Florida Valentines Day Shooting

[oneforthebus]

Any officer could do what they want. If they go they might get a medal at city hall or at their funeral. But going in by yourself isnt proceedure.

You're missing my point. If one officer has to wait for backup there's no point in having him there. 10 cops can get there in the time he is "waiting for backup". If they need two people they should have two people. One person who who has to wait for backup is virtually useless.

 

[SteelChip]

Gov Scott calls to raise the legal age for gun purchase to 21. Will that be enough to satisfy the screeches from the left-leaning leaches?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...27a6ccb38eb_story.html?utm_term=.bd4dacd4c4d5

Bill Whittle's take on the situation mirrors mine.....it is not the guns fault, nor is it the age of the shooter.

 

[SteelerSask2]

You are COMPLETELY misrepresenting the analysis. COMPLETELY.

Specifically, the safety officer was wearing a badge and uniform, and carrying a loaded weapon. His promise to enter the building and risk his safety to protect others HAD ALREADY BEEN MADE. That was his ******* JOB. He cashed his paychecks, but when the time came to do his job, he bailed.

Writing, "Oh, you don't know how you would have reacted" is utter, complete bullshit.

I don't work as a peace officer, or wear a badge and gun at work, or accept a decent salary to protect students. If I did, then I have made the bargain already. I have agreed to risk my safety to protect the students.

Finally, the statement that the sheriff faced danger akin to the troops landing on Normandy? No. Just ... no. First, we won WWII because those troops - many of them kids - charged the beach while machine gun fire and mortars and landmines destroyed them by the hundreds. Thousands. One ******* 19-year old dipshit is more dangerous than the Nazi army in Normandy? Oh for **** sake.

Second, the vast majority of those troops had been DRAFTED, and had not volunteered for this danger, and stormed the beach to face it. ******* dipshit sheriff who stood behind a tree waiting for backup would have been the guy who VOLUNTEERED for duty, and was weeping on the landing craft and refusing to land.

In other words, a guy facing court martial and prison - deservedly.

I never said he shouldnt have went in. You cherry pick points. Ive said I think he should have went. Im just saying pretty tough to judge if you havent been in the situation yourself. I think most or all police realize the could be killed but there is a big diffetence between that and heading into that sitiation. No one can say what they would do. That is all talk. I would say when an assault rifle is going off and you have a handgun you are pretty much ******. Im pretty good with a rifle to about 250-300 yards. I shot a handgun one time(very limited access in Canada). They are ****** useless as far as Im concerned. And yes the kid had body armor. He ditched when he blended in.
So im review. He should have went in, but no one who hasnt done something like that can say what they would do. At the point where back up arrived. That was ******.

 

[Yinzerlyn]

I think we can all agree that this whole situation is beyond ****** up. We can't sit here and say "If I were there, I'd do such and such," because we don't know. That being said....if you are a LEO....and you have ever had any doubts as to what you are supposed to do and how you are supposed to react, then quit.

 

[oneforthebus]

I think we can all agree that this whole situation is beyond ****** up. We can't sit here and say "If I were there, I'd do such and such," because we don't know. That being said....if you are a LEO....and you have ever had any doubts as to what you are supposed to do and how you are supposed to react, then quit.

I agree, you can't say for sure what you would do. I have never fired a gun in my life but I honestly believe if I was standing there with a gun in my hand knowing my kid and my friends' kids were in there getting shot at, I'm pretty sure I'd go in. I wouldn't run in full speed gun blazing probably, that's just suicide. I'd try to be smart and find a way to sneak in, hide around a corner and catch him off guard or something. Maybe it would be useless, maybe I'd get myself killed.

But I just can't fathom that I would just stand there with a gun in my hand and listen to my kids being slaughtered for four minutes and do nothing. I don't think I could live with myself after that.

 

[hamster]

The Federal Gov;t failed these kids.
The local gov't failed these kids.
The school security failed these kids.
Next time they may fail you.
But they want to take away your ability to protect yourself.

**** all of them.

 

[ark steel]

Nope. Not a ******* chance in the pit of hades. You ban those damn assault weapons, and maybe then, you will have gone far enough.

Makes me sad to see you use the phrase "assault weapons".....

 

[ark steel]

Some people run toward danger and some people run from it.

