesn’t want to get an education and just wants to drink and do drugs all day?

 

[IndySteel]

A strong, loving, caring parent would allow her to do as she wants and dress as she wants while CONTINUING to make her understand she is a girl, and what her name really is. You also need to CONTINUE to let her know that even though she is a girl, it in no way has to limit her as she grows up, same as any other PERCEIVED differences. She needs PARENTS, not want to be friend supporters. What do they do when she decides she doesn’t want to get an education and just wants to drink and do drugs all day?

Do you really think that the best course of parenting is to look the other way while your daughter “Beth” decides to call herself “Burt” and pretend that she has a dick?

 

[Yinzerlyn]

A strong, loving, caring parent would allow her to do as she wants and dress as she wants while CONTINUING to make her understand she is a girl, and what her name really is. You also need to CONTINUE to let her know that even though she is a girl, it in no way has to limit her as she grows up, same as any other PERCEIVED differences. She needs PARENTS, not want to be friend supporters. What do they do when she decides she doesn’t want to get an education and just wants to drink and do drugs all day?

THIS. I don't care about her wanting super short hair or wearing athletic clothes. That's a non- issue. I had short hair as a kid and wore tomboy clothes. HOWEVER....my mom and dad made sure that on Sundays, I wore a dress to church and they never once told me I was a hoy....or allowed me to be a boy. I know there were a few times I said that I wished I was a boy (mostly for going to the bathroom purposes and the like), but never did they cater to those desires.

As a grown adult, I still shun dresses and dressy clothes. My hair is long, and I am 100% female. Never questioned my gender at all. I feel my friend is doing a HUGE disservice by not reinforcing what gender "Elliott" really is. THAT is my issue....that the 5 year old runs the house.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

Dude, anything west of the Mississippi is going whacky.
NM is becoming California light

KS is still pretty Red....and we are west of the Mississippi.....

 

[MTC]

KS is still pretty Red....and we are west of the Mississippi.....

The midwest in general is still red. Head west past TX you get into some pretty blue states with small red cities.
Gets pretty odd around these parts lol.

I was surprised how liberal Denver has gotten too. Went there in July. It was weird.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

The midwest in general is still red. Head west past TX you get into some pretty blue states with small red cities.
Gets pretty odd around these parts lol.

I was surprised how liberal Denver has gotten too. Went there in July. It was weird.

That's because Colorado legalized the ganja.....lol.

 

[oneforthebus]

THIS. I don't care about her wanting super short hair or wearing athletic clothes. That's a non- issue. I had short hair as a kid and wore tomboy clothes. HOWEVER....my mom and dad made sure that on Sundays, I wore a dress to church and they never once told me I was a hoy....or allowed me to be a boy. I know there were a few times I said that I wished I was a boy (mostly for going to the bathroom purposes and the like), but never did they cater to those desires.

As a grown adult, I still shun dresses and dressy clothes. My hair is long, and I am 100% female. Never questioned my gender at all. I feel my friend is doing a HUGE disservice by not reinforcing what gender "Elliott" really is. THAT is my issue....that the 5 year old runs the house.

This little girl is not you though. As you said, you never questioned your gender. Some of these kids start telling their parents "I am a boy" as toddlers.

Personally I don't think this is a decision most families take lightly. The backlash they will get will be brutal. And as I said I don't know (maybe you know better) what actually goes on in their home and with their child. Therefore I don't judge what they are doing as wrong. If they were giving her hormones or surgery or something else that was potentially irreversible, I would have a problem with it as the child is too young to make those kinds of decisions. But letting her dress and live and call herself what she wants harms no one. Forcing her to be someone she doesn't want to be could cause her long term damage.

I'm not a parenting expert but those are my feelings. Yes, we are parents not friends, but that does not mean we have or should have complete control over everything.

This isn't a red/blue issue to me. This is a what's best for the mental health of the child issue to me. And we have a difference of opinion on that.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

She had no desire to be a boy until after the girls bullied her. For 5 years she was ok with being a girl-then a few weren’t nice to her and that’s when this started. Does she not get that all kids are mean to each other at some point in life? I give my friend props for not forcing hormones and all that...but I do think 5 is still too young to dictate a major life decision like this. 5 year olds waffle from wanting to be a truck driver to a doctor to a fisherman to a ballerina to a teacher to a garbage man...sometimes all in one day.

 

[oneforthebus]

She had no desire to be a boy until after the girls bullied her. For 5 years she was ok with being a girl-then a few weren’t nice to her and that’s when this started. Does she not get that all kids are mean to each other at some point in life? I give my friend props for not forcing hormones and all that...but I do think 5 is still too young to dictate a major life decision like this. 5 year olds waffle from wanting to be a truck driver to a doctor to a fisherman to a ballerina to a teacher to a garbage man...sometimes all in one day.