I won't call the guy a coward though. Until you have been in a fire fight, you just don't know what it is like or how you'll react. I can assure you, it is unlikely you will react the way you think you will.

What happens to the guy in your platoon that, when the bullets start flying and he doesn't go in while the rest of you do?

 

[Sarge]

What happens to the guy in your platoon that, when the bullets start flying and he doesn't go in while the rest of you do?

He gets reprimanded and processed for separation.

 

[Sarge]

Makes me sad to see you use the phrase "assault weapons".....

Isn't that what the people that want to ban them call them?

 

[ark steel]

Isn't that what the people that want to ban them call them?

I may have misunderstood you. In thought you were saying we shouod ban them, but you were adding what the gun controp people say?

 

[ark steel]

He gets reprimanded and processed for separation.

I would think that he would not be treated very well.

 

[Sarge]

I am going to tell you a story I have only told to one other person. That person is my wife. My mom doesn't know. My kids don't know. In the army, my career field was aviation. Be that as it is, I had never been in firefight. I was a mechanic with a weapon, pretty much. All that changed on June 1st of 2012. I was deployed to Afghanistan, at FOB Salerno in RC East. It was a Friday, a typical slow day, being that Friday's are Muslim holy days. Usually there isn't much action. I wasn't scheduled to fly that day so, I slept a little late, went to the gym and reported for duty.

It was me, and three of my Soldiers assigned for maintenance. All of the rest of my guys were either out flying, or in bed because they had missions that night. Somewhere between 1130 and noon, we went to the chow hall to grab a bite. We ate our lunch and left, swung by the little PX next door for a can of chew, and headed back. About 100 meters from the PX, the chaplain had a table set up with personal hygiene items he was giving to Soldiers who needed them.

About that time, a huge explosion hit the hesco barrier. I later found out it was a truck with roughly 10,000kg of explosives on board. The bad guys had breached the base. The explosion was so powerful, it knocked us down. The chow hall was destroyed along with the PX. We started hearing gunfire. All the guys in my company carry 9mm Berettas, and when we go outside the wire, each crew member also takes an assigned M4.

I sent the guys to the CP to get M4's, body armor, helmets. I ran into the PX to make sure anyone in there was ok and not in need of medical attention. They were ok. After that, I ran toward the fight.

I took up a defensive position behind a cement barrier with a clear view of the breach. I was quickly joined by guys from Army infantry, Seals, SF. First bad guy poked his head out, was killed. Another one got to cover and fought back with machine gun and RPG's. Long story short, we were engaged with 5-7 bad guys, and all I had was a 9 mil and 31 rounds. I fired my pistol. Probably didn't hit ****. Don't know if I did or didn't. Whole fight lasted 15 minutes, tops. All bad guys dead.

Why is this significant? Because at some point during the engagement I pissed myself. Didn't even know I did it until someone pointed it out. I got laughed at. I laughed. Then once the dust was settled, I began shaking uncontrollably. Shook for the better part of an hour. Maybe more. The whole thing ****** me up for a little bit.

I guess my point is, I thought I was pretty brave, and I guess I was. But there was a part of my brain that apparently was very afraid, but I never felt it. Knowing what I know, I believe I could do it again. But I don't know. Everytime something like Florida happens, it brings me back to that day and I wonder what I would do in such a situation. I would like to think I would run in again. But I just don't know.

 

[Sarge]

I may have misunderstood you. In thought you were saying we shouod ban them, but you were adding what the gun controp people say?

I would never advocate banning any weapons. Ever.

 

[jitter77]

Here is the problem there is no such thing as an "assault weapon" unless your are talking full auto. Any semi automatic rifle / handgun could be called an assault weapon. If AR-15s are banned someone will move on to the next gun. I own an SKS that costs $99 back in the day. My uncle has many many guns including an SKS, AK 47, AR-15, M-16 etc etc...Even if you ban all those your still looking at hundreds of guns that are semi auto and have the exact same capabilities as those. I just dont think that will be realistic.

Next you could look at banning high capacity magazines. Not sure how effective that would be since there are already millions of high capacity clips out there.

I am definitely in favor of stricter background checks and letting the police / FBI remove guns from people. Lets say I have a squeaky clean background, buy a few guns then start posting crazy stuff online or telling my family / friends crazy things. The police or FBI should be able to remove the guns.

My neighbor a long time ago was with 3-4 friends in his car. He pretended that the car stalled on train tracks with a train coming. He either panicked or the car didnt really start and the train smashed into the car killing everyone but him. I am not sure if he got jail time, but I know he was on house arrest for a long time and all of his guns were taken because what he did was a felony. I think this should be expanded to things like assault, domestic violence / terroristic threats etc etc. Also people who are being treated for things like depression / bi-polar and things like that should not be able to own a gun. I am not sure how much all this will help because society is the main issue. Like someone said kids used to bring guns to school and there was not mass shootings so what has changed? I think it is the breakdown of the family and society trying to make everyone winners. When someone "loses" or doesnt get their way they just spaz out now and cant handle it. Look at the people when Hillary lost. You had grown people going into full meltdown.

I dont know what the answer is and I think it maybe too late to reverse course. The one school I saw on TV had an amazing setup. Cameras everywhere, certain walls were reinforced, and this was under live watch. They also had things called hotspots. If a shooter was in the building these things that looked kinda like sprinklers and would shoot smoke into the area. They were remotely controlled by whoever was watching the video. It was a very costly system (like 400k) and obviously not every school is going to be able to do that.

 

[Sarge]

I would think that he would not be treated very well.

No, and he would be reassigned immediately for everyone's safety. Never heard of anyone refusing to go in or run the other way though. Not saying it never happened. Never heard of it.

 

[ark steel]

I am going to tell you a story I have only told to one other person. That person is my wife. My mom doesn't know. My kids don't know. In the army, my career field was aviation. Be that as it is, I had never been in firefight. I was a mechanic with a weapon, pretty much. All that changed on June 1st of 2012. I was deployed to Afghanistan, at FOB Salerno in RC East. It was a Friday, a typical slow day, being that Friday's are Muslim holy days. Usually there isn't much action. I wasn't scheduled to fly that day so, I slept a little late, went to the gym and reported for duty.

It was me, and three of my Soldiers assigned for maintenance. All of the rest of my guys were either out flying, or in bed because they had missions that night. Somewhere between 1130 and noon, we went to the chow hall to grab a bite. We ate our lunch and left, swung by the little PX next door for a can of chew, and headed back. About 100 meters from the PX, the chaplain had a table set up with personal hygiene items he was giving to Soldiers who needed them.

About that time, a huge explosion hit the hesco barrier. I later found out it was a truck with roughly 10,000kg of explosives on board. The bad guys had breached the base. The explosion was so powerful, it knocked us down. The chow hall was destroyed along with the PX. We started hearing gunfire. All the guys in my company carry 9mm Berettas, and when we go outside the wire, each crew member also takes an assigned M4.

I sent the guys to the CP to get M4's, body armor, helmets. I ran into the PX to make sure anyone in there was ok and not in need of medical attention. They were ok. After that, I ran toward the fight.

I took up a defensive position behind a cement barrier with a clear view of the breach. I was quickly joined by guys from Army infantry, Seals, SF. First bad guy poked his head out, was killed. Another one got to cover and fought back with machine gun and RPG's. Long story short, we were engaged with 5-7 bad guys, and all I had was a 9 mil and 31 rounds. I fired my pistol. Probably didn't hit ****. Don't know if I did or didn't. Whole fight lasted 15 minutes, tops. All bad guys dead.

Why is this significant? Because at some point during the engagement I pissed myself. Didn't even know I did it until someone pointed it out. I got laughed at. I laughed. Then once the dust was settled, I began shaking uncontrollably. Shook for the better part of an hour. Maybe more. The whole thing ****** me up for a little bit.

I guess my point is, I thought I was pretty brave, and I guess I was. But there was a part of my brain that apparently was very afraid, but I never felt it. Knowing what I know, I believe I could do it again. But I don't know. Everytime something like Florida happens, it brings me back to that day and I wonder what I would do in such a situation. I would like to think I would run in again. But I just don't know.

I'd expect most, if not all people involvex in a firefight, especially, their first few are scared as ****. Being brave is not the absence of fear, it is overcoming that fear to do what needs to be done.

You did it while grown men and women, some of whom were better trained for the firefight, were there to do it. You could have sat it out, and you didn't. I find it hard to believe that, knowing kids were in danger, you wouldnt do the same. Pissing yourself, or not.