If you're not privy to all the conversations they have had in private over the last several years I'm not sure how you could know that she was fine with it before then. You said she was a tomboy and dressing like a boy before the girls bullied her. Perhaps they haven't shared publicly everything that has gone on.

Like I said, I don't think "most" parents would make this move lightly. If they are just trying to avoid bullying this sure isn't the best way to go about it.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

No, I wasn’t privy to ALL conversations. I do know that if this had been an issue before, that I would have known. Our families are that close. Heck- I changed her younger brother’s diapers. My friend and her husband are very liberal. Very new age parenting and just non traditional. Their kids are loved and not abused...but I can’t help but wonder if their political leanings play a part in this decision. I hope that “Elliott” outgrows this and that SHE is ok in the end. Just so far out of the realm of anything I would do for a kid that age, I can’t support it.

 

[MT~Forged]

Do you really think that the best course of parenting is to look the other way while your daughter “Beth” decides to call herself “Burt” and pretend that she has a dick?

Reading comprehension is not your strong suit is it?

 

[IndySteel]

Reading comprehension is not your strong suit is it?

Sorry about that. I was half asleep while the dog was outside and only read this part: A strong, loving, caring parent would allow her to do as she wants and dress as she wants

 

[Supersteeler]

I have to side with Lyn on this one. I am very supportive of gay and trans people.....always have been as someone who works with high school kids. I know what a difficult life they have most of the time. That being said, if my kid started talking about identifying as the opposite gender in Elementary School, there is no way in the world I would feed into it in any way until they were at least high school age and probably very late teens. I would not be mean about it, I just wouldn't encourage it and I'd let the comments go without making a big deal.

Let's be honest.....little kids are all over the place at all times with what they want. And don't even freaking get me started on middle school kids. Middle school kids will do or say absolutely anything under the sun if it gets them attention and makes then seem special or different. They are completely desperate for that attention at all times. If a middle schooler thought that identifying as a giraffe would get them attention from their peers, the next day, they would be come to school walking on stilts telling everyone they were a giraffe. Now.....on the other hand, I would figure that if the kid has been talking about it since they were young and continues talking about it into their later teens, it's not a passing fad and is most likely going to stick for good. If that happened, so be it. I would support them.

But I can't see any benefit whatsoever of allowing a kid to become a different gender in Elementary school just because they talk about it. They aren't old enough to take care of their own daily functions by themselves let alone plot out the course of the rest of their lives. That would be akin to the 5 year old telling you they wanted to be a brain surgeon, so you go out the next day and buy them a scalpel set to go around practicing cutting things up around the house or trying out surgery on the dog. My point is, there's no need to jump into a life altering choice with both feet at that age, with very little evidence that it is really a life altering moment or if it's little kid talk.

 

[oneforthebus]

That would be akin to the 5 year old telling you they wanted to be a brain surgeon, so you go out the next day and buy them a scalpel set to go around practicing cutting things up around the house or trying out surgery on the dog.

I don't think letting them wear what they want and call themselves what they want is akin to giving them a scalpel.

There've been 3 suicides at my daughters' two colleges in the last 2 weeks. Kids today are under so much pressure. I realized several years ago that the biggest parenting mistake I was making was trying to create the perfect family with the perfect kids and make sure everything always went according to my plan. I did not even realize the pressure I was putting on my kids.

What kids need more than anything from their parents is unconditional acceptance and love. They need to know their home is the place where they can be who they are and feel loved and accepted. If anyone thinks they are going to stave off transgenderism in their kid by forbidding it, I think there is a fairly large body of evidence that it won't work and will only harm the child by teaching them that who they are inside is bad and wrong. Confidence in their true identity comes from that security that is developed at home.

Again, I realize my parenting philosophy differs a lot from many here. That's ok. I haven't had to deal with this particular issue but I have had to deal with a few other issues and I can only imagine this would be gut wrenching. Seeing your child suffer is the worst feeling there is and most of us will do what we can to make things better. Unless there's some reason to think these parents have some kind of twisted motives I would support them in doing what they feel is best for their child and their family.

 

[IndySteel]

This is so stupid. Now Germany has a third gender called "diverse." That's such bullshit. You are either male or female.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2018/12/14/germany-approves-third-gender-diverse-for-official-documents/

 

[Yinzerlyn]

This is so stupid. Now Germany has a third gender called "diverse." That's such bullshit. You are either male or female.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2018/12/14/germany-approves-third-gender-diverse-for-official-documents/

EXACTLY!!!!!! How exactly would two "diverse" people procreate?????