To me, knowing unarmed innocents, especially children, are in danger would, probably, spur most men to some action, but, maybe, not.

 

[ark steel]

I would never advocate banning any weapons. Ever.

Ahh...i misunderstood, then. Sorry.

 

[Sarge]

I'd expect most, if not all people involvex in a firefight, especially, their first few are scared as ****. Being brave is not the absence of fear, it is overcoming that fear to do what needs to be done.

You did it while grown men and women, some of whom were better trained for the firefight, were there to do it. You could have sat it out, and you didn't. I find it hard to believe that, knowing kids were in danger, you wouldnt do the same. Pissing yourself, or not.

To me, knowing unarmed innocents, especially children, are in danger would, probably, spur most men to some action, but, maybe, not.

I believe I would run in again. I mean, I didn't even think about it. As you might imagine, I was in my own head for a while after that. I didn't have my body armor, my helmet or my rifle. Just my uniform, patrol cap and a pistol. It was beyond a stupid thing to do. Especially when others are there, and better equipped.

But.......

That's my one war story. The rest is mostly a participation trophy.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

https://www.google.com/amp/syndicat...r-threat-to-richie-incognito-hs-more.amp.html

Former Miami Dolphins offensive tackle Jonathan Martin was detained at a Los Angeles-area hospital Friday and was not taken into police custody, according to A.J. Perez of USA Today.

As seen in the following tweet by 12Up.com's Nick Brown, a disturbing post surfaced on Martin's Instagram story Friday in which apparent threats were made toward the Dolphins, Harvard-Westlake High School (which Martin attended), Miami center Mike Pouncey and the team's former guard Richie Incognito, now of the Buffalo Bills:

 

[jitter77]

I'd expect most, if not all people involvex in a firefight, especially, their first few are scared as ****. Being brave is not the absence of fear, it is overcoming that fear to do what needs to be done.

You did it while grown men and women, some of whom were better trained for the firefight, were there to do it. You could have sat it out, and you didn't. I find it hard to believe that, knowing kids were in danger, you wouldnt do the same. Pissing yourself, or not.

To me, knowing unarmed innocents, especially children, are in danger would, probably, spur most men to some action, but, maybe, not.

You have a trained deputy who had the strategic advantage and didnt do anything. I am not sure how you could sit outside of school and listen to kids getting shot up while you hide. I would like to hear the guys story to see what he has to say about the situation. To me it seems like the guy was close to retirement and looking for an easy job to finish out his time. A lot of these shootings probably couldnt have been prevented, but in this situation I think most if not all lives could have been saved. Everyone dropped the ball from the FBI to the local police to the school to the deputy outside just epic failures all around.

 

[Steelr4evr]

I'm not 100% sure what I'd personally do in that situation. I do know that if it was my child in that building I would go without thinking. I'm not sure how any father could live with themselves by not going in and your child dies. That would be 10 times worse than getting shot to death.

 

[Ironcitysteelers]

It’s the act of hiring a person that is right for the position, not just filling the spot because he/she meets the specs. https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/24/armed-teachers-texas-trump-362397

Hire the right people, train them, continue to follow up. This is for any job, ..or position. A nurse, teacher, cop, military..etc

 

[Ron Burgundy]

You have a trained deputy who had the strategic advantage and didnt do anything. I am not sure how you could sit outside of school and listen to kids getting shot up while you hide. I would like to hear the guys story to see what he has to say about the situation. To me it seems like the guy was close to retirement and looking for an easy job to finish out his time. A lot of these shootings probably couldnt have been prevented, but in this situation I think most if not all lives could have been saved. Everyone dropped the ball from the FBI to the local police to the school to the deputy outside just epic failures all around.

One of my Libtard cousins is saying on FB that he didn't sign up to shoot people when he took the job. She's real pretty but not very bright.

 

[SteelerSask2]

I know this happens in my profession and my buddy is a cop. He says its the same there. The least able get the simplest job away from the real action. They desk it at the station, run detention and liason with schools. So this guy probably doesnt have a good history when **** hits the fan and now he is in worst case scenario. When he was by himself it was one thing to me. When others arrive now proceedure states they should have formed a phalanx formation and gone in. FOR SURE